===FILE=== -at52cSECho - Chris Voss Speaks on Tactical Empathy at The World Economic Forum 2025.txt
https://youtu.be/-at52cSECho
Chris Voss Speaks on Tactical Empathy at The World Economic Forum 2025

[0:00] One of the things we all have to at some [0:02] point in our lives figure out is how we [0:05] get what we want [0:07] when it's too challenging or maybe when [0:09] it's too tricky, maybe when you lack [0:11] resources that you need to become [0:13] resourceful. [0:15] So, [0:16] our keynote speaker now, Chris Voss, is [0:18] going to teach us how we can become [0:20] resourceful with what we have. And for [0:22] most of us, cuz I hear some of you [0:23] talking, keep it down, to use our voice. [0:26] So, thank you very much, Chris Voss, and [0:28] the stage is yours, sir. Pleasure's [0:29] mine, thank you. How many started the [0:31] negotiation already? [0:36] Couple of ways. [0:39] A little bit of humor, making you wonder [0:41] what I was going to say next. [0:43] Secondly, [0:45] the late night FM DJ voice. [0:50] I know that my tone of voice is going to [0:51] have an immediate impact on the the pace [0:53] of your brain. It's a neuroscience [0:55] reaction. It's things you can't you [0:57] can't stop me [1:00] from changing [1:01] the velocity of your thoughts. [1:04] Now, you can resist them, you could [1:05] fight back, you can move it back. [1:07] But if I use a downward inflicting [1:09] voice, [1:11] it actually slows your brain down [1:13] before I finished a sentence. [1:17] If I smile, [1:23] that's actually [1:25] you didn't choose to smile back. [1:27] It's a It's a neurochemical response. [1:31] It's an involuntary response. [1:34] Now, you can fight the smile, but you [1:36] can't stop me [1:38] from starting it. [1:40] And a statistic that I like a lot is [1:42] you're 31% smarter in a positive frame [1:45] of mind. [1:46] Source of that is a TED Talk by Shawn [1:49] Achor, Harvard psychologist. I don't [1:52] know if I'm quote psychologist. [1:54] The happy secret to better work, I [1:56] think, is the name of the TED Talk. I [1:57] highly recommend it. It is some of the [1:59] most enjoyable 12 minutes of your life. [2:02] Of course, he talks about happiness and [2:04] his and humor and how it makes you [2:05] smarter. [2:06] And of course, the TED Talk is highly [2:08] entertaining. [2:09] Um so, it's worth listening to. [2:12] So, [2:14] I have an indecent proposal. [2:20] The secret to power negotiations [2:24] is empathy. [2:27] Empathy. [2:29] What? [2:32] Because empathy is the secret to power [2:34] relationships. [2:36] And those of you that are truly great [2:38] negotiators realize the key [2:41] to a powerful negotiation is a [2:43] powerfully strong relationship, a [2:44] powerfully strong connection. [2:46] And many of you instinctively know that [2:48] already. [2:50] But how does empathy play into that? [2:53] Well, I will indecently [2:56] redefine the word [2:58] as the just the transmission of [3:00] information. [3:03] And only. So, it's not agreement, it's [3:05] not disagreement. [3:08] It's not sympathy at all. [3:11] It's not compassion. The reaction to the [3:13] transmission of that information is [3:15] often compassion. [3:18] So, if I use empathy with you, [3:22] you feel compassion from me. [3:25] I don't necessarily have to have [3:27] compassion for you, but you feel it from [3:29] me. [3:30] And there are a couple things that are [3:31] truly irresistible. [3:33] I don't know of any human being on Earth [3:35] that can resist compassion. [3:38] No matter who you are, [3:41] no matter what political, ideological, [3:44] or religious agenda [3:46] you're propagating, [3:48] because com- you react to compassion. It [3:52] moves you more in the direction of the [3:54] other person. [3:56] How could it be, [3:58] no matter who you are, [4:01] even a sociopath, if you will. [4:04] Does empathy work with sociopaths? [4:07] Even sociopaths [4:10] react to compassion. Do they possess it [4:13] for others is a separate issue. [4:15] But do they react to it and how do they [4:17] react to it? When I finish, [4:19] I'll tell you a story [4:21] to help make the case, [4:23] but then I'll lay the groundwork [4:25] along the way. [4:27] So, the next [4:30] indecent thing that I will do. [4:34] How can we all be the same and all of us [4:37] be different? [4:39] How's that possible? [4:41] How is it I'm standing in front of a [4:45] cross-cultural negotiation expert? I [4:49] think it was actually here in [4:50] Switzerland about a year ago. [4:53] And of course, his claim to fame was [4:54] that we have to know Italians, you have [4:57] to know Germans, [4:58] you have to know this, you have to know [5:00] that, you have to be an expert in each [5:02] one. [5:03] And he could tell from the look on my [5:04] face that I wasn't buying any of it. [5:07] And finally, just blurted out, [5:09] "Everybody just wants to know that you [5:11] know where they're coming from." [5:15] My definition of empathy. [5:18] If I know where you're coming from, I [5:19] don't have to agree with it or disagree [5:21] with it. [5:23] How do you know that I know where you're [5:25] coming from? I've got to say it out [5:27] loud. [5:28] And it triggers changes neurochemical [5:30] changes in you that you can't change. [5:33] You can't stop. [5:36] So, the same and different. There is a [5:38] hypothesis, if you will. I don't know [5:40] how the you rigorously prove this. I'm [5:43] not saying psychologists or [5:44] neuroscientists really [5:46] argue with it. [5:49] That we're all born original equipment, [5:51] just like a car, original equipment. [5:54] We're all born with a group of core [5:57] emotions. [6:00] And [6:01] first articulated by psychologist, I [6:03] need I believe Paul Ekman, and there [6:05] were five, [6:07] uh as I recall, anger, fear, disgust, [6:10] happiness. [6:12] And [6:15] I can't remember the fifth. [6:18] Because [6:20] since then, other psychologists, while [6:23] not disagreeing, said say, "Well, [6:24] they're not five, they're seven." [6:27] Or [6:28] it's not happiness, it's joy. [6:32] Academics, [6:33] researchers tend to want to [6:36] argue with one another over nitpicking [6:38] ideas, but nobody wants to argue the [6:40] idea that we're all born with these core [6:41] emotions. [6:44] And then feelings [6:46] are what happens when our interactions [6:48] when our life interacts with reality, [6:51] the world. [6:52] Well, a friend of mine writes a a blog [6:54] that says, "Well, we're all different [6:56] because Eskimos have this word for an [6:59] emotion that no one else in the world [7:00] has." Or there's a South Sea island in [7:02] the Pacific [7:03] where the inhabitants have a word for [7:06] emotions that no one else has. Well, [7:08] they're feelings, the core emotions [7:10] interacting with life. [7:12] So, no matter who you are, [7:15] no matter what your gender, your [7:17] ethnicity, your religion, when you came [7:19] to Earth originally, to the planet, [7:23] you were born with these core emotions. [7:27] Original equipment. And they react the [7:29] same way regardless. [7:31] So, if I use empathy with you, [7:34] you will respond, [7:36] no matter your age, your gender, your [7:38] ethnicity. [7:40] I like to joke that empathy is so [7:42] powerful, [7:44] it's even effective [7:46] with vegans. [7:51] Now, that's powerful. [7:53] There's a joke in the United States, [7:54] "How do you know if somebody's a vegan? [7:55] They'll tell you." [7:57] And then my girlfriend was giving me a [7:59] hard time recently because I grew up in [8:00] a small town in the Midwestern United [8:02] States, in the state Iowa, the state of [8:04] Iowa. [8:05] And we're Those of us that are from [8:07] Iowa, we're very proud of this. [8:09] We think of ourselves as very practical [8:11] people. [8:12] And I was bringing it up in a group [8:13] conversation recently, and she said, [8:15] "You people from Iowa, you're so proud [8:17] of yourselves. You can't wait to tell [8:19] somebody you're from Iowa. [8:21] You're worse than vegans." [8:23] And I thought, "Wow, all right. All [8:25] right. That you know, that's a that's [8:26] that's a mark that I'm would be proud to [8:28] exceed." [8:31] So, when I originally started hearing [8:33] about the difference between emotions [8:34] and feelings, I'm I'm a very practical [8:37] human being. I'm a practitioner. [8:39] I'm a layman. I don't think of myself as [8:40] an ac- academic. I think of myself as a [8:42] very experienced practitioner. [8:45] I thought, "I really don't care [8:48] what the difference between emotions and [8:50] feelings are. That's an academic [8:51] distinction [8:53] that academics, which I now realize I'm [8:55] very hard on academics, while [8:57] simultaneously we need them. [8:59] We need them for the advancement of our [9:00] knowledge and our learning. [9:02] Similarly, I tend to be very hard on [9:04] governments, while simultaneously we [9:06] need governments. We just need to [9:07] understand our limitations. [9:11] But anyway, I thought it was an academic [9:13] distinction that didn't matter until I [9:15] came across the explanation for [9:19] why do you certain people in certain [9:21] parts of the world have words for [9:23] feelings that no one else has. [9:26] Well, if you're born with this original [9:27] equipment emotions, [9:30] and then feelings are what happens when [9:33] your experience reacts, [9:35] that's how everyone in this room can be [9:37] completely different, but at our core, [9:40] exactly the same. [9:42] And that's why how I approach empathy [9:46] will work with each and every one of you [9:48] in this room [9:50] to different degrees, [9:53] but will work with everyone here because [9:55] of these core emotions [9:57] that you were born with. [10:00] Now, another point that's lost is [10:03] most of those [snorts] [10:06] emotions [10:08] are negative. [10:11] In the original five, [10:14] four out of five [10:17] were negative. [10:20] So, if I've learned an ability [10:23] to process those negatives [10:27] that you haven't, [10:30] I hold a distinct advantage [10:34] in communications [10:36] globally [10:39] over you. [10:41] So, if you feel that you're from [10:45] uh Italy and you're an expert on [10:47] Italians, [10:49] and you have to be from Italy to [10:51] understand Italians. [10:54] Well, I understand human emotions. [10:57] And if you're Italian, [10:59] you have human emotions, or German, or [11:02] French, [11:03] or African, or Greek. [11:07] You're born with these core emotions. [11:11] So, I'm going to do something else [11:14] indecent. [11:16] I'm going to offer each of you two [11:18] different phrases [11:21] that I would respectfully [11:24] request, [11:25] challenge, [11:30] that you use in your interactions for [11:32] the rest of this week, [11:36] and I can promise you [11:40] conversations [11:43] that you'll love and remember. [11:47] And then I'll break down [11:49] what you do each time and what to look [11:51] for. [11:54] The first question [11:58] to ask [11:59] to get to know someone faster than you [12:01] could imagine [12:04] would be simply this. [12:06] What do you love [12:09] about coming [12:10] to Davos? [12:12] You can also change them and say the [12:14] Voss, but Davos. [12:17] So, here's what happens when you ask [12:18] somebody that question, and here's how I [12:19] stumbled over this. [12:22] I'm at a function in what is now [12:24] probably burned down in [12:26] uh Bellaire, Beverly Hills in Los [12:28] Angeles couple of years ago. [12:31] Forest Whitaker, the actor, phenomenal [12:33] actor, [12:34] and a great human being, [12:36] has started foundations [12:39] in many of the places that he's done [12:41] movies. He has a foundation for youth in [12:43] Africa, he has a foundation for youth in [12:45] Los Angeles, several places. [12:48] Friend of mine is organizing his [12:49] foundation, [12:51] and I'm there [12:53] because I was delighted to be there, [12:56] and it's a fundraiser, which I ended up [12:58] donating to despite myself. [13:02] But then I see an individual that's a [13:04] friend of my friend, [13:06] and I can tell right away I don't like [13:08] this guy. [13:10] But he's a friend of a friend, [13:12] and he is, if you will, [13:15] a stereotypical entertainment industry [13:18] Los Angeles [13:21] male [13:23] who you can tell he's in love with how [13:25] beautiful he is. [13:29] Very enamored with his own, and quite [13:31] very handsome man, [13:33] and that's not my type. [13:36] I need to speak to him, and I don't want [13:39] to have a forgettable conversation. You [13:41] know, what do you do for a living? Any [13:43] of those questions. What are you doing [13:45] here? How do you know Forest? How do you [13:47] know Dominic? [13:49] He's going to say the things to me he [13:50] says to everyone else. It'll be a [13:52] completely forgettable conversation. [13:55] So, I look at him and I say, [13:57] "What do you love about Los Angeles?" [14:01] And this is what will happen with [14:02] everybody you say this to. [14:04] I saw him transform in front of my eyes. [14:09] And he lit up in a way [14:11] that I saw him energize and made him [14:13] happy. [14:15] And then he told me things about himself [14:19] that I know he never told anybody else [14:21] that night. [14:22] So, when you ask this question, [14:25] you actually open a portal in their [14:27] brain [14:29] to deep thinking. The what question [14:33] creates what Danny Kahneman, [14:35] the winner of Nobel Prize in Behavioral [14:37] Economics 2002 for Prospect Theory, [14:40] would call deep thinking, deep [14:42] introspective thinking, stop you in your [14:44] tracks thinking, [14:46] which is often exhausting. [14:50] Like in any part time of the day, even [14:52] when you have the most energy, if I ask [14:53] you a what question and you answer, and [14:55] I ask you a how question and you answer, [14:58] and I ask you another what question, [15:00] you'll be exhausted. [15:02] That's early in the day. [15:04] Whereas, if it's at the end of the day, [15:06] you don't even have the ability to [15:07] normally answer that question. [15:09] Those of you that had children, and you [15:11] say when they come home from school, and [15:13] you say, "How was your day?" [15:16] And they say, "I forget." [15:20] Because actually it's a deep thinking [15:21] question, and they might not have the [15:23] energy to answer. [15:26] But if I open that portal in your brain, [15:29] and I ask you about what you love, [15:32] you watch the person energize. [15:36] And you can see them you see their eyes [15:38] shift, and you see them shift deeply [15:41] into something they love, and no matter [15:43] what time of day it is, they energize. [15:46] In that moment you made them feel [15:48] better. [15:50] And I delight in that. I delight in [15:53] being able to walk up to anybody [15:55] and in less than 20 seconds [15:58] raise them to a new level, because [16:01] that's what love is. It's this [16:02] tremendously energizing positive thing, [16:05] and everyone has loves. [16:09] So, I'm walking up to a CEO, who's head [16:11] of a [16:12] water company, not long after that. [16:15] And I'm very interested in international [16:17] development, and this is a company that [16:19] provides clean water globally, and I'm [16:21] inspired by that. [16:22] So, I ask him, "What do you love about [16:25] being the CEO of your company?" [16:28] And he says, "I love leading teams. I [16:30] absolutely love leading teams, and I [16:32] love giving shareholders a great return [16:34] on their investment. That's very [16:35] important to me. And then we deliver [16:37] water." And then he named a fourth [16:39] thing. [16:42] So, what did I learn instantly instantly [16:45] in that period of time about him? [16:48] The mission didn't matter. [16:51] Now, as an entrepreneur, I'm a [16:53] mission-first person. [16:57] And I want to make a lot of money. [17:01] But not blood money, not empty money. [17:04] So, the mission's going to be first with [17:06] me. In my company, we make good money. [17:09] And if we coach you and you we train [17:10] you, [17:12] we're going to charge you a lot. [17:14] And if you have a lot at stake, [17:18] we're not going to charge you anywhere [17:19] near compared to how much you're going [17:20] to make. [17:22] Because I want you to see the world in [17:24] color instead of black and white. [17:27] But in this response with this [17:29] individual, what I learned in that [17:30] amount of time was I could never work [17:32] for him. [17:33] Because I would always be a [17:34] mission-first person, [17:36] and there will always be decisions in [17:38] any company where you have to decide [17:40] between the mission and the profit, and [17:42] I'm always going to lean in the [17:43] direction of the mission at the expense [17:46] of profit, and that guy is going to fire [17:48] me over it. [17:50] Simultaneously, [17:52] he could never work for me. [17:55] Because there will be times, and we have [17:57] made decisions, intentional decisions [17:59] that cost us money. [18:01] A friend of mine has said, "The test of [18:04] your core values are, will you lose [18:07] money over them?" [18:09] And on a regular basis, I make decisions [18:11] that cost us money, [18:13] because it follows our core values. So, [18:15] in that short period of time, it was an [18:17] interesting conversation with me with [18:19] that man, but I knew that we would never [18:20] be close. There's no judgment on either [18:22] one of us, not bad nor good. It's just [18:25] that we'll never be close because of [18:27] those distinctions. [18:30] So, what happens [18:32] if they don't love [18:34] what you asked them about? [18:37] So, I'm getting in into a lift. I live [18:39] in Las Vegas. [18:41] I'm getting into a lift, and I expect [18:45] that if you're in the service business, [18:47] you've agreed, almost like the terms and [18:50] conditions in Facebook, right? [18:52] You've agreed that you will provide [18:54] service. [18:56] And I I don't travel light. I travel all [18:58] the time. I don't believe in traveling [19:00] light. I always have at least two [19:02] suitcases full of many things, mostly [19:05] vitamins. [19:09] So, I call the lift, and in Las Vegas, [19:11] they have a choice of where they can [19:13] wait for you in the airport, and this [19:14] guy's at the far side of the parking [19:16] lot. [19:17] And I'm dragging my suitcases over, my [19:19] hands full, two suitcases, two shoulder [19:21] bags. [19:23] And as I'm getting close, [19:25] he's not moving a muscle. [19:27] Doesn't get out of the [19:28] SUV to help. [19:30] Doesn't open the back end of the SUV. [19:33] I walk around to the back of the SUV, he [19:35] still hasn't popped out. I got to figure [19:37] out how to open it. I got to load my [19:39] bags, everything. Guy hasn't moved a [19:42] muscle. [19:43] I get in, and I it you know, emotions [19:47] have a feeling, have an energy. I I [19:49] absolutely believe that there's emotions [19:51] that are projected in person [19:53] through energy fields and I can just [19:55] feel [19:56] that he's seething. [19:58] And he's just waiting for me to say [20:01] something of complaint [20:03] so that he can kick me out of his [20:05] vehicle, which is his right. [20:08] And we take off and my instinctive [20:12] anger [20:13] is reacting to his anger and I can feel [20:15] the downward spiral [20:17] and I envision [20:20] myself standing on the side of the [20:22] highway [20:25] while he is driving away after he's [20:27] kicked me out of his vehicle because [20:29] we've had an argument. [20:31] And I would rather not walk home on the [20:34] freeway carrying my bags. [20:39] And it looks like he hates what he does [20:41] for a living. [20:43] So I say, "What do you love [20:47] about driving for Lyft?" [20:50] Here's the secret. [20:53] He immediately launched into why he was [20:56] driving for Lyft. [20:58] And he um it was in support [21:02] of his grandson. [21:05] And his daughter had had a bad [21:08] relationship where she'd become [21:11] impregnated, the guy abandoned her, she [21:12] was lost, she moved in with him. She [21:15] worked as a nurse and driving for Lyft [21:18] gave him the opportunity [21:20] to give his grandson a better life [21:23] whenever his daughter had to be home [21:26] because she had to work specific shifts. [21:30] So [21:32] I couldn't help but be touched [21:35] by his what he loved about why he was [21:38] there. And this is what will happen no [21:40] matter what you ask anybody because they [21:42] may not love where they are or why what [21:45] they're doing there, but they will love [21:47] why they're there. [21:50] Which is another delightful thing to go [21:52] through. My company's training in Dubai [21:53] about 10 months ago. [21:56] We have an exercise where we make you do [21:58] this. [22:00] You don't get to stand on the sidelines. [22:03] When you come to train with me [22:05] we're going to make you try this in [22:07] person to feel it. [22:09] And I'm looking around the room, there's [22:10] about 70 people in the room and there's [22:12] one individual that is not engaged in [22:14] the exercise. [22:17] That makes you my victim. [22:21] I'm going to come down and sit down with [22:23] you [22:24] and I'm going to say, "What do you [22:25] love?" [22:27] And since we were in Dubai [22:29] I said, "What do you love about being in [22:31] Dubai?" [22:33] And he looked at me and he says, "I [22:34] don't love Dubai. I think Dubai is a [22:36] polished piece of [22:40] garbage." That wasn't the word he used. [22:43] But to me then I This is fascinating [22:46] because I know you're not here as a [22:47] condition of your parole. [22:51] And I began to speak with him and I [22:52] found out he was he was he was born and [22:55] grew up in England but he was a [22:57] Palestinian ethnicity and he was working [23:00] in Dubai to send money back to his [23:02] family. [23:04] Admirable qualities. Someone I could be [23:07] close to. [23:08] Loyalty, family, hard work, opportunity, [23:12] freedom. [23:14] Those are core values that I learned in [23:16] those few moments that I was with him. [23:19] So what do you love about pick it when [23:22] whoever you talk to? [23:23] Watch them shift in front of your eyes [23:28] to a better place. [23:30] And then you will hear phenomenal things [23:32] about them. [23:34] Sentence one. [23:36] The other sentence. [23:40] Seems like you have a reason for saying [23:42] that. [23:45] There will not be any conversation that [23:47] you have with anyone that will not draw [23:50] them out. [23:52] You go to Washington D.C. today [23:56] and say [24:01] "What do you love about Donald Trump?" [24:03] "I love Donald Trump." [24:06] After they tell you, "Seems like you [24:07] have a reason for saying that." [24:10] [snorts] [24:11] Same person, "What do you love about [24:12] Donald Trump?" "I think he's the worst [24:14] thing that ever could have happened to [24:15] American politics." [24:17] "Seems like you have a reason for saying [24:19] that." [24:22] They do. [24:25] They want to be able to tell you. It [24:28] doesn't matter [24:30] what opinion they represent. This [24:32] empathy concept, the feeling of [24:34] compassion. Everybody wants to open up [24:37] with you as long as you won't argue with [24:39] them. [24:41] I could pick any leader of any Western [24:44] European [24:46] country [24:48] sit him down with Vladimir Putin and ask [24:50] him about the war and if that leader [24:52] instead of lecturing him [24:55] would say, "Seems like you have a [24:56] reason." [24:59] Get him to talk and potentially hear [25:01] what he's saying out loud. [25:04] Find the things the two of you can [25:06] potentially agree on. Even if you don't [25:09] agree, the act of feeling heard, being [25:12] made to feel heard [25:14] triggers someone feeling compassion. [25:17] There isn't a human being on earth that [25:19] will not draw closer to you if they feel [25:22] like they're receiving compassion from [25:24] you. The secret to power negotiations is [25:27] power relationships. [25:30] The application of empathy. Not you [25:32] understanding but you demonstrating to [25:34] the other person that you understand. [25:38] I first started doing this [25:41] in New York City when I was an FBI agent [25:43] and we had a case that was tried in open [25:47] court against an individual who was a [25:49] legitimate Islamic cleric. [25:51] Even though we had charges against him, [25:54] none of us have ever disagreed whether [25:56] or not he had credentials [25:58] that justified that he was a legitimate [26:00] cleric. There were things that he did [26:03] that were against American law but those [26:05] two things could be simultaneously true. [26:08] We had Muslim witnesses testifying in [26:11] open court against someone that they [26:13] thought it was wrong to advocate murder [26:15] on behalf of political religious [26:16] beliefs. [26:18] Those are interesting arguments. [26:21] What did I say to get them to [26:23] voluntarily testify? [26:25] I would sit down with them and I would [26:26] say "You believe that for the last 200 [26:30] years there's been a succession of [26:32] American governments that have been [26:34] anti-Islamic." [26:37] And they would [26:39] look startled [26:42] and say, "Yeah." [26:45] Now did I agree? [26:47] I said, "You believe." [26:52] Did I disagree? I never said, "But we [26:54] have a First Amendment and the First [26:56] Amendment promises this and that and our [26:58] country was founded on the [27:00] belief of freedom of religion." [27:03] I never agreed or disagreed or explained [27:05] and they were shocked [27:06] that I could say that and they would [27:08] bond with me. [27:10] And they would be honest with me. [27:13] And they would be willing to be open and [27:15] honest from that point forward. So [27:19] empathy is not agreement. [27:21] Empathy is not sympathy. [27:24] Empathy is not compassion. It's a [27:26] precursor to compassion. You will feel [27:29] compassion from me. I don't necessarily [27:32] have to feel it. And the important thing [27:34] is how does it feel to you? [27:37] Because you will draw closer to me and [27:39] you will be more honest with me [27:42] because of those five core emotions [27:45] that I talked about from the very [27:46] beginning [27:48] that each and every one of you [27:49] possesses. [27:52] Which makes you vulnerable [27:55] to the feeling of connection. [27:59] Regardless of how the world has treated [28:01] you after you were born [28:04] because you were still born with this. [28:11] The last point I'll make is I started [28:12] this [28:14] negotiating with an Al-Qaeda terrorist [28:17] about 20 years ago. He's holding an [28:19] American for hostage. [28:21] $10 million ransom demand. [28:26] The terrorist said the ransom demand was [28:29] not ransom but [28:31] war damages [28:33] for 500 years of oppression in the [28:35] Philippines [28:37] from the colonial powers that have been [28:39] through there, the Spanish, the [28:40] Japanese, and the Americans. [28:42] And he further contended that they [28:43] weren't Filipinos but they were Moros [28:46] from a separate Moro Islamic homeland [28:50] that was being held up and was being [28:53] oppressed by puppet government in Manila [28:56] dominated by the most recent colonial [28:58] power, the United States. [29:00] And we argued and debated. [29:03] What does an American today have to do [29:06] with what happened that the Spanish did [29:08] 500 years ago? [29:10] And how is that $10 million? [29:12] And finally one day we decided to no [29:15] longer debate or argue or show a [29:16] counterpoint. We were going to say [29:18] everything back to him that he was [29:20] saying to us. [29:22] And the negotiator that I was coaching, [29:24] I said, "You will summarize his facts, [29:28] not ours, his." [29:30] And he will say [29:32] "That's right." [29:35] And everything will change. [29:38] And everyone said, "Sure, right, of [29:39] course." No, go ahead. Go ahead. Try it. [29:45] And we got the terrorist on the phone [29:47] and then the negotiator that I was [29:48] coaching. [29:50] And he was only coachable. He knew [29:51] nothing about negotiations prior. [29:54] The only thing I would ask of you is are [29:56] you coachable? [29:58] And he repeated everything. [30:01] Went on and on, 500 years, colonial [30:04] powers, [30:06] Islamic homeland, [30:09] and then went silent. [30:12] And the terrorist on the other end of [30:13] the phone [30:14] said, [30:16] "That's right." [30:18] And in that moment, [30:20] the ransom went from 10 million to zero. [30:25] Now, the kidnapping took a couple more [30:27] twists and turns over the course of a [30:28] couple of coming months. No ransom was [30:31] ever mentioned again. [30:32] Non-monetary demands came up. [30:35] We were relentless with empathy. [30:39] And then on Maundy Thursday, [30:41] the Thursday before Easter, [30:44] on the anniversary [30:46] of the night that Jesus prayed in [30:48] Gethsemane, [30:50] our hostage walked away. [30:54] He simply walked away. [30:56] Military found him, flew him back to [30:59] Manila, press conference, we rescued [31:01] him, gave him a ride. [31:04] We rescued him. [31:06] But the important thing was I was back [31:07] in the Philippines 3 weeks later. I went [31:09] to the negotiator that I'd been [31:10] coaching. [31:12] And he said, "You're never going to [31:13] guess who called me on the phone." [31:16] I don't know. [31:18] The Al-Qaeda terrorist. [31:20] What did he say? [31:22] He said, "Have you been promoted?" [31:27] [laughter] [31:29] "I don't know what you said. I was going [31:32] to kill the American. [31:34] You stopped me from doing it. [31:36] You should be promoted." [31:40] What did he say? [31:42] No matter how it turns out, he still [31:45] felt respected and connected and would [31:47] talk to the negotiator that I spoke to [31:50] under any circumstances again. This is [31:52] what I'm asking. The tides of history [31:54] change. You are the captain of your [31:57] ship. [32:00] The tides may change, but as long as you [32:02] approach people [32:05] with respect and empathy, they will [32:07] always be willing to talk with you [32:10] again, regardless of how the tides have [32:12] separated you, the governments, [32:15] whatever they may be. Always leave [32:17] people [32:19] willing to speak to you again. [32:21] That's all I ask of you. [32:24] To always leave people willing to speak [32:26] to you again. [32:28] You will make a difference [32:31] that will echo [32:33] across the world. [32:34] Thank you. [32:37] [applause] [32:43] So, if you learned something from from [32:45] Chris, we're going to be doing this [32:46] again a little bit differently in 2 [32:48] days. So, on the 22nd here, he will be [32:51] on a panel with myself, a CIA station [32:55] chief, a a Department of Justice head [32:58] attorney for the District of Columbia, [33:00] and a US ambassador. And we're going to [33:02] talk about diplomacy. We're going to [33:03] talk about the state of the world, and [33:06] you'll be able to learn more from Chris [33:08] Voss. But I have to ask you, [33:10] um [33:11] because you love to learn. It's all over [33:13] you, Chris. What are you learning today? [33:17] Oh, wow. Um [33:20] The different takes and the different [33:21] opinions on AI and the biohacking. [33:24] Um everyone that I've met here so far [33:28] and had any kind of a conversation, [33:31] your journey to this room [33:35] is utterly fascinating. [33:38] And I'm loving hearing [snorts] about it [33:42] and how you developed and how you see [33:44] things. So, to me, this is [33:46] this is a this is a buffet of ideas. [33:51] Let's give him another round, Chris. [33:52] I'll see you in a couple days, my [33:53] friend. Thanks again.

===FILE=== 0mUMncgUCAI - STOP Letting Yes Ruin Your Sales.txt
https://youtu.be/0mUMncgUCAI
STOP! Letting Yes Ruin Your Sales!

[0:00] How many times have you left a meeting [0:02] thinking you'd secured a yes only to [0:05] have the deal fall apart later? It's [0:08] happened to the best of you. Today, [0:12] we're diving into an indecent proposal. [0:15] Why yes is often the worst thing you can [0:18] hear in a [0:19] negotiation. And what should you be [0:22] striving for [0:24] instead? Forget everything you knew [0:27] about getting to yes. [0:30] At its best, yes, is an aspiration, a [0:34] hope. As the saying goes, hope is not a [0:36] strategy. Hope is a drug. Hopium. Hope [0:40] clouds [0:42] observation. Now, the Black Swan Group [0:44] used to say, "Yes, how." Now, we've [0:47] updated that. [0:49] Yes, and how is [0:52] everything. Think about it this way. [0:54] Yes. [0:56] It can mask hidden agendas, unresolved [0:59] concerns, or even outright [1:01] lies. There are three kinds of yes: [1:04] commitment, confirmation, and [1:05] counterfeit. A lie. And the vast [1:08] majority of yeses are [1:12] counterfeit. Instead of chasing yes, the [1:15] Black Swan Group teaches you to aim [1:17] for that's right. This phrase signals [1:22] genuine agreement and understanding. [1:25] When somebody is all in, when they [1:26] believe what you've just said is the [1:29] truth, they say that's [1:32] right. Every time someone says that's [1:35] right, they're moving in your [1:38] direction. They're acknowledging that [1:40] you get [1:41] them. The ultimate that's right comes [1:44] from an epiphany, a moment of insight [1:47] they gained because of something you [1:49] said. It triggers oxytocin, the love [1:53] drug, the bonding [1:55] neurochemical. They bonded with you and [1:58] you've established [2:01] trust. Now, that's right still needs [2:05] how. The difference is that's right is [2:09] where you want to proceed into how from. [2:13] In fact, that's right can be so powerful [2:18] that if you just stay silent after [2:20] hearing it, they just might outline the [2:24] how for [2:27] you. So, why does yes fall so short? [2:31] It's about experience. People are [2:33] conditioned to expect hidden hooks and [2:36] micro commitments in a yes. Micro traps, [2:40] tie downs. [2:42] They've been trapped by it in the [2:44] past. Someone's used it to corner [2:47] them. Can you expect good implementation [2:51] of a deal where a counterpart has been [2:55] cornered? Instead of trying to move from [2:58] a counterfeit yes to a commitment [3:01] yes, you want to go for [3:05] no. Here's how to transform your [3:07] yesoriented questions into no oriented [3:10] ones. Few examples are instead of do you [3:13] agree ask do you disagree instead of [3:16] would you like to ask are you against or [3:20] is this a ridiculous [3:22] idea? As I mentioned earlier that top 10 [3:25] oriented questions PDF can help you get [3:28] there. But what about getting to [3:30] yes? What about yesable [3:34] propositions? You might be thinking but [3:36] I make deals all the time with yes. [3:39] actually not as many as you should make. [3:41] You lose deals all the time by going for [3:44] yes. You're playing at the low win [3:45] table. You compromise, concede, cut your [3:48] price, and still have implementation [3:51] problems. Your deal pipeline is poor, [3:54] your referral pipeline is anemic, and [3:56] you live in a quarter to quarter [3:59] anxiety. Yes, is killing [4:02] you. So, what should you do? It's [4:05] simple. Get out of the yes business [4:07] altogether and get into the agreement [4:09] and long-term trusted relationship [4:12] business. Focus on understanding empathy [4:15] and finding mutually beneficial [4:17] solutions, even the black swans, things [4:19] you didn't even think of in the first [4:21] place. Strive for that's right, and [4:24] watch your deals close more smoothly and [4:27] your relationships [4:30] flourish. Negotiation is a perishable [4:33] skill. What does that mean? What that [4:35] means is when the sun rises tomorrow, [4:38] your choices for your ability only one [4:40] or three places for you to be. The same, [4:44] better, or worse. That's it. Your three [4:48] options. Two out of three of [4:51] those require involvement from you. For [4:55] more on this, check out the Black Swan [4:58] Group's article on the top four [5:01] nooriented questions. [5:04] We'll link it in the description.

===FILE=== 1ZJG9PJfmss - Chris Voss Business Keynote Speaker.txt
https://youtu.be/1ZJG9PJfmss
Chris Voss, Business Keynote Speaker

[0:00] [Music] [0:12] uh if you will please welcome the stage [0:15] give a big new york welcome to mr chris [0:18] boss [0:20] all right chris voss huh [0:27] good call all right is uh here we go [0:29] let's start with this see if this works [0:32] love affair with the word hostage listen [0:37] you do not hold people hostage or engage [0:40] in ransom taking to get a hundred [0:43] percent of your way they're trying to [0:44] hold veterans hostage to force obamacare [0:46] on the american people you cannot [0:48] negotiate with a hostage situation they [0:51] had to take the country hostage whether [0:53] or not [0:54] it's it's correct to kind of use the [0:57] hostage terms of by politicians when you [1:00] see this as somebody who's negotiated a [1:02] lot when you see what's going on in [1:03] washington what jumps out to you [1:05] well there's two things about that you [1:08] know on a personal note i like that they [1:10] use the word because then it gives me a [1:11] chance to be on your show [1:13] [Laughter] [1:16] i haven't been able to focus on anything [1:18] his company is called the black swan [1:20] group that is the baddest ass name i [1:22] have ever heard i love that now what is [1:24] the black swan group that's like the [1:26] coolest what is that [1:28] oh thank you very much uh a black swan [1:30] is uh something unusual that has a great [1:32] impact and we like to think that the way [1:34] we negotiate has a great impact [1:39] all right how often do you get a chance [1:40] to tell a joke that makes anderson [1:42] cooper laugh right [1:44] all right but there's a uh there's a [1:46] communication lesson in there there's a [1:47] negotiation lesson there there's uh [1:50] there's a sales lesson in there [1:52] buried in that what do you think it is [1:58] i'm sorry [2:00] what do you think the lesson is what is [2:01] it [2:03] see the thing that i love about hostage [2:05] negotiation will come to learn is when [2:08] we invented this back in the 1970s we [2:10] didn't know it was all neuroscience [2:12] based [2:13] you know we were psychologists [2:14] psychologists did a great job before we [2:16] could actually learn inside look inside [2:18] the brain and see how it works [2:20] everything we did in hostage [2:21] negotiations backed up by neuroscience [2:24] and communication the neuroscience [2:26] negotiation communication lesson here is [2:28] you're up to 31 smarter in a positive [2:30] frame of mind [2:31] 31 that's no small jump [2:35] the mood that we have [2:37] directly correlates to how efficiently [2:40] your brain functions [2:42] for hostage negotiators [2:44] we would calm people down we'd use the [2:46] thing called the late night fm dj voice [2:52] and people calm down we didn't know why [2:54] it worked we just knew it worked it [2:55] actually turned their brain down [2:58] 31 smarter in a positive frame of mind [3:00] what's the lesson here for you [3:02] now as a hostage negotiator you know do [3:04] i show up at a bank going like hey [3:07] i'm from iowa i just flew in boy my arms [3:09] tired i'm not telling jokes [3:12] you know i didn't i didn't go on [3:13] anderson cooper telling a joke but i did [3:16] use humor humor appropriate to the [3:17] context [3:20] when you're using humor you're up to 31 [3:23] smarter [3:24] think about that [3:27] you're also [3:28] causing your counterpart to be up to 31 [3:30] percent smarter putting them in the mood [3:32] one of our one of our terms for [3:34] negotiation is flexibility never be so [3:36] sure of what you want that you wouldn't [3:37] take something better [3:40] cool all right so that sounds cool i'll [3:42] do that how do i get something better to [3:44] happen [3:46] appropriate humor in the moment i don't [3:48] tell that joke [3:50] jeffrey tubin does not give me the best [3:53] commercial my company ever had the black [3:56] swan group that's the baddest ass name i [3:58] ever heard what is that he does that [4:00] spontaneously [4:02] i kick i cause him to have the oppo the [4:05] id in his head [4:06] he doesn't know it came from me because [4:08] i made him feel better he gives me [4:10] something enormously valuable [4:12] receiving nothing in return [4:16] but it's contextual to the moment [4:17] context is always important [4:20] a friend of mine is telling me he's in a [4:22] negotiation he works for raytheon what [4:24] is raytheon [4:25] raytheon is the government's arms dealer [4:28] right [4:28] so weapons on behalf of the u.s [4:30] government arms dealer around the world [4:32] they're selling weapons to korea [4:34] south korea they got a problem the [4:35] relationship is breaking down they send [4:37] my friend to south korea to negotiate [4:39] with these guys [4:41] south koreans are so mad at these guys [4:42] they put them in a room in the middle of [4:43] this in the middle of a building a room [4:45] that's got no windows [4:47] you know i'm surprised they didn't [4:48] waterboard them when they came in [4:50] but they got them in a room with no [4:51] windows [4:52] because they're trying to make it [4:54] unpleasant for them and it's an [4:55] unpleasant negotiation one in the middle [4:57] of this negotiation the lights go out so [4:59] if your room with no windows you're in [5:01] pitch black [5:02] the lights go completely out there [5:03] sitting there he says after a couple [5:05] minutes sitting in the p in the pitch [5:06] black he says [5:08] whose hand is that on my leg [5:12] and the lights come back on and they all [5:13] laugh [5:15] and then they make the deal [5:17] now of course they felt better about [5:19] each other but they simultaneously felt [5:20] better about each other and got smarter [5:22] in the moment [5:23] this is crazy here's how crazy this is [5:27] and here's how you can begin to override [5:29] your system [5:31] and hack your system because two out of [5:33] three in this room are not normally in a [5:35] positive frame of mind there's a number [5:36] of things we know about the types of [5:39] human beings that survived on a planet [5:41] and regardless of gender or ethnicity [5:44] we break down pretty much into three [5:46] types fight flight and make friends now [5:48] to make friends type [5:50] from the caveman days is normally in a [5:52] pretty good mood the fight flight guys [5:54] i'm a fight guy [5:55] you know we're not running around a [5:57] positive frame of mind on a regular [5:58] basis so we're actually not tapping into [6:00] our full mental capacity how can you [6:02] hack that if you're in one of those [6:04] types if you're like me they did a [6:06] psychological experiment where they [6:08] asked people to hold a pencil in their [6:09] in their mouth without letting their [6:11] lips touch it [6:13] what are you doing [6:15] you're smiling right [6:17] can we [6:18] fool ourselves if we know in a positive [6:21] frame of mind [6:22] what happens if you don't know you're in [6:23] a positive frame of mind is there a [6:25] hardware connection between the facial [6:27] muscles the nerves in the brain [6:28] they did the experiment their brain [6:30] picked up anyway [6:32] they didn't know they were smiling [6:35] you forced a smile onto your face if i [6:37] look at you and i smile [6:41] i hit your mirror neurons it's an [6:42] involuntary reaction [6:45] i can pick anybody out in this room if i [6:47] smile at you even if you frown back at [6:50] me you're going to be fighting the smile [6:51] on your face on your uh [6:54] fighting the smile in your brain with [6:55] your frown but that still means i'm [6:57] still hitting your neurons you can't [6:59] stop it if you can hear [7:01] i can hit your mirror neurons if you can [7:03] see [7:04] i can hit your mirror neurons it's an [7:05] involuntary response here's another [7:08] crazy piece of information along these [7:10] lines that i found out recently [7:13] they gave botox to women who are [7:14] depressed [7:16] this now this is the our sample group [7:19] happens to be women do not be [7:22] um misled by the fact that they're women [7:24] because this work because they're human [7:26] beings not because they're women you [7:28] gotta be careful the kind of data you [7:29] get if you misinterpret data [7:31] then you say things like playing [7:33] basketball makes you tall [7:38] you gotta understand how you interpret [7:40] your data so sample size as women this [7:42] works because they're human beings not [7:44] because they're women they're depressed [7:46] they give them botox so they can't frown [7:48] anymore [7:51] the mood instantly elevates [7:54] instantly [7:56] because they override the system if [7:58] you're a natural frowner you're hurting [7:59] yourself [8:02] bad news about that experiment is with [8:04] botox they also have trouble smiling so [8:06] they can't elevate the rest of the way [8:08] up there [8:10] so neuroscience rule make yourself smile [8:13] you'll hack your system you'll [8:14] communicate better [8:16] you will get more [8:18] you will get surprises in your deals as [8:20] unexpected stuff you get you get the [8:22] jeffrey tube and give you something [8:24] enormously valuable you didn't give them [8:25] anything in return [8:28] so [8:30] let me see if i can tell you a little [8:31] bit more about myself [8:32] i was the fbi's lead international [8:34] kidnapping negotiator what did that mean [8:36] what that meant was any american got [8:38] kidnapped anywhere in the world it was [8:40] my job to come up with a negotiation [8:42] strategy that got you out set the stage [8:45] for us to follow on and get the bad guys [8:47] afterwards effectively the way that we [8:49] ran the program was it's the same reason [8:51] you give a bank teller bait money [8:54] bank robber comes in you don't want the [8:56] bank teller to get killed [8:58] money's great evidence you actually want [9:00] the bank robber to leave with some money [9:03] if he gets all the way back to his [9:04] hideout he divides up the money then you [9:05] get the people that work with him it's a [9:07] pretty good system [9:09] so that's what i did [9:11] and i worked kidnappings all over the [9:13] world so if an american got grabbed [9:14] someplace [9:16] and let's make a distinction this is not [9:18] americans getting arrested by a [9:20] government in north korea that's an [9:22] illegal detention that wasn't my thing [9:24] what i did was kidnappers criminals [9:26] terrorists that was my job [9:29] so you might ask yourself all right so [9:30] how busy is the lead international [9:33] kidnapping negotiator [9:35] well it's a big world and a lot of [9:37] americans doing really stupid things [9:43] so you call it on a regular basis [9:46] but this instance in particular in haiti [9:48] haiti is a little bit different ball [9:49] game [9:51] um [9:53] a lot of dual nationals getting grabbed [9:54] in haiti bad guys don't know they're [9:56] taking americans they're dual nationals [9:59] now this is happening on a regular basis [10:01] because do you guys know this and this [10:04] is one of the reasons why i'm an [10:05] unabashed [10:07] patriot fan of the united states [10:10] we're not perfect we got our [10:11] shortcomings [10:13] i think i think we're a phenomenal place [10:15] how many countries in the world [10:18] if you're born there are you a citizen [10:21] do you know [10:25] i grew up in iowa i know the accent [10:26] doesn't sound like i grew up in iowa but [10:28] i grew up in iowa i grew up there i [10:29] thought i was born here i'm entitled to [10:31] citizenship it's the way the world it's [10:33] it's the way things should be no it's [10:35] not [10:36] it's argued that there are only two [10:37] developed nations on the entire planet [10:41] that have birthright by citizen by [10:43] citizenship by birth [10:45] i believe the latin term is just just [10:47] soleil which is right of the soil those [10:49] of you can speak latin forgive me for my [10:51] butchering of the pronunciation two [10:53] countries in the entire world two [10:55] developed nations us and canada not one [10:57] country in europe you're born in england [10:59] you get citizenship now [11:02] you're born in australia you get [11:03] citizenship no they'd laugh at you they [11:05] think that's hysterical united states [11:07] right of birth as it turns out it's [11:09] largely a creature a thought and idea of [11:13] the americas [11:14] most of the countries in north and south [11:16] america for whatever reason how these [11:18] cultures came to be here we believe [11:20] in citizenship by birthright [11:23] what does this have to do with haiti [11:25] haitian moms no [11:27] the very best gift they could possibly [11:29] give to their child on their child's [11:30] literal first birthday is a gift of [11:32] american citizenship [11:34] and privileges and opportunities [11:37] that brings [11:39] salvation moms one way or another [11:41] illegal legal or illegal or finding a [11:43] way to uh [11:45] american soil so the child can be born [11:47] an american citizen [11:48] that's how that's why the bad guys don't [11:50] know they're grabbing americans they [11:51] think they're grabbing haiti haitians [11:54] now at the time also recognition [11:57] kidnapping is a business [12:00] i i'm i'm the most practiced negotiator [12:03] on international commodities and many [12:04] other hostage negotiators kidnapping is [12:07] a business's commodity business to us [12:09] it's a horrible event to the kidnappers [12:12] it's a job it's what they do [12:14] it's commodities business commodity [12:15] happens to be human beings they don't [12:17] care it's what they do [12:18] they got a division of labor [12:20] they got people that acquire the [12:22] commodity [12:23] they got people that transport the [12:25] commodity they got people that house the [12:26] commodity they got people that release [12:28] the commodity they got people that [12:30] handle the transactions for the [12:31] commodity [12:33] they get a boss that sits back and [12:34] watches everybody and criticizes what [12:36] they do [12:37] just like everybody else has a boss it [12:38] criticizes what you do [12:41] you guys you guys saw the movie man on [12:43] fire with denzel washington right [12:45] who do you negotiate with in that movie [12:48] the voice [12:51] 's job was to negotiate [12:54] it's a business [12:56] haitian kidnapping business at the time [12:58] the bad guys got a great business model [13:00] it's actually i was impressed with what [13:02] they'd come to as a business model [13:04] carjacker car with more than one person [13:07] in it [13:09] let one person go keep the other person [13:11] in the car [13:13] you've immediately handled your [13:14] notifications you don't have to worry [13:16] about marketing if you will [13:23] you pre-qualified your customer [13:27] if they got a car they got money for a [13:29] ransom [13:30] in haiti you got a car you got some [13:32] dough you got money for a car and gas [13:34] you can pay ransom you're pre-qualified [13:38] and what happens if you grab the one [13:41] person in a family that nobody likes [13:44] you got a car [13:50] pretty sharp right very short business [13:53] model [13:55] so i get a call one day [13:57] 12 year old boy in haiti has been [13:58] grabbed told your boy is an american [14:00] citizen his father is not his father [14:03] knows [14:05] that his son is an american citizen [14:07] and because of that he's supposed to get [14:08] help from the u.s government goes to the [14:11] united states government says my son's a [14:13] citizen he's been kidnapped [14:16] and the state department says the fbi's [14:17] going to be there to help you [14:19] put my next slide or put my slides back [14:21] up please i'm not sure [14:24] what went through his mind when he heard [14:26] that [14:27] but i'm sure that probably about 15 [14:28] minutes later he expected to hear a [14:32] and these guys would be there [14:35] at his door [14:37] maybe [14:40] they'd have fbi hats on [14:44] but instead 15 minutes later he gets a [14:46] call from some guy in washington dc [14:48] named chris foss [14:50] and he [14:51] literally says to me on the phone [14:53] you're in washington dc [14:56] how you gonna help me [15:02] now how much time have i got before this [15:03] guy hangs up the phone [15:08] seconds right [15:10] how much time do i got [15:12] you or me what do you say [15:18] how long do you have to make a first [15:20] impression do you know [15:25] seven seconds [15:26] same amount of time as me [15:29] when you're making a first impression [15:33] you think people aren't saying to [15:35] themselves [15:36] how you gonna help me [15:41] you think they're not saying that to [15:42] themselves [15:45] in that seven seconds [15:48] what do you have to establish [15:52] in that seven seconds what did i have to [15:55] establish [15:57] trust what else [15:59] confidence [16:00] not confidence close competency [16:04] not [16:05] the same thing [16:08] you got the same amount of time as me [16:11] you got to establish the exact same [16:12] things i had to establish [16:14] you got somebody saying to you about you [16:18] in their head the same thing that that [16:19] father said [16:21] to me on the phone how you gonna help me [16:25] it's the same thing [16:28] what do you say [16:33] you're me what do you say [16:38] now the reason why i knew what to say to [16:40] this father is because i've done it [16:41] wrong in the past [16:43] first time i showed up in the [16:44] philippines on a case we're going to [16:45] talk about in a few minutes i did it [16:46] wrong they walked me into a room [16:49] the entire heads of the government are [16:50] there [16:51] because it's american it's been grabbed [16:53] i've been invited in by the ambassador [16:55] the ambassador's personally signed off [16:58] on me coming in the head of our office [16:59] in manila has brought me in everybody [17:01] other than the president of philippines [17:03] is in a room the only reason the [17:04] president is not there is his personal [17:06] advisor is [17:07] secretary of defense is there head of [17:09] the police everybody is there [17:12] and basically in summon substance what [17:14] they say how are you going to help us [17:17] i make the mistake of laying out my [17:18] resume [17:20] fbi agent [17:22] hostage negotiator we're terrorism won [17:25] the attorney general's award for [17:26] excellence investigation the fbi agents [17:29] association award for distinguished and [17:31] exemplary service [17:33] been on a terrorist task force in new [17:34] york city for 14 years not only have i [17:37] been trained by the fbi and scotland [17:39] yard i write the book i wrote the book [17:42] that we train from now [17:46] i will tell you they were suitably [17:47] unimpressed [17:50] they may as well have yawned right in my [17:52] face [17:54] i remember walking out of that meeting [17:55] the head of our office goes those guys [17:57] are disrespectful they challenge your [17:58] credentials i'm from iowa i go like how [18:00] cool was that when did i ever get to [18:02] argue with the secretary of defense of [18:03] an entire country [18:09] why is that why why is me you laying out [18:11] me laying out my resume you laying out [18:13] your resume [18:14] stupid [18:17] it's all about you [18:18] number one it's all about me but number [18:20] two your resume correlates loosely [18:23] with whether or not you know what you're [18:24] doing [18:27] if your resume correlated accurately [18:29] with what you did you guys would never [18:30] make a bad hire would you [18:34] what'd i say to that father [18:37] here's what i said [18:39] all right so [18:41] haitian kidnappers are not killing [18:42] kidnap victims these days i realize it's [18:45] really stupid because they kill each [18:46] other to drop up a hat [18:48] but they're not killing kidnap victims [18:51] now today is thursday and haitian [18:53] kidnappers love the party on saturday [18:56] night [18:58] so if you say the things that i want you [18:59] to say when [19:01] i want you to sing [19:03] we'll have your son out late friday [19:05] early saturday morning [19:07] he said tell me what you want me to do [19:13] and we had a son out saturday morning [19:17] let's break down a little bit what i [19:19] said what i didn't say [19:22] first of all [19:23] which took more time [19:26] me laying out my resume [19:28] or me laying out what he was faced with [19:33] it took less time for me to lay out what [19:35] he was faced with didn't it [19:37] i will tell you also in the course of [19:39] getting his son out he never asked me [19:42] how long had been an fbi agent [19:44] he never asked me how long i've been a [19:45] negotiator he never asked me how many [19:48] countries i'd negotiated in he never [19:50] asked me how many cases in haiti had [19:52] negotiated and he never even asked me [19:54] how many times i've been to haiti you [19:56] know how many times i've been to haiti [19:59] never [20:00] i've never been to haiti [20:03] did i speak french did i speak creole [20:05] that he asked me those questions [20:07] and you may have asked yourself already [20:09] you know there's basically 168 countries [20:11] in this world a lot of languages how [20:12] many languages does chris ball speak if [20:14] he negotiated all over the world and by [20:16] now you realize the answer to that is [20:18] barely one [20:24] he didn't ask me any of those questions [20:27] i told him what he was facing because [20:29] when someone says how you gonna help me [20:30] their first question is okay so you've [20:32] been doing this for a long time do you [20:34] see what i see [20:37] do you know what i'm looking at [20:42] i laid it out for him and i offered him [20:44] the slightest bit of insight [20:48] and they say to themselves wow if you [20:50] see clearly what's in front of me [20:53] there's a really good chance you know [20:54] what you're doing [20:57] do i have to explain this to you [20:59] do i have to explain to you my [21:00] challenges [21:02] you lay it out one or two things happen [21:04] they say to you that's right or they say [21:06] no that's not it this is it [21:08] what happens when they say that's not it [21:10] this is it [21:12] you're in dialogue [21:15] you're in collaboration instantly you're [21:17] trying to get to dialogue and [21:19] collaboration instantly aren't you [21:22] and many people don't realize that when [21:23] somebody corrects you that means you're [21:25] in collaboration you're in dialogue [21:27] and you're you're on your way with that [21:30] here's a couple of other things i did [21:32] not do [21:33] and one of them is probably the two the [21:36] two worst habits you have [21:40] did i try to get him to say yes [21:46] you guys are hardwired to hear yes you [21:49] guys are desperate for it you guys you [21:50] guys got an addiction to yes [21:54] you didn't know it was going to be that [21:55] kind of a meeting did you [21:57] hi hi chris [22:01] it's so bad here's how bad it is and [22:04] getting you out of that you think [22:06] getting people to say yes the yes [22:07] momentum the yesable proposition get [22:09] them to say yes a lot of little things [22:11] and you get and they say yes to the big [22:13] thing you're addicted to that and [22:15] getting out of that is going to be one [22:16] of the most difficult things you could [22:17] do not complicated but here's how [22:19] difficult it's going to be everybody [22:20] make a fist with either hand [22:25] right thumb up [22:27] left forefinger out [22:31] now switch [22:34] that hurt didn't it [22:36] switch back [22:38] some of you are going like i got your [22:40] left forehead [22:43] i saw him right here [22:45] see if he sees this [22:51] was that complicated what i asked you to [22:53] do do you need to be do you need to be [22:55] elon musk to know what i was trying to [22:56] get you to do [22:58] no [22:59] but it was awkward it was difficult [23:02] i noticed somebody in the back room [23:03] right now going like [23:04] [Applause] [23:06] ah [23:08] here's the cool thing about that brain [23:10] science the difficulty that you felt [23:14] trying to get that done is actually the [23:16] creation of a new neural pathway [23:19] that's a cool idea [23:23] the neuroscience rules are the path the [23:25] synapses that fire together [23:28] wire together [23:31] now your yes habit is hardwired [23:34] that road is built and you're used to [23:36] screaming down that road in your thought [23:38] processes getting out of it is going to [23:40] take some repetitions [23:43] how many [23:45] 63. [23:49] john foley blue angel pilot i heard him [23:51] give a speech probably about two years [23:53] ago he talked about wiring grooves into [23:55] their brain which is the same thing as [23:56] the neural pathways and new habits that [23:58] i'm talking about and they you know if [24:00] they don't wire a groove into their [24:01] brain these guys crash into each other [24:03] in the air people start to die instantly [24:06] and he said they did some research on it [24:07] and said it took about 63 to 65 [24:09] repetitions to put a new habit in the [24:11] brain [24:12] but [24:14] at the very beginning it's as hard as [24:16] that was and you quit you give up [24:19] and you because you think it's going to [24:20] be that hard the whole time like i'm not [24:22] doing this anymore it hurts my head [24:25] but you don't know how close you [24:26] actually are to breaking through a new [24:28] habit everybody knows what the the bell [24:30] curve looks like it's very steep and it [24:32] peaks [24:33] and then you take off on the other end [24:35] we're building you're building a new [24:36] habit some of the new habits i'm going [24:38] to share with you today at the beginning [24:40] you just see how steep this thing is [24:42] initially you're like you know this is [24:43] too hard i'm not doing this anymore [24:47] but i got to get you out of the yes [24:48] habit i got to get you out of that [24:50] that is the worst thing you could [24:52] possibly do [24:54] i i didn't even bother with the word yes [24:56] and when we were when we were working on [24:58] the book one of the guys that i was [24:59] working with he said hey how did you get [25:01] the [25:02] hostage negotiator how did you get [25:03] kidnappers to say yes the only question [25:05] i can remember being thoroughly stumped [25:06] by because i never really thought about [25:08] it that hard [25:09] at that time and i said [25:11] no we never did it's a useless word [25:15] so we didn't even bother with it [25:18] so some of you are sitting there sitting [25:19] there thinking right now like okay fine [25:21] now what do you want me to do [25:24] because that's all i do [25:26] and you know what i close deals that way [25:28] too you can't tell me that i don't close [25:30] deals getting people to say yes [25:32] now i'm not saying you can't do it [25:34] i'm just saying your batting averages at [25:36] anywhere close to what it should be [25:38] you're batting 125 when you should be [25:40] batting 350 for your baseball players [25:44] yeah stick to 125. you want to stay [25:46] there [25:50] because this is what it looks like and [25:52] this is why it fails [25:54] would you like to have a more efficient [25:56] system [25:58] would you like to have more customers [26:00] would you like to have more free time [26:03] buy my product [26:10] now this is maybe there was a point in [26:13] time when this was a good idea maybe [26:18] but the swamp land timeshare salesman [26:23] the coupon book the 50 000 coupon book [26:27] salesman [26:27] [Music] [26:29] has already batted them so hard [26:32] that they're battered by yes [26:36] you guys know anecdotally [26:38] what happens if you come across a [26:40] battered child and you try to hug them [26:43] they still flinch and jump back from you [26:46] but wait a minute i was trying to give [26:47] him a hug i'm a good guy [26:50] i meant well i wasn't trying to trap [26:53] them i was trying to [26:55] have integrity [26:58] it doesn't matter they're bad [26:59] everybody's battered by yes you you got [27:01] to stop this [27:03] you got to stop it [27:06] okay fine you convinced me now what [27:09] you know who this is [27:13] jack welch [27:14] jack [27:16] one of the most famous ceos former ceo [27:19] ge author of a number of books jack [27:22] winning [27:23] the real life nba [27:24] jack welch come to los angeles a couple [27:26] years ago he and his wife susie the the [27:28] latest book the real life mba i'm going [27:30] to go to the book signing i'm going to [27:31] ask jack to come speak at the class i'm [27:33] i'm teaching at that time [27:35] at the usc marshall school of business [27:37] in the mba program [27:39] negotiation i want jack to come speak to [27:41] my negotiation class how many people try [27:43] to get jack welts to say yes to [27:44] something that day [27:48] everybody how many people in the book [27:50] signing are trying to going to try to [27:51] get jack welch to say yes to something [27:54] they can come up to them and say hey [27:55] jack you want to come to the house wife [27:56] makes a great meal loaf [28:00] how many people everybody [28:03] you're me what do you say [28:06] how much time have i got [28:09] maybe not seven seconds [28:11] even less than that because at a book [28:13] signing what happens a guy like jack [28:15] welch you come in when when you're about [28:17] five six seven people from jack somebody [28:19] comes up to you and says what's your [28:20] name they write your name down on a [28:21] piece of paper so jack can write your [28:23] name on the book they say but in reality [28:25] so you don't talk to him [28:27] he doesn't say have to say to you what's [28:28] your name he said chris [28:31] good luck keep going [28:33] problem one there's 300 people online if [28:35] i try to stop and talk to jack welch for [28:37] even 20 seconds we're now there for six [28:40] hours right [28:42] problem two [28:43] jack what's a legitimate celebrity [28:45] they don't know who i am they they [28:47] haven't put me through a medical [28:48] detector they don't know i i don't have [28:50] a gun as a matter of fact i have a gun [28:52] but they don't know that i'm an fbi [28:53] agent they haven't got any id for me i [28:55] could come up i'm gonna get within arm's [28:56] length of jax welch i could do what i [28:58] want [28:59] jane fonda was at a book signing a [29:00] number of years ago vietnam vet got [29:02] within arm's length of her and spit [29:04] right in her face [29:05] action is quicker than reaction i'm [29:07] going to be arms length from jack welch [29:08] he's got security people there that are [29:10] worried about his safety they know they [29:12] can't stop me from doing whatever i want [29:14] to do i could walk up to jack welch i [29:16] could take his face in my hands and kiss [29:17] him right on the lips if i wanted to [29:20] you got a disgusted look on his face for [29:21] that [29:25] but they don't know what i'm gonna do [29:27] so everybody's more than jumpy i walk up [29:30] to jack welch and this is what i say [29:33] is it a ridiculous idea [29:36] for you to come and speak to the [29:37] negotiation course that i teach at usc [29:40] and he looks up and to the left [29:42] he gets this really intense skull on his [29:45] face and he just freezes [29:47] he doesn't move [29:50] and i think [29:51] it just killed jack welch [29:55] because he's old right i figured he got [29:57] mad [30:00] and he had a stroke and he's going to [30:01] die because he's so angry he's going to [30:04] fall right in front of me and then [30:05] they're going to tackle me they're going [30:06] to blame me they could drag me out cuffs [30:09] and i'll say but i'm an fbi agent and [30:11] you killed jack welch doesn't matter [30:14] so initially when he doesn't die i'm [30:16] relieved [30:17] but he's he still doesn't [30:20] move and i'm thinking now he's going to [30:23] start going security security because he [30:25] looks furious [30:27] finally looks at me and he says [30:29] this is my personal assistant's name [30:31] this is a special twitter account we [30:32] have set up to communicate with her i [30:34] will call her tell her who you are and [30:36] what you want i think we're going to be [30:38] in los angeles in the fall if we all [30:40] will come in and speak to your course [30:45] because it triggered a no i triggered a [30:46] calibrated no a calculated no i changed [30:49] the s question to a no [30:52] and i'm i'm here to tell you a [30:54] calibrated no is worth five yeses [30:59] think about think about what he thought [31:01] through in the steps that he thought [31:03] through before he answered me [31:06] because all the rest of that stuff i [31:07] would have had if he just said yes i [31:08] said who do i get in touch with how do i [31:11] coordinate with them how do i [31:13] communicate them with them will you call [31:15] them and brief them we're talking about [31:17] the fall where you're going to be in the [31:19] fall think of how many questions he went [31:21] ahead and answered for me [31:25] it's insane we do this on a regular [31:27] basis [31:29] i don't bother with yes we did a [31:31] training in new york just about uh [31:34] earlier this month it's still may right [31:36] about two weeks ago [31:38] um very intense intensive master class i [31:41] happened to run across robert herzevec [31:43] from shark tank [31:45] in new york or in l.a just a couple [31:47] weeks ago by the way a wonderful guy i [31:49] mean a wonderful gracious charming [31:52] impressive guy i would work with him i [31:54] would work for him he was telling me [31:55] about how he develops his people [31:57] phenomenal guy [31:59] i offer him a free ticket he's gracious [32:01] enough to say how many can we buy [32:04] and so we're going back and forth on how [32:06] many he could buy and i'm trying to get [32:07] a commitment out of him and the event is [32:09] selling like it is the door is slamming [32:12] shut and i realized that if i don't get [32:15] a nearly instantaneous commitment from [32:17] him because we're charging people a lot [32:19] of money for these tickets we're [32:20] charging people just short of two [32:22] thousand dollars per head to be there [32:24] and every you know [32:26] we got people buying them [32:28] i can't keep this window open for him i [32:30] don't care if he is a billionaire we get [32:31] people who want these tickets [32:33] so five o'clock on a friday [32:36] i have to get a commitment from him now [32:37] we're in l.a five o'clock on a friday [32:39] it's 8pm here in new york the other [32:42] problem is [32:43] business opens in new york three hours [32:45] earlier than it does in los angeles if i [32:47] haven't got him committed before the [32:48] start of the next business day he's out [32:51] i sent him an email that says are you [32:53] against making a commitment for these [32:55] tickets now [32:58] are you against [33:00] paying for them [33:01] before the start of business tomorrow [33:06] and i get an email back instantly says [33:08] no we're going to take three in total [33:10] we'll pay for them before the before [33:12] business starts tomorrow less than 20 [33:14] minutes later i'm getting emails from [33:15] his assistant just to pay [33:19] now what would you have done normally [33:20] you know how many would you like [33:22] would you please commit now [33:24] can you pay before the close of business [33:27] tomorrow would be the normal thing [33:29] but it's going to be too late [33:32] but i you [33:33] help people think [33:35] by switching out a yes and into no i [33:37] don't bother with yes [33:40] we don't bother with yes [33:42] i could i could go i could belabor it at [33:44] length yes it's commitment commitment [33:46] creates anxiety no is protection [33:49] protection makes people feel safe and [33:51] secure and helps them think anxiety [33:53] interferes with people's thought [33:54] processes every time you try to get [33:56] somebody to say yes to something you're [33:58] creating anxiety because they say to [34:00] themselves what have i let myself in for [34:02] what's the catch what's the hook where's [34:03] this going what are you trying to do to [34:05] me these are anxiety creating [34:08] instances which interfere with their [34:10] ability to make decisions [34:14] it's not me telling you this this is [34:16] neuroscience anxiety slows the brain [34:20] don't take my word for it [34:23] okay fine so what if no is not enough [34:29] this is this is this is what this is [34:31] really what sold the book to the [34:32] publisher they've never seen anything [34:34] like this before it's [34:35] in our utter disdain for yes because [34:37] what's the most famous negotiating book [34:39] in the world anyway right everybody [34:40] knows getting to [34:42] yes right yes it's supposed to be what [34:44] you want to get people to say [34:46] yes is not what you want people to say [34:49] this is what you want them to say after [34:50] the no [34:53] now [34:55] that's kind of disappointing right [34:57] like that's not special that doesn't [34:59] make me feel good well yes makes me feel [35:01] good i love yes i got a bad addiction to [35:04] yes i'm happy when i hear you that's [35:06] right [35:08] it's it's not what it is to you when it [35:10] comes out of their mouth it's what it is [35:11] to them that's right is what people say [35:14] when they think that what they've just [35:16] heard is the total and complete truth [35:20] there's two simultaneous things that [35:21] happen it triggers a subtle epiphany in [35:23] people's brains there's a chemical [35:25] change with epiphany they feel better [35:27] they feel smarter they feel clarity [35:32] stephen covey's advice from way back [35:34] when seek first to understand then be [35:35] understood [35:37] and so we thought okay all we got to do [35:39] is say to somebody i understand and then [35:41] you then you get a talk right because [35:42] they're ready to hear you no [35:45] it's the changes show understanding [35:49] first [35:50] trigger a that's right [35:52] then and only then are they ready to [35:54] hear you what whatever your political [35:57] whatever political side of the aisle [35:58] you're on i'll give you an example to [35:59] prove it to you [36:01] last presidential election the two [36:03] candidates were on tv engaged in a [36:06] debate when whichever candidate [36:08] you loved when you decided to vote for [36:10] them they said something in the debate [36:12] you thoroughly believed in you didn't [36:13] look at the tv and say you're right [36:15] you looked at the tv and you went that's [36:17] right [36:19] that's what people say when they're all [36:21] in they say that's right [36:24] also [36:25] i had somebody stop me and say i think [36:27] it's when the person is telling you they [36:29] feel empathy from you [36:32] empathy is this powerful mystical tool [36:34] empathy is not sympathy [36:36] i don't know how [36:38] many times i could say that empathy is [36:39] not sympathy [36:44] and it triggers a moment when they feel [36:45] bonded to you [36:48] and that's where you build trust-based [36:49] influence you know who the greatest [36:50] practitioners of empathy are on the [36:52] planet do you guys know [36:56] social very close social pass [37:06] why do you think it's the preferred [37:08] communication approach of sociopaths [37:12] because they like you [37:16] because it works [37:21] because they like to work hard [37:23] because sociopaths have a great work [37:25] ethic yeah i want to hire social pet [37:27] they work really hard [37:30] it's efficient [37:31] it sticks it lasts it's the most durable [37:35] form of influence there is sociopaths [37:37] are lazy [37:40] they want to wind you up once and then [37:42] keep you wound up with a minimal amount [37:43] of effort [37:47] all right fine so they like it [37:50] does it work on them i love this [37:52] question [37:53] does empathy work on social pass [37:56] we think [38:02] here's a sociopath [38:04] you have a slide back please guy up on [38:06] the right [38:07] guy at the bottom is american overseas [38:09] doing stupid stuff [38:11] he gets grabbed by this guy [38:14] guy in a sunglasses and a black bandana [38:16] make no mistake is a murdering raping [38:19] straight out of the movies bad to the [38:21] bones sociopath he's a killer he's got [38:24] the blood on his hands literally [38:27] of no shortage of people that he has [38:29] physically and personally cut their [38:31] heads off [38:34] these guys got a method of chopping [38:35] heads off that they were shown to me and [38:37] explained to me they're actually kind of [38:38] proud of they're so effective at it [38:41] like a contest [38:43] how mo how efficiently can you chop a [38:46] head off of a human being this guy's [38:48] done it a bunch of times and a rapist [38:52] and he finds a woman that he likes he [38:53] rapes her enough she becomes present [38:55] pregnant him and his buddies shove it [38:56] down a hill so she miscarriages so they [38:58] can keep her these are not nice guys [39:01] these are the definitions of sociopath [39:03] they've got this american [39:05] i am coaching this guy [39:09] because i was an international [39:10] negotiation coach is what i really was [39:13] all i need to do is find somebody that's [39:15] coachable if you're coachable [39:18] i don't care what you're faced with [39:21] i can make you pretty effective [39:24] because i know how the brain science [39:25] works [39:26] by the way is this stuff cross-cultural [39:30] do you guys know every hostage [39:32] negotiation team uses the same skills [39:35] the hostage negotiation team in tokyo [39:37] japan [39:38] and in cape town south africa both use [39:41] the same skills [39:43] wait a minute japan to africa you got to [39:45] be kidding me right what's the [39:46] commonality [39:50] they're human [39:52] so that's the limitation [39:54] my approach to negotiation only works [39:55] where humans are involved [40:02] so our sociopath is holding this [40:04] american and there's a 10 million demand [40:06] but he's not saying it's a ransom he's [40:08] saying it's for 10 million [40:10] for 500 years of oppression for war [40:12] damages from the spanish to the japanese [40:14] to the americans to the atrocities [40:16] committed by the americans in the early [40:18] 1900s under blackjack persian and we're [40:20] not even filipinos anyway we're a [40:22] separate independent nation we're [40:23] morrows and we're currently being [40:25] oppressed by a puppet government in [40:27] manila that's held up by an american [40:29] colonial invader [40:31] so we're not asking for ransom we're [40:33] asking for war damages for 500 years of [40:35] oppression which actually makes 10 [40:37] million seems kind of kind of kind of [40:39] small [40:40] and i realize right now most of you are [40:42] tuning this out in your mind because [40:44] you're saying like i was never in an [40:46] argument with somebody where they were [40:47] bringing up stuff from the past it [40:48] didn't matter [40:55] it doesn't happen to me [40:57] all my arguments are logical irrational [41:00] right [41:03] so we go back and forth with this guy [41:04] literally for months and finally i say [41:06] to my gay we're going to hit the reset [41:07] button here and this my son's referred [41:10] to this as a birth of the that's right [41:11] moment because i used to take this for [41:13] granted i didn't realize the [41:15] extraordinary power of it [41:17] i said the next time we get this pass on [41:19] the phone we're going to get him to say [41:21] that's right [41:22] and you're going to repeat the entire [41:24] situation from his perspective [41:27] especially the bad stuff about us [41:31] that might be the most [41:32] critical part of it [41:35] the bad stuff about you [41:40] so my guy gets back on the phone with [41:41] this terrorist and he says you know what [41:43] you're not asking for ransom [41:46] for the american but you're asking for [41:47] war damages from 500 years of oppression [41:50] from the spanish to the japanese to the [41:52] americans the violations the atrocities [41:54] under blackjack persian and the [41:56] americans in [41:57] the 1900s [41:59] and you're not you're not filipinos your [42:00] morals your separate independent nation [42:02] been fighting for your freedom for 500 [42:03] years and you're being impressed [42:05] currently [42:06] by a puppet government in manila it's [42:08] held up by the by the american colonial [42:10] invaders and it's unjust and it's wrong [42:13] and he went on and on if you're not and [42:15] he laid it on thick and i'm here to tell [42:16] you if you're not laying on thick you're [42:17] not laying it on thick enough the bad [42:19] stuff [42:20] not the good stuff the bad stuff [42:24] and probably and it didn't seem like [42:26] it'd take that long but it seemed [42:28] forever [42:29] it [42:30] took my guy to lay this out and it was a [42:32] moment of silence and his sociopath [42:35] on the other end of the phone said [42:38] that's right [42:41] and it was dead silence for another [42:42] couple moments and my guy says let's [42:45] talk again in a couple of days okay [42:47] hangs up the phone [42:49] we went from 10 million dollars to zero [42:51] in that moment [42:53] 10 million dollars went off the table [42:55] never to be mentioned again for the rest [42:58] of the kidnapping [43:00] last a couple more months kidnapping [43:02] took a couple of twists and turns [43:04] finally one day the americans out in a [43:06] swamp [43:07] we have so [43:08] diffused everything they're doing [43:10] they're not even watching them anymore [43:12] they're not angry they don't know that [43:13] we've defused them they don't know what [43:15] sort of an upper hand we have on them [43:17] they just don't know what's going on [43:19] the american they're checking them every [43:20] three days he's sitting out there and [43:21] the swamp says i'm leaving and he walks [43:23] away [43:26] local farmer sees him says you must be [43:28] jeffrey schilling the american he says i [43:29] am you know how many black guys walking [43:31] around south of the philippines right [43:34] says i am they alert the military the [43:35] military flies down and helicopters [43:37] picks them up they take them back to [43:38] manila they hold this monumental press [43:40] conference he's got the president of [43:41] philippines on one side secretary [43:43] defense on the other secretary of [43:44] defense says we have rescued the [43:46] american jeffrey shilling in a daring [43:48] military operation [43:53] it gave him a ride [43:58] it was a daring operation at the newark [44:00] airport yesterday where i was rescued [44:07] he's sitting there he doesn't say [44:08] anything we fly him out back [44:11] back to the united states [44:13] and back in the philippines about three [44:14] weeks later on another kidnapping i [44:16] connect back up with my guy he says [44:18] you're not gonna believe who called me [44:21] i don't know who called you [44:23] the terrorist [44:24] guy named sebaya sabaya call [44:27] really [44:29] what do you say [44:31] have you been promoted yet [44:34] i don't know what it was he said to me [44:36] on the phone [44:38] i was going to kill the american [44:41] they should promote you he hangs up [44:44] what's he saying when he made that [44:48] call terrorist sociopath [44:52] called the pays respects [44:56] to say [44:59] i felt respected by you [45:02] he's also saying [45:05] i talk to you again [45:08] if we meet again [45:11] i talk to you [45:13] everybody you deal with regardless of [45:16] the [45:16] outcome should feel that solid about the [45:20] interaction when it's over [45:23] no matter how the interaction went [45:26] that they'd still deal with you [45:30] everybody you deal with [45:34] and you'll be amazed at the impact it'll [45:35] have not just on your business but your [45:37] personal relationships [45:39] on everybody in life that matters to you [45:43] all right [45:44] we're going to do a little bit of q a [45:46] here in a minute [45:47] but i want you to know if you want more [45:50] besides the book if you want to add to [45:51] it only if you want more [45:54] uh we've got a newsletter comes out [45:57] once a week short sweet newsletter it's [46:00] very digestible it's not one of those [46:01] it's an encyclopedia that you got to [46:03] take a nap after you get done reading it [46:07] text fbi empathy all one word don't let [46:09] your autocorrect put a space between fbi [46:12] and empathy send that to 22828 you'll [46:14] get a dialogue box back that'll sign you [46:16] up for the newsletter a lot of people [46:17] love it as a great supplement to the [46:19] book [46:21] and it's also the gateway to everything [46:23] that we do [46:24] when we when we do training sessions [46:25] open enrollment training sessions it's a [46:27] gateway to the website which is [46:28] blackswanltd.com [46:30] but the newsletter will take you there [46:32] read past issues find about other stuff [46:35] that we have we have we have quite a bit [46:37] of free content on the newsletter [46:39] on the website a lot of articles in the [46:42] newsletter you can search them and find [46:43] a lot of stuff that that will help you [46:45] subscribing to the newsletter is a great [46:46] tool and it's free it's complementary [46:48] for those of you like me former federal [46:50] federal employees you love free [46:54] all right all right q a [46:57] thank you [47:00] all right [47:03] we have time for just uh a few quick [47:05] questions uh so if there's anybody that [47:08] is dying to ask chris something raise [47:11] your hand and speak loudly i see a hand [47:13] over that's yeah there you go go ahead [47:23] [Laughter] [47:26] there you go [47:27] i i got a car buying story in the book [47:30] and and and we just on and on our [47:33] youtube channel uh a friend of mine the [47:35] guy i told you about was a negotiated [47:37] with south koreans he tells his car [47:39] buying story [47:41] and uh we could get we get good prices [47:43] [Laughter] [47:47] you do that as a service by the way [47:50] i hope you get a car there you go there [47:51] you go that's good yes [47:53] chris what do you do when you go for a [47:55] no and you get a yes [47:56] well see that's a great question you go [47:58] for a no and you get a yes if you didn't [48:00] hear the question um [48:02] first of all no like nobody nobody will [48:04] do that i i already know i know how hard [48:08] it is for anybody to say yes i mean it's [48:09] it's insanely hard and my son used to [48:12] challenge me on this we're walking out [48:14] of a building [48:15] in uh [48:17] uh with a client here in new jersey [48:19] across the river and they've got a [48:21] security guard who's checked us in and [48:22] we're checking out and he's he's a [48:24] security guard and he's got allied [48:26] security and so my son says i don't [48:28] think it's always hard for somebody to [48:29] say yes to something and the security [48:31] guard's right there and i go i look at [48:32] him i go do you work for allied security [48:35] now he's at work on duties the same guys [48:37] have checked us in in the morning he [48:38] remembers us from the morning before [48:39] he's got a uniform on says allied [48:40] security [48:42] i said you work for allied security and [48:44] goes [48:45] why do you want to know yeah that's [48:47] right that's right and i look at my son [48:49] and i go [48:50] [Laughter] [48:54] now in the unlikely event the answer is [48:56] yes what you are going to get is silence [49:00] they're just not going to say yes now [49:02] the on on [49:04] one in 10 000 [49:06] because we like asking ridiculous no [49:08] you'd be shocked at the no questions we [49:09] ask we coach [49:12] employees to ask their bosses do you [49:15] want me to fail [49:18] and then [49:19] and every now and then if the answer is [49:21] yes you will get silence and [49:23] also part of negotiation is [49:26] you go from knowing from wondering to [49:28] knowing [49:30] and you're never worse off you might not [49:33] like the answer [49:36] but you cannot move forward until you [49:38] know what ground you're standing on [49:41] and so if the answer is have you give [49:43] you know a question we send out all the [49:45] time have you given up on doing business [49:47] with the black swan group [49:50] if they don't respond you know what we [49:52] do next [49:54] pursue someone else [49:57] how many non-responders do you have [50:01] you know how many we have [50:03] none [50:06] because we don't pursue that business [50:09] if they're not going to do business with [50:11] us there are lots of people who will [50:14] and i'm not wasting my time with people [50:16] who won't do business with us love that [50:18] absolutely win fast lose fast who else [50:20] another quick question [50:22] i'm not seeing the hand i i have one [50:25] really interesting thing i in the book [50:27] you you make this argument that [50:29] the smarter you are [50:31] the more difficult it is to be a good [50:32] negotiator so there's hope for a lot of [50:35] us in the room [50:37] yeah talk about that why is that smart [50:39] people people with higher degrees they [50:41] want they want to they want to show you [50:42] how smart they are [50:44] you can't get them to shut up [50:47] i mean you can't they just they just [50:48] want to show you how they thought [50:50] they've thought stuff through [50:52] they want they want you to [50:54] appreciate how much they've thought [50:56] stuff through [50:58] and so they want to lay it all out for [50:59] you they want to help i mean it's very [51:01] well intentioned stuff but it's really [51:02] hard to get those kind of people to shut [51:04] up [51:06] yeah yeah [51:08] and this is this is about shutting up [51:10] asking the question and getting [51:12] information [51:13] from who you're talking to getting them [51:15] to talk not me to talk your counterpart [51:17] should be talking five times more than [51:19] you yeah we like to we like to say [51:22] uh [51:23] he who talks most [51:26] loses [51:29] that's good that's good who talks most [51:32] loses who has a question anybody [51:36] yeah i'm not asking anything now [51:38] i'm just going to listen [51:40] actually you have time for for uh yeah [51:42] yeah frank how about when it comes to [51:44] like a wife [51:46] negotiating with that yeah wife and kids [51:48] negotiating with that we don't have a [51:50] lot of time oh [51:52] senior senior executive although very [51:55] young lady uh um executive in silicon [51:58] valley is talking to her then fiance now [52:00] husband one day and she goes [52:03] why do i like talking to you all of a [52:04] sudden [52:06] so [52:07] you know [52:08] this last couple days i've really [52:10] enjoyed talking to you and he's like [52:14] taking his class and [52:16] that teaching this book never split the [52:18] difference in it making us do it with [52:20] the with our wives and our girls [52:25] she went out and bought books for all [52:27] her girlfriends husbands and boys [52:32] oh that's good that's good i saw a hand [52:34] here yeah [52:36] um [52:46] a lot of the businesses in your area [52:47] today that we've been working with [52:48] they've experienced some security [52:50] outbreaks and we've been trying to work [52:52] with them and [52:54] most of the businesses are struggling to [52:56] fight technology today and [52:59] really i understand everything that [53:01] you're going through so i'm just [53:02] wondering is it possible for you [53:03] clearing schedule so we can talk about [53:05] and help you grow your business [53:07] uh all right so what would he [53:09] break that down [53:10] he pitched like crazy right [53:14] he's what he he he did a nice job he [53:17] took he says it's a ridiculous idea for [53:18] me to clear my schedule for the rest of [53:20] the rest of the day [53:22] and [53:23] then it he three four sentences to lay [53:25] out the pitch [53:27] and then he said i understand [53:29] which is bad you should never say i [53:31] understand you had a really good start [53:34] your pitch needs to be a lot shorter but [53:36] you're i didn't did i pitch with that [53:38] father [53:39] no you did [53:40] no yeah i didn't that was the other [53:42] thing i didn't do i didn't pitch the [53:44] father i didn't pitch solutions i didn't [53:46] pitch answers i said here's what you're [53:47] looking at and waited to see if he was [53:49] going to interact with me on what he was [53:51] looking at [53:52] so you got a good start that's [53:55] the first fact that you already picked [53:56] up on a to starting out with a with a no [53:58] oriented question is but you're still [54:01] wired to pitch [54:03] you're still wired to pitch and getting [54:05] that's right out of the other side [54:06] before you proceed seek first understand [54:08] before you can be understood [54:11] you should get it that's right before [54:12] you make the pitch on top of that when [54:14] you get the feedback from back from your [54:16] counterpart you guys have a broad value [54:18] proposition [54:20] how do you know which portion of that [54:22] proposition is valuable [54:26] your counterpart you got you got seven [54:28] selling points your counterpart might be [54:30] interested in two [54:32] every time spent on the other top five [54:34] is your counterpart is starting to go to [54:36] sleep on you so the the guidance you [54:39] want to get you want to know exactly [54:40] which part of your pitch matters to them [54:43] and then [54:45] now that you've honed you know which [54:47] part of the value proposition is [54:48] actually there for them now you can go [54:49] into it yeah so you're on the right [54:51] track good start and and and there's a [54:53] coaching on the right you have a good [54:54] example that on the podcast we just [54:56] released chris where you know we we role [54:58] play a little bit where we say hey you [55:00] know chris i was at your at your website [55:02] saw one of your videos really liked it [55:04] would love to understand more about [55:06] about black swan you know give me your [55:08] pitch real quick uh what do you guys do [55:10] and how does this all work [55:11] right yeah and so my answer was [55:15] sounds like you're not sure we're [55:16] valuable [55:18] or it would be yeah because i need to [55:21] know what you think is valuable [55:23] i we don't make we don't pitch yeah we [55:25] find out what matters yeah and then if [55:27] what you're looking for is not us we're [55:29] like you're not looking for us [55:30] because we need to talk to people that [55:32] are looking for us so much of what you [55:35] talk about is counter-intuitive and and [55:37] kind of goes against how we've always [55:39] operated this isn't an easy shift for [55:41] people to make uh the 63 i think i heard [55:45] repetitions [55:47] they'll get there yeah and a little bit [55:48] of practice and prep so [55:50] i got a video to show you about the [55:52] value preparation [55:53] fireman [55:54] go for it [55:56] all right [55:57] slides back up [56:05] a proof of life video that's what [56:06] they're called the ultimate good news [56:07] bad news story if you're ever [56:09] unfortunate enough to see one today hot [56:11] today's high stakes rescue mission in [56:12] colombia ended a drama that has been [56:14] dragging on for years [56:16] chris voss is the former fbi lead [56:18] international kidnapping negotiator and [56:20] he worked on the [56:25] all right so in terms of preparation [56:27] what are my preparation issues here [56:32] [Applause] [56:35] it's a little dark but on the right hand [56:36] side of my head my hair is sticking [56:38] outside [56:41] so this was the first time i was ever on [56:42] cnn like i gotta tell you something i [56:44] thought this was cool like i'm gonna go [56:46] in there are more people watching [56:47] anderson cooper on cnn that are in my [56:49] hometown back in iowa [56:52] and there's so much i don't know [56:54] like [56:55] i heard they have a green room do they [56:57] have a green room and is it green [57:01] they have a green room it's not green [57:03] all right so i know you go into the [57:05] green room you sit down it's kind of a [57:06] nice place they're very nice to you they [57:08] give you coffee they give you water i [57:09] think that's cool you know it's free [57:11] coffee i'm from iowa they don't give [57:13] free coffee [57:15] and then then do you know where you go [57:16] after the green room [57:19] makeup [57:21] i can remember the first time i was [57:22] sitting in that makeup chair and they're [57:23] putting makeup on my face and i thought [57:25] my father's rolling over in his grave [57:28] right now [57:29] his son is putting on makeup [57:32] again a middle-class blue-collar guy [57:34] from iowa i didn't wear makeup growing [57:36] up in iowa [57:38] so you go you get out of makeup then [57:40] they take you into a room attached to [57:41] actually a large dark closet [57:44] you're not in a studio with anderson [57:46] cooper light shines right in your eyes [57:47] you're supposed to look right below the [57:48] light that's anderson talk right there [57:50] that's camera you gotta look at that and [57:52] they say down to the left there's a [57:54] monitor [57:55] and when we go live the monitor is going [57:56] to come on and it'll show the [57:58] programming do you want us to leave that [57:59] on i said leave that on i never saw me [58:03] on tv before [58:06] i want to watch me on cnn leave that [58:08] baby on [58:10] so we've just gone live [58:12] the monitor's on [58:14] and i'm looking down at the monitor and [58:16] i see my hair sticking out [58:20] and i am perplexed [58:23] now the other problem here [58:25] is [58:27] the monitor is a mirror image and i [58:29] don't know which side of my head the [58:30] hair is sticking out [58:37] so i'm a negotiator right i generate [58:39] options i figure stuff out so the first [58:41] thing i got to do is i got to figure out [58:42] which side of my head the hair's [58:43] sticking out so i can address it so [58:46] this case from the beginning until his [58:47] retirement just last year he joins me [58:49] now chris this has got to be kind of [58:56] i don't know why i thought moving my [58:57] head around was going to help [59:01] if you see from the look on my face and [59:02] going like nah that didn't help [59:05] just don't know where it is [59:06] so i'm trying to figure out what i can [59:08] do i'm trying to generate options what [59:09] are my moves and when can i make my move [59:11] cause they're more people my mom and the [59:13] people she goes to church with her [59:14] watching us sing they're gonna give her [59:16] a hard time and his son doesn't know how [59:17] to comb his hair [59:19] i gotta fix this so like i can't go with [59:22] two hands because you know i kind of [59:23] look like one of the three stooges [59:26] i probably can't lick my hand [59:29] try to tamp it down [59:31] so i'm trying to decide what to do i'm [59:33] sitting there this is going through my a [59:35] remarkable day for you to be so [59:40] anderson cooper's hair is perfect [59:42] [Applause] [59:44] why do they got to make sure everybody [59:46] sees my hair's out of place anderson [59:48] cooper could be in a hurricane and his [59:50] hair wouldn't move i know that while [59:52] this was going on the producer was going [59:53] like hey hey hey [59:55] let's go split screen let's make sure [59:57] everybody sees how good anderson's hair [59:59] is [60:01] so they go split screen and now i'm even [60:02] more disgusted by this you can see that [60:04] look on my face [60:06] and i'm trying to decide what to do when [60:07] can i make my move because the clock is [60:09] ticking this is like that double dutch [60:10] jump rope thing where there's two ropes [60:12] going when can you jump in when can i go [60:14] when can i go when can i go i gotta take [60:16] care of this my mom's watching her [60:17] friends are watching so i'm sitting [60:19] there and i when can i make my move [60:21] closely involved in this and to finally [60:27] [Laughter] [60:33] see it come for fruit [60:36] [Applause] [60:40] damn it [60:46] so what i'm trying to say is [60:49] and we finished the interview with [60:50] anderson cooper and they never they [60:52] didn't ban me from anderson cooper as a [60:54] result they invited me back on [60:57] what i'm trying to say is [60:59] you make mistakes it's okay [61:03] a solid approach where people feel [61:05] respected and appreciated [61:09] and you get that's right out of them [61:11] they feel empathy from you you'll make [61:13] mistakes and it'll be okay they'll [61:15] forgive you for them so i'd like [61:16] everybody to stand up please [61:23] all right you guys remember at the [61:24] beginning of this i talked about the men [61:25] in black well those guys actually work [61:27] for me [61:29] remember a little red flashy thing those [61:31] guys had everybody look up here please [61:33] [Applause] [61:39] all right from this point forward after [61:41] today everybody that you deal with [61:45] will feel that they were treated with [61:46] respect you understood them [61:49] no matter how the outcome went they felt [61:51] bonded to you they felt connected to you [61:53] by the chance to talk with you [61:56] and collaborate with you [61:58] and they felt a long-term relationship [62:00] was established that they deal with you [62:02] again no matter how things went [62:05] thank you for spending time with me this [62:07] morning it's been a privilege to be here [62:08] with you guys thank you very much [62:11] [Music]

===FILE=== 37VA3dBy8dA - Negotiation Myths That Kill Your Sales.txt
https://youtu.be/37VA3dBy8dA
Negotiation Myths That Kill Your Sales!

[0:00] When people hear I used to negotiate [0:02] with terrorists, they assume I must love [0:05] hardball tactics. [0:07] Anchoring, ultimatums, [0:10] take it or leave it. [0:11] Nope. [0:13] That stuff [0:14] gets you killed. [0:16] Literally and figuratively. [0:20] Today, I'm going to bust the five most [0:23] dangerous myths in negotiation. [0:26] The ones that tank your deals, stall [0:30] your career, [0:33] and ruin relationships before they [0:35] start. [0:37] Myth number one, [0:39] get them to say yes. [0:41] Of course, the myth is that the goal is [0:43] to get them to say yes as fast as [0:45] possible. Wrong. [0:48] Yes is a trap. [0:51] People say yes to get rid of you. [0:54] In fact, yes can be one of the biggest [0:57] red flags in a negotiation. If they say [1:00] yes too quickly, they may [1:03] not have the authority, [1:06] they may be placating you, they may be [1:09] setting you up to fail with their team. [1:13] The truth? [1:15] No [1:16] is safer. [1:18] It makes people feel protected, in [1:20] control, instead of [1:23] would you be open to discussing this [1:25] further? [1:26] Try [1:27] is now a bad time to talk? [1:29] Or [1:31] would it be ridiculous for us to explore [1:33] a better way forward? [1:35] No-oriented questions deactivate threat [1:38] and invite real dialogue. [1:41] Myth number two, [1:43] start with common ground. [1:46] The myth is you need to build rapport by [1:49] finding common ground first. [1:52] Sounds nice, [1:54] but in tense or complex negotiations, [1:56] it's a waste. [1:59] When someone's skeptical, nervous, or [2:01] even hostile, [2:03] they don't care if you both like skiing [2:05] in Vail. [2:06] They don't care if you played Little [2:08] League baseball as a kid. [2:11] The truth? [2:14] Build trust by showing you understand [2:16] their pain. That's tactical empathy. [2:19] Lead with an accusation audit. [2:23] You're probably thinking this is just [2:24] another sales call. It might feel like [2:27] I'm pushing an agenda here. [2:30] This clears emotional landmines before [2:33] you step on them. Myth number three, [2:36] state your value proposition, or your [2:39] elevator speech, or whatever they call [2:41] it these days. The myth is to lead with [2:44] your value. Tell them why they need you. [2:48] Classic mistake. [2:50] You think you're helping, they think [2:52] you're selling. [2:54] In high-stakes negotiations, the more [2:55] you talk, the more they distrust you. [2:58] Why? [2:59] Because the brain is wired to defend. [3:02] When someone's pitching, we [3:04] instinctively brace ourselves. [3:07] So, the truth? [3:09] If you can handle the truth, [3:12] let them discover the value. [3:15] How? Use calibrated questions, like [3:20] how does this line up with what you're [3:22] trying to solve? [3:23] Or [3:25] what's the biggest obstacle you're [3:27] facing right now? [3:30] Ask questions that begin with what or [3:33] how, which make them articulate [3:37] their need. Now they're selling you the [3:40] problem to solve. [3:43] Myth number four, control the [3:45] conversation. [3:47] The myth is whoever controls the [3:49] conversation wins. So, you talk and talk [3:52] and talk. [3:54] Congratulations, you're now in what we [3:56] call the agreement graveyard. [3:59] The real truth? Real control comes from [4:03] having the upper hand in the [4:04] negotiation. The secret [4:06] to gaining the upper hand in a [4:08] negotiation is giving the other side the [4:10] illusion of control. How you do this? [4:13] Strategic silence [4:16] and great listening. [4:18] Let's say you're pitching a big deal. [4:22] You ask, [4:23] what are the biggest roadblocks to [4:25] getting this across the finish line? [4:27] Then you shut up. Get a PhD in shut up. [4:33] Silence [4:35] not just forces their thinking, but [4:37] creates a space for them to think. [4:41] And to feel connected to you without [4:43] feeling forced or pushed. [4:47] And then, [4:48] they can't resist filling that silence. [4:52] That's where the gold is. [4:55] When they fill the silence. [4:58] Studies show people make smarter [5:00] decisions when they feel heard. [5:04] Control is an illusion. [5:06] Influence is the goal. [5:10] Myth number five, fairness wins the day. [5:15] The myth is as long as it's fair, people [5:18] will agree. [5:19] Cue the tiny violins. [5:23] Fair is the most weaponized word in [5:25] negotiation. [5:27] When someone says, I just want what's [5:29] fair, what they really mean is I want [5:32] what benefits me and I want you to feel [5:34] bad if you disagree. [5:37] The truth? [5:39] Anchor people in vision and loss instead [5:42] of it's fair, try [5:44] what happens if we don't solve this? [5:49] How will this affect your team if it [5:51] stays like this? [5:54] People act to avoid pain more than to [5:58] gain pleasure. That's the science of it. [6:01] Use it. To wrap up, [6:04] here's the recap. [6:07] Don't chase yes, chase truth. [6:10] Use no to get there. [6:14] Don't pitch value, discover problems. [6:19] Don't lead with logic, lead with [6:21] empathy. [6:23] Don't control, [6:25] influence. [6:28] And finally, please don't play the [6:30] fairness card. [6:32] Ask better questions. [6:34] These aren't tricks, they're tools for [6:37] the truth. And when you use them, you [6:39] stop negotiating like a needy amateur, [6:43] and start negotiating [6:45] like a black swan.

===FILE=== 7OqEGgBb4YY - STOP Sending Emails that Get Ignored.txt
https://youtu.be/7OqEGgBb4YY
STOP Sending Emails that Get Ignored!

[0:00] let's talk about some of the bad things [0:03] uh with email and then some of the [0:05] things that you can do to be more [0:06] effective when it comes [0:08] to communicating via email I hesitate to [0:12] say negotiating via email because I I [0:14] don't really advocate for that um but [0:16] we'll talk about some things that you [0:18] can change to make your communication [0:20] via email a little bit better so some of [0:24] the things off the top of my [0:26] mind that are bad about email [0:30] first and [0:31] foremost you can't control your tone via [0:35] email it's interpreted by the reader and [0:38] that doesn't only go for email that goes [0:40] for text that goes for any black letters [0:42] on a white page or if you use dark mode [0:46] white letters on a black page um but you [0:49] can't control your tone and as a result [0:52] your effectiveness at being able to [0:54] deliver a message goes down [0:56] substantially that's the kind of uh [1:00] outlier in terms of problems when it [1:02] comes to email some other things about [1:05] email that I'm not a fan of uh this is [1:08] probably because I come from the sales [1:10] world I get a bunch of cold emails from [1:12] time to [1:14] time just checking in just following [1:18] up I encourage anybody who's listening [1:21] to remove those words from all of your [1:25] emails we have such good intentions with [1:28] those of just nudging somebody to say [1:31] hey I'm checking in seeing how things [1:33] are going on your end but that's what [1:36] everybody [1:38] says and are you just checking in or [1:42] does the other side read into that as oh [1:45] you just want a decision you're not just [1:47] checking in on what's going on you want [1:50] a decision on what we talked about and [1:53] you know I I guess I'm looking at this [1:54] too much from a sales perspective now [1:56] but but just in general if you've got [1:59] something want to follow up with [2:01] somebody on or or you need to um kind of [2:05] nudge along the [2:07] process get a call whether it's a phone [2:10] call or a zoom call shoot for that [2:13] because it's going to make things that [2:16] much faster now you know there's [2:19] obviously like in the virtual era that [2:22] we live in right now there's a lot of [2:24] memes and and stuff on on these um short [2:27] form video sites like that that meeting [2:30] could have been an email so if it's [2:32] something simple and minor like that [2:34] sure email can be totally appropriate if [2:38] you know you're implementing something [2:39] new or or sharing that you're moving in [2:41] a d certain direction with teammates [2:44] sure emails fine but when it comes to [2:49] negotiation pick up the phone absolutely [2:53] absolutely and you can even say that so [2:57] where does negotiation be begin and and [2:59] of course I'm coming from a sales [3:01] background as well negotiation be begins [3:04] with that first intro so if you can if [3:07] there's a higher likelihood of [3:08] converting because you've had a [3:11] conversation then call you can always [3:14] follow up with an email that's short and [3:17] succinct and summarizes the conversation [3:19] but you can gain you're going to gain so [3:21] much and you risk losing so much by not [3:25] picking up the phone and taking the [3:26] opportunity to connect with that person [3:28] the only time I think you know emails [3:31] over five to seven lines are appropriate [3:33] is summarizing [3:35] something and you know the times that [3:38] I've sent longer emails I've told my [3:42] counterpart you're going to get a longer [3:44] email just summarizing what we talked [3:46] about today so they're at least ready [3:48] for it they know what to expect but if [3:52] you're starting a relationship or things [3:55] are in the early part of of building [3:58] that Rapport and building that trust [4:01] long emails do you no [4:04] favors you know I I might read a long [4:07] email from Marcel might read a long [4:09] email from Derek or Sandy or Troy [4:11] because you know I know there's good [4:13] intention behind that email but from [4:14] somebody that I don't trust or you know [4:17] hasn't fully I don't feel like they [4:20] fully built solid Rapport and we've got [4:22] a good [4:23] relationship probably going straight in [4:25] the trash [4:27] can yeah I totally agree with you that [4:30] email negotiating in email make things [4:33] complicated um for the most of the [4:36] business if we don't build out the trust [4:38] or any kind of the report it is really [4:42] hard to negotiate through the email so [4:45] the better way could be set out a tone [4:48] that we set out a schedule for the zoom [4:50] meeting call or whatever kind of the [4:52] phone call discussion or [4:54] face-to-face uh discussion that could [4:56] make things easier because we can know [4:59] noce uh the counterparts emotions and [5:03] dynamic and one of the most important [5:06] things we talking about we should read [5:09] by our eyes right we everybody have a [5:12] body language when we have a face [5:15] to-face discussion instead of discussion [5:18] by the email we can read their body [5:21] language at the same time sometimes it [5:23] means a [5:24] lot Nick yeah yeah those those uh those [5:29] you know AFF effect shifts as we always [5:31] refer to the Dynamics on the other side [5:34] when you can see somebody it makes your [5:36] job that much [5:39] easier you you try to exactly send a [5:42] quote via email or or or you try to send [5:46] anything via email you miss the reaction [5:49] of the other side and that's huge [5:52] because now you've got a huge space in [5:55] between when you send that email to them [5:57] and when that next communication is so [6:01] that's going to kind of you know start [6:02] to brew up a a storm in them if they [6:05] don't like what you sent that's when you [6:07] start getting ghosted etc etc so you [6:11] know Zoom call or or in in-person [6:15] meeting ideal because to Joann's point [6:20] you see the affect of the other side [6:23] phone call is a nice second [6:26] place because you can still pick up [6:29] effect through that phone call whether [6:31] it's a a sigh or a pen tapping or you [6:35] know fidgeting you can notice those [6:37] things in a phone call you may miss some [6:40] but you can notice those a lot better so [6:42] having that ability to see somebody is [6:44] extremely important yeah and having that [6:49] verbal conversation allows those [6:51] opportunities to happen where is it [6:53] email you're really restricting you're [6:55] still guided more by your goal and [6:59] something we should be concerned about [7:01] and weary of that's why we always want [7:03] to go for the call yeah your your [7:06] ability to influence your ability to [7:09] diffuse negative emotions on the other [7:11] side with text or [7:14] email is very [7:16] low very very low you may have some [7:20] effect with you know mirrors or or [7:23] asking questions but when things start [7:25] to get tense or there's something that's [7:27] hanging up a certain negotiation [7:30] you can't do that in written [7:31] communication and if you are able to [7:34] it's going to take you a really long [7:37] time and I would submit that just get on [7:39] the phone save everybody a lot of time [7:42] make things move a lot faster the other [7:45] thing that grinds my [7:48] gears generic subject [7:51] lines we looked you [7:55] up free month of blank this was multiple [8:00] different [8:01] services this may solve your [8:04] problem how do you know I have a problem [8:07] I was just gonna say that how do you [8:09] know I have a problem you looked me up [8:12] okay great I open the body of the [8:16] email all of the information was [8:18] inaccurate like oh so you looked me up [8:20] and you took no time doing anything [8:23] there was no personalization this is [8:24] just a template that you have so get [8:28] creative with lines now I'm not saying [8:31] you have to be like some wizard when it [8:33] comes to these subject lines but [8:35] something you know whether it's more [8:37] personal whether it's you know uh a no [8:41] oriented [8:42] question um maybe even an accusations on [8:46] it or if you've been in conversation [8:50] with somebody for a while maybe it's a [8:53] label hey seems like things have stalled [8:56] out on your end now depending on if [8:58] you're looking at that on your phone or [9:00] your computer they may be able to see [9:01] the subject line they may not be able to [9:04] see the subject line but it's just it's [9:06] more creative than we looked you up free [9:09] month of [9:11] blank I want some some some personal [9:15] touches to it or something that doesn't [9:17] read like a template you want to be more [9:20] genuine you want people to be more [9:21] genuine exactly exactly here's here's [9:25] one that I see in business [9:28] negotiations and it's a it's a positive [9:30] and a negative depends on how you use [9:33] it someone gets an email that fires them [9:38] up you know it's an intense [9:41] negotiation and it's sensitive and they [9:45] get an email from the other side that [9:46] fires them up and what do they do [9:49] immediately respond immediately just get [9:51] to typing I'm gonna and this em not only [9:54] is it long but now it's [9:56] emotionally it's emotionally like [9:59] confused and [10:01] so in as in verbal Communications we [10:04] don't necessarily need to respond right [10:06] away but we definitely don't need to [10:08] respond in an email negotiation first of [10:11] all we shouldn't be negotiating via [10:12] email and secondly we shouldn't be [10:15] responding right away to an email that [10:17] fires us up we need to slow it down and [10:20] take advantage of the fact that it is an [10:21] email thankfully that we receive yeah [10:25] you bring up a good point [10:28] um email Emil gives [10:32] us this [10:34] space on one hand it's very nice to have [10:37] space to not immediately have to respond [10:39] to [10:41] something on the other hand if you take [10:44] too long or you respond too quickly yes [10:49] yeah now you're hurting the relationship [10:51] you respond too quickly you come back [10:53] with emotionally charged things you [10:55] haven't thought it over you haven't [10:56] thought of their perspective and how [10:59] they type that [11:00] email you respond with something that's [11:03] just going to blow it up [11:05] mhm the latter you wait 24 hours 36 [11:11] hours 48 hours now the other side is [11:13] like why are you ghosting me I thought [11:15] we had a good relationship what did I do [11:17] is this you know is this deal going this [11:20] way or that way and now they start start [11:23] to have all these thoughts fester in [11:26] their head so it's a blessing and a [11:27] curse [11:29] so you know think about the promptness [11:32] in which you respond to emails and [11:35] here's something that I'm very guilty of [11:37] re you know travel day going to the [11:40] airport in the lift Etc I'll look at an [11:44] email and I won't respond to it and then [11:46] I forget about it until two days later [11:48] and I'm like oh shoot yes yeah so you're [11:50] not one of those one email in your inbox [11:52] kind of person Nick is that what you're [11:54] saying no I just have I can't have any [11:56] uh unread emails in my inbox that's all [12:00] um [12:02] but and I'm sure some of us are guilty [12:05] with this not only via email but also [12:07] text you read somebody's text you read [12:09] somebody's email and you're like oh I'll [12:10] get back to it you know after I go [12:12] through security or after I get these [12:13] things done and then you forget about it [12:16] and two days go past and they're like [12:18] what the heck and then you're like oh [12:20] shoot [12:24] so that's a little bit of more holding [12:26] yourself accountable in that but [12:29] be prompt in your email response if you [12:32] can't get to it in that moment either [12:35] have your out of office on or send them [12:37] an an email and say hey I'm traveling [12:39] today I'll get back to you as soon as I [12:40] can that's a great [12:42] point just just as like an [12:44] acknowledgement because you know I've [12:47] been on the other side of that where [12:49] I've sent emails and not got responses [12:51] for a couple days and I get hey sorry I [12:53] was traveling and I'm like yeah there's [12:55] a good chance you probably read it yeah [12:58] you probably did and the intent wasn't [13:00] negative it was just I didn't have a [13:03] chance to get back to you but then again [13:05] we read tone into everything and we you [13:07] know [13:09] assume um and and [13:11] that's the luxury with an email is that [13:14] we can respond to people um but there it [13:17] can create bad habits when we re when we [13:19] see an email and there's something there [13:21] that makes us hesitant to respond to or [13:24] it makes us take time then we should [13:26] really be asking ourselves should this [13:28] be a phone call like I know it's [13:30] uncomfortable but because it's [13:31] uncomfortable maybe it shouldn't be an [13:33] email maybe this should be a phone call [13:36] yeah yeah agreed so uh if you two aren't [13:40] against it now let's I think that's a [13:41] nice transition into some things that [13:43] you can [13:44] do uh from your side to communicate via [13:52] email we've already beat over the head [13:56] push it to a conversation a voice to [13:59] voice conversation a face-to-face [14:01] conversation push it to [14:04] that the thing we always run into or [14:08] that we hear is well you know uh gen Z [14:11] Gen X Millennials these people they just [14:13] really like you know emailing that's [14:15] their preferred version of [14:18] communication [14:20] um I call [14:25] BS when you [14:27] get email responses that are long pick [14:31] one [14:32] thing label it mirror it paraphrase [14:37] it they're going to come back hey you [14:39] didn't answer my other questions blah [14:40] blah blah blah [14:42] blah pick one thing out label mirror [14:45] paraphrase ask a question whatever it [14:49] is show you know just make it a little [14:52] more difficult on them to negotiate via [14:55] email so it becomes their idea MH to get [14:59] on the phone that's one option the other [15:03] option is just go straight at it with a [15:05] no oriented question you know how [15:08] uncomfortable would it make you if we [15:10] had a I like random numbers 11 minute [15:14] phone call or 11 minute Zoom call no [15:18] oriented question and a random number [15:20] catches their attention they're going to [15:22] be like 11 minutes 13 minutes not five [15:25] not 10 not 15 not even 30 pick a random [15:29] number because some [15:31] people particularly the analysts will [15:35] then play a game with you of like let's [15:38] see if you can stick to that 11 minutes [15:40] that you said it's good to know at 10 [15:43] and a half minutes you say hey I told [15:45] you it was going to be 11 minutes let's [15:46] stop here we can continue the [15:48] conversation elsewhere and they'll say [15:50] you got me on the phone now let's let's [15:53] just finish now or you'll reschedule it [15:55] you'll talk about more another time but [15:58] just the no oriented question with a [16:00] specific amount of time is a nice direct [16:03] short way to get somebody on the phone [16:05] any any other thoughts on that Marcel [16:08] yeah and they're also inviting you when [16:10] you do stop so it is important to stop [16:11] actually at right before the 11 minutes [16:13] because then it's their idea to continue [16:16] the conversation so now you're not in [16:18] that position where you've taken up half [16:20] an hour or 45 minutes of their time and [16:22] they they're blaming it psychologically [16:24] on you they've asked you to go on which [16:26] is it's really a great place to be if [16:28] you know that you're connecting with [16:29] them if they're asking you to [16:31] continue yeah sometimes I use the labels [16:35] I I really love this skills because um [16:39] especially for the new business when you [16:42] have a write a simple email back and [16:44] force you already knows that negotiate [16:48] by the email is not efficiency so we can [16:51] say sounds like you have a vision about [16:54] the new proposal sounds like you have a [16:56] new vision about our Corporation is it a [16:59] bad idea if we could set up um 15 15 [17:05] minutes Zoom call next [17:08] week um N Out of the 10 your client or [17:12] your [17:13] supplier probably agree because for one [17:17] thing they think about oh 15 minutes or [17:20] 11 minutes that is a odd number right [17:23] they they have a um they [17:27] asks why why it is a 15 minutes phone [17:31] call not 30 minutes so they could [17:34] thinking about that for another things [17:37] um we just have a a little bit break in [17:40] between we don't necessarily bombard a [17:43] message in the long email we can keep it [17:45] short use a labels and then not a rented [17:49] question keep it [17:51] simple all right some other things that [17:54] that I had written down as some better [17:57] ways to communicate [18:00] via email or text I mentioned catchy [18:03] subject [18:06] lines think of creative things that you [18:08] can come up with I gave you some [18:10] examples that you could use accusations [18:13] on it's no oriented questions labels um [18:17] or even something specific to the person [18:19] that you're talking to [18:22] and here you know Troy is very good at [18:26] this and I am not [18:29] but he's talked about [18:32] how he follows up with clients all the [18:35] time just to touch base with them he [18:37] doesn't ask them how [18:39] negotiation he he completely removes [18:41] business from the equation checks in not [18:44] only at the holidays he checks in all [18:47] the time with his [18:48] clients and because Troy is such a [18:50] personable guy and really loves to get [18:53] to know people you know he'll ask people [18:55] you know how how are your kids you know [18:57] gymnastics tryouts or you know whatever [19:00] it is that he managed to find out about [19:02] them it makes it personal to them and [19:04] when people read that email they're like [19:06] oh you actually listen to that I to to [19:09] me saying those things and that means a [19:11] lot to people so it doesn't have to be [19:13] like a Black Swan skill in terms of [19:15] catchiness in an email but something [19:17] that they're going to read it and be [19:19] like oh that was genuine that was to me [19:24] that wasn't to you know get me to spend [19:27] x amount of dollars that wasn't to get [19:29] me to sign on the dotted line that was [19:32] just to me as a person because that [19:35] rarely happens in email that rarely [19:37] happens in communication that we [19:39] recognize there's human on the other [19:41] side which makes the deal when the deal [19:44] does happen so much easier because the [19:48] trust is built and they know that it's [19:50] not an [19:52] investment that's just for the deal like [19:55] they know you're a good person because [19:57] you took the time to show them so A good [20:00] rule of thumb is limit it to about five [20:04] lines like anything beyond that starts [20:08] to become too cumbersome to read or [20:11] people aren't going to get to it right [20:12] away so keep it to about five [20:16] lines and the things I like to do in [20:20] email depending on the context of the [20:23] conversation if you're delivering bad [20:27] news accus accusations [20:30] audits now be very careful littering [20:34] your emails with accusations audits not [20:38] three not four not five one maybe two [20:42] depending on the context of the [20:45] situation I came to what I thought was [20:48] an agreement with a certain [20:51] person they introduce me to procurement [20:54] procurement loves to negotiate via email [20:57] from my experience [20:59] anyways [21:01] and it was always hey you know we know [21:04] that you talk to so and so uh we see [21:07] your price of this you know why don't [21:08] you take 15% [21:10] off and I'm like okay here we go so my [21:14] response was almost always the same some [21:16] iteration [21:18] of greeting I know you're just doing [21:21] your [21:23] job accusations audit and then I would [21:26] follow it up with a softener of I'm [21:30] afraid there's no wiggle room on the [21:36] price uh always try to end it with a [21:39] positive note something to the effect of [21:42] you know really appreciate you reaching [21:44] out or really looking forward to working [21:45] with you together on this something to [21:47] make the email end positively cuz the [21:50] last impression is the Lasting [21:52] Impression but what that that email [21:55] contained three lines of [21:56] text very short very succinct [21:59] recognizing that I know they're just [22:01] doing their job standing my ground with [22:04] a phase of no I'm afraid there's just no [22:07] wiggle room here and then the last [22:09] impression is the Lasting Impression [22:11] that's how simply you can respond to [22:13] these [22:14] emails yeah that's great I love that um [22:17] I've used this is probably going to be a [22:19] deal breaker on a negotiated term just [22:22] something easy yeah it you know it [22:25] doesn't have to [22:27] be an elaborate list of accusations [22:30] audits [22:31] because they're going to read through [22:33] one they're going to read through two by [22:35] the third one they're going to start to [22:37] say what's this all [22:39] about and their guards going to go up [22:43] because you don't have control of the [22:46] tone and on top of that it feels [22:50] templated it doesn't feel genuine it [22:53] feels like a robotic response so when [22:56] you're using accusation dot it'ss Thea [22:58] email one maybe two in most [23:00] circumstances and and make that one or [23:03] two [23:05] powerful don't you know maybe something [23:08] stronger than I have bad [23:10] news something a little bit stronger [23:13] based on the scenario or based on the [23:15] circumstances of the other side yeah I [23:18] mentioned I'm afraid I'm sorry and I'm [23:20] afraid are great softeners for emails [23:24] because you can't control your tone I'm [23:26] sorry and I'm afraid soften the tone up [23:28] just a little bit is it going to make [23:30] you uh you know a wizard when it comes [23:32] to negotiating the email of course not [23:35] but it helps soften it so you have a [23:37] little bit more control over the tone [23:40] that you're [23:42] delivering [23:44] um we've kind of beaten up no oriented [23:47] questions in email the only one we [23:49] haven't touched is the have you given up [23:51] on which at this point I feel like [23:53] everybody in their brother knows about [23:55] to have you given up on email uh as they [23:58] should [23:58] it's it's a great attention getter U but [24:02] that's subject line only have you given [24:04] up on this partnership on working [24:06] together have you given up on the Black [24:07] Swan [24:08] group as that restarter to [24:11] Communications when you've been [24:14] ghosted here's the thing that I think a [24:17] lot of people fail to realize after [24:20] using the have you given up on [24:23] email they don't trust [24:26] you if they trust you they would have [24:29] never ghosted you so when you restart [24:32] that communication don't go back to your [24:35] old habits don't continue doing the same [24:38] thing that you've been doing but instead [24:40] lean back into tactical empathy ask [24:43] yourself what have I missed yes you know [24:47] what is holding the other side up what [24:49] could be standing in the way of making [24:52] this happen and be curious about it [24:55] because the only way to continue that [24:58] relationship and conversation and to [25:00] avoid getting ghosted again is by [25:02] building [25:03] trust if you go back to the same ways [25:07] you're getting ghosted again and then [25:09] you're going to find yourself three [25:11] months later sending another have you [25:12] given up on and you're like well the [25:13] have you given up On's working great but [25:15] I just can't seem to close this [25:17] deal there's a lack of trust yeah and if [25:20] you're repetitive with the same email [25:22] it's only going to work for so long [25:24] exactly exactly um so have you given up [25:28] on email no body no salutation no [25:31] greeting nothing just the subject line [25:34] only [25:40] um I mentioned uh oh the subject lines [25:45] some catchy subject [25:47] lines I came up with a few off the top [25:49] of my head and this is all industry [25:51] dependent totally depends on the [25:53] position that you're in who you're [25:54] talking to Etc but something like would [25:58] you hate more filling the [26:02] blank somebody you know if you're trying [26:04] to um get somebody more leads and that's [26:07] what you're selling to a business would [26:10] you hate more leads that catches [26:13] somebody's attention they're like no I [26:15] wouldn't hate more leads who would hate [26:16] more [26:17] leads does that mean you're going to be [26:19] 100% successful of course not welcome to [26:22] email welcome to cold [26:24] email um but maybe it boosts your [26:27] percentage by a little bit [26:29] um is this a waste of time subject line [26:33] just to peque somebody's interest and [26:35] then as I mentioned earlier something [26:37] personal I've had the few cold emails [26:41] that have caught my attention are [26:44] somebody recognizing something that I [26:46] wrote in a blog [26:48] article somebody um seeing one of our [26:51] videos and saying like hey I heard you [26:53] say this I thought it was really [26:54] intelligent or whatever they say um [26:59] but then they don't ask for anything [27:01] they just recognize it and they throw [27:03] the email out and see what happens now [27:06] did I respond to those no because I [27:08] wasn't interested in what they were [27:09] selling because I just looked them up [27:11] rather quickly um had I been interested [27:15] in what they were talking about I'd have [27:17] been more inclined to do [27:18] so personalization matters so be genuine [27:23] don't don't just be like everybody else [27:25] that uses email in this way be different [27:28] the only thing I can add is to follow up [27:30] an email especially if you're if it's a [27:33] cold [27:35] email and you get a response really [27:37] drive to the call at that point because [27:40] if you're just if you're allowing it to [27:41] go to an email strand then you're [27:43] missing the whole point of the email if [27:45] there's anything that comes out of this [27:46] it's just emails should be a driver to a [27:49] phone call Y yeah and you you sparked [27:53] another [27:56] thought I mentioned just check in just [27:58] following up [28:01] earlier take those out of your emails [28:04] and use labels don't just do things to [28:07] check a box but do things with a purpose [28:09] and do things with an [28:10] intention so have that genuiness and [28:14] just be curious what could cause [28:17] them to not respond to you in the manner [28:21] that they said they were going to I [28:23] always like to follow the rule of thumb [28:26] no more than 24 hours for response to an [28:29] email even if it was just like a hey I'm [28:33] going to have to get with so and so to [28:35] talk about this and then we can decide [28:37] how to move forward at least give them a [28:40] status [28:41] update [28:43] so in that and you know depending on the [28:46] circumstance I would say definitely no [28:48] more than 24 hours but in some [28:50] circumstances maybe no more than three [28:52] or four hours if you're already like [28:54] very certain on it no need to wait no [28:57] need to you know let them sit on it [28:59] because then they start [29:01] to have other thoughts come into their [29:04] mind about what's going on is everything [29:06] okay is this going a different way [29:08] Marcel maybe you have a different uh [29:10] perspective than I well you I you're the [29:12] gold star because you're the analyst and [29:14] so of course I'm the assertive and I I [29:16] am not the best always with this I would [29:19] say you don't want to go beyond the 48 [29:21] hours at that point you're people are [29:23] really wondering two days is just a long [29:25] time so um but best case couple hours to [29:30] 24 hours and if you don't have an answer [29:32] you can always say would you mind if we [29:34] take a couple days to look into the [29:37] details before we give you an [29:41] answer yeah I'm assertive also so time [29:44] matters the long emails I usually don't [29:47] have the patient to read everything or [29:49] every single R it's better to have a [29:52] face to-face communication that could [29:55] make things easier um another thing [29:58] things could come to my Minds about the [30:00] intuition for the face tof face [30:03] discussion or [30:05] negotiation we we have a very strong [30:08] intuition when we read Al for example [30:11] especially for women we we can pick up [30:15] the dynamic emotions from Another Side [30:18] tactical empathy is all about ability to [30:22] recognize the d uh Dynamic emotions and [30:26] another important things which should [30:28] viralize that if we cannot read the room [30:32] it's really hard to ver viralize that [30:37] recognition so it's better to have face [30:41] tof face discussion or the phone call MH

===FILE=== 9CLWxThRDSA - 1 Trick To Build Trust With ANY Client.txt
https://youtu.be/9CLWxThRDSA
#1 Trick To Build Trust With ANY Client!

[0:00] you think if you call somebody and say [0:02] hey there's nothing new that makes you [0:04] look lazy it makes you look like what [0:07] you're doing [0:09] nothing it's not about you it's about [0:17] them when do you normally talk to your [0:23] clients when you have good [0:25] news and when you have bad [0:28] news when is that going to happen [0:30] happened you don't know [0:32] right so what does that mean you're [0:35] failing to put predictability into the [0:38] process how do you put predictability [0:40] into the process I tell you what we used [0:42] to do as hostage negotiators working [0:44] kidnappings overseas I had to have it [0:46] pointed out to [0:47] me and then I found a real estate agent [0:50] that was doing it in Australia and she [0:52] was her referral pipeline was far in [0:55] excessive what anybody else's was so I'm [0:57] working cases in the Philippines and [1:01] what are we doing we're calling a family [1:03] when there's good news and they bad news [1:04] family didn't families didn't like us at [1:06] all very early in my career of running [1:08] these cases overseas finally there was a [1:10] guy with a state department named Ted [1:11] Ted interesting [1:13] cat and the families love Ted loved him [1:17] and he wasn't actually doing anything he [1:19] wasn't there saving anybody's life and [1:22] it was annoying the hell out of me they [1:23] liked him Ted more like us finally Ted [1:26] calls me on the phone he says look I [1:28] can't take it anymore here's what you [1:29] doing to kill [1:31] yourself they never wonder when they're [1:33] going to hear from me I have scheduled [1:36] calls with them they always know when [1:38] they're going to hear from [1:40] me and I tell them in advance you're [1:43] going to hear from me in exactly a day [1:44] and a half the phone rings and if I got [1:46] nothing to tell them I call them on the [1:48] phone I say I got nothing to tell you [1:51] and they love [1:53] it you want to call when you have [1:56] information you think if you call [1:58] somebody and say hey there's nothing new [2:00] that makes you look lazy it makes you [2:04] look like what you're doing [2:06] nothing it's not about you it's about [2:11] them they're wondering what's going on [2:15] they find it very reassuring if there's [2:17] nothing new you call at the appointed [2:20] time and say there's nothing [2:23] new and I knew this in hostage [2:25] negotiation then I'm listening to this [2:28] real estate agent who's a f Focus [2:30] speaker at a major conference in [2:32] Australia simply because of her [2:35] pipeline was killing everybody on a [2:38] pipeline and she laid out that that's [2:40] what their schedule was with their [2:41] clients their clients always knew when [2:44] they were going to hear from the P from [2:46] whoever was representing them not when [2:48] there was good news or bad news a [2:50] Breaking Bad News is something we're [2:51] going to get into but a consistent basis [2:54] of when they're going to hear from you [2:56] because what do they do what what [2:59] happened to us in hospital negotiation [3:00] they didn't know when they're going to [3:01] hear from us the minute they got off the [3:02] phone they go on the internet start [3:04] googling information and then they want [3:06] to call me and find out why I'm not [3:07] doing this why I'm not doing that sound [3:13] familiar in their anxiety to get to the [3:16] transaction if they feel they're being [3:18] held in the dark they're going to go out [3:21] and they're going to start searching [3:22] stuff they're going to start asking [3:23] questions they're going to talk to their [3:24] brother-in-law or your agent's not doing [3:26] this why aren't they doing that that's [3:28] why they want to call you at all all [3:30] kind of odd times on weekends and on the [3:32] evenings cuz they've been Googling stuff [3:34] and they don't know when they're going [3:35] to hear from [3:37] you let's say they know they're going to [3:39] hear from you at 10:00 on Monday they're [3:42] less likely to ring you up at 10 p.m. on [3:46] Sunday because they know when they're [3:47] going to hear from you I got to the [3:49] point where we never let never let [3:51] anybody wonder when they were going to [3:52] hear from us whether it was a specific [3:55] time or if it was something that was [3:57] going to go down in two or 3 days as I [4:00] got to the end of every call I'd say [4:01] You're going to hear from me in an hour [4:03] and an hour later I got back on the [4:05] phone and if I had nothing new just want [4:07] you to know there's nothing new and they [4:09] loved it now the final kicker was [4:11] because this is human nature we're [4:13] working at case in the Philippines burn [4:15] a barrel case and um Mary Jones is the [4:20] sister of Grace [4:21] shur and everybody was scared of Mary [4:24] Jones I mean scared to death of her when [4:27] I finally met her when it was all over I [4:29] mean this you know this kind of short [4:31] just upbeat she's got this pixie haircut [4:34] and I'm like how how is everybody scared [4:36] the death of this girl I mean how the [4:37] hell is because she wanted answers and I [4:40] got a SWAT guy in Cincinnati that scared [4:43] the caller on the [4:44] phone I got a SWAT guy scared of this [4:46] little [4:48] pixie and I I said I called him one day [4:51] I said you call Mary on the phone yet he [4:53] goes no I'm tired of cuz I'm tired of [4:55] calling on the phone asking her how [4:57] she's doing and having her bite my head [4:59] off [5:01] and I'm like first of all it's not what [5:02] I told you to do I didn't call you to [5:05] call her on the phone and say how you [5:06] doing like how the hell do you think [5:08] she's [5:09] doing as a trusted advisor and as a [5:12] professional you know how your clients [5:14] are [5:16] doing when they're anxiously waiting on [5:18] news don't call them on the phone and [5:20] say how are you [5:21] today you're supposed to [5:24] know you make yourself look [5:28] stupid and in her mind she's like how [5:31] the hell do you think I am my sister's [5:32] being held hostage by Islamic terrorists [5:35] in the Philippines and they are known [5:37] for doing horrible things to people how [5:38] do you think I [5:40] am so these tiny little emotional [5:43] intelligence [5:45] tweaks don't ask somebody how they are [5:47] when you know how they [5:49] are demonstrate an [5:52] understanding don't let them wonder when [5:56] they're going to hear from [5:58] you because is the minute that they [6:01] start hearing knowing when they're going [6:02] to hear from you even if you got nothing [6:04] new you put predictability back in a [6:07] process and you build predictability in [6:11] an unpredictable process because as [6:13] every one of you said you don't know [6:15] when there's going to be good news you [6:16] don't know when there's going to be bad [6:18] news but you can be eminently [6:19] predictable in the way that you interact [6:22] with your clients and they will love [6:25] it because you put predictability in an [6:29] uncertain situation

===FILE=== Eu73ut5vBZs - Top 5 Deal Killersand How to Stop Them.txt
https://youtu.be/Eu73ut5vBZs
Top 5 Deal Killers(and How to Stop Them!)

[0:00] Here's the thing. Most deals don't die [0:03] because of what's said. They die because [0:06] of what's not said. If you don't uncover [0:09] the truth, your pipeline looks great on [0:12] paper and dead in real life. Hi, it's [0:16] Chris Vos, CEO of the Black Swan Group, [0:19] and today I'm pulling back the curtain [0:21] on something that kills more deals than [0:24] bad pricing, bad timing, or bad pitches [0:27] ever could. I'm talking about the secret [0:30] deal killers, the hidden traps that [0:32] sabotage your sales without you even [0:36] knowing it. Stay tuned. By the end of [0:40] this video, you'll know how to spot them [0:42] and stop them before they kill your next [0:45] big close. Let's start with the first [0:49] secret killer. Secret deal killer number [0:52] one, [0:54] the hidden decision maker. You think [0:55] you're talking to the decision maker, [0:58] but there's someone in the shadows who [1:01] can kill your deal and say no if you [1:04] don't find them. They'll kill your deal [1:06] at the last minute. The deal killer. How [1:09] to kill the killer. Ask. It seems like [1:12] someone else needs to feel comfortable [1:14] with this before we move forward. [1:18] That's an asking label. [1:21] Simple, non-threatening. [1:24] Powerful [1:27] secret deal killer number two, the [1:29] unspoken budget constraint. They say [1:33] price looks fine. You think you're good, [1:38] you're not. Most buyers won't admit [1:40] they're overbudget until it's too late. [1:43] How to kill the killer? Ask, [1:46] "How does this align with your budget [1:48] goal for the quarter?" Then shut up. [1:52] Shut the front door. [1:54] Listen for hesitation. [1:57] That's your signal to dig deeper. Label [1:59] the hesitation. Label what you see. [2:02] Label the look on their face. Label the [2:04] body ship. Label every affect ship. It [2:08] seems like something just crossed your [2:10] mind. That's the perfect label. When you [2:12] see that hesitation, secret deal killer [2:16] number three, [2:18] the unvoiced fear. [2:22] People won't tell you they're scared. [2:24] They'll ghost you instead. [2:27] Fear of looking stupid. Fear of buying [2:29] the wrong thing. Fear of getting fired. [2:33] Fear explaining your offer to their [2:35] boss. [2:37] How to kill the killer. Label it. It [2:41] seems like you might have some concerns [2:43] about this working for you. [2:46] Take a six second pause. Count thousands [2:49] to yourself slowly till you get to six [2:53] 1000. If they don't speak, ask [2:57] what worries you most. Just like that. [3:02] When you name the fear, they feel safe [3:04] to open up. [3:06] When you give them time to react, they [3:09] feel even more safe. If you got to ask [3:12] the what question, you ask this in a way [3:16] that's gentle and understanding. They'll [3:18] open up. Secret deal killer number four, [3:22] the silent competitor. You're not the [3:24] only one in the race, [3:27] but you might be the only one not [3:29] talking about it. If you don't know who [3:32] the fool in the game is, [3:34] probably you. [3:37] If they're shopping you against three [3:39] other offers, you better know how to [3:42] reveal the killer, how to kill the [3:44] killer. label. [3:47] It seems like you're still shopping [3:48] around. That's a fair label. It's fair [3:53] to ask that. Ask it nicely. Not like an [3:56] accusation, [3:58] but gently [3:59] with no judgment and no defensiveness. [4:04] It's just the intel you need to win. [4:08] Secret deal killer number five, the fake [4:13] yes. the counterfeit. Yes. The three [4:16] kind of yeses, commitment, confirmation, [4:18] and counterfeit. The vast majority of [4:20] yeses are counterfeit. [4:23] They say yes just to get you off the [4:26] phone. They never intend to buy. Polite [4:29] buyers are dangerous buyers. [4:32] How to kill the killer. [4:36] The best way to never get a counterfeit [4:38] yes [4:40] is to not go for yes at all. Instead of [4:43] yes, go for that's right. How do you do [4:47] that? Well, you summarize their [4:49] situation. [4:50] For example, sounds like you're trying [4:52] to achieve X and then name that [4:55] objective, [4:57] but struggle with [5:00] and then something else that they're [5:02] struggling with the the comparison. [5:07] And then go silent. [5:10] When you get a that's right out of them, [5:12] you know you spoken the truth to them. [5:15] And since they see you as a trutht [5:18] teller, [5:19] they're bought in with you. [5:23] These are the five secret deal killers. [5:27] And now you know how to kill them before [5:30] they kill your commission check. [5:34] Remember, your best weapon is tactical [5:37] empathy. Don't out talk your customer, [5:41] out listen. [5:44] Stay curious, find the black swan, [5:48] and go close your next deal like a black [5:51] swan pro.

===FILE=== FZ-CNt3VQnE - Why Forcing a Yes Is Killing Your Salesand how to fix it.txt
https://youtu.be/FZ-CNt3VQnE
Why Forcing a Yes Is Killing Your Sales(and how to fix it)

[0:00] Why getting to yes is killing your sales [0:04] and how to fix it. Yes is the most [0:06] dangerous word in business and your [0:09] sales are suffering for it. Hey, it's [0:12] Chris Vos. Is it weird to think a [0:15] client's yes might not really mean yes? [0:18] You heard this looks great. They smiled. [0:21] They nodded. They said yes three times [0:24] over. And then radio silence ghosted. [0:29] Let me tell you something I've learned [0:31] after 25 years in hostage negotiation [0:33] and sales. You are killing your sales [0:36] without even knowing it. When you're [0:38] pushing hard for a yes. Does that sound [0:42] fair? Are we in agreement? You're not [0:45] closing the deal. You're killing trust. [0:49] Because your counterpart is silently [0:51] thinking, "If I say yes, what trap am I [0:55] stepping into?" [0:57] Yes. Feels like being cornered, a trap [1:01] door, a loss of autonomy. And the moment [1:04] they feel cornered, their survival brain [1:07] kicks in. And now you're the threat. And [1:11] people don't make deals with threats. [1:14] But even the easy yes, that's dangerous, [1:18] too. The friendly. Yes. The Let's circle [1:22] back. Yes. The Sure, this looks good. [1:27] Yes. [1:29] That one feels better, but it's even [1:31] more lethal. Why? [1:34] Because it's counterfeit. A false yes. [1:38] It gives you false hope. They're not [1:40] saying yes to commit. They're saying yes [1:43] to escape. [1:45] And now your follow-ups, your emails, [1:47] your calls feel like chasing a ghost. [1:52] The solution, [1:54] nooriented questions. Questions that [1:57] seek no. [2:00] Here's the fix. [2:02] Make no your new best friend. [2:06] Stop chasing yes. Start designing [2:09] conversations where the other person [2:11] feels safe to say no. Because when [2:14] people say no, it makes them feel safe. [2:18] It makes them feel protected. Let them [2:21] feel protected. Let them feel in [2:24] control. Start with questions like, "Is [2:28] now a bad time to talk?" [2:31] "Would it be ridiculous to consider [2:33] another option?" [2:35] "Is this a bad idea?" [2:40] These are called nooriented questions. [2:44] and they make you a non-threat. [2:47] They buy clarity, honesty, and real [2:50] engagement. Here's what's happening [2:53] behind the scenes. Humans are twice as [2:56] motivated to avoid a loss than to gain [2:59] something of equal value. [3:02] So, every yes feels risky. [3:06] Every yes feels like potential loss. But [3:10] saying no, that's safe. It's autonomy. [3:15] It's protection. [3:17] When someone says no, they're actually [3:20] opening the door to real conversation. [3:22] No is not rejection. It's the beginning [3:26] of trustbased influence. Next time [3:29] you're on a sales call, forget about [3:31] getting them to say yes. Instead, say, [3:35] "Would it be a horrible idea to go in [3:37] this direction?" Or, "Are you against [3:41] talking about pricing?" [3:43] And then shut up. [3:47] Let them lean in. Let them engage. [3:51] Let them tell you the truth. Let them [3:54] tell you what the real barriers are, if [3:58] any. Chasing yes [4:02] is costing you trust. [4:06] Getting to know [4:08] is how you build it. [4:11] If you want deals that don't die after [4:14] the handshake, [4:16] start making no [4:19] feel like a safe place. [4:22] Control is an illusion. [4:24] Collaboration is the game. [4:28] Now ask yourself, [4:31] are you still addicted to us?

===FILE=== GwKoxnIvZJI - Hostage Negotiator Reveals Psychological Tricks To Win Any Deal  Chris Voss.txt
https://youtu.be/GwKoxnIvZJI
Hostage Negotiator Reveals Psychological Tricks To Win Any Deal ｜ Chris Voss

[0:00] welcome to the show I'm Jordan Harbinger [0:03] several years ago I met an FBI hostage [0:05] negotiator who had revolutionized the [0:08] way the FBI deals with terrorists bank [0:10] robbers and other hostage takers who [0:12] would gladly hold a gun to your head to [0:13] get what they wanted now my good friend [0:15] Chris Voss is one of the leading experts [0:18] on negotiation anywhere today we'll [0:21] learn the subtle art of letting someone [0:22] else have our way using psychological [0:25] leverage archetypes of different [0:27] negotiators and personalities as well as [0:29] something called the Black Swan rule [0:31] treating others not the way we want to [0:33] be treated but the way they want to be [0:35] treated now there's a reason that Chris [0:38] has changed the way we negotiate with [0:39] both terrorists and teenagers at home or [0:42] the home office and if you liked our [0:45] previous three-part series on [0:46] negotiation with Alex Koontz then you'll [0:48] really love what Chris and I have for [0:50] you on this episode of the show remember [0:52] there are worksheets for every episode [0:54] this one is no exception those are at [0:55] Jordan Harbinger calm in the show notes [0:57] and also check out six-minute networking [1:00] if you want to learn how I book all [1:01] these amazing people for the show that's [1:03] over at Jordan Harbinger comm slash [1:06] course we teach you my networking tips [1:08] and tricks' systems to keep it all [1:10] engaged all right here's Chris Voss I [1:12] read the whole book of course again [1:14] which is great because you still learned [1:16] there's so much in the book it reads [1:18] like a more interesting instruction [1:21] manual or textbook with actual stories [1:24] which most textbooks don't have because [1:26] there's never any practical application [1:28] the things you read in a lot of [1:29] textbooks but I noticed that even after [1:31] how long you been doing the FBI thing [1:34] how long were you doing that 20 years 24 [1:36] years 24 years you said you still feel [1:38] fear during the negotiations what do you [1:41] mean by that what why are you still [1:43] feeling fear after well you know I mean [1:45] that nobody ever gets away from it [1:47] you're wired into it it really would [1:48] just matters what you're scared of it's [1:50] nothing that scared it's what were you [1:51] scared of you know I'm scared of not [1:53] doing a good job I'm scared I miss [1:56] something I it took me a long time to [1:58] realize I'm actually scared of being [1:59] afraid scared of being scared yeah you [2:01] know like like the like if fighting [2:04] words for me you're coward because the [2:06] last thing I want to be as a coward or [2:08] the what conversely [2:10] you know the worst one of the worst [2:12] names I ever call him but it's a coward [2:14] like if I say you're a coward [2:15] I probably despise you okay yeah where [2:18] are you from woods Europe Iowa okay is [2:21] that a cause that sounds like it's like [2:23] a Texas thing okay so how boy like all [2:26] he called me yella yeah Marty McFly yeah [2:30] because me yeah that's kind of what I'm [2:34] thinking if somebody called me a coward [2:36] I'm like I don't know how personally [2:37] would I take that yeah right now they're [2:39] different yeah we resonate with [2:41] different words now I don't think it's [2:42] an Iowa thing I think people are guilty [2:44] that everyone sure you know it's a [2:46] little bit you know were you born [2:47] I mean we believe you know my company [2:51] that you're born one of three types [2:53] fight flight or make friends it's a [2:55] descendents from the caveman days and [2:56] people who put it in other ways you know [2:58] caveman saw something you know do I eat [3:00] it does it eat me can I make with it [3:01] it's the same thing yeah I happen to be [3:05] from the fight tribe so okay but the [3:07] world splits pretty evenly into thirds I [3:09] mean you get into a real problem the [3:12] prompt rejection bias I am normal if you [3:15] will thinking that other people think [3:18] like us yeah so for flight we think [3:19] everybody's fight yeah yeah that you [3:21] know you think everybody's like that I [3:22] can remember first time I got introduced [3:24] to a concept I was was when I first went [3:28] up to Harvard Law School's from [3:29] negotiations course in their executive [3:31] class and they gave us his tki [3:33] thomasgillam and conflict mode [3:35] instrument breaks you into five types [3:36] knocked you out you're left with one of [3:38] those three and remember the sitting [3:41] there thinking like every one of my [3:43] hostage negotiators damn well better [3:45] being assertive because we got people's [3:46] lives on a line projection you know it's [3:50] how I am that's what it takes to do the [3:51] job as it turns out that's only one each [3:54] type has stuff they bring to the table [3:56] that are necessary no one type has the [3:59] market cornered and as I looked over my [4:01] hostage negotiators I had those that [4:04] were primary analysts and I had those [4:06] that were primarily relationship [4:07] oriented people and I was primarily [4:10] assertion and what you really need is [4:12] all three so that just happens to be the [4:15] tribe I started out and and you got to [4:17] learn the rest so we have personality [4:20] archetypes that affect our negotiation [4:22] is that what I'm hearing that's who that [4:23] would [4:24] yes okay yeah and you measure that from [4:26] a tester you just kind of say this [4:28] person is this one this person is that [4:29] one based on their you know you're gonna [4:31] get you can get a pretty good feel early [4:34] on [4:34] problem when you have miscommunications [4:36] and miss matches and communications or [4:40] barriers you know impasse is almost [4:42] always a type problem a type mismatch [4:44] problem misunderstanding of a [4:46] conversation classic example the [4:49] accommodative relationship oriented type [4:52] the worst thing they can do to you is [4:55] stop working on a relationship because [4:57] that's the thing they value most if [4:59] we're talking it's awesome if I shut up [5:02] it means I hate you or I'm furious the [5:06] meanest thing relationship or in person [5:08] can do is give you the silent reading [5:10] you know and that's how these signal [5:12] fury now the analytical type on the [5:14] other hand love silence because they [5:16] live to think so you get an analyst [5:18] analyst and a comedy are talking to each [5:20] other the analyst goes silent because [5:22] they grateful for the opportunity to [5:24] thank the accommodated relationship [5:27] oriented type is like oh my god they're [5:28] upset I better talk the analyst can't [5:32] think because the accommodator keeps [5:34] talking right this is just like you [5:36] should shut up and the commenter is [5:38] going I gotta talk and if the other [5:40] person is assertive or relationship [5:43] oriented I should say and then viana was [5:45] just thinking the relationship oriented [5:47] person's going oh they're mad at me [5:48] they're angry right so we have that it's [5:51] kind of like the internet book the five [5:52] love languages or something [5:54] yeah it's for relationships of course [5:56] but it sounds like these personality [5:59] archetypes exist in negotiation as well [6:01] yeah and so do you in the beginning of [6:04] any negotiation do you try to ascertain [6:06] which type of communication style the [6:09] other party has is that important well [6:10] you want you want to you want to pull [6:12] you know pull the information as you go [6:13] in reality should be working and having [6:16] a great relationship all the time so you [6:19] know we like to start with of the nine [6:21] negotiation skills there's two that [6:23] everybody likes and so you start out [6:27] with that till you know the other type [6:28] which is basically you know really [6:31] listening really dial in and because [6:32] everybody wants to be listened to and [6:34] then if you run into problems your first [6:36] question is [6:37] probably misinterpreting what they say [6:40] you know problems on mind it's sort of [6:44] like the real problem with [6:45] cross-cultural negotiations everybody [6:46] wants to learn cross-cultural [6:48] negotiation yeah because I still want to [6:51] be me but I want to know the tiny little [6:52] things I got to do to make you happy so [6:54] I can still be me like an American [6:56] alright so don't show the bottom of my [6:58] feet to somebody from the Middle East [6:59] and don't shake with my left hand and [7:01] then I could do everything else wrong [7:02] yeah yeah you know we're looking for [7:04] shortcuts as opposed to really adapting [7:06] to the other side right so we look for [7:08] these kind of even know you'd call them [7:10] sound bites yeah go don't cross your [7:13] foot and point it at the Saudi prince [7:15] because that'll make them mad and then [7:17] right while you just ignore all of the [7:18] other more nuanced exactly the things [7:21] that would actually require work to [7:22] learn and practice right yeah better to [7:25] just open up a fortune cookie and learn [7:27] something yeah that makes sense okay and [7:31] I know that you use this in parenting [7:32] which makes sense you got to negotiate [7:34] with kids but what about people day to [7:37] day I mean are you looking at [7:38] personality archetypes and communication [7:40] or negotiation styles with everybody [7:43] that you meet kind of automatically you [7:45] know it's you know are you looking for [7:48] it or you're focusing on it or are you [7:49] just trying to remain aware of it right [7:51] right and it's a little bit more just [7:53] remaining aware of it or so and make [7:57] some predictions about how people are [7:59] gonna react to different sorts of [8:01] gestures you know an assertive type I'm [8:04] a natural-born a certain you know we're [8:07] not good at reciprocity because we think [8:10] we're so logical that if you gave us [8:12] something it was only logical that you [8:15] should give it to me therefore I don't [8:17] know just a little sense of entitlement [8:19] maybe yeah you could call like that if I [8:22] got it I should have got it the [8:25] relationship oriented person we want to [8:27] trade stuff back and forth all the time [8:28] so if I give you something I'm really [8:31] happy I'm like a puppy dog with a ball [8:33] you know throw the ball again let's do [8:34] it again [8:35] and we get really flummoxed when the [8:37] assertive just seems to be completely [8:40] oblivious there you gotta throw the ball [8:42] back and the assertive is thinking like [8:44] what's your problem you know I don't [8:46] know what the matter with you so tiny [8:48] little things like that again [8:49] you it's when there's an impact [8:52] somebody communication is broken down is [8:54] probably gonna be type mismatch I wonder [8:57] if it's been a little annoying since [8:59] you've written the book dealing with [9:00] family and friends where they they look [9:01] at every action that you have that you [9:03] do and they're like oh I'm not doing [9:04] that you're doing this thing that you're [9:06] doing the reciprocity thing I'm not [9:07] playing that game [9:08] ah the hardest part is with my [9:10] girlfriend oh yes because she's heard me [9:13] give a thousand interviews talking about [9:14] this stuff so she's heard me talk about [9:17] her guard gets up a little bit and I'm [9:19] like you know I can what is that what is [9:21] that line from the movie the negotiator [9:23] okay you know Kevin Spacey [9:25] the character he's playing I can listen [9:28] to you and actively listen at the same [9:29] time yeah it's in a way people people [9:33] get that people do get a little [9:34] defensive the closer they are to you the [9:36] more defensive they might get oh man how [9:39] do you shut that down because I would [9:40] imagine there's people especially if [9:42] you're dealing with a somebody who's [9:45] also really aware of negotiation skills [9:47] or your say you're not dealing say [9:50] you're dealing with it like a terrorist [9:51] and the Philippines which you talk about [9:52] in the book are they if they're reading [9:56] into your actions that could kind of [9:57] blow up in your face because even if [9:59] you're not trying to do some sort of [10:01] trick to them they might perceive it [10:04] that way and you have to manage that [10:06] yeah well all right so first of all it [10:08] kind of starts with who's where's the [10:10] other side coming from like if my son [10:13] and I use negotiation techniques all the [10:15] time he's my chief operating officer [10:17] he's a print he's a chief negotiator for [10:19] a company the word we want to [10:21] collaborate so of course we should be [10:23] able to use negotiation techniques with [10:25] each other we'll both come from a great [10:26] place or potential clients you know if a [10:31] client wants to cheat us then that come [10:35] from a good place we're probably not [10:36] going to make a deal with them we're not [10:38] trying to cheat our clients you know so [10:41] they don't need to have their guard up [10:43] around us what we're gonna over deliver [10:46] so it's really on where you're coming [10:48] from now then you're talking about a [10:50] terrorist there most of them that [10:55] negotiate are the classic assertive [10:56] negotiator and I got one or two moves [10:58] period they're used to intimidating [11:00] people and that's it they're demanding [11:02] name-calling assertive [11:04] the craziest thing is that I didn't [11:07] realize when a book was written but we [11:10] realized since we come out the [11:12] procurement negotiator in business is [11:14] almost the exact same type as the [11:17] kidnapping negotiator internationally [11:19] well wait so so somebody somebody in Abu [11:22] Sayyaf is the same as the procurement / [11:24] guy one one just has a fancier rifle and [11:30] maybe a hostage right people they in [11:34] business boy they they intimidate they [11:37] call names they do everything they can't [11:40] to pound a heck out of the other side [11:43] huh I am imagining we're gonna get some [11:46] emails from procurement people they're [11:47] like it's not true I'm not like that [11:49] you don't start with bad ones every no [11:52] no here's a funny thing every we do a [11:56] lot of open enrollment training 50 [11:58] people in a room there's always one or [12:00] two procurement people there and you [12:03] know I'll say anybody here from [12:04] procurement and get out well let stay [12:09] but I'll say tell me I'm wrong about you [12:11] guys tell me I'm wrong really and every [12:13] like now you know I mean I was said I [12:15] was a lot of procurement people in [12:17] supply chain I was at a supply chain [12:19] conference one time one of the guys was [12:21] talking me off to the side and he said [12:23] you know we you know when you [12:25] procurement you got to be really careful [12:26] that you're not suppliers [12:29] you're the biggest customer or only [12:32] customer because you'll end up putting [12:34] them out of business right and I [12:37] remember thinking to myself if you're [12:39] doing did you hear what you just said [12:42] they know there's yeah it's not win-win [12:46] at all at that point it's not good not a [12:50] good the big advantage is to and sales [12:53] people are horrified of procurement I [12:55] mean they find out procurements on the [12:57] other side and they just start to have [12:59] nervous breakdowns [13:01] the only time procurements going to be [13:05] involved is when they really want you [13:08] can you explain what procurement is so [13:11] in case people don't don't know German [13:13] are the the buyers the contracts [13:16] negotiators [13:17] calls them contracts negotiators some [13:20] companies call them there either in [13:22] contracting northern German those will [13:24] be their titles but their job is to buy [13:27] on behalf of the organization okay now [13:30] what happens is the organization will [13:33] identify a supplier they want and then [13:37] procurement becomes involved procurement [13:40] does not waste their time on suppliers [13:42] they have no interest in ever so if [13:45] procurement gets in a game with you [13:47] buckle up let them call you names don't [13:50] get upset [13:51] calm down they're only talking to you [13:54] because they really want you and if we [13:57] realize that up front chasing them down [14:01] the don't get scared right you know I I [14:03] had a director of sales call me says I [14:06] want you to teach my people how to not [14:09] cut the price when someone from [14:11] procurement calls us with 48 hours left [14:15] in a quarter and I remember thinking to [14:17] myself if you even have to ask me that [14:22] question your structural problems are [14:24] far out of my ability to change but the [14:28] reality is all I could do is say no [14:30] because the procurement guy who calls [14:32] with 48 hours left and a quarter feels [14:36] that's the only time the entire quarter [14:38] he had leverage 48 hours his leverage is [14:42] gone right so wait 48 hours [14:45] well you don't wait 72 hours you got [14:48] them interesting yeah I think a lot of [14:50] people don't know that they have any [14:53] leverage that's also in never split the [14:56] difference is that you always have [14:58] leverage and I thought well wait a [14:59] minute what about in a kidnap situation [15:01] they got your aunt you don't have any [15:02] leverage but even then you have leverage [15:03] and it's a it's a classic example that [15:06] we love to ask people the person with [15:09] all the leverage you know I got your [15:10] aunt you got you the ones got the [15:12] leverage [15:13] cash is king right who's got the cash [15:15] yeah you know they don't you probably [15:17] don't actually want my family member [15:20] ha ha ha screaming and whining in your [15:22] basement I'm gonna give them back yeah [15:23] if you want to get rid of that person I [15:25] tried them for a briefcase full of money [15:26] at that point some point yeah [15:29] ya know but the it's a it's a buyers [15:31] market kidnapping in reality is a buyers [15:33] market but that gets back to leverages [15:35] in the eye of the beholder that's true I [15:37] suppose because unless you're talking [15:39] about you're an American and you're [15:41] being held by a group overseas your aunt [15:45] is only really valuable to you they [15:48] can't turn around and go oh well we got [15:50] a better offer for your aunt from this [15:52] other person down the street yeah yeah [15:53] yeah it's like you're the only buyer for [15:56] that particular product [15:57] exactly you might really want that [15:58] product you might really want your aunt [16:00] back but nobody else can outbid you [16:02] there's nobody else exactly yeah that's [16:05] interesting I hadn't really thought [16:06] about that I thought for sure the [16:07] exception - you always have leverage was [16:10] when you were talking about a kidnapping [16:12] but actually even even there yeah was [16:15] sort of amazing huh well and your stuff [16:18] has to work because if if your [16:20] negotiation techniques don't work in the [16:22] FBI for hostage situations someone [16:25] someone dies theoretically yeah let me [16:28] draw a fine line cuz I had to learn that [16:30] early on - I learned it from my old boss [16:32] Gary Nestor but he would always told us [16:35] and it took me a while to figure out [16:36] what it meant we got the best chance of [16:38] success [16:39] we never guaranteed anybody success we [16:42] just guaranteed them the best chances so [16:45] by death you know you said it's always [16:47] got to work best chance of success if it [16:49] works 99 times out of 100 0 100 [16:51] kidnappers you're gonna lose one person [16:53] oh man so you always have to be kind of [16:56] ready for that emotionally you should be [16:58] I don't know that you're ever actually [17:02] ready till it happens and but then [17:05] depending upon how have you you prepared [17:07] yourself accepted and told yourself at [17:09] least intellectually that it was a [17:12] possibility then you get through it and [17:15] what I ended up doing was I actually [17:17] pointedly recruited the veteran kidnap [17:21] negotiators with people that have been [17:22] in situations that somebody got killed [17:25] who are the best because the other thing [17:27] at that point in time - is one of two [17:30] things happen if you're kidnapping [17:31] negotiators somebody that's killed you [17:34] say you know what I could do something [17:35] else you know like a different job let [17:38] me let me go do something else within [17:39] the FBI I don't got an appetite for the [17:41] you know I wanna whatever it is you know [17:43] maybe I want to do witness support I [17:46] don't know what but they're gonna decide [17:48] I think that much fun or they're gonna [17:51] say I'm never gonna let this happen [17:52] again I'm gonna double down I'm gonna [17:55] get smarter I'm gonna work harder I'm [17:57] gonna go back I'm gonna think about [17:58] every single thing I did and if there's [18:00] one even the tiniest thing I would [18:02] change or get better at I'm gonna go [18:04] back and get better at it and those [18:05] people would become the best negotiators [18:08] because we're always going to propose [18:11] solutions to scare people what do you [18:14] mean by that um I might say stop talking [18:19] to the bad guys now yeah that would [18:21] freak me out I'd be like I want to keep [18:23] talking with them because I feel like as [18:24] long as I keep talking with them my [18:26] wife's gonna be okay exactly sure but we [18:29] may know from the profile of the [18:31] situation that at this point in time if [18:35] we stop talking the other side's gonna [18:36] get worried in order to regain control [18:39] instead of doing something negative [18:41] they're gonna do something positive [18:42] because then they can regain control and [18:44] a completely different mindset so let's [18:49] let's give them let's trick them into [18:51] doing something positive because they're [18:53] gonna try to regain control and they'll [18:55] they'll be real specific instances where [18:58] that will be crystal clear that that's [18:59] what they're gonna do oh man to be [19:01] sitting next to you must have a lot of [19:05] people standing next to you especially [19:07] during these kidnap situations where [19:09] they're like you better be damn sure [19:11] about this because you're sitting there [19:13] like alright well what we're gonna do is [19:15] we're gonna leave them alone for 24 to [19:16] 48 hours and then they're probably to [19:18] put your your mom on the phone and then [19:20] that person's like what are you talking [19:24] about you better be right about this [19:26] right how do you gain that person's [19:28] trust or do they just have to trust you [19:31] got to know that moments coming okay if [19:34] you know what's coming you prepare in [19:35] advance so you tell them in advance hey [19:38] look we might have to ghost them for a [19:39] couple days [19:40] just be ready for them well I'm gonna [19:41] say you know there's a really good [19:42] chance we're gonna do something that's [19:43] gonna scare the hell out of you you know [19:46] I don't know exactly how all this is [19:47] going you know I got a team with me this [19:50] is not just me saying this I got a team [19:52] I I'm a representative of [19:54] our entire body of institutional [19:56] knowledge this is not my decision [19:58] everything I do I bounce off a lot of [20:01] people by wente in advance we're gonna [20:02] ask you to do stuff that scares the heck [20:04] out of you and actually and I'm I'll say [20:07] them I'm gonna tell you in advance I [20:08] want you to be scared it's gonna help us [20:11] in a negotiation how's that well what [20:14] actually happens when you do that first [20:17] of all the bad guys if they satisfied [20:19] you're scared they think they got the [20:21] upper hand and they relaxed you know [20:23] fear is their control mechanism so their [20:26] overriding desire is for you to be [20:28] scared yeah mission accomplished if [20:30] you've got some kidnapped relatives now [20:33] they think they're gonna get what they [20:34] want and they they relax [20:36] they're less worried about deadlines [20:37] they don't make so many threats they [20:39] chill out but the other really crazy [20:41] thing about the way the brain works is [20:43] if you have a negative emotion and you [20:44] say fear and instead of me trying to say [20:48] eliminate fear I say I like it it'll [20:52] make it go away right it dissipates [20:54] takes the edge off problem takes it [20:55] takes the edge off tremendously because [20:57] you'll be like what you want me to be [20:59] scared I'm not trying to suppress it at [21:00] that point as soon as you stop trying to [21:02] suppress it it's one of the keys to [21:04] making it go away okay so this ties in a [21:09] little bit with what you wrote about [21:10] with cognitive I think with cognitive [21:12] bias and having to with knowing that we [21:15] all suffer from this cognitive bias we [21:17] can't just have these robotic [21:19] negotiations and part of that is there's [21:23] an emotional component to negotiation a [21:25] lot of people think oh if I do this [21:26] they're gonna do this if they do this [21:28] then we're gonna do that and that's sort [21:29] of like a rational computer program [21:31] right negotiation right and that doesn't [21:34] work because we have to take into [21:35] consideration this emotional component [21:37] of negotiation how do you prepare for [21:39] that are you looking at kind of a road [21:40] map in your head of all right the [21:42] logical response would be this but I [21:44] think that we've got this emotional [21:45] component where they're freaking out [21:46] because the military is looking for them [21:48] in the jungle so there's a little bit of [21:49] fear or there's a little bit of urgency [21:52] that they're feeling that wouldn't [21:54] dictate this type of response how do you [21:57] how do you even know are you able to [21:59] predict what the other side is gonna do [22:00] most of the time or are you looking at [22:02] maybe two outcomes the logical outcome [22:04] and the emotional outcome and it's going [22:05] to be one or the other well we [22:07] there's no such thing as logic first of [22:09] all at all at all period okay [22:11] it's like beauty it's in the eye of the [22:13] beholder no it's logical to you and [22:15] what's logical to me we're gonna make up [22:16] based on what we care about mhm [22:18] which then sort of takes the definition [22:20] of logic out if it's based on what you [22:22] care about so we start that there's [22:24] emotional tension we'll try to think [22:26] about two to three moves ahead no more [22:28] than that and we'll think in and and [22:30] we'll think on a couple two or three [22:32] different sets of outcomes now we're [22:34] never going to hit one exactly but [22:36] actually if we think on both extremes [22:38] and we're prepared for extremes it's [22:42] going to land someplace in the middle [22:43] and we're gonna be prepared for no [22:45] matter what the reason why you don't [22:46] think more on three moves ahead is and [22:48] it's kind of hard to envision this but [22:50] everybody wants to think in terms of [22:52] chess you know rotations chess right [22:54] well just connect all the pieces with [22:59] Springs under tension because when you [23:02] make a move in chess all the other [23:04] pieces stay in exactly the same place [23:06] but if they were all connected by [23:09] Springs every time you moved one they'd [23:11] all move a little bit and by the time [23:13] you'd made two or three moves almost all [23:16] the chess pieces would have reset which [23:18] meant all of your analysis is now gone [23:20] because the entire board got reset and [23:25] that's what happens with emotion so you [23:27] think I don't know roughly where I want [23:29] to end up there's about five different [23:31] ways to get there let's see which one we [23:34] go off on first so you're not looking at [23:37] like okay we do this and then that's [23:38] probably gonna happen then we're gonna [23:39] do that and that's probably gonna happen [23:41] do you have to take each move [23:42] individually based on where you are [23:44] right in that moment because if the [23:46] chess pieces are all moving every time [23:48] you do something then you're dealing [23:51] with a whole new scenario after each [23:53] move that much after about after each [23:56] third move like you get a pretty good [23:58] idea what the next move is gonna be but [24:01] you go very much farther than that and [24:03] I'll give you an example Chase Manhattan [24:05] Bank we talked about it in the book yeah [24:07] the bank robbery bank robbery i I'm a [24:11] second negotiator on a phone [24:13] humid gown as a commander of the NYPD [24:15] team he puts me on a phone he takes this [24:17] guy off he says you're up you're next [24:18] this is what I want you to do [24:20] bad-guy been hiding his name from us the [24:23] whole time we're pretty sure we knew who [24:24] he was by the time I'm getting ready to [24:25] get on a phone [24:26] we'd also been talking to him about [24:28] letting hostages go is this crit is it [24:31] Chris Watts [24:32] guy named Chris walks yeah hey great [24:34] first name right yeah depends on depends [24:38] on your emotional perspective yeah but [24:40] all right so we're asking about hostages [24:43] we got no reason to believe he'd hurt [24:46] the hostages which was bad analysis he [24:49] beaten all of them at that point and [24:51] that's we didn't know that's a bad sign [24:53] I would assume generally it's a bad sign [24:55] so Hugh says we're gonna switch up and [24:59] go is we're not the ordinary [25:01] Hancock handoff with Jordan be like [25:03] Chris is gonna come on the phone chris [25:05] has been listening the whole time let me [25:08] introduce Chris and you have been [25:10] listening the whole time I have okay [25:11] that's the normal handoff and I would [25:13] say hi I'm Chris you know I've been [25:14] sitting with Jordan the whole time and [25:16] as a matter of fact I've been listening [25:18] to everything here's everything I heard [25:19] why would you switch negotiators sorry [25:21] to interrupt you but I'm curious what [25:22] why go hey Jordan was negotiating with [25:24] you before he's gone now now it's me Oh [25:27] what's the point of that it could be [25:29] you're doing a bad job yeah that's [25:32] probably why it also could be you and [25:35] the hostage taker I have got such a [25:38] great relationship going that the minute [25:41] he comes out the relationships over and [25:44] that's why he won't come out Oh [25:46] interesting so there's this he wants to [25:51] keep that going for some reason some [25:52] psychological attachment to the [25:54] negotiator yeah I was I was I was on I [25:56] was on another barricade and I'm [25:58] listening and the hostage the guy was [26:01] barricaded and a negotiator having such [26:02] a great conversation I turn the [26:05] commander and I said he ain't coming out [26:07] as long as he gets to talk to Jordan [26:09] we're gonna be loves only friend [26:13] yeah George is only proud man so it [26:16] could be a variety of reasons you know [26:17] you got to call in a moment but anyway [26:19] Hugh puts me on the phone and he says [26:21] we're not gonna do the ordinary handoff [26:23] you're just kind of take over the phone [26:24] so you're talking to me now and we're [26:26] gonna do it really abruptly all right [26:28] and then when you get a chance you can [26:31] do a couple of other things [26:33] so we do a complete abrupt shift and our [26:38] bad guy is kind of like oh well play [26:41] games with me huh now of course this is [26:43] not what he says but he talked to me for [26:44] a few moments puts me on hold he goes [26:48] and gets a hostage with no warning and [26:51] all of a sudden I hear a woman's voice [26:52] on the other and the phone say I'm okay [26:54] mm-hmm and I I'm sorry who is this who [26:58] is this she says I am okay and then the [27:00] phone goes dead she goes away now not in [27:04] a million years we have predicted that [27:06] going forward but he's like you want to [27:08] play games I'll play games too he goes [27:10] and gets a hostage he puts her on the [27:12] phone doesn't say anything threatening [27:14] he never gets on the phone and says now [27:19] I want to remind you I got hostages it's [27:21] all implied because he also knows the [27:24] bank is surrounded with the seventh [27:27] largest standing army in the world [27:28] NYPD 7th largest standing army in the [27:32] world they got 50 caliber machine guns [27:34] they got SWAT guys they got bombs [27:37] he's one of he killed he's smart enough [27:40] to imply a threat without stating a [27:42] threat because he knows if he says you [27:44] got an hour if you want to keep the [27:46] hostage alive what's gonna go in and [27:48] somebody's gonna put a little red dot on [27:49] his forehead he's gonna be gone but we [27:52] never could have predicted that move and [27:54] if we if we had a whole game plan mapped [27:56] out that we were sure was gonna work [27:59] that would have all been wasted time as [28:01] soon as he put the hostage on the phone [28:03] cuz it blew the Planum - that's my [28:05] chessboard it reset the chessboard what [28:07] was the point of the abrupt shift in [28:09] negotiation and negotiators without [28:11] doing a handoff what was that why do [28:12] that we were trying to show him and us [28:16] more maybe not entirely subtle way that [28:20] we were in charge and you can do that [28:24] you can do in any negotiation you could [28:26] risk something the other side might not [28:28] like if you've been stalemated for a [28:31] really long time and we'd been [28:32] stalemated for five hours and a [28:35] stalemate by definition is a low threat [28:37] level so it's you know risking a u-turn [28:41] and what happens after you turn it come [28:44] becomes an s-curve [28:45] and you come around someplace else and [28:47] you're in a better place okay so we we [28:50] were risking a setback because it we'd [28:52] been stuck for so long you mentioned [28:54] that when people feel listened to they [28:56] listen to themselves more and they [28:59] clarify their demands and their desires [29:00] so how would that look in practice is [29:03] that because what I'm imagining this I'm [29:05] imagining somebody just kind of being [29:07] fake-nice to the hostage-taker on the [29:09] phone so that they feel heard or [29:11] something I guess I'm trying to imagine [29:13] what this would look like in practice [29:14] well in a bank or in a business [29:16] negotiation well I guess the exciting [29:19] version is the bank robbery but the [29:20] practical situation is the the business [29:22] negotiation yeah well you know I could [29:24] say look you you you know you see you're [29:28] not gonna hurt a hostage but you're not [29:30] gonna let anybody go you know how those [29:32] things add up you know you know I'm [29:35] gonna I'm gonna if I need you to hear [29:38] what you're saying I need to pick out a [29:40] couple things that you say that don't [29:42] add up and then I say how do those add [29:45] up so you're forcing me as a hostage [29:46] taker to reconcile what I've said and [29:48] maybe think about what I'm doing that is [29:50] exactly the point and that works in [29:52] hostage negotiation or some business [29:54] negotiation and and it's actually [29:56] probably more important in business [29:58] negotiations because most business [30:01] people will stay stuck in a rut on us [30:04] with a strategy that's taken them [30:06] nowhere and and they'll say they have [30:10] big goals and so I can say to a head of [30:13] sales um you want your salespeople to be [30:16] more productive but you're not going to [30:18] give him any more training how do those [30:19] things that up hmm it reminds me of the [30:22] how am I supposed to do that technique [30:24] it's a version of that is it okay yeah [30:26] exactly right you know how is a great [30:28] deference award you know one definition [30:30] of confrontation is a focus comparison [30:33] so I take your actions and I take your [30:36] words and I use the word how to compare [30:38] them it's just a focus comparison so [30:41] that in practice would be somebody asks [30:43] you for something like give me a million [30:45] dollars or I'm gonna shoot your your [30:47] aunt say well how am I supposed to do [30:50] that how am I supposed to get you the [30:51] money yeah that's just that's just a [30:53] straight how it's um that's deferential [30:57] but it shifts the entire problem [30:59] back onto them which at least wears [31:02] amount so do you how much of negotiation [31:05] especially in a hostage situation or [31:07] actually business and that for hostage [31:09] for that matter is wearing the other [31:12] party down to the point where they just [31:13] want to if it's a hostage situation go [31:16] home take whatever the hell they can get [31:18] leave or in business they just want to [31:19] go to the bathroom or get lunch and just [31:22] not be in that damn conference revenue [31:24] well it's wearing the other side down if [31:26] the other side is an aggressive [31:27] throat-cutting negotiator or if they're [31:31] from procurement sure yeah you know [31:34] depends upon who's on the other side or [31:36] if your emotions are out of control [31:38] you know your emotions are gonna get [31:40] tamp down as you get exhausted if your [31:43] emotions are out of control and negative [31:45] way you know it's important to draw a [31:47] fine line it's not emotions that are bad [31:49] it's negative emotions that are bad [31:50] positive emotions actually help us [31:52] perform better how do you harness that [31:55] and practice I would imagine it's got to [31:58] be pretty tough knowing there's a bank [32:00] full of people and you've got a harness [32:03] positive emotion I mean what are you [32:05] doing to get yourself in a positive [32:06] state oh well I mean the defensive wound [32:09] on a bank I mean I'm gonna remain [32:12] optimistic over the outcome even with [32:15] you like you're a bank robber and I'm [32:18] talk to you on the phone ideally you've [32:21] made it escape demand ideally where's [32:25] that ideal that shows that you want to [32:27] live oh right right if I make no escape [32:29] demand you're wondering if I'm just [32:30] gonna if you haven't made an escape [32:32] demand there's a really good chance that [32:34] you're planning on dying today suicide [32:36] by cotton so absence of an escape the [32:40] man is a really bad bad bad bad bad sign [32:43] in a barricade bank robbery if you got a [32:47] guy barricade in his house ain't getting [32:49] make an escape domain because that's [32:50] where he lives but if it's a if it's a [32:52] bank or something like that and there's [32:54] no escape demand you got a real problem [32:55] do you try to lead them to an escape [32:57] demand or are you actually seeing if [32:59] they'll do it because you want to get it [33:00] there a read on their situation now you [33:02] got to read them yeah you know you you [33:04] really can't lead people because [33:06] something and what they're saying is [33:08] going to give you the out so I just got [33:12] to listen for it [33:13] okay right because if you just say how [33:14] do you plan on getting out of there [33:15] they're just gonna make something up but [33:17] it's gonna be like I'm gonna start doing [33:19] bodies out to you let me go oh man so I [33:22] don't want to go there yeah you don't [33:24] accelerate that timeline by any stretch [33:26] yikes yeah youyou've also one thing [33:32] that's fascinating to me is that smart [33:34] people often don't make good negotiators [33:36] that was actually really disappointing [33:37] for me because I thought because you're [33:38] really smart guy naturally I'm a [33:41] well-studied guy I went to law school [33:42] I'm gonna be great at negotiation and [33:44] then I read the rationale for why and I [33:46] thought that crap that is me I would [33:48] totally fall into these traps can you [33:49] outline what some of that is because I [33:51] think a lot of people think they're [33:53] really good at negotiating because [33:54] they're intelligent and they can solve a [33:56] lot of problems yeah you want y'all [34:00] smart yard and the problem with that is [34:03] you might not intend it that way but it [34:07] makes me feel stupid as a as a hostage [34:10] taker or as a right yeah in business I [34:14] mean the more the more you show you're [34:16] smarter than me the less I want to be [34:17] around you because I like being around [34:18] you and that's not good news for a [34:20] long-term relationship so you know [34:23] that's a real problem the other problem [34:24] is there's an efficiency problem that [34:26] was completely obstacle we would think [34:29] if you want somebody if I want to tell [34:32] you the answer me telling you it's very [34:36] passive on your side it's what we refer [34:39] to as a didactic exchange you're just [34:42] sitting there listening passively and [34:44] there's some pretty solid data out there [34:46] that if I want to get a point across you [34:48] in in a didactic exchange where you're [34:50] just listening you're just passive [34:52] you're not you're not engaged I got to [34:54] tell you 19 times that's a lot it's a [34:57] lot it's it's it's the least efficient [35:00] way to get a point across is to tell [35:03] somebody cuz you got to tell him 19 [35:04] times now if I slow down if I use [35:09] questions to affect your thinking if I [35:11] shape your thinking so that you discover [35:13] it right if then it's my idea to things [35:16] okay you discover it faster and it's [35:18] your idea so I got two things going for [35:21] me now it took less time overall [35:26] and you embrace it much more because you [35:28] feel like you thought it this would this [35:31] seems like a parenting that's be kind of [35:33] handy a parenting right like well maybe [35:35] you know how much a parent thing is just [35:36] human being the human being yeah I think [35:38] all of it yeah it's just that one human [35:40] being might be a little bit more [35:42] emotional or irrational kids more our [35:44] kids more rational than adults I don't [35:46] even know [35:46] well again definition of rationality you [35:48] can count on kids to be more optimistic [35:50] and adults to be more pessimistic so [35:54] who's better off probably the kid in a [35:58] lot of ways yeah you know there's and [36:01] that's that'll give us off unto almost a [36:04] whole different journey on cognitive [36:06] learning but kids are more present in [36:09] the moment that's why they learn faster [36:11] than adults do dogs are always worried [36:13] about outcomes always considering what [36:15] happened in the past always worried [36:17] about where it's going those two things [36:19] by definition takes you out of the [36:20] moment which means you're not learning [36:23] as much you're not figuring out the [36:25] moment as fast as you could be [36:26] kids learn languages faster than adults [36:29] do do they have this magical power no [36:31] they're not distracted by the past or [36:33] the future the way adults are and they [36:35] just have more focused in the moment and [36:37] probably less worried about looking [36:38] stupid as well that's part of the worry [36:40] they were more in the future how am I [36:41] gonna look this doesn't work out [36:42] interesting book out there called the [36:45] culture code Daniel Coyle sure yeah very [36:48] first part of it right for groups [36:50] kindergartners business school students [36:52] CEOs and I think lawyers more [36:57] interesting set of samples see it for [37:00] four teams marshmallow challenge you get [37:03] macaron dried macaroni string in a [37:05] marshmallow as a team construct the [37:08] highest tower what team wins the [37:12] kindergarten really huh third second [37:15] place of the CEOs third place are the [37:18] lawyers last place are the business [37:21] school students that's funny no surprise [37:23] lawyers coming in and coming too high [37:26] right yeah yeah but the kiddie cars [37:27] because they're there they don't care [37:30] about looking stupid in front of each [37:32] other so they don't care about make a [37:34] mistake so they try 400 different ways [37:36] and they finally find a handle ball and [37:38] they interact [37:39] then they support each other and nobody [37:40] gets bent out of shape or nobody gets [37:42] concerned or embarrassed and and they [37:44] win every time [37:45] and the Business School students are [37:46] still making spreadsheets until the [37:48] clock almost runs out let me finally [37:50] throw something together and it falls [37:51] over yeah yeah I can imagine [37:53] yeah and I actually took a harder look [37:54] at that too because I don't think it's [37:56] Business School students per se I think [37:57] it's the age range and the typical age [38:02] range you're talking about you mid 20s [38:04] to early 30s and in sort of my view my [38:11] experience that's when people are at [38:13] their some of the most individually [38:15] competitive times do you find that [38:17] negotiating with people hostage takers [38:21] for example do you see differences in [38:23] the age group like hey if someone's 19 [38:25] and they take hostages is it a different [38:27] negotiation than if someone's 60 and [38:29] they take hostages or is that kind of no [38:31] yeah it would be completely different [38:33] really yeah because they're you know [38:34] their views of the past in the future [38:35] gonna be completely different and which [38:38] is gonna affect your threat level how [38:39] can you tell aside from the age what are [38:42] you looking for for their assessment of [38:44] the past in the future they're gonna [38:46] start giving it to you right away it's [38:47] remarkably that stuff in any [38:50] circumstances remarkably easy to hear if [38:52] you actually listen I'm really listening [38:54] for first you look for pronouns then you [38:58] then you'll look for levels of emotion [39:00] then you know there's gonna be [39:01] implications indicators of the future [39:04] and nearly everything that they say [39:05] they're optimistic young person or the [39:07] old either person okay either optimism [39:10] or pessimism about you know where things [39:12] are going oh you know what's in the [39:14] moment or you also look for specific [39:17] types of losses personal professional [39:20] losses are the biggest ones you know big [39:22] personal losses big professional losses [39:24] and so you're looking at people's [39:26] calculation over losses and then how [39:29] does that affect their vision of the [39:30] future okay so when you see that [39:34] somebody is maybe younger or optimistic [39:37] about the future does that bode better [39:40] for the negotiation itself or is it just [39:42] a difference that a tactic yeah well if [39:44] they're optimistic about the future then [39:45] yeah you got somebody can work with it [39:47] and you know they just staring they're [39:49] in the midst of a coping situation [39:50] sometimes gone sideways for the mom [39:53] there's a pretty good chance - just [39:54] trying to sort of get their feedback [39:57] under them emotionally and especially if [39:59] if they're optimistic about the future [40:01] then they feel like and they can they're [40:03] resilient over whatever comes out of [40:05] short term they'll get over it [40:06] so you're pulling all these different [40:08] levers depending on what people are [40:10] giving you are you mostly reacting to [40:13] the hostage taker or are you following [40:15] through on a specific set of plans [40:18] more or less that just takes different [40:20] detours based on what they're doing you [40:22] try to figure out how you can get out in [40:23] front what does that mean well I need to [40:27] start a assess you know what's driving [40:29] you know what you know what loss is [40:31] there what negative emotions there the [40:34] hostage negotiation skills are just [40:36] emotional intelligence tools I can start [40:39] to hear what negative emotions are [40:41] driving you and I know how to turn them [40:42] down I will listen for what those [40:45] positives might be and I know how to [40:47] turn those up and as soon as I started [40:49] getting a readout of where you are sort [40:51] of on you know there's a buffet of [40:52] choices that I then have and so now now [40:56] I can get proactive and start to get out [40:58] in front of something if you just need [41:00] to feel back in control your barricaded [41:03] your man of your wife instead of saying [41:06] do you want to get out us alive do you [41:08] want to see your kids again do you want [41:11] to live those are all yes oriented [41:13] questions if you really mad at your wife [41:15] I might say you want your wife to win [41:17] hmm and so that's no right I know from [41:22] my experience that when you say no you [41:25] feel in control that's why people say no [41:28] yeah so you might want to give them a [41:31] know so that they regain control I feel [41:33] like it's five times as good as yes will [41:35] ever be so knows even better than yes at [41:38] least five times better really across [41:40] the board in all circumstances all [41:42] circumstances so you're trying to get [41:45] them to say no or get to a no I should [41:49] say business deal i I lay a proposal out [41:53] in front of you instead of instead I [41:55] said saying would this work for you I'll [41:58] say is it ridiculous to think this might [42:00] work for you yeah of course I would say [42:03] no unless it's actually ridiculous [42:04] somewhere well if if their problems [42:07] with it when you say no you say no it's [42:09] not ridiculous but here are the problems [42:11] if I say would this work for you you [42:15] can't say yes but here are the problems [42:17] it's really hard to do that so you're [42:19] scared to say yes because you think [42:21] you've just agreed to the deal right so [42:23] that's when you're gonna go maybe and [42:27] then you got a dancer you got nothing [42:28] you're scared to answer at all but since [42:30] since you've already said when you've [42:31] already said no to something [42:33] whatever you say after that you don't [42:35] feel there's obligations that go along [42:38] with it I said no it doesn't work here [42:40] the problems I never said I'd agree if I [42:43] lay the problems out if I lay the [42:46] problems out and you fix them I will [42:47] agree but since I never felt like I said [42:50] that an import of fact if I fix all [42:52] those problems I now have a tailor-made [42:54] solution to you that you felt in control [42:55] right so the know is almost like a [42:57] highlighter it's like Envisat it's like [43:00] an you're seeing the invisible ink at [43:01] that point yeah it's a nice point [43:03] because you can I'm telling you exactly [43:05] what's wrong at that point and then you [43:07] can go all right circle it mentally [43:08] circling these three things change those [43:11] and then we in theory we have a deal [43:13] yeah yeah instead of just having you [43:15] shoot something down or lose control by [43:18] saying yes what you're not gonna do [43:20] especially if the stakes are really high [43:21] right right right yeah I mean we got a [43:23] lot of people that are focused and on [43:24] air they lay a proposition out to [43:25] somebody and I say well you know what's [43:27] wrong with this you know what are the [43:29] obstacles here [43:30] there's gotta be obstacles you know help [43:34] us identify them so this is cooperative [43:37] almost no matter what because you're [43:39] you're doing a deal whether the person's [43:41] kidnapped a family member or they're [43:43] robbing a bank or you're sitting across [43:44] from sharing a pot of tea at a business [43:48] negotiation that's friendly or you're [43:49] parenting your kid so these are all [43:51] cooperative regardless of whether or not [43:53] it's all a business deal seemingly yeah [43:57] I would imagine that cognitive bias [44:00] comes into play especially when emotions [44:02] are really high and you talk about this [44:03] a little bit in the book is that why you [44:07] have people all right let me let me back [44:10] this up you see these things in movies [44:11] right where there's there's a hostage [44:13] negotiation and there's like the police [44:15] captain's on the phone and the [44:16] commissioners on the phone and the [44:17] mayor's on the phone and the hostage [44:18] negotiators on the phone and then some [44:20] psycho [44:20] is on the phone and there's 15 other [44:23] people listening on headphones one is [44:26] that accurate to what is the point of [44:27] that are you trying to is it sort of [44:30] getting everybody's opinion I mean [44:31] what's the point of all this all those [44:34] people are on the phone with a bad guy [44:35] yeah I feel like I said only gonna want [44:37] to have one person on a phone you're not [44:39] gonna want to swap out a lot of people [44:40] oh I just mean listening to the call oh [44:42] well let's think you can call if people [44:43] know how to listen as a team what does [44:46] that mean everybody everybody everybody [44:48] got specific assignments stuff you're [44:50] listening for like your only job may be [44:53] to keep track of how long the [44:54] conversation lasted why is that why is [44:57] that important because the longer the [44:59] conversation it's an indicator we're [45:00] making progress because of it's sort of [45:03] a trust barometer or yeah I think that's [45:06] a fair that's that's a fair assessment [45:07] but there's and then so then I might [45:10] have somebody else you're only listening [45:12] for the negative things that they say [45:13] that sound negative Rican Street as [45:16] negative you're only listening for the [45:17] positive things they say I mean when [45:19] somebody starts talking between the [45:21] words that they say and even more [45:22] importantly the words they don't say or [45:25] their tone of voice there's more [45:27] information there than one person can [45:28] keep up on roughly we can we can listen [45:34] at a rate of about 400 words a minute we [45:36] speak at a rate of 140 160 words a [45:38] minute that's why we think we can listen [45:40] to more than one conversation just [45:42] awards but there's five times as much [45:45] information in the tone of voice and [45:47] there are in the words so 140 times five [45:51] we're banned what's odd is now you're [45:54] already shot the bandwidth of one person [45:56] Ellis I see so you've got people [45:58] listening for vocal tonality like you [46:00] said the positives and negatives and [46:02] that has to be a specific person because [46:04] I'm sitting here while you're telling me [46:05] that I'm like I could do that all myself [46:07] but that's exactly what people who get [46:10] people killed in hostage situations [46:11] think right yeah yeah yeah I hire me for [46:14] that I'll you know give me give me seven [46:15] people yeah you give me seven people to [46:17] listen to everything will all pick a [46:20] different part we'll all have very [46:22] specific assignments and we will come up [46:26] with an encyclopedia of information [46:29] ideas and clues in a ten-minute [46:31] conversation so these seven people are [46:33] these all these people [46:34] all on your team yeah negotiating with [46:36] the hostage negotiation thing and then [46:38] the call ends and then what everybody [46:41] goes and sits down and says all right [46:42] what did you hear what did you I mean [46:43] how does how do you construct this in [46:46] the moment cuz I would imagine you can't [46:47] say all right everybody file a report [46:50] about this this has to happen pretty [46:51] quick I would imagine these hostage [46:52] negotiations time is always of the [46:54] essence so you got these seven people [46:56] that you pick for your team and are they [46:58] all hostage negotiators or they're all [47:01] trained they've all got to be trained [47:02] and do they always do the same thing [47:04] like is there always a guy am I always [47:06] the voice tone guy am I always the [47:08] positive that kind of depends got [47:10] everybody's capable pretty much doing [47:12] any job our best negotiator will not be [47:16] on a phone or best negotiator will be [47:17] running the team anyway any and then [47:20] because of that like almost any one of [47:22] the team members can be on the phone [47:24] because whoever's on the phone's got the [47:27] support of seven people and we we can [47:30] almost take our least trained negotiator [47:33] and put them on a phone so that's in a [47:35] way that's almost like the least [47:36] important maybe not quite least [47:39] important least technically skilled part [47:43] of it probably if you're a coach as long [47:45] as you're coachable be a you're [47:47] coachable you're you're taking input [47:49] from people on notes and plus while [47:52] you're talking I mean you're looking [47:53] around and maybe somebody's written [47:55] something on a board and they point to [47:56] that and then you say that like in Chase [47:59] Manhattan Bank Robbery again in the book [48:03] you know I'm on the I'm on the phone I'm [48:05] talking to the guy and talk to the guy [48:07] I'm working on them to really my my [48:11] point is to get a hostage out which is [48:12] what the hostage negotiator is supposed [48:14] to do and somebody hands me a note and [48:17] says ask him if he wants to come on and [48:21] with somebody that was listening as it [48:23] as it turned out I didn't even know at [48:25] the time who was from I found out about [48:26] I think I found out like three years [48:28] later it was my friend Jamie Jamie Sudan [48:32] yo Jamie is sitting there and something [48:35] in Jamie's instincts is telling him that [48:37] this guy wants to come out more than [48:40] anything else he just hears it his [48:42] radars picking it up our subconscious [48:45] where our radar is is [48:47] is literally 20 million times faster [48:49] than our conscious and Jamie's [48:51] subconscious his instinct is picked it [48:53] up any rights asked him if he wants to [48:56] come out and I see no popping in front [48:59] of my face on where it came from doesn't [49:01] matter so I go do you want to come out [49:06] and there's a long silence on the other [49:09] in the lion and the guy says which is a [49:14] great big giant yes yeah a great big [49:17] giant please figure out how to give me [49:20] out yeah I want to come out but I don't [49:22] want to get shot I don't want to get [49:23] shot I want you beat up and as it turned [49:25] out what he was really worried about he [49:27] was worried about his buddy shoot him [49:28] when he went out the door and then his [49:31] co-conspirators laughter whatever yeah [49:33] or as soon as he got out the door he [49:36] thought the NYPD he was gonna catch a [49:38] beating and he's like I don't know how [49:41] I'd do it that's that's what we found [49:43] out later on that was what all that [49:44] meant so we continued to talk we [49:47] continued to talk and when he says I [49:48] don't know how I do that like everybody [49:49] goes like holy cow okay get him out of [49:52] there every woke us on getting him out [49:54] I'm talking I'm talking I'm talking [49:55] again pipe out I don't know maybe half [49:58] an hour later no note comes in my hand I [50:00] don't know where it's from as it turns [50:01] out it's from Jamie again and the note [50:04] says tell him you meet him outside and I [50:07] say to him how about this how about if I [50:12] meet you out from the bank yeah so did [50:17] you walk up to the bank door not quite [50:20] yeah I'm a customer yeah because [50:25] normally first of all FBI doesn't do as [50:28] a general rule we don't do face-to-face [50:30] really yeah so so we're scrambling we [50:34] decided I got to go out I don't have a [50:36] bulletproof vest I don't have a [50:37] ballistic helmet you know they're [50:38] grabbing the vest from this guy in a [50:40] grab and a helmet from this guy and I'm [50:41] trying to put this stuff long and I'm [50:44] scrambling to get outside and the plan [50:47] once I get outside is I'm gonna stand [50:48] behind one of the SWAT trucks it's got a [50:51] PA on it and I'm gonna talk to him from [50:53] the PA I'm not gonna walk up how was [50:55] that better than the phone yeah who [50:57] cares right I guess whew [50:59] and felt better you know and we don't [51:02] know what he's thinking so I and it was [51:04] it actually was it was funny haha [51:06] hostage story funny haha yeah the people [51:09] inside are like this story is not funny [51:11] but I get out there get on the PA I [51:13] start talking to him at this point I [51:16] still don't know this guy's name crazily [51:19] enough that's the way it evolved so I [51:21] said hi it's Chris I'm out here so SWAT [51:25] standard operating procedure is to [51:27] barricade the exit from the outside so [51:32] bad guy suddenly doesn't run away [51:34] so SWAT has barricaded the bank from the [51:36] outside which everyone has forgotten so [51:40] I'm trying to talk this guy out the door [51:42] we don't know how many bad guys are [51:44] inside we don't know how they're gonna [51:45] react we don't know they're gonna start [51:47] shooting we know what the hell's gonna [51:48] happen he comes to the door and you [51:50] thinking okay I was he rattles the door [51:55] it was like he's nervous right I mean oh [51:58] crap I'm trapped in here now they're on [51:59] the outside we'll go now what do we do [52:01] we forgot to unlock the door and with no [52:03] plan of how to unlock the door [52:05] so SWAT commander SWAT guys you know [52:08] those guys don't get rattled [52:10] you know they quickly they they scramble [52:12] a couple guys ballistic shield these two [52:14] guys get behind a ballistic shield you [52:16] know they go up really really really [52:17] really slow again we don't know how many [52:19] bad guys are inside and we don't know [52:21] what those gonna happen you know are [52:23] they gonna see him if somebody can jump [52:24] them who knows they just get up there [52:26] real slow to get the key and let the [52:28] door real slowly back away and Bobby [52:31] comes out I'm trying to put myself in [52:37] his shoes I don't know if I'd want to [52:40] leave I you'd after I would have to [52:42] trust you so much to be like yeah I'm [52:44] gonna stroll out of here yeah sure I [52:50] wanna I guess also I have no choice I'm [52:52] stuck in a bank with a bunch of other [52:54] criminals that I'm thinking of might [52:55] shoot me too well you know I you know [52:57] decision some people you know you make [53:00] the decision I mean what holds you back [53:02] from your decision your fears the big [53:05] the biggest fear that was holding him [53:06] back was that he was gonna get a serious [53:10] seriously beaten when he came out [53:12] did not happen and the fear the drove [53:16] amount was he had come to the [53:19] realization that every additional minute [53:21] he stayed inside since he planned on [53:23] coming out every additional minute he [53:27] say stayed inside was gonna cost him [53:29] jail time so the clock is tickin [53:33] did you tell that you told him that was [53:34] don't don't need him to think that [53:36] realize that he's come to that [53:37] conclusion on his own [53:38] there's also since you don't know for [53:41] sure what's gonna happen to the hostages [53:42] that's not resolved yet he needs to get [53:44] out of there before this goes bad on the [53:46] inside so he's all sorts of losses are [53:50] driving them to go out the door I don't [53:53] want to be here when this goes bad I [53:55] want to minimize my jail exposure every [53:58] you know the status quo when the status [54:01] quo costs you that's when you leave the [54:03] status quo whether you're in a bank [54:05] whether you're in a business deal that's [54:09] most people don't make deals because [54:11] they're comfortable with the status quo [54:13] even if they shouldn't some boiling frog [54:15] analogy you know you can turn the heat [54:17] up on a frog and it'll stay they'll get [54:19] comfortable when they should leave you [54:22] have to be aware that the status quo is [54:23] worse than the possibilities and that's [54:25] when that's when people make decisions [54:27] to change the status quo you highlight [54:29] that for him like hey you know the [54:31] longer this lasts the worse it's gonna [54:32] be that seems like something I would [54:33] hear at a movie with alright you [54:34] highlight a but not like that [54:36] right that seems you don't want him to [54:38] panic right right right you don't want [54:40] to sound like you're threatening right [54:41] yeah that sure that makes sense so you [54:44] you go back yeah you're gonna ask you [54:46] how question I I might say something [54:49] like look man and how can I go to the [54:53] judge in your behalf if you don't come [54:55] out that's saying the same thing but [55:00] it's using how question again is really [55:02] deferential and so you owe you always [55:06] you confront people with how questions [55:09] because it leaves them the option of the [55:11] decision and they don't feel backed into [55:13] a corner is this how you mentioned [55:15] before slow things down is that what [55:18] this is as well slowing things down bad [55:19] physical questions yeah and we're [55:21] slowing things down because we want them [55:23] to feel that sense of control and not [55:25] like this is moving so [55:26] fast that they don't have Congrats it's [55:29] it's the first and biggest reason the [55:30] other thing too is you know Danny [55:33] Kahneman wrote a book called Thinking [55:34] Fast and Slow yeah [55:35] slow thinking is in depth thinking [55:38] you're using a how or what question to [55:40] trigger in-depth thinking which also is [55:43] exhausting so if it's my intention to [55:47] gain the upper hand by exhausting you [55:48] that's what I'm gonna do so you're [55:51] creating more cognitive load for me to [55:53] come up with this reason a law school [55:56] some yeah yeah well I read Daniel [55:59] Kahneman's book right yeah Thinking Fast [56:01] and Slow will link to that in the show [56:03] notes as well so I'm you're really [56:04] making my brain do work right so that [56:07] I'm eventually like just beat up tired [56:11] yeah you're tired you're worn out and [56:13] you own it you know Elmo strips [56:16] ownership is is is the issue huh yeah [56:19] this is this is really interesting [56:21] because it seems like it's a really slow [56:25] game of you're grinding these guys down [56:27] a little bit but you can't make it seem [56:30] like it you can't beat them up you have [56:32] to let them just drain their energy [56:34] reserves on their own [56:35] yeah and principally again it's draining [56:37] negative energy because you don't make [56:40] good decisions in an angry state of mind [56:42] you know there's an old saying you give [56:43] a speech when your anger it's the best [56:45] speech you'll ever regret yeah I've [56:47] heard that I think probably from you but [56:50] are there tricks then for getting into a [56:52] positive emotional states when the [56:53] states are I I mean you're you said [56:55] optimism but do you want them in a [56:58] positive emotional state as well well it [57:00] would sequencing in context as a general [57:04] rule in a crisis hostage situation you [57:09] don't want to you know you don't want on [57:10] your fork you just don't want them [57:11] negative business the more positive [57:15] frame of mind we're both in the better [57:17] deal we're gonna make and the more [57:20] likely we are to want to do another deal [57:23] and that's probably the only the only [57:25] flipside difference between business [57:27] negotiation and hostage negotiation [57:29] hostage negotiators at least 90 percent [57:33] of the time I'm using the soothing [57:35] calming voice they night if and [57:37] the FM deejays less to calm you down [57:40] slow you down and maybe 10% 5% I might [57:45] have Anna beat voice selectively flip [57:49] those for business 90% of the time I [57:52] need to be upbeat 10% of the time I may [57:56] need to say something like we can't do [57:59] that instead of no so 10% you know for [58:05] me to lay something out that I need you [58:08] to think about in a serious way which it [58:10] should be a minority of the time a small [58:12] minority I'll use that's when I flip the [58:14] voices that makes sense you're switching [58:16] between this logical brain where they [58:20] have to calculate something in crunch [58:21] numbers or do something in their head [58:23] and keeping their emotions engaged [58:25] enough where they're happy to be there [58:28] with you and they feel like it's a [58:29] cooperative engagement yeah and and [58:31] you're actually you have more mental [58:33] ability in a positive frame of mind I [58:35] mean that's the mindset of flow which is [58:37] where optimum human performance is is [58:40] highly positive okay so what about when [58:43] somebody asks you for something [58:46] impossible right this is one of the the [58:48] top takeaways from never split the [58:50] difference that how am I supposed to do [58:52] that type situation but what happens [58:54] when somebody asks you for something [58:54] impossible business we can come up with [58:56] an example easily but I'm thinking in [58:57] hostage situations you hear this [58:59] ridiculous stuff in movies all the time [59:01] with they're like yeah we need a [59:02] helicopter and a private jet and you [59:05] know you need to drive the van around [59:07] the like you're you know you're not [59:08] gonna help these guys get into a [59:10] helicopter landing on the roof of Chase [59:12] Manhattan Bank it's not gonna happen but [59:14] you can't say you're delusional man [59:16] there's no chance of that happening you [59:18] have to do something when faced with an [59:21] unreasonable request how do you handle [59:23] that how am I supposed to do that and [59:25] then I mean that's that's the opening [59:27] move what if they just say land the [59:29] helicopter on the roof of the dam [59:30] building and I'm saying but if I do that [59:34] how are you gonna let the hostages go [59:36] okay so it's always make them think make [59:40] them think make them think right right [59:42] huh [59:42] yeah it's kind it's kind of crazy how it [59:44] works I finally got it flipped on me [59:47] once I'm in a we're doing a simulated [59:51] terrorists prison takeover we're doing [59:53] some training interestingly enough we [59:56] weren't Jamaica and I'm playing a bad [59:59] guy and I'm the most experienced [60:01] negotiator fun I had a great time yeah [60:03] plus I figure you know I I'm better than [60:07] either my opinion I'm better than [60:08] negotiate is on the other side okay and [60:11] I'm saying you know you got a I'm [60:12] holding these people you gotta let my [60:13] colleagues out of jail and did ago [60:18] shared on the other side says he wants [60:21] to let them go and then it up until that [60:26] moment the thought in my head that I [60:29] hadn't thought it all the way through [60:31] cuz it would be enough just to let him [60:34] out of jail [60:34] sure let him run around Kingstown yeah [60:37] well they go half a mile and a wait for [60:39] him and pick him up again it's not just [60:41] how do I get him out of jail how do I [60:43] make sure they get away I hadn't thought [60:45] it all the way through and it never even [60:48] occurred to me till they asked me that [60:50] question in a simulation and I remember [60:52] saying to myself I didn't think this all [60:54] the way through so even you who kind of [60:57] maybe developed a lot of his tactic it [61:00] works yeah a good question [61:02] makes you slow thinking Danny Kahneman [61:05] thinking in depth thinking you become [61:08] aware that you haven't thought it all [61:10] the way through you immediately see it [61:12] falling apart two steps further than you [61:15] thought and that completely stops you in [61:17] your tracks completely which is the [61:20] point of the question stop the other [61:22] side in their tracks [61:23] so you pause I know that the formula [61:26] this is like pause apologize mirror [61:29] slash applies a question so can you [61:32] break down that formula a little bit the [61:35] the pause is clear and then you [61:37] literally say sorry sorry Jordan but how [61:40] am I supposed to do that is that is that [61:43] kind of how this is applied yeah yeah [61:46] and it's that simple it is as stupid as [61:48] it sounds absolutely so your girlfriend [61:50] and kid must use this on you all the [61:52] time you know it's a great way of [61:56] letting somebody know also it's another [62:00] way of saying you just asked him [62:01] possible with me you know it forces [62:04] good how am I supposed to do that [62:06] question forces the person being asked [62:09] to take a hard look at exactly what [62:12] they're asking the other person to do [62:13] now they might not change their mind [62:15] that's not the point the point is to get [62:17] him to stop and think okay cuz I'm [62:20] thinking people right now are going wait [62:21] a minute they're just gonna tell me [62:23] exactly how they expect me to do that [62:25] but that's okay well two things first of [62:27] all everybody imagines it yeah that's [62:32] how it simulates in my head right that's [62:34] how everybody simulates in in your head [62:36] now slightly out of nine out of ten [62:40] times it doesn't work out that way [62:41] and so we got a lot of people Wow well [62:44] one kind of doesn't realize there that [62:47] you success percentages you'd be happy [62:49] with those percentages if you went to [62:51] Vegas you got a gambling system if are [62:54] you gonna do is it works more than 51% [62:56] of the time or more and pretty soon [62:59] they're renaming the casino after you [63:01] right sure yeah so again or you're [63:03] banned from the casino which is more [63:05] like but every now and then somebody on [63:10] the other side says because you have to [63:12] if you want the deal that's actually a [63:15] great answer because everybody's job is [63:18] the negotiators find out how far we can [63:19] push the other side without driving [63:21] words from the table right and when [63:23] somebody says if you want the deal [63:24] you'll do it you now know that's as far [63:27] as we go what happens when people get [63:30] angry this is probably happening far [63:32] less in business situations but I would [63:34] imagine hostage negotiators or people [63:36] who work hotshot stage takers they get [63:40] pissed off they're like look man I'm the [63:42] one with the gun I'm the one with the [63:43] civilians stop jerking me around I'm [63:46] tired of answering your stupid questions [63:48] I'm hungry I'm tired it's hot in here [63:51] quit asking me stupid stuff and his [63:55] which should completely baked your brain [63:57] hostage negotiations are calm more than [64:00] business negotiations okay how is that [64:03] even possible [64:04] I haven't run into a single business [64:07] negotiator doesn't have at least five [64:08] stories of somebody on the other side [64:10] screaming at him slam the door calling [64:12] them names refusing to call names on a [64:15] phone [64:16] constantly everybody's got those stories [64:19] yes hostage negotiators have one too [64:22] okay why is that the case well again [64:26] because as soon as the other side feels [64:29] listen to why get mad and a hostage [64:32] negotiator starts listening right away [64:33] business negotiation we sit down I go [64:37] like I ain't interested in what I you [64:38] had to say you're gonna listen to me [64:39] right I hold all the cards I gotta win [64:42] my boss needs to see me as the smart guy [64:44] in the room yeah yeah we don't do that [64:46] as hostage we calm people down real fast [64:48] how do you do that for first its voice I [64:52] mean FM DJ voice i FM DJ voice actually [64:55] what does that really mean before I [64:57] finish the sentence if you can see me or [65:00] if you could hear me and if we're on the [65:01] phone you could hear me my tone of voice [65:04] has gone in and hit something in your [65:05] brain called mirror in there runs those [65:08] mirror neurons have triggered an actual [65:10] chemical reaction in your brain [65:13] chemicals are being dumped into your [65:15] brain and into your system that slow you [65:17] down before I've even finished a [65:20] sentence that's how that happens and [65:23] that works even with like psychopath [65:25] sociopath type folks that don't maybe [65:29] everybody's got mirror and everybody's [65:31] got mirror neurons okay I was I'm not [65:32] sure on that I you're probably right I [65:35] haven't the psychopaths the sociopath [65:37] that's a result of principally of [65:40] conditioning nobody's contending that [65:43] there are functional physical things [65:45] missing from their brains they're [65:48] talking about something happened in [65:50] their development interestingly enough [65:53] there was a there was a syndrome the [65:56] reason why people hold babies and [65:59] hospitals and in orphanages now because [66:02] if children aren't held enough in the [66:04] first year of their life they have [66:05] that's when they learned how to bond and [66:07] if you haven't been held enough in the [66:10] first year in many children and [66:12] orphanages or abandoned or in hospitals [66:16] for extended periods of time are not [66:18] picked up and held they haven't learned [66:20] how to bond so they end up with [66:22] developmental stuff they they have [66:24] issues in the rest of the life bonding [66:26] with people and if so that something is [66:28] absent that [66:29] after they were born okay I think I [66:33] vaguely remember reading about this it's [66:35] just been a while some of those these [66:37] books all blur together after a while [66:38] especially there especially with all the [66:40] junk science out so you just need to [66:42] read one book yeah just one just never [66:44] split the difference boss I'm imagining [66:46] well I guess that's the book you [66:47] recognize in two thing that you should [66:49] mention yeah that's my idea I think I [66:50] came up with that you identify and label [66:54] emotions when people are feeling them to [66:56] calm him down I read that I thought that [66:57] was a brilliant tactic it's how does [66:59] this work in practice I'm screaming at [67:01] you stop asking me stupid freaking [67:03] questions send in the pizza and two [67:05] million dollars I'm gonna start whacking [67:07] some of these dumb kids I got here you [67:09] know stuck on this Bank what are you [67:12] doing to calm me down at this point yes [67:14] you're listening but what else I mean [67:16] I'm just pissed off it's been 13 hours I [67:19] got nothing left in the tank I'm over it [67:21] I'm gonna say I'm gonna say sounds like [67:23] you're mad at this whole situation it [67:26] sounds like you want to get out of there [67:27] and what does that do the labeling what [67:29] does that do to my lizard brain the [67:33] simplicity of it will obscure how [67:37] effective it is what I'm actually trying [67:39] to do if I say something that sounds [67:41] like when that hit your pitch your brain [67:45] you actually ask yourself is that the [67:48] way it sounds it triggers a thought in [67:51] your brain like a logical aural of [67:54] rational and identify and will it [67:57] triggers an identification a labeling of [68:01] it if you will it causes you to [68:02] contemplate it sort of as an issue [68:04] decide what you're thinking they did a [68:06] the book is the upward spiral they I [68:09] wish to remember the author's name they [68:11] did an actual experiment they induced [68:13] negative emotions in people by showing [68:15] pictures picture made him scared and sad [68:17] made him lonely wherever it is they're [68:20] monitoring the neural activity I show [68:24] you picture to makes you angry and a [68:26] specific part of the brain lights up [68:29] it's a portion of the amygdala where the [68:31] negative emotions are housed and that [68:33] lights up the electrical activity is [68:35] going crazy crazy crazy I show you the [68:37] picture and I just say what are you [68:39] feeling and looking at it if you're [68:42] feeling afraid [68:43] you say I was feeling of afraid and they [68:47] the part of the brain that was lighting [68:49] up now stops lighting up so labeling the [68:53] emotion blunts it or gets rid of a [68:56] triggering of contemplating the emotion [69:00] not denying it not suppressing it not [69:03] pushing it not trying to get rid of it [69:05] anywhere just a triggering of an [69:07] awareness of a negative and every time [69:09] they did that that portion of the brain [69:11] that was lighting up stop lighting up [69:13] not some of the time every time so if I [69:18] say it sounded like it just tired of [69:20] being here that causes you to think [69:23] about it and the part of you that was [69:26] frustrated tired annoyed it doesn't you [69:29] don't mean for it to happen but that [69:31] part of the brain stops lighten up what [69:33] if it's a positive emotion do I not want [69:35] to label it then that's the stupid thing [69:37] because positives then reinforce [69:38] positives so I do want to so I want to [69:40] label negative emotions too blunt them [69:42] and label positive emotions to really [69:43] it's like the North and South Pole of a [69:45] magnet has the opposite effect complete [69:48] exact same device complete opposite [69:51] effect huh why is that that I haven't [69:54] you know well first of all I don't know [69:56] why it caused the negative part of the [69:58] amygdala to shut off I just know it did [70:01] you know and they said there's so much [70:03] of the brain they got no idea why it [70:05] works they just know it's there a little [70:07] bit like gravity we really have no idea [70:09] how gravity works nobody's jumping off [70:13] you ain't gonna go jump off the Empire [70:14] State Building because gravity is still [70:15] gonna be yeah I don't think it works [70:19] today [70:19] yeah I don't understand it therefore I'm [70:21] not gonna hit the ground right so it's [70:23] still there and the emotional reactions [70:25] in our brain are very much like them you [70:27] know do we completely understand them [70:29] but their effects are unmistakable [70:32] from practice the effects of labeling [70:36] positives are unmistakable if if you say [70:39] I want a car and a million dollars a car [70:43] means you want to escape you want to [70:44] live I'll say it sounds like you want to [70:47] get out of this okay so that will [70:50] reinforce your positive desire to live [70:53] yeah so you're not necessarily even [70:56] sounds like you're reading between the [70:58] lines you're not saying okay let's talk [71:00] about the car let's talk about the money [71:02] you're actually reading their intention [71:03] instead of what they're actually the [71:04] more you read between the lines are more [71:06] powerfully effective huh because you're [71:08] telling them why you're actually let me [71:11] repeat that why is that the case well it [71:14] you know it's it's triggering the [71:15] recognition inside and again this is a [71:18] gravity issue [71:19] I just know works and we see it on a [71:21] regular basis and we see it actually [71:23] kind of in really funny ways his is a [71:25] great one with customer service people [71:28] because they're they're battered [71:30] children right you call customer service [71:32] as in everybody it's a dream that all [71:36] day every day [71:37] you know we wonder why they're in a bad [71:39] mood they're getting screamed that all [71:40] day every day I'm gonna phone with this [71:44] woman and I'm not doing a great job and [71:46] she's like give me short answers she's [71:49] barely standing on a phone or tone is [71:50] really clipped and well she's got me on [71:53] hold on trying to fix an airline take it [71:55] with no fees sure I can I can just [71:58] imagine her turning to her colleagues [72:00] and saying this guy's lucky I'm on the [72:03] phone with him at all mm-hmm all right [72:05] so let's go into bizarro world [72:06] you know tactical empathise what's the [72:08] other side to you not what's your view [72:10] or what's true [72:11] tactical empathy is what now tactical [72:13] empathy is what we use in the book [72:16] Daniel Goleman would call it cognitive [72:18] empathy we call it tactical because [72:21] since we know how the brain works we [72:22] might as well use in a tactical fashion [72:25] so if she's saying that I'm lucky that [72:29] she's talking to me at all in her view [72:32] of the world she's being generous oh I [72:37] see so she gets back on the phone with [72:40] me and the first thing out of my mouth [72:41] is I appreciate how generous you've been [72:45] with me so far [72:46] and I can feel her mood instantly change [72:49] and her tone instantly changed and she [72:54] says I give me another moment to look [72:58] into this yeah turns out I can solve [73:00] your problem pretty easily I just didn't [73:01] want to but you don't want to be fear of [73:03] course why she puts this she put cuz [73:05] this guy's been a jerk [73:06] like everybody else but I you know I [73:10] lines I know there's a positive emotion [73:13] in there that if I can punch it if I can [73:15] hit that target and tile it up it's a [73:17] pretty good chance you're gonna change [73:18] your mind [73:18] and that's exactly what happened she's [73:20] not in a limit I something else I got a [73:22] chair she puts me on hold [73:23] she comes back on all frees away they [73:25] get the ticket changed so we reinforce [73:28] people's what current opinion of [73:29] themselves or we just try to read their [73:32] mind in the moment and then tell them [73:33] what yeah well yeah it's it's all kind [73:37] of gonna be implied its current opinion [73:39] of themselves depending upon which you [73:40] want to reinforce you know what what [73:43] what do they tell themselves in a moment [73:44] you know if if they're acting stingy [73:47] then their view is if you're lucky to [73:50] have any other time they're actually [73:51] being generous you know sometimes it [73:53] with a little practice you can hear [73:55] around this stuff pretty fast and that's [73:57] really all it takes it's just practice [73:59] huh okay I like that example a lot [74:01] actually [74:02] so this dovetails nicely with what you [74:04] call the Black Swan rule which is don't [74:06] treat other people the way you want to [74:09] be treated treat them the way they need [74:11] to be treated right yeah so can you [74:13] flush that out or is that kind of what [74:15] we just talked about or is there more to [74:16] it no it's it's really more that you [74:18] know the assumption that everybody [74:19] assumes they're normal when in fact at [74:22] best you may be normal with the third [74:25] other people out there so you get into [74:28] this thing called well I'm going to [74:29] treat you the way I want to be treated [74:30] you know if I'm gonna sort of I want [74:32] answers so give me answers and I think [74:35] I'm treating you the way I want to be [74:37] treated I like people to be direct with [74:38] me I'm gonna be direct with you well [74:41] that's probably not true you know you [74:44] you may not want to be spoken to that [74:46] directly that bluntly [74:48] if I'm doing a Golden Rule I like to be [74:52] asked I love clarity I claim I crave [74:54] clarity I once had colleagues say that I [74:58] I crave clarity Eric Barker writes a [75:03] fantastic blog and book of the same name [75:05] barking up the wrong tree [75:07] he's his clarity's violence you know [75:11] trying to try to get clear let's get [75:13] clear about this [75:14] it often is perceived as a very violent [75:17] exchange [75:18] verbal exchange so you know you got to [75:21] be real careful about [75:23] assuming the how you're wired is how [75:25] somebody else is why because you can put [75:26] something on them that they just might [75:28] not resonate with so we try to read what [75:31] they need and give them what they need [75:33] instead of assuming that they need the [75:34] same things as us exactly okay yeah and [75:37] what sort of principal factors do you [75:39] look for you look for the communication [75:41] style whether they were assertive [75:42] cooperative was the other one five five [75:45] make friends fight fly to make friends [75:47] okay yeah yeah yeah well you know really [75:51] to some degree everybody's gonna want to [75:53] be heard out you know which is everybody [75:56] wants to be heard that's why I show up [75:57] in a negotiation I want you to hear me [75:59] so I if I start hearing you out plus [76:02] it's gonna give me a good read on which [76:05] of the types you are you know have you [76:07] thought through every detail you pride [76:09] yourself on the details have you done a [76:11] lot of research on me cuz you pride [76:13] yourself on relationships are you really [76:16] firm on what you want cuz you pride [76:17] yourself on getting what you want those [76:19] are basically the three times you know [76:22] so I'm gonna let you start talking and [76:24] I'm gonna I'm gonna start to get a real [76:27] clear feel for where you are plus also [76:29] when I see maybe some holes if I adapt [76:36] to how you are you're gonna let me show [76:38] them to you you know where does this not [76:40] add up well the book is loaded with very [76:45] detailed negotiation examples from both [76:47] hostage situations and business [76:50] situations there's a lot more than we [76:52] could get to here and it's I think it's [76:54] probably got to be one of the most [76:55] widely regarded books on negotiation [76:56] even if even if you do say so yourself [76:59] so thank you very much for your time [77:02] my pleasure thanks for you [77:11] you

===FILE=== M6DdRistr3w - Negative Self-Talk is LOSING You Sales.txt
https://youtu.be/M6DdRistr3w
Negative Self-Talk is LOSING You Sales!

[0:00] recently on it [0:01] and as I was brainstorming for it I [0:04] realized how much I used to do this on [0:07] the job as a cop we would be in a [0:10] briefing room or we'd be doing strategy [0:13] on a case and we'd be talking about [0:16] something that needed to happen or [0:18] something that had happened and somebody [0:20] would inevitably when we were talking [0:22] about taking it up the chain or taking [0:23] it to the other side we say well we [0:25] can't tell them that and we did that all [0:28] the time we would we would be worried [0:31] about how it was going to be received on [0:33] the other side so we'd negotiate with [0:35] ourselves and just not present it and [0:38] when I joined the Black Swan group even [0:41] before that when I read the book and [0:43] started on my Black Swan journey I found [0:45] myself negotiating against me to do the [0:48] skills accusations audits especially I'd [0:52] look at accusations audits I'd even make [0:54] a list of them and then think I can't I [0:57] I don't want to I don't want to say that [0:59] that's that makes me feel weird or you [1:01] know i' I'd be sitting in the moment [1:03] thinking about a label that I could use [1:05] but what if it what if they weren't [1:07] thinking that and I was going to lay I [1:09] was going to hang a negative on them or [1:10] something like that so I would negotiate [1:12] against myself and as I wrote through [1:16] the article I realized that what had [1:18] slowed that for me was again with the [1:22] basics the genuine curiosity if I could [1:25] keep my curiosity on then I wasn't so [1:27] worried about thinking about what I was [1:29] going to say say I was listening to the [1:31] other side I was trying to get their [1:34] perspective and their worldview and then [1:37] I would label that or mirror that or or [1:40] summarize it whatever and I could also [1:43] deliver any kind of bad news once I got [1:46] good at accusations audits in fact [1:50] accusations audits I think were one of [1:51] the things that built my confidence up [1:54] so much because no matter how horrible [1:56] it's going to sound on the other side if [1:58] I've hit it with a bunch of accus ation [2:00] audits I don't have to sit and think to [2:02] myself oh this is going to sound [2:03] horrible for them and they're going to [2:05] they're going to they're going to hate [2:06] me for even saying it I'll talk around [2:07] it or all I won't even mention or I [2:09] won't bring it up no I'd throw it right [2:11] out there in an accusations audit and [2:13] then I didn't have to worry about it [2:14] anymore I didn't have to negotiate with [2:15] anybody about it [2:17] so it's it is I found it interesting [2:20] that we're all so good at negotiating [2:23] with ourselves when we don't train for [2:26] that the problem is we don't think about [2:28] it we don't think that that's what we're [2:30] doing we think we're problem solving you [2:33] know somebody comes to us with something [2:35] and and they say I think they're going [2:37] to want and you haven't tested that with [2:41] the other side so you start off solving [2:44] that problem of I think they're going to [2:46] want without doing the negotiation work [2:50] the information gathering work that you [2:51] really need to so that you're not close [2:54] an awful lot of [2:56] avenues um you know when you second [2:58] guess yourself instead of just throwing [3:00] caution to the wind and and putting it [3:02] out there uh you tend to limit yourself [3:05] and I think that's the part that people [3:06] forget about is when you decide not to [3:09] do something because you assume it's not [3:11] what the other side wants to hear uh [3:14] you're second guessing yourself and [3:15] you're actually [3:17] limiting your your ability to get good [3:20] things moving forward and you do it out [3:22] of fear and we always say that fear is [3:25] that biggest driver of decision making [3:28] and behavior and when you allow fear to [3:32] come in on your side you end up not [3:36] putting things out there that could [3:37] benefit you in the long run because you [3:39] assume the other side is not going to be [3:41] on board with it and you don't know [3:43] until you test it it's like you know you [3:45] have to test all this stuff you never [3:47] know until you try all they can do is [3:48] say no and as soon as you understand [3:50] that no is a magic word it's not [3:53] necessarily the end all of everything um [3:56] it's a it's a magic word that can [3:57] actually get you what you want if you're [3:59] not afraid of no you can get a lot more [4:02] done a lot more accomplished without you [4:05] know ruining it for yourself by [4:08] self-talk it's it's amazing you know you [4:11] know we all coach we all coach have [4:13] coaching clients and stuff and and we'll [4:17] sit there and I I love to roleplay with [4:19] them when it gets to a point where they [4:21] want to work on certain skills and [4:24] they'll say certain things and then [4:26] they'll say to themselves oh I could [4:28] never say that in a real situation [4:30] I'm like what are you talking about it [4:32] just landed perfectly and and then when [4:36] when it's when it's real to you you get [4:38] nervous and you start negotiating [4:40] against yourself I'm like that's the [4:41] perfect time to try it to use it you [4:43] know it's it's right there you can have [4:45] it and then I I just had a reach reach a [4:48] coaching client that [4:50] actually I pushed them to the point [4:53] where they were talking and they said [4:55] okay as soon as I get off the phone I'm [4:56] going to do it and they did it and they [4:59] sent me a text message back saying oh my [5:01] gosh oh my gosh oh my gosh this you you [5:04] would not believe how well it went and [5:06] I'm like we've been working with you [5:08] guys for how long now and this is really [5:12] the first time that you've ever used it [5:14] that you've ever really you know taking [5:16] a chance to to just do it and and now [5:20] you see the result and and I'm gonna try [5:22] it tomorrow I'm like good do that [5:25] because it's it's it's so hard for [5:27] people even when we coach them [5:31] to [5:32] get confident enough to just go ahead [5:34] and do it you know they'll tell us hey [5:37] you know what should I say or they'll [5:38] say things like that and they want us to [5:41] to to walk them through the [5:43] process but if we don't take you know [5:46] take the training wheels off and let [5:47] them actually do it or you know push [5:50] them into a conversation where they have [5:52] to use it they'll never know I think I [5:56] think where I see most people failing [5:59] with this is they come in with [6:00] conclusions already made whether it's [6:02] conclusions about um what the other side [6:05] wants or conclusions about what they [6:08] want you know this is the price I'm [6:09] going to pay I'm not going any lower [6:11] than this I won't take this and those [6:15] are okay as guidelines but when they [6:17] become [6:19] conclusions you're negotiating to that [6:21] point instead of seeing what else is [6:23] available and you're you're kind of [6:25] taking yourself hostage a little bit [6:27] because you're not open to all that [6:30] might be available and like I've heard [6:32] it from both of you and Chris and Derek [6:34] and and you know never be so sure what [6:36] you want that you'd pass up something [6:37] better if it came along and it that [6:40] served me very well that's made me some [6:42] money in my own business and uh you know [6:45] you just you got to be kind of open to [6:47] it and not so convinced that you've done [6:50] this so many times before and you know [6:52] how it's going to go because that's [6:54] another one I saw was we used to call it [6:57] complacency on the department here it's [7:00] negotiating against yourself you you've [7:02] done it however many times you're good [7:04] at it you've been successful at it so [7:07] you just go the same way you've always [7:09] been going and the negotiation against [7:12] yourself is I'm I'm doing what works I'm [7:15] doing what you know you're doing what [7:18] works but are you doing what works best [7:21] so that selft talk as you're preparing [7:24] is very important that you're not coming [7:26] to conclusions about what you're about [7:28] to see even if if you've dealt with the [7:30] same person over and over again you [7:32] haven't been with them all the time [7:33] things have changed on their side things [7:35] have changed on your side and there [7:38] might be some there might be a lot more [7:40] room than you thought you should not [7:42] assume you should be a blank slate when [7:45] you go into a conversation and allow [7:46] things to happen in a natural way and [7:50] not be afraid to say things and put [7:52] things out there and and that's the [7:53] problem everyone's afraid well if I say [7:55] this and they don't want that it's going [7:56] to put me in a bad place no it's not you [7:58] say that and they don't want that you [7:59] say okay well it seems like you have a [8:00] vision of what you would like to do and [8:02] you let them tell you and then you then [8:03] you know if that's something you can do [8:05] or can you make that happen um you know [8:08] it's one of one of the reasons people [8:11] negotiate against themselves is out of [8:12] fear the other one is out of ignorance a [8:15] lot of the times because you don't know [8:17] what the other side wants you don't know [8:19] what they're willing to do or willing to [8:20] give you and instead of coming out and [8:21] opening it up in a way to figure that [8:23] out you assume you know and you limit [8:27] yourself and you limit them So you [8:30] you're not doing anybody any favors by [8:32] doing it that way in business your fears [8:36] are different than they are in your [8:37] personal life in business your fears are [8:39] this is my livelihood I could screw this [8:41] up I could blow this deal in your [8:43] personal life it's this is my personal [8:45] life this is my daughter if I say the [8:47] wrong thing I could have her mad at me I [8:49] could ruin the relationship so it [8:50] there's different things on the line but [8:52] when you think about it it's the same [8:54] thing it's still fear interfering in [8:56] what you're going to do and causing you [8:57] to take a step back and second guess [9:00] yourself and and what you're doing and [9:01] your motivations even so you know you [9:04] like I said I I use this analogy all the [9:07] time because for whatever reason what [9:08] worked for me but when you're cooking [9:10] spaghetti and you want to know if it's [9:11] done or not you throw it against the [9:12] wall it either sticks or it doesn't and [9:14] that's the way your conversations need [9:15] to go you throw something out there it [9:16] either sticks or it doesn't and if it [9:18] doesn't it falls off the wall and you [9:19] pick it up you throw it away it's not [9:20] the end of the [9:22] world I've seen a lot of people at work [9:26] who they take that into an almost a [9:29] negotiation with themselves they say I [9:31] don't want to hear that we're doing this [9:33] because this is the way we've always [9:34] done it and their message that the other [9:36] side receives is this has to change even [9:39] if it's working so they're again they [9:42] negotiate against themselves because [9:43] they hear oh he wants it changed and [9:46] what he that's not what he meant he just [9:49] meant he didn't want you just relaxing [9:51] into what's always been if there's a [9:54] better way to do it but we we say to [9:57] ourselves you know oh well he wants it [9:58] to change so we got to change something [10:01] and it may not it may not work better [10:03] but uh we change anyway cuz what I [10:06] should be doing is if I want if my want [10:10] in that negotiation is to make it better [10:11] for them I should find out what their [10:14] actual problem is first I have a a [10:17] mindset in the family you know if I say [10:19] things I only say it once and my kids [10:21] know that [10:24] so I find myself not saying some of the [10:28] things that I want to [10:30] say in order for them to grow to me you [10:34] know so I negotiate against myself and [10:37] and when I get back home my wife said [10:40] you should have said [10:42] something and I'm like babe I'm trying [10:45] to let them grow yeah but not like that [10:46] because it's gonna cost [10:49] us and so you go back and you go back [10:52] and you have to go back to the drawing [10:53] board okay what should I say and what [10:56] should I let go and let them figure out [10:58] for them El and and so you negotiate [11:01] against yourself [11:03] because you love them and you want them [11:06] to succeed and you want them sometimes [11:07] to go through those little hurdles that [11:09] they need to go through to get [11:11] better but then you don't want them to [11:13] have to go through that yeah so you end [11:15] up negotiating against yourself on what [11:18] should I say like you said and what [11:19] shouldn't I say in the business world [11:21] it's a lot different for [11:23] me I I I'm I'm comfortable with [11:27] saying what I'm I'm feeling what I'm [11:30] thinking is is is better and the [11:33] personal and on the personal side it's [11:36] it's like a dance almost all of this [11:39] stuff can be undone with um the Black [11:43] Swan techniques because in every example [11:46] where we're negotiating with [11:48] ourselves what we're we're making it All [11:50] About Us instead of making it about the [11:52] other side and if you just make it about [11:55] the other side even for a few seconds [11:57] you can force that and try to check [11:59] their perspective then you don't have to [12:01] worry about should I say this or should [12:03] I say that because they're going to give [12:05] you what they need they're G to they're [12:07] going to show you how they need to be [12:08] treated I [12:10] think so Troy I want to bring up [12:12] something that I know you and I like to [12:14] talk about um and Don me too um we [12:17] haven't had in as in-depth discussions [12:19] about it but when you look at [12:20] personality [12:21] types who do you think tends to [12:24] negotiate against themselves more [12:30] I think it's the cons I think it's the [12:32] the uh [12:35] accommodators I don't want to say that [12:37] because I don't it's about the [12:38] relationship in the moment so you don't [12:41] want to say some of the things that you [12:43] may be thinking so you'll just go go [12:45] into agreement mode knowing that you [12:47] know that's not [12:48] real so I'm not gonna nothing right now [12:51] you know and and so it's almost like [12:53] avoidance you know you avoid saying it [12:56] because you don't want to you don't you [12:58] don't want to hurt the relationship in [13:00] the moment and and you know that the [13:03] conversation has to be had but you're [13:06] more focused and that goes back to what [13:08] D says about it's more about you at that [13:11] point so I'd love to say that analysts [13:16] are the information gatherers so we're [13:18] not as apt to do it but I think I think [13:22] that this is something that goes across [13:26] the board because analysts are we avoid [13:29] arguments because they're a waste of [13:31] time but the way that we often avoid [13:33] arguments is by not being curious we [13:36] hear something we don't like on the [13:37] other side and we just we just avoid it [13:41] and accommodators to your point they're [13:44] always worried about the relationship [13:46] how's this going to affect the [13:47] relationship is this going to land wrong [13:49] assertives on the other hand are always [13:51] thinking if I can just get them to [13:54] figure this out if I can just explain [13:56] this well enough they need to know this [13:58] they need to know that I need to explain [14:01] better and harder and um just so you [14:03] know a certain member of our audience [14:05] said that you would throw the spaghetti [14:07] through the wall and uh that's the [14:09] assertive side um but uh but I I kind of [14:15] think this might be just absolutely [14:17] Universal where we all do it for [14:19] different reasons or different [14:21] motivations but I think that it's a it's [14:24] a very human like um like you said Sandy [14:28] it's based on fear and no matter what [14:30] your personality type is 75% of your [14:32] amigdalas resources are processing fears [14:36] see I think analysts because they [14:38] overanalyze everything get down in the [14:40] Weeds about what they should and [14:42] shouldn't say based [14:46] on and assertives I feel like I'm [14:49] careful sometimes what I say because I'm [14:51] pushy and unfiltered and I know that if [14:53] I come off a certain way it won't go [14:56] well so I that's my fear and why I end [14:58] up to go NE against myself so I think we [15:00] all do it for different reasons but no [15:03] personality type is immune to [15:05] negotiating against themselves they may [15:06] just have different reasons for it so do [15:10] we have any questions yet [15:12] Gabby yes we do we had some submitted [15:16] and the first one was is dynamic silence [15:19] one of the best skills to use when you [15:21] are starting to doubt yourself during a [15:24] negotiation I I like Dynamic silence for [15:28] that um if I'm if I hear my inner voice [15:31] start to start talking then I try to I [15:35] try to create Dynamic silence across the [15:37] board with me and my counterpart and [15:39] that quiets my mind turns my curiosity [15:41] on gets you know gets me look if I'm if [15:44] I'm face to face I can listen with my [15:46] eyes I can start putting resources [15:48] toward what I'm supposed to be doing [15:51] instead of my inner monologue because we [15:54] talk a lot about you know um in our [15:56] classes and with our clients about the [15:58] levels of listen listening we talk about [16:00] listening for the gist of what the other [16:01] person is saying and then going into our [16:03] internal monologue or or listening for [16:05] to rebut and all of that allows for that [16:09] negotiation with yourself when you turn [16:10] your Curiosity on and you get into [16:13] looking for their internal logic looking [16:14] for their emotions or their worldview [16:17] now it's harder for you for your mind to [16:20] start holding up little signs about how [16:23] bad you're doing or how this might not [16:25] work or maybe you shouldn't say that um [16:29] because you're predicating it all off of [16:31] what you're getting from the other side [16:32] so if you can be quiet if you get into a [16:34] spot where you're stuck silence is [16:38] silence is very effective it's the only [16:41] time Dynamic silence is negative if [16:43] you're using it to manipulate um but [16:46] pausing and taking a little silence to [16:49] get yourself back on track um meaning [16:52] getting out of your own way as far as [16:54] negotiating against yourself never a bad [16:59] one one of the things that Don was [17:00] saying about the being curious you have [17:02] to you have to pair that with that [17:04] Dynamic silence to me because if you [17:07] don't sometimes you you'll you'll start [17:10] to hyperventilate because you get quiet [17:12] and then you start thinking oh I said [17:14] something wrong and then you start [17:15] getting in panic mode and the amydala [17:17] fired up now you can't think clearly now [17:20] you and and you don't you know you think [17:23] everybody can see it oh my gosh you can [17:25] tell and and you you talk yourself right [17:28] out [17:29] know being in the conversation so as [17:32] soon as you get quiet one of the things [17:34] that it pairs with it is is [17:38] uh why am I feeling that way it's kind [17:41] of relaxing a little bit when you know [17:45] that you have to confront something and [17:47] you don't want to do the work so you [17:49] just talk yourself out of it um and and [17:54] uh you know put it put it off till [17:56] tomorrow or whatever um that's why I was [17:59] so enamored when I was writing this [18:01] article with how effective accusations [18:05] audits are at negotiating with [18:06] yourselves [18:08] because uh it seems like when you make a [18:11] list when you think about what the other [18:13] side might be thinking about you [18:14] negatively or the deal negatively or or [18:16] any of the negative things they might [18:18] want to accuse you of when you're [18:20] thinking of all those things those are [18:22] all things that are going to Spur your [18:25] own internal negotiations against [18:28] yourself so if you can get those down on [18:30] paper and start to realize hey this [18:33] might be what they're thinking and you [18:35] know instead of I can't tell them that [18:37] this is what I need to throw out there [18:40] and and pave over before it before it [18:43] becomes a problem so that really knocks [18:47] a lot of my of my self uh negotiating gu [18:52] my self kind of times down is if I can [18:54] do effective and visceral accusations on [18:59] because again accusations audits [19:02] especially all of our skills really if [19:04] you're not comfortable with them if you [19:06] haven't used them enough you'll find [19:08] yourself thinking oh I'll try that next [19:10] time um this this wouldn't really fit [19:12] here and you you're negotiating with [19:15] yourself not to do it and accusations [19:16] audits are the absolute like I think one [19:19] of the hardest ones for people to master [19:21] because when we have people write out [19:23] lists of them it's so funny because [19:25] they'll they'll read their list about [19:27] negatives the other side might be [19:28] thinking about him and they're like you [19:30] probably think that we may be untruthful [19:33] sometimes occasionally when you're not [19:34] around and you're like no that's not [19:36] what anybody thinks they're they're [19:38] thinking you're a liar and and uh but [19:41] they sof they they negotiate against [19:43] themselves with oh I don't want to tell [19:44] them that I don't want to hear I don't [19:45] want to make me sound like a monster so [19:48] instead of telling them what they might [19:49] be thinking them what they might be [19:51] thinking you're actually writing down [19:53] what you hope is the minimal thing they [19:55] might be thinking and you don't want to [19:57] you don't want to push it and uh but [19:59] accusations audits really if they're [20:01] visceral you can take away a lot of your [20:03] negotiating with yourself I think [20:05] because you just you don't have to worry [20:08] about I can't tell them that this might [20:10] be this might be a problem they don't [20:11] want to hear that you don't have to [20:12] think any of that stuff because you [20:13] blurt it out at first effectively you [20:16] know that low and slow with that [20:18] heartbeat in between them to let it land [20:20] and and uh now neither of you have you [20:23] don't have to negotiate against yourself [20:24] because the other side trusts you we do [20:26] have a question in the chat from GES and [20:29] his question is you're stuck in a car [20:32] with a narcissist who seems intent to [20:34] upset you firing insults labeling your [20:38] silence Etc what strategies help you [20:41] most when you feel trapped in an [20:42] extremely tough [20:44] situation I would just look at him and [20:47] say um hey Don get out of the car um but [20:51] uh you gotta walk no um um if you're if [20:56] you're stuck in a car with a narcissist [20:58] um your first your first thought is [21:02] going to be to negotiate with yourself [21:03] and actually do some self-labeling about [21:06] what kind of poor Life Choices have led [21:08] you to this place and you're probably [21:11] stuck moving because you can't just step [21:13] out so that's unfortunate or it's your [21:15] car and you don't want to give it to [21:16] them but um but what you want to do in [21:20] that case if they're firing insults and [21:22] if they're labeling I don't know how [21:24] you'd label somebody's silence unless [21:26] they said you know maybe you're being [21:27] quiet because of this or you don't you [21:29] don't know what to say or something like [21:31] that if they're firing stuff at you [21:33] silence is the first is my first defense [21:36] because I can let them know without [21:39] saying a word that what they're saying [21:41] is unwelcome and hopefully they will fix [21:46] themselves a little bit now if they're a [21:47] true narcissist and it's all about them [21:50] and they think they've got you right [21:51] where they want you and they're trying [21:52] to beat you into a corner then our go-to [21:57] labels seems like have a for feeling [21:59] that way seems like you have a reason [22:01] for thinking that and uh you know talk [22:05] to him until you can get to an [22:06] intersection and then unlock the doors [22:09] and throw them out you have to recognize [22:11] very early that that's not somebody [22:14] you're going to have a long-term [22:15] relationship with or you're going to be [22:16] you're going to do business with and so [22:19] the last impression is the Las [22:20] impression you know I'm really sorry you [22:21] feel that way it's really unfortunate [22:23] that uh you know all this stuff's going [22:26] on with you but um hopefully in the [22:28] future Maybe things will work out and [22:29] and um next time we'll we'll meet [22:33] somewhere instead of taking this car but [22:35] um but do the last impression is the [22:38] Lasting Impression but in any case no [22:41] matter how tough it is no matter what [22:43] the situation is when you wonder what [22:46] should I do for this the first the very [22:49] first thing that you need to do is turn [22:51] your Curiosity on what is the reason [22:54] behind their behavior and you don't get [22:56] to answer that that's self negotiating [22:59] you need to check in with them and if [23:03] they're if they're firing insults and [23:04] things like that know that the reason [23:06] that people attack you is because either [23:09] they feel you're not listening to them [23:11] they feel like they're under a lot of [23:13] pressure on their side to do a certain [23:14] Thing by a certain time or they're [23:17] trying to manipulate you and in any of [23:19] those cases genuine curiosity and using [23:23] the Black Swan skills to try to uncover [23:24] their motivation is going to get you out [23:26] of that attack now if is not a Magic [23:29] Bullet if somebody's screaming at you [23:31] like they did to us on the phone as we [23:33] get on the phone with some barricaded [23:34] person or some hostage taker and they'd [23:36] be screaming at us and telling us what [23:38] we were going to make the SWAT team do [23:39] and all this other stuff and if you [23:42] personalized that and didn't stay [23:43] curious it' be just a battle of [23:46] arguments and nobody'd ever come out [23:47] somebody wouldd eventually get tased [23:49] whether it was you or them or whatever [23:51] but um if you could stay curious and ask [23:55] yourself what's the why behind this [23:56] behavior and then last in that mindset [23:59] for a minute and a half or two minutes [24:02] and kept your voice tone low and slow [24:05] slow your Cadence slow your tone a [24:07] little bit they will start mirroring [24:09] that no matter how excited they are and [24:12] they'll come down to where you're at um [24:14] if you've got a full on [24:15] narcissist uh you know I usually stroke [24:20] their ego and own up to whatever they [24:21] think the problem is basically like it's [24:23] my fault I don't come out and say oh [24:25] that's my fault I'll say seems like I've [24:27] done something that's really got you [24:29] angry at me today in other words you're [24:31] firing all this crap at me so what [24:33] obviously I've done something to earn [24:35] this and so if you have that's when [24:37] they'll tell you what it is and you just [24:39] take it in and say serious about where [24:40] it's coming from or if you haven't [24:43] they'll realize they're taking whatever [24:44] this is out on you for no good reason [24:47] and'll make them make them think twice [24:48] about what they're doing and reset their [24:50] brain so you [24:53] know you you have to you have to call [24:56] out something so make a verbal [24:58] observation about what you what your [25:00] intuition is telling you is happening in [25:02] the moment where is this coming from [25:03] what is their problem is it you is it [25:06] someone else are you just the brunt of [25:07] their anger at the moment because they [25:08] happen to have you captive in this [25:10] car that's the Curiosity part if if all [25:14] you can do is practice then that's what [25:16] you do if if you know that relationship [25:19] isn't going any further or uh it's just [25:22] a just an unwarranted attack because [25:25] somebody's emotional about something [25:26] else use it to practice [25:29] I will tell you I recently had this not [25:32] I wasn't trapped in a car I was trapped [25:34] at dinner with somebody that I disagree [25:36] with on nearly every point and usually I [25:40] can get through a dinner like that but [25:42] the problem with this particular one was [25:45] the other side desperately wanted to [25:48] hear their opinion come out of my mouth [25:51] so for two hours I practiced these [25:54] skills and I did I think I did pretty [25:57] well at it we never fought I never [25:59] nobody raised their voice and I never um [26:03] confronted anything that wasn't [26:06] worthwhile for me to confront in other [26:08] words something that I'm not changing [26:10] their mind they're not changing mine uh [26:12] but I will say when I dropped them off [26:15] and I started to back out of the parking [26:17] space I was physically tired the only [26:20] way you're going to get better at not [26:22] negotiating with yourself is practicing [26:25] and being mindful of not negotiating [26:27] with yourself [26:28] of keeping these skills in the front and [26:33] and working out with them instead of [26:36] sitting back and and hoping things go [26:39] better or thinking that you know I I'd [26:41] rather not even you know rather not even [26:44] engage and uh so yeah practice when you [26:48] can yeah it is all about the process and [26:51] if you if [26:52] you ignore that and don't use the [26:55] process that's the biggest way you [26:56] negotiate against yourself it's just not [26:58] even thinking about using the process um [27:02] the thing that makes it the easiest is [27:04] to slow everything down um if you're [27:07] like me and your brain runs 15,000 miles [27:10] a minute uh you you can't handle any of [27:12] this stuff if your brain is on overdrive [27:14] because you you get stuck and then you [27:18] start saying things that are hard to [27:20] take back so you have to slow down and [27:22] and concentrate on the other side [27:24] because remember it's tactical empathy [27:25] it's about them concentrate on the other [27:27] side What's happen with them what's [27:28] going on with them why are they doing [27:30] this um you know they may be a [27:32] narcissist it doesn't mean that you need [27:33] to use the skills any differently [27:35] because if it's a narcissist or somebody [27:36] that's just having a horrible day and [27:38] everything's going wrong you're going to [27:39] use the same skills yep and remember [27:42] that moment between the trigger and your [27:44] reaction you can choose how to respond [27:47] and that's where the work comes in but [27:49] you got to do it so

===FILE=== PHqtfh9Re9M - Chris Voss Master Business Negotiations Like A Pro With A Former FBI Negotiator.txt
https://youtu.be/PHqtfh9Re9M
Chris Voss： Master Business Negotiations Like A Pro With A Former FBI Negotiator

[0:02] it takes about two weeks in in point the [0:05] fact we get you up to a very high level [0:08] i want to know what's important to this [0:09] person how they tick do i want to do [0:12] business with them [0:13] hi everyone and welcome to the spencer [0:15] lodge podcast after many years in the [0:17] business and finance industry hearing [0:18] countless stories and interviewing [0:20] hundreds of business professionals i've [0:22] learned that every successful person is [0:24] good at this one thing negotiating so [0:26] how do you develop this skill and how [0:27] can you negotiate better today's guest [0:30] is chris foss the ceo and founder of the [0:32] black swan group and author of never [0:34] split the difference negotiating as if [0:36] your life depended on it chris was [0:37] trained in the art of negotiation by the [0:39] fbi scotland yard and harvard law school [0:42] he had a successful 24-year career at [0:44] the fbi as a master negotiator today [0:47] chris gives his time to some of the most [0:48] prestigious schools in the world to [0:50] teach the art of negotiation but what [0:52] can we learn from his expertise from [0:53] right here in dubai he has used his many [0:55] years of experience in international [0:57] crisis and high-stakes negotiations to [0:59] develop a unique program that applies [1:01] these globally proven techniques to the [1:03] business world to sit back listen and [1:05] learn all about the world of high-stakes [1:07] negotiation and get ready to apply it to [1:09] your life and your business cue the [1:11] music [1:12] [Music] [1:25] with the impact of climate change and [1:27] the growing population on the planet by [1:29] 2050 we're not going to have enough food [1:31] to feed everybody we have to think about [1:33] different ways of doing it how we [1:35] address that problem is a difficult and [1:37] complicated one but one that our sponsor [1:39] smartcast is dealing with head-on they [1:42] want to solve 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their [2:30] future najahi events are one of our [2:32] sponsors and have been now since the [2:34] beginning they bring motivational [2:35] speakers inspirational leaders here into [2:38] the region so that we can benefit from [2:40] their knowledge and wisdom go and check [2:42] them out because they offer [2:43] really valuable education resources for [2:47] you to improve your life whether that's [2:48] investing whether that's personal [2:50] development whether that's learning how [2:51] to build social media platforms all of [2:53] this kind of stuff they offer the [2:55] knowledge around it so najahi events are [2:57] on instagram [2:58] naji events go check them out right [3:01] chris first of all it's taking me a year [3:03] to get you on the show it took me six [3:05] weeks to get tony robbins on the show [3:07] [Laughter] [3:10] and to get tony robbins on the show i [3:12] contacted his manager and his manager [3:14] said no [3:15] i found his publicist in new york and [3:17] she said no right i sent her a bunch of [3:19] flowers she then still said no oh yeah [3:22] and then i sent a six cupcakes [3:25] nice and she said to me why did you send [3:27] the flowers and i'm like what do you [3:29] mean she's like i hate flowers i love [3:31] cupcakes you just saved yourself some [3:33] time if you send them first and it was [3:34] on the back of that that she then said [3:36] to me do me a video as to why you want [3:38] him on the show right i'm gonna be on [3:40] the plane with him i'll play the video [3:42] from my phone oh very nice and that [3:44] that's how it happened perfect and since [3:46] then it's been you know [3:48] much easier to get lots of the kind of [3:50] guests that i'd wanted to in that space [3:52] but you don't fit in that space you're [3:54] not one of these business guys [3:56] right to me you're a bit different and [3:58] the reason i see you is a bit different [4:00] is that you write a book [4:02] and that book becomes almost like a [4:05] bible for me to listen to [4:07] when it comes to doing business with [4:09] different nations different cultures [4:11] different nationalities [4:13] and [4:14] i read it i listened to it i read it and [4:17] then i listened to it again [4:19] and a lot of what you say [4:21] makes me feel like that's a book for [4:23] every sales person in the world yeah [4:26] yeah yeah to have no matter what they [4:28] sell yeah thank you [4:30] did you did you write it because you [4:32] wanted to write a book to share this [4:34] information or did someone tell you you [4:36] needed to write a book no well um since [4:38] i left the fbi you know i had colleagues [4:41] friends telling me to write a book [4:43] but i didn't think we had [4:44] you know a whole product whole system [4:46] ready [4:47] you know we really my son and i working [4:50] on it together [4:51] and uh so then i was lucky enough to i [4:53] got a chance to teach at harvard then i [4:55] then i got a little more established [4:57] position in georgetown [5:00] and we started teaching part-time [5:02] students [5:03] which if they're part-time they're [5:04] working during the day that's why [5:05] they're going to school part-time how to [5:06] put these ideas straight in [5:09] to their jobs like great thing about a [5:11] part-time mba student [5:14] is they're not there for theoretical [5:15] stuff [5:16] they're like i got a problem tomorrow [5:19] give me a way to deal with this tomorrow [5:22] and i'll let you know how it went [5:24] and so then [5:26] then we get a chance to test drive some [5:28] stuff some stuff jumped out of this we [5:30] didn't think was important [5:32] and after doing that for a couple years [5:33] then i thought all right we got a book [5:36] so your [5:37] original question was was i told to do [5:38] it or did i want to do it i think both [5:42] you know one wanted wanted to get it out [5:44] there wanted to get it out there want to [5:45] know that uh we had um sort of a system [5:48] in the end that would work [5:49] when when you read your bio and [5:52] understand about your history [5:54] a lot of people would say that's pretty [5:55] rock and roll [5:57] you know it's kind of sexy isn't it say [5:59] i was an fbi hostage negotiator and you [6:01] know you've done these really cool [6:03] things trained by scotland yard and [6:04] stuff like that i mean it's [6:06] it leans into the whole kind of [6:08] fascination we have with true crime okay [6:11] and the movies that we've watched over [6:13] the years as well [6:14] but [6:15] how did you get into it not get into it [6:17] how did you get interested in this [6:19] subject matter in the first place where [6:20] did it start for you in terms of [6:22] becoming interesting [6:24] uh well [6:25] when i decided i decided i want to be a [6:27] police officer when i was about 16 years [6:29] old [6:30] and then for whatever reason i was drawn [6:32] to terrorism [6:34] you know the idea that [6:37] anybody should kill other people based [6:39] on [6:40] a political agenda [6:42] there's something about that that always [6:44] really rubbed me the wrong way [6:46] um [6:47] so you know i i wanted to i wanted to [6:50] work it so i got into the fbi and as [6:52] fate would have it i ended up on a joint [6:54] terrorist task force in new york city [6:56] which is this great [6:58] hybrid of the nypd and the fbi [7:02] and so i was working terrorism i was a [7:04] swat guy [7:05] and uh [7:07] screwed up my knee again [7:09] but i like crisis response the other [7:10] thing i always liked about crisis [7:12] response is there's no procrastination [7:15] we gotta decide right now what we're [7:17] gonna do [7:19] and so when i knew that i was gonna have [7:22] a shelf life as a swat guy i thought [7:23] hostage negotiators they're always there [7:25] when i was on a swat team and you know [7:27] we'd get out there we'd do the exercise [7:29] and i knew that somewhere somebody was [7:31] supposed to be talking to one phone [7:32] didn't sound hard [7:33] you know i got to talk you know how hard [7:36] is that [7:37] and uh so i figured i could do it and um [7:41] and i got into it and then it was [7:43] you know there were some bumps along the [7:44] way it was [7:45] initially rejected [7:47] and and then i got into it and it was [7:49] just like [7:50] this is this is cool stuff to use words [7:54] to change the [7:56] trajectory of an entire crisis [7:59] and [8:01] not long after i got trained it was a [8:04] bank robbery with hostages [8:07] and i went [8:08] and we got we got them out i got a guy [8:11] to surrender to me [8:12] how did that feel [8:15] it was amazing it's a it's a rush it's [8:18] an adrenaline rush [8:20] i mean you just you're sort of astounded [8:24] that your words [8:26] stopped people from getting killed and [8:28] then [8:30] got a really bad guy [8:33] to say [8:35] all right i'm coming out [8:37] i mean that's [8:38] it's it's [8:41] it's a high for lack of a better term [8:43] and so then when i was [8:45] when i was teaching it [8:47] uh you know i went from doing it to the [8:48] teaching at the full-time quantico [8:51] like every class the crazy thing about [8:53] it we'd only teach two classes a year [8:56] but there would be about 33 people in [8:58] every class and we just knew [9:01] that the minute we put release these [9:03] trained negotiators back into the wild [9:06] that weekend somebody was going to get [9:08] into something [9:10] it always happened that way that weekend [9:12] they got home or within the week [9:14] like instantly like it had been that [9:16] close for me in new york because when i [9:18] got out of the training there was a [9:19] siege on the gates of the u.n [9:22] and [9:24] um i waited to get called [9:26] and i never got called and i was mad at [9:28] myself i'm angry mad at myself to this [9:31] day for not just showing up [9:33] and when it was over i checked with the [9:34] coordinator and she said look don't wait [9:37] show up [9:38] just show which is how i got into in the [9:41] middle of things at the bank [9:44] so i i'd come that close to negotiating [9:46] a siege that literally at the gates of [9:48] the u.n and so i knew that was going to [9:51] happen to other people and and we told [9:53] we'd always tell them you know [9:54] somebody's going to get into something [9:56] before the week is out [9:59] and [10:00] they would call us as soon as somebody [10:01] surrendered i remember one of our [10:03] negotiators in in florida called me [10:05] after he talked the guy out of a siege [10:07] and he was he was [10:09] he was high he was astounded he was [10:12] he felt like i had felt and i and i knew [10:14] was coming he said you told me this last [10:16] week and i i just didn't believe you [10:20] and but it just happened [10:22] so yeah it was pretty cool it was it's [10:24] it's phenomenal experience you um [10:26] you think about sales and there's people [10:29] that get into sales because [10:31] or has some success in sales because [10:33] they think so they have some natural [10:34] ability to communicate and you know [10:36] natural ability to build rapport or in [10:38] england we'd say the gift of the gab or [10:40] your grandmother would anyway [10:42] and i i'm quite offended by that [10:44] personally because i believe that [10:45] selling is a skill yeah and and it's [10:48] something that you have to learn it's a [10:49] professional skill if you learn how to [10:51] do it properly [10:53] i think there's people out there that [10:54] would imagine that they're pretty good [10:55] negotiators yeah they're a lot they're [10:58] thinking yeah that don't actually have [11:00] the skills if you were to take someone [11:02] like me [11:03] from the ground up and say right you're [11:05] going to school and you're going to [11:06] learn how to negotiate expense and i'm [11:08] going to teach you [11:10] how long would it take me and how [11:11] intense would it be [11:14] is that a five-year thing is it is it is [11:16] it is that what is it no well [11:19] like if there were there weren't in [11:20] intensive training [11:22] like we we focused you [11:24] all the hostage negotiation [11:27] the best the the the best in the world [11:29] are scotland yard [11:31] fbi um canadians are on a really good [11:34] school [11:35] theologians run a really good school [11:37] and all of us steal liberally from one [11:39] another [11:41] it takes about two weeks [11:43] in point of fact i mean two weeks of [11:45] intense training we can get any one of [11:47] those schools or any uh person's similar [11:50] training about 80 hours [11:53] we get you up to a very high level [11:57] so it's going to be up to you whether or [11:59] not it sticks [12:01] and that's really the issue because it's [12:03] so it can it can perish so invisibly [12:06] when i first [12:07] got trained before i became a hostage [12:09] negotiator to get become a hostage [12:11] negotiator i was told to volunteer on a [12:12] suicide hotline [12:14] eminently i was eminently unqualified [12:16] initially [12:17] i had to go volunteer on a suicide [12:19] hotline so i went to the hotline [12:21] training it was roughly 80 hours of [12:23] training and to give you an idea how far [12:25] it progressed [12:26] very first night they give you a sheet [12:28] of paper 10 responses somebody might say [12:30] on the line write down what you might [12:33] say [12:34] and at the end of the training they give [12:36] you that piece of paper back [12:38] now i've been told [12:40] that my handwriting looks like i hold a [12:43] pencil with my feet [12:48] so it's fairly distinctive [12:53] never heard that before [12:56] okay [12:57] so when they handed that piece of paper [12:59] back to me [13:01] i knew it was my handwriting [13:03] but i looked at those words and i said [13:05] to myself what [13:07] idiot wrote this stuff down [13:10] that's how far they could take you well [13:12] now the problem with it being a [13:14] perishable skill is [13:16] over the course of the year my skills [13:18] have deteriorated so badly and i had no [13:20] idea [13:22] i come up from my annual annual review [13:24] this great guy named jim [13:26] is reviewing me [13:28] he's listening on the other line near [13:29] the room i make the call [13:32] caller at the end the call the caller [13:33] goes wow you're you're fantastic [13:36] that was you just helped me so much [13:38] thank you and i hung up [13:40] so i'm walking back to the [13:42] to listen to jim kind of going like [13:46] exactly [13:47] and jim goes that was horrible [13:50] and i'm like [13:53] you listen to my call [13:55] because my guy congratulated me [13:58] he said let's start with that that's one [14:00] of the reasons it was horrible because [14:02] he attributed the success of that call [14:04] to you which means that when you get off [14:05] the phone he's lost without you [14:09] and i was like [14:10] have i gotten that bad over a year of [14:13] not attending to the skills not [14:15] practicing [14:17] you know would be like if tiger woods [14:19] never hit the practice [14:21] green or the the driving range like [14:23] tiger woods was a maniac for [14:26] being on the driving range when he [14:27] wasn't playing you know your skills [14:29] deteriorate and so [14:31] we could and you've already told me that [14:33] you like to learn and that you believe [14:35] that skills are learned and not natural [14:37] so that gives you an advantage in [14:38] learning to start with [14:40] so we could train you up easily [14:43] relatively short period of time [14:46] but then whether or not [14:48] you understand the maintenance that's [14:50] necessary to stay on top of it when you [14:52] consider the the different industries [14:54] that you help and the different [14:56] situations that negotiations required it [14:58] kind of [14:59] encompasses everything doesn't it [15:01] from getting your parents to do [15:03] something for you when you're younger [15:04] all the way through to getting your boss [15:06] to give you the kind of outcome you're [15:07] looking for to the client that you're [15:08] dealing with the challenging situation [15:11] between a few parties at the same time [15:12] around the table [15:14] is it to get a cup of coffee at [15:16] starbucks yeah to get a cup of coffee [15:18] and starbucks is it [15:20] is it all very very different [15:23] or on the whole is it actually all very [15:26] similar just nuances based upon the [15:29] individual situation yeah yeah it's [15:32] that's exactly it human beings make [15:33] their mind up on what they're going to [15:34] do pretty much the same same regardless [15:37] of circumstances [15:38] you know there's a ruler that we live by [15:40] never be mean to somebody who could hurt [15:42] you by doing nothing [15:45] which is [15:46] everybody to talk to [15:48] so the flip side of that is [15:51] anybody you talk to could help you if [15:53] they felt like it [15:54] so how do you get them to feel like it [15:58] okay and then how do you accelerate that [16:00] and the decision of whether or not they [16:02] feel like it is [16:03] did they connect with you [16:06] did they feel like you connected with [16:08] them [16:09] now in the following steps [16:11] what are they going to do or what could [16:13] they do extra [16:15] and then [16:16] is this one-off [16:18] and nothing is a one-off [16:21] you know everybody thinks that stuff is [16:22] a one-off but nothing is a one-off [16:25] because anybody that you encountered in [16:26] your world today you're likely to [16:27] encounter them tomorrow so how is that a [16:29] one-off [16:30] shopping at a for a car shopping at a at [16:33] a home depot one of my one of my [16:35] students in georgetown in the book [16:36] there's a section on bargaining [16:39] we call it the ackermann method like it [16:40] is a brutally effective way to bargain i [16:43] mean you will get your price [16:46] so one of my students at georgetown uses [16:49] the ackerman model to just just kill [16:51] home depot on a price of cabinets just [16:54] slaughtered him [16:56] best deal he'd ever heard of anybody got [16:57] on cabins [16:59] had to go back to the same guy a week [17:00] later [17:03] that guy remembered getting [17:05] the daylight beat out of him a week [17:06] earlier he wasn't about to help him [17:08] again yeah you know he thought that was [17:09] a one-off transaction but he had to go [17:11] back to the home depot for something [17:13] else [17:14] are you [17:15] studying personality types [17:18] a lot of the time when you when you [17:20] first start to talk to somebody i'll try [17:22] and give an example [17:25] when i sell something right [17:27] my the the first part of any [17:28] communication i have is to build some [17:30] rapport right yes and i have a process [17:32] to building rapport so my process will [17:35] always be [17:36] work social family all right okay [17:39] because you don't start with family when [17:40] you don't know somebody it's kind of a [17:41] bit weird asking about if you're married [17:43] and you've got kids but right most [17:45] people are happy to talk about their [17:46] business right so and you can ask them [17:48] about their business they can tell you a [17:50] bit more about that and again living [17:51] overseas people have probably more to [17:54] tell than if we're all based back in our [17:55] home towns [17:57] once i've built some rapport which takes [17:59] some time i've got a good understanding [18:01] it's not a good a better understanding [18:04] of [18:05] what they like what they don't like [18:06] what matters to them what's important [18:08] and and how they feel about the work [18:10] that they do right [18:12] once i've built that bit of rapport [18:14] it's and again in report i'm learning so [18:16] i'm asking questions i'm not really [18:18] talking right i'm trying to pay [18:20] attention yeah right [18:22] because i know i'm going to have to [18:24] speak at some point and i want to speak [18:26] at a time that my prospective client [18:28] wants me to speak [18:30] right [18:30] i've earned the right to speak yes [18:32] because i need to share some information [18:35] but if i meet them for the first time [18:36] and i just have a doubt but then [18:38] they're not going to be listening to me [18:40] but if they've done 15 minutes of [18:41] talking and telling me stuff then [18:43] naturally people want to learn a little [18:45] bit about you because of that and again [18:47] this is my process and you can you can [18:48] tell me how right that's a process and [18:50] then after that i then could explain a [18:52] bit about what i do and then my job then [18:54] is to learn some more and identify [18:56] through that learning experience the [18:58] areas that that potential client might [19:00] have a problem a weakness an issue a [19:02] challenging situation that they need to [19:05] resolve [19:06] once i find out what that is my job's [19:08] then to make that issue essentially [19:10] bigger so that they want to do something [19:11] about it right that makes sense to you [19:13] yeah yeah okay [19:16] when it and i look at that [19:18] as taking somebody on a path [19:21] but i'm i'm trying to learn at the very [19:23] outset is this person a driver what are [19:25] they amiable you know are they [19:27] expressive are they analytical because i [19:29] know for sure i'm not an analytical and [19:31] when i find an analytical i have to [19:33] change my game completely very [19:35] consciously [19:36] because i know they're going to require [19:38] things that are different from the [19:39] amiable guy the immune guy is going to [19:41] get on with me no matter what and it's [19:43] almost dangerous that he will get on [19:45] with me because it puts me into a full [19:46] sense of security from a from a business [19:50] perspective [19:51] and then i've got the driver guy that [19:53] i haven't got time for your small talk [19:55] mate you know i need to buy this i need [19:57] to sort this out we need to get to this [19:58] point so can we just go there [20:01] so in everything i do i kind of i use [20:03] this process that i learned 25 30 years [20:06] ago [20:07] to infiltrate every part of what i do in [20:09] business right [20:10] when you go in and coach companies [20:13] it doesn't matter what the industry is [20:14] that they're in when you go and coach [20:16] them [20:17] is that is your process being taught [20:20] that way [20:21] well first of all it's really [20:22] interesting the way you broke that down [20:23] because um [20:26] we break the world down into the same [20:28] three types we got different names for [20:29] them you called them amiable analytical [20:31] and driver amy bannon driving expensive [20:33] yet okay all right so we got four types [20:36] which is uh close to something that's [20:38] been around for about 30 40 years we [20:40] call it three we call fight flight make [20:41] friends [20:42] accommodator analytic assertive [20:46] uh you're you threw in the expressive [20:48] which may or may not be a combination of [20:50] a couple of those two maybe [20:52] but very almost exactly the same thing [20:54] that we that we've broken it down to we [20:56] got it from [20:57] thomas killman conflict mode which [21:00] breaks world in five when i went to [21:02] harvard they knocked two out broke it [21:04] down to three [21:06] we took what they were thinking and made [21:08] some tweaks but again three types [21:11] and it's our you know you would probably [21:13] speculate the world breaks up evenly [21:15] into those four [21:17] we've found reason to believe that the [21:18] world [21:19] breaks up evenly into hour three [21:22] regardless same same basic ideas [21:25] now we don't dial into that right away [21:28] but we look forward for [21:30] misunderstandings or if there's an [21:31] impasse it's going to be a tight [21:33] mismatch [21:34] or there are certain things that are [21:36] absolutely guaranteed misunderstandings [21:39] like one of them is going dead silent [21:42] you know with the [21:43] with the amiable the friendship oriented [21:45] the interaction-oriented type they're [21:47] horrified over silence [21:49] because [21:50] to them [21:51] the currency [21:53] is the interaction [21:55] and to go silent is to withhold the [21:57] currency [21:58] which is [21:59] the um [22:01] the harshest thing they could do i [22:03] withhold my most valuable currency from [22:05] you [22:06] the sign of treatment [22:07] now the analytic [22:10] love silence [22:11] because they give think [22:13] so you get an amiable across from an [22:15] analytic or an analytic across from an [22:16] accommodator or or term [22:19] like the uh the analytical guy has gone [22:21] dead silent and is grateful for it [22:23] because he wants to think [22:25] and he's thinking thank god the other [22:27] person finally shut up because i i want [22:29] to think [22:30] and the other the the accommodator the [22:33] the angry bull is going like oh my god [22:34] oh my god he's he's not talking he must [22:36] be furious oh my god what do i do i got [22:38] to speak up you know it's a comedy [22:42] so [22:43] we we teach people that it's type [22:45] mismatch now we want to dial in on that [22:48] fairly earlier [22:49] and we we got a little bit of a hack [22:51] which is similar because you said ken [22:53] said to you what makes you cool yeah [22:56] and then you went on a quick journey of [22:58] your life [23:00] and he got a really interesting story [23:02] out of you [23:03] in about 90 seconds [23:05] instead of 15 minutes that you were [23:07] talking about [23:08] and the mirror asking the question what [23:10] makes you cool i mean it lit you up [23:12] it created an instantaneous state change [23:14] in you tony robbins you said you know [23:16] he's had as a guest he always talks [23:18] about state change yes [23:19] so similar thing that we do is at a [23:22] cocktail party [23:23] i could ask you where you're from [23:25] and i'm going to get stuff out of you [23:27] about where you're from that you've [23:28] never told anyone [23:30] like i was at a party and hollywood [23:32] party [23:33] and this producer had no idea who this [23:35] dude was everybody was falling all over [23:37] themselves [23:38] you know to walk up to him and genuflect [23:40] in front of him you know stroke him [23:42] flatter him [23:43] i finally talked to him we i talked to [23:45] him longer anybody else did [23:46] when he got done he was like wow i [23:48] haven't told anybody that stuff in 20 [23:50] years [23:52] all based on where you're from or [23:55] i can look at you and i go [23:57] what about what you do [23:59] makes you passionate [24:02] and i didn't ask you what you did [24:04] because a lot of people are leery of [24:06] that [24:07] but i i caused a state change to trigger [24:10] your passion [24:12] and it'll light you up very much the [24:14] same way that the ken's question what [24:16] about what is it about you what makes [24:18] you cool yeah [24:20] and then you get into passion i and i [24:22] watch people instantaneously [24:25] change [24:26] and then they start unloading core [24:29] values to me which is also what you were [24:32] just talking about yeah i want to know [24:33] what's important to this person how they [24:35] tick do i want to do business with them [24:38] are they going to want to do business [24:39] with me [24:41] do our core values align how do i [24:43] proceed [24:44] uh we um we do eos entrepreneurial [24:47] operating system coached by this really [24:49] smart guy named jonathan smith first [24:51] meeting he says all right we're gonna [24:53] outline our core values [24:55] i'm like [24:57] what are you that's stupid work hard be [24:59] honest what else is there to say [25:01] he goes no no no it's more [25:03] complicated than that and then [25:05] ultimately [25:07] every relationship you have business or [25:09] personal [25:11] will work because your core values align [25:14] or if there's a core value mismatch it [25:15] won't work [25:17] and then also [25:20] if it doesn't work you don't say well [25:22] you're a jerk i'm a jerk you just say [25:25] look our core values didn't line up [25:27] you know that's cool [25:29] we got it we got a value mismatch you're [25:31] entitled to your values [25:34] but it's not going to work out long time [25:36] so you'll go be happier doing business [25:38] with somebody other than me that's [25:39] really what we're trying to dial into i [25:42] find this interesting because a lot of [25:43] people feel like they need to do [25:44] business with everybody and if they [25:46] don't do business with everybody they're [25:47] failed right and [25:50] and that's a big drama you know whether [25:52] that from be the powers that be above [25:53] them or with their own business it's [25:55] kind of like yeah it didn't happen and [25:57] and i believe that you know [25:59] you shouldn't be doing business with [26:01] everybody because everyone is aligned to [26:03] you right [26:04] talk to me about non-verbal [26:05] communication because i think non-verbal [26:07] communication plays a big part i i spend [26:09] a lot of time when i meet people trying [26:11] to understand them [26:13] when they don't speak [26:15] so i i'll check that person out in a [26:18] room before i'll talk to them yeah oh [26:20] good yeah you know and if they're in the [26:22] corner on their phone not wanting to [26:24] engage with people that's something that [26:25] i'm very aware of um [26:28] i can identify the the arrogant [26:29] obnoxious [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] pretty quickly um and [26:32] that makes me not want to [26:34] you know step forward and engage with [26:36] them because you know i i've [26:38] automatically titled them and sometimes [26:40] this is wrong by the way i've [26:41] automatically given them a title in my [26:43] mind you know he's a bit arrogant isn't [26:45] he so i've been judged that situation [26:48] but i find that people talk [26:50] and share an awful lot when they don't [26:52] say anything right [26:54] and this this stuff you can utilize that [26:57] can be to your advantage [26:59] now years ago when you were doing [27:01] hostage negotiation i would gather a lot [27:03] of that would be on the phone hold [27:05] yes you're not getting that human [27:07] interaction apart from [27:08] the silences on the phone and the words [27:10] they would use well if all that data [27:12] goes into tone of voice and you start to [27:14] dial in almost all of it is right there [27:16] so [27:18] you then go from that situation [27:22] to [27:23] being in front of people [27:26] telephone to face to face [27:29] to now which is more digital than ever [27:31] before [27:32] which is where emails [27:35] text messages become part of the [27:37] negotiating process right the reason i'm [27:39] saying this is somebody came to me the [27:41] other day [27:42] about two months ago and they said can [27:44] you teach me to sell on whatsapp [27:46] wow [27:47] and i was like excuse me yeah yeah and [27:50] then i thought hold on a minute they're [27:52] clearly [27:53] communicating with their clients [27:56] through whatsapp [27:57] they want to know how to close a deal [27:59] that way [28:00] well [28:01] that's where my kind of my skill set run [28:03] out because i can teach them how to do [28:05] this face-to-face stuff [28:07] i can i can even teach to some degree on [28:09] zoom [28:10] but if i've only got messaging to use [28:13] that's a whole nother skill set is that [28:16] something that you've [28:18] got experience in and understand because [28:20] i know you mention emails you know how [28:22] people don't respond and do respond to [28:24] emails so i feel there's some synergy [28:26] with that [28:27] see the problem with that kind of a [28:28] question is [28:31] it's lazy and arrogant at the same time [28:35] they only want to communicate on [28:37] whatsapp [28:39] so they're not really interested in [28:40] learning any other way [28:42] they're not interested in coming out of [28:44] their comfort [28:46] so they want people to communicate with [28:48] to conform to them [28:50] first [28:52] now they may be saying well i talk to [28:53] people that they only want to talk on [28:54] whatsapp [28:57] anybody wants to confine themselves to a [28:59] certain type of communications because [29:01] they're sick of people not listening to [29:02] them if you if you will be paid attended [29:05] to if you will be paid attention to [29:07] you'll talk [29:09] people are sick of talking to people [29:11] that don't pay attention [29:12] if you if you're going to teach me that [29:14] you're not going to pay attention to me [29:16] then no i'm not going to talk to you [29:18] so human beings [29:20] are drawn to communication modes that [29:23] work [29:25] so if you're trying to confine it to one [29:27] mode [29:31] most likely you're being lazy [29:34] you know i'm good on whatsapp that's how [29:37] i want to communicate [29:39] well i don't know that you're good on [29:40] whatsapp to start with [29:42] but you've got to be able empathy is [29:44] about adapting to the other side period [29:46] yeah you know the whole gist of [29:48] everything [29:50] that the black swan method and tactical [29:52] empathy is based on empathy is about [29:54] adapting to the other side [29:56] like when i get questions about [29:58] cross-cultural communications does this [30:00] work [30:01] you're an american you know does this [30:03] work in china does it work [30:05] if you adapt to the other side you know [30:08] if you're willing to to take their cues [30:11] and show them that you're paying [30:12] attention to them [30:14] there isn't a human being on earth [30:17] you know you could be up in the [30:18] antarctic somebody pay attention to you [30:20] you'd be happy to talk to him [30:22] yeah man [30:24] i'm asked this question i'm so glad you [30:26] just said that i'm asked a question how [30:27] do you sell to indians [30:29] how do you how do you sell to the to the [30:31] chinese how do yourself [30:33] and and i'm like [30:34] they're all human beings yeah they're [30:36] just people yeah but you know we the [30:39] real estate industry is huge here okay [30:41] so [30:42] and it's gone up in value like crazy [30:43] over recent time so [30:45] they're running ads online and people [30:47] are saying how much is that one bed [30:48] apartment in the marina or whatever and [30:50] they're getting an inquiry a digital [30:52] inquiry and i'm like pick the phone up [30:54] and call them and tell them [30:56] yeah no but yeah i tried to call him but [30:58] he doesn't want to speak on the phone he [30:59] just wants me to text message the the [31:00] the price back and i might we'll still [31:03] call him yeah you know think about what [31:06] you can say to him call him up say [31:08] there's no way in the world i can tell [31:09] you this by text i need to talk to you [31:11] because it's valuable to you you know [31:12] engage in the conversation yeah i know [31:14] but you know i'm from eastern europe and [31:16] it's really hard to sell to somebody [31:18] from england because they've just got a [31:19] different approach to us [31:21] and i'm like [31:23] and metacoving was the guy that that [31:26] said something really profound to me [31:27] metta coven is the guy that [31:29] spent 69 million dollars buying the nf [31:32] the first nft auction in april of last [31:34] year this year [31:36] and i sat talking to him and i'm like [31:38] you're from india you had nothing [31:40] you learned to code on somebody else's [31:42] laptop with a usb stick [31:45] and yeah you're a billionaire [31:47] i'm like how do you see yourself [31:49] differently he said i don't i spend all [31:51] of my time trying to focus on how i'm [31:52] the same as other people or how i'm [31:54] similar because we're far more similar [31:55] than we allow ourselves to believe right [31:57] and it really has he said it really kind [31:59] of just sat there with me for a minute [32:01] because we talk about differences [32:04] as opposed to the same and i think that [32:06] like with religion i'm like what's [32:07] religion all about it kind of teaches [32:09] the same things to everyone doesn't it [32:11] you know what does everyone want to be [32:13] good good human good to others kind to [32:15] others they want their kids to grow up [32:16] and be well educated and be kind to [32:19] others they teach them hard work and [32:21] good moral values well every religion [32:23] teaches exactly the same thing which [32:25] means we're all reading a book whether [32:27] it's the bible or the quran or whatever [32:29] it is and actually [32:31] the same stuff's in there anyway be a [32:32] good be a good human being you know [32:35] and so i look at that and i'm like well [32:37] that's that's be a good human being so [32:38] if we're all coming from different [32:39] religions but we're all reading a book [32:41] that kind of says the same kind of stuff [32:45] then surely there's a lot more about us [32:47] that's similar to what's different right [32:49] exactly you know i i you know [32:52] brits brits don't understand american [32:54] sense of humor [32:57] and we don't we know that brits [32:59] struggled to live in america [33:01] they struggled to live in america and [33:04] and again it's it's well documented that [33:06] they struggle to live in america i'm [33:07] like you struggle to live in america but [33:09] your favorite comedy show is friends or [33:10] seinfeld [33:12] that's an interesting thought yeah yeah [33:14] you know you laugh your face off [33:15] watching american comedy movies you know [33:18] and [33:19] anchorman or talladega knights are your [33:21] favorite movies you know you know you're [33:23] consuming that but you're conscious [33:25] about how we're different why don't you [33:26] focus on how we're similar yeah exactly [33:29] and so for me when we deal with you know [33:32] negotiation it's it's it's all about [33:34] trying to find out what's similar about [33:36] us right [33:38] i'm so glad that you said what you said [33:40] because it's being on the same page [33:41] really matters to me [33:43] and how we're wired emotionally similar [33:45] yeah and everybody has the same [33:47] emotional wiring it does it makes no [33:49] difference [33:50] well we all start with the same basic [33:52] emotional wiring [33:54] and then the rest of it is sort of [33:55] layered on top of that but if you get [33:57] back down how we're similar [33:59] people want to be understood [34:01] and that it brings [34:03] opportunities to you [34:06] and so why not strongly understand [34:08] period [34:10] yeah [34:11] have you had some examples over time [34:14] where you've got it [34:15] hopelessly wrong [34:18] well because you've written this book [34:20] you're like really well known as being a [34:22] master negotiator like that the world [34:24] over blacks one everyone knows i mean it [34:26] took me a year to get you on a bloody [34:27] show so i know you're in high demand [34:29] and so and so you you've clearly had a [34:32] huge amount of success but [34:34] there's been some times i'm sure that [34:36] you've had some howlers and you're like [34:37] what yeah yeah yeah can you give me some [34:40] examples well the first time i showed up [34:42] in the philippines to work at kidnapping [34:43] there you know was a muslim terrorist [34:46] you know there were terrorist group that [34:48] said that they were muslim you can get [34:49] into the whole all the definitions yeah [34:52] which is a complete waste of time [34:55] but um i had worked a lot of [34:58] uh [34:59] terrorist case by people who claim to be [35:01] muslims and or and probably were in new [35:04] york but they were all arabs [35:07] and so i rolled out of new york thinking [35:09] i understood [35:10] um people who were driven by to commit [35:13] crime based on [35:14] islamic [35:15] concepts [35:17] and [35:18] what they say politics are local right [35:21] so we first roll into the philippines [35:24] and uh these guys are muslims in the [35:25] south you know let me let me use the [35:27] same sort of phraseology that worked on [35:29] on the guys that were from the middle [35:31] east [35:32] and you know i remember hitting [35:34] uh you know through the negotiator i was [35:37] coaching [35:38] hitting him with stuff that i knew the [35:40] guys in the middle east just resonated [35:41] with and he would just like shake it off [35:44] you know like it it sort of rang a [35:46] distant bell because theoretically he [35:48] studied the same book [35:50] but they didn't study it anywhere near [35:52] the greek to the degree like the [35:54] the arabs did like the arabs [35:57] you know quoting the koran as a sport [35:59] you know the way americans quote [36:01] baseball stats [36:03] or westerners quotes any sports [36:06] yeah you know the arabs i mean [36:09] you sit down and talk to them you better [36:11] know what you're talking about [36:12] you know but half these guys in the [36:14] south you know they just adopted it as [36:16] an excuse for bad behavior south of the [36:18] philippines [36:20] so i'm hitting them with stuff that i [36:22] knew from the koran and they were just [36:24] like i don't know no where's my money [36:26] [Laughter] [36:28] so it took me a while to catch on and [36:30] then i began to find out that their [36:32] culture [36:33] they were from a daring war-like culture [36:36] you know a whole different take and they [36:38] prided themselves on having been an [36:40] insurgency [36:41] for well over 500 years [36:44] you know the koran came in much later in [36:47] in their cultural [36:49] in their local [36:50] politics [36:51] so that's again why i went like i gotta [36:53] adjust to how they see it [36:55] and if i bring a set of assumptions from [36:57] another place chances are they're not [36:59] gonna fit here [37:00] and we ended up um you know riding the [37:03] ship so to speak but it took us a few [37:04] months [37:06] was it um [37:09] in that time did you do you think you [37:11] didn't know what you were doing or [37:13] you think you're out of your depth or [37:17] well because if it's worked before and [37:19] then all of a sudden it's not working [37:20] you must have been scratching your head [37:21] going well you know yeah scratching my [37:23] head but i've never been smart enough to [37:25] know when i've been out of my depth [37:26] which has been a lot [37:27] [Laughter] [37:30] and so [37:32] as you progress through your career [37:34] building this business that you've got [37:36] is it is it is it a scalable business [37:38] that you've got is it something that you [37:40] can continue to grow and grow or is it [37:42] really hard to find people to be really [37:44] good teachers of negotiation it's [37:47] scalable we're working on specifically [37:49] designing uh [37:51] you know deciding [37:52] what the attributes are the people in a [37:55] different job right see right person [37:57] right seat you know right get it wanted [37:58] needed do they get it do they want it [38:01] uh do they have the capacity to do it is [38:04] one of our rules from entrepreneurial [38:06] operating system [38:07] they might [38:08] have the capacity but they don't want to [38:10] do it [38:11] you know i got a lot of former hostage [38:12] negotiators have the capacity just don't [38:14] feel like doing it [38:16] or they don't uh need it or [38:19] you know any one of a number of reasons [38:21] so finding somebody [38:23] that [38:24] has the capacity and wants it another [38:27] thing that's really hard is [38:29] it reminds me of [38:30] the movie the matrix when they're waking [38:32] people up [38:33] and uh um you know uh um morpheus says [38:36] to neo you know we can't we have trouble [38:38] waking people up after a certain age [38:40] because they can't adapt [38:42] like we're we're [38:44] taking hostage negotiators they got 20 [38:46] 30 years of experience and we want them [38:47] to rethink everything that they learned [38:50] and [38:51] that they haven't been caught off guard [38:54] in a long time and they are not used to [38:57] that [38:58] and understanding that that skill set is [39:00] just just with a little bit of tweak it [39:03] fits right in because it's human nature [39:06] and so we wait when we wake them up it [39:08] takes a little bit too and finding [39:10] somebody's willing to be woken up [39:12] which industry industries typically [39:14] contact you to do business with you [39:16] which industries are like you're kind of [39:18] like your top three or four well we've [39:20] probably done more in the [39:22] healthcare space [39:24] than anywhere else some of that may have [39:26] been [39:27] that's been such a turmoil in the united [39:29] states with all the changes in health [39:31] care for the last [39:33] 10 years or so [39:34] that they're a little more willing to [39:36] look from the outside [39:37] we're looking for help from the outside [39:39] but [39:40] we really don't focus on industries we [39:42] focus on top performers [39:44] what we refer to as one percent [39:47] those are the people we go after and you [39:49] could be doing anything you could be in [39:50] real estate you could be mergers and [39:53] acquisition you could be [39:54] an attorney but if you're into learning [39:58] and then if you're into learning you're [40:01] going to end up in the top one percent [40:04] and it's not just learning by doing [40:06] but it's people that seek out somebody [40:09] that could teach them because they want [40:10] to accelerate their learning curve [40:12] if you're into learning [40:15] and you could be doing anything you [40:17] could be a car salesman [40:19] it doesn't matter [40:20] we're after what we refer to [40:23] as the one percent which are really [40:25] people that are into learning [40:27] they like making the world a better [40:28] place they like making a very good [40:30] living [40:31] but that's not what drives them because [40:34] whatever they're doing is eminently [40:35] satisfying and they want to get better [40:37] at it and it has this great residue [40:39] where people are actually helped [40:43] i was at a reception in phoenix [40:47] six months ago [40:48] the owner of a private jet company is [40:50] opening up a place in phoenix [40:53] through this big [40:54] reception you know for the high-end [40:56] buyer at a hangar [40:58] both the owner of the jet company and [41:01] his top salesman had both read never [41:03] split the difference [41:05] and his top salesman and they're talking [41:07] with me about this in front of me [41:11] the top salesman used my skills to [41:13] negotiate his compensation package with [41:15] his boss who is standing right there [41:18] and they're both good with it [41:22] love that that's exactly what you want [41:24] when both parties [41:27] use the skills [41:28] and they're both good with it [41:30] there's this they're respecting it [41:33] it's a skill [41:34] they're really respecting it's a skill [41:36] rather than being played yeah exactly [41:38] yeah and then they didn't get played [41:41] yeah they both ended up in a better [41:42] place i think there's [41:44] for me that a lot of the time there'll [41:46] be [41:47] some form of negotiation where there's a [41:49] winner and a loser [41:50] and to me that's not a negotiation to me [41:53] the best outcome is everybody wins [41:55] because if everybody wins everybody [41:57] walks away happy and they'll and they [41:59] want to do it again yeah and if you [42:00] could if you can create that in your [42:02] business [42:03] with everybody you do business with in [42:05] in whichever capacity that is that's a [42:08] really nice life to live [42:10] you know just as a human being that's a [42:12] nice life to live you know i [42:13] i'll give an example [42:15] it's like um i i coach some people in [42:17] the financial services industry in the [42:19] uk [42:20] okay and i coach them in [42:22] life insurance for example and i'm like [42:25] the better job you do for somebody [42:28] the more money you will earn we agree [42:30] that yeah but the better job you do for [42:32] somebody the better off they will be [42:35] how beautiful is that [42:36] you can earn the most amount of money by [42:39] doing the very best thing for them [42:43] get your head around that [42:45] and you're into a world of absolute joy [42:48] from going to work every day yeah yeah [42:49] yeah exactly because you create you see [42:51] so this is like it's like you create [42:53] that ultimate win-win [42:55] and i said i see you know there's [42:57] different types of sales and and i think [42:59] that the insurance is one it's kind of [43:01] like a fear-based sale a lot of the time [43:03] interesting yeah you know so if you [43:05] don't have life insurance and you die [43:06] then your family are much you know you [43:08] know [43:09] they really are who's going to pay the [43:10] mortgage if you die and all that kind of [43:12] stuff uh who what have they got to live [43:14] on your wife's got three kids and she's [43:15] trying to bring them up and you're no [43:16] longer here or because you didn't get it [43:19] and so [43:20] for me like life insurance and critical [43:22] illness insurance these things are [43:23] necessary but the reason most people [43:25] don't have them [43:26] is that the people selling them [43:28] are doing the police sir would you like [43:30] to buy some insurance sale [43:33] rather than thinking about the [43:34] consequences of that particular buyer [43:36] if they don't buy [43:39] you know and i say if it was your [43:41] brother or your sister or your mum and [43:42] your dad would you talk to them that way [43:45] they're like well no and i'm like well [43:46] why wouldn't you talk to them the same [43:48] way [43:49] if your mum or your dad was doing [43:50] something stupid would you tell them [43:52] yeah yeah [43:54] i would [43:55] so when it comes to your client if [43:57] they're doing something stupid [44:00] surely the outcome for them is a bad [44:02] outcome right right so why not give them [44:04] something that gives them a great [44:05] outcome right at the end of the day it's [44:07] a little bit of money [44:09] but that security goes there and so [44:12] when it comes to negotiation it's always [44:14] for me it's always that kind of have [44:15] that process in your mind you know [44:17] everyone wins if everyone wins you know [44:19] and whether you're negotiating for stuff [44:21] that was you know [44:22] way above my my category but being a [44:24] hostage negotiator and stuff but in [44:26] business give everyone a win-win [44:29] if you can make that happen then [44:30] everyone leaves happy yeah and and they [44:33] want to do it again [44:34] ah the other thing yeah do it again do [44:36] it again how long have you been how long [44:38] have you been doing it as a business [44:40] teaching [44:41] after you left the for the police [44:44] well we uh theoretically er [44:48] and technically like i left i left the [44:49] fbi in 2007 okay and incorporated the [44:53] business i you know i was in school at [44:55] the time but i incorporated the business [44:57] three months later so i you know i went [44:59] back and i did some more schooling and [45:01] as soon as i got out [45:03] we tried my son and i uh started to try [45:06] to [45:06] you know let people know about the idea [45:08] before the book came out that really [45:10] started in 2008 but it we didn't really [45:13] we couldn't get any traction until the [45:14] book came out in 2016. [45:17] so you kind of plodded away into because [45:19] you weren't you weren't a businessman [45:20] were you at the end of the day you no [45:22] you hadn't you didn't have that [45:23] background [45:24] and in 2016 the book came out and then [45:26] all of a sudden people were like oh yeah [45:28] this is interesting [45:30] yes it started it started to gather [45:32] steam [45:33] i mean um it it you know [45:36] we just got more and more traction [45:38] then our marketing got better [45:41] um it was principally my son and i we [45:43] another guy who now is full-time [45:44] coaching with us derek was helping some [45:47] but we weren't generating enough income [45:49] to keep keep us afloat and then my [45:52] daughter-in-law came in and took over [45:54] the marketing for us and a lot of our [45:55] organization my son and i are not [45:57] particularly organized you know we [45:59] continued to build the team out [46:01] and [46:02] we continued just to con get more [46:04] traction and we worked hard and we [46:07] learned [46:08] and we just [46:10] you know the book is phenomenal [46:11] marketing device [46:13] but it's not enough by itself [46:15] and we just we've been learning ever [46:17] since and then [46:19] then we really took off [46:22] in terms of building capacity and [46:24] handling demand when we switched to the [46:26] operating system the business operating [46:28] system which is the os i had no idea [46:31] what a difference that was going to make [46:32] to have an actual [46:34] operating system like anybody that's in [46:37] a company [46:38] if they haven't got an actual system [46:40] that's been designed and there are other [46:41] versions of this [46:43] eos isn't the only one but [46:45] you are not doing as well as you could [46:47] do without a specific system that [46:49] somebody designed [46:51] and just because you made it up as you [46:53] went [46:54] maybe yours is pretty good but you're [46:56] missing pieces [46:58] and we're at the point now where if [47:00] we're leery of partnering up with [47:02] anybody that's not run in the os [47:06] and if we do [47:07] any sort of [47:09] now we're looking to make deals where [47:10] i'm not gonna [47:12] coach you for money i'm [47:13] gonna coach you for equity and you have [47:15] to put eos into your business [47:18] i do not want a piece of anybody's [47:20] business that's not running eos [47:23] or a similar system that smile [47:27] because we you know it makes you [47:30] uh nassim nicholas tala wrote a book [47:32] called anti-fragile an operating system [47:34] makes you anti-fragile when the [47:37] started [47:39] like everybody else like it [47:42] night fell fast [47:44] you know it was march-ish [47:47] we went from [47:48] you know it's the flu to shut down in [47:51] like three weeks [47:53] ninety percent of our revenue stream [47:54] shut off i mean just turn the faucet off [47:59] and because of us [48:01] we pivoted online [48:03] we set back up in a month and a half [48:06] and we had a profitable year we didn't [48:09] make as much as we made the year before [48:11] but you shut off 90 of your revenue and [48:13] you stand up on new operation [48:16] in [48:17] 60 days [48:19] you only do that if you got a system and [48:21] we had a system it works a treat [48:24] thank you so much for coming to take [48:26] some time to talk to us today i'm so [48:27] glad it's taken me a year and it's been [48:29] worth the wait and uh [48:31] yeah i hope the rest of your time here [48:32] in dubai is a good one but for people if [48:34] they want to businesses they want to [48:36] engage with you do they just go to your [48:38] website or look the best way is just go [48:40] straight to the website and we got we [48:41] got a ton of free material on a website [48:43] i mean a lot [48:45] so wherever you are start with free [48:47] stuff [48:48] and it's it's usable it's like the book [48:50] it's actionable [48:52] you can use it yeah and for all of you [48:54] that are watching this right now i think [48:55] it's really important you know go and [48:57] grab a copy of the book or get it on [48:58] audible and listen to it that that's how [49:00] i learned from it it's added value to me [49:02] and a lot of you know my background [49:04] anyway so [49:05] have that desire to learn desire to grow [49:08] he's the master at this for goodness [49:10] sake you know you can go wrong with it [49:12] chris thank you so much for coming on [49:13] the show i really appreciate your time [49:15] thank you the man christmas is in the [49:17] house [49:20] [Music] [49:22] look if you're enjoying this on youtube [49:24] you can click in get more episodes just [49:26] like this one or subscribe over there go [49:28] and subscribe and you can get every [49:30] single piece of content we make as and [49:32] when we make it coming straight to you [49:33] i'll see you on the next episode

===FILE=== QMuSkU2Byso - How to Get the Upper Hand in ANY Take it Or Leave it Deal.txt
https://youtu.be/QMuSkU2Byso
How to Get the Upper Hand in ANY Take it Or Leave it Deal!

[0:00] how to get the upper hand in any take it [0:03] or leave it offer a take it or leave it [0:05] offer signals a great deal of insecurity [0:09] on the part of the other side if they [0:12] weren't afraid to negotiate they [0:15] would they're either afraid they might [0:17] give in too much or they're under some [0:20] external pressure that's got them [0:24] spooked this gives you opportunity to [0:28] influence and though the other side side [0:30] may not see it overtly any demand they [0:32] make is a test of you as both a [0:36] potential business [0:37] partner and an ambassador on their [0:40] behalf after all if you can't stand up [0:42] for yourself politely how could you ever [0:45] stand up for [0:47] that the dominating emotion in nearly [0:50] all business negotiations is [0:53] fear it shows itself in many different [0:56] forms concern being the most common [0:59] discuss [1:01] yet what is concern really other than [1:05] fear your job is to gently cast yourself [1:09] as being [1:10] respectful not a pushover and capable of [1:14] looking out for the long-term interest [1:16] of both [1:18] sides these things increase your value [1:21] long term which is your real overall [1:24] goal here are four powerful tools for [1:28] handling take it or leave it [1:31] offers number one the no oriented [1:35] question [1:36] opener ask is it disrespectful if I ask [1:41] to clarify a few [1:42] points this is a no oriented question [1:46] people are much more comfortable saying [1:48] the word no than they are saying [1:53] yes the pavlovian response you remember [1:56] pav Lo's dog that salivated every time [2:00] heard the bell ring the pavlovian [2:03] response is saying the word no is [2:06] protection and [2:08] safety when you say no you feel you've [2:12] protected [2:14] yourself since yes saying yes is most [2:18] often a trap to [2:20] people they're often very leer of [2:24] saying again it's a pavlovian [2:27] response you'll be stunned that what [2:30] people are willing to say no to in the [2:34] unlikely event the answer is yes well [2:37] then you just learned a great deal about [2:40] your potential future partner which [2:42] makes you [2:44] smarter number two Mirror [2:48] Mirror select which points you want to [2:51] test for movement and simply mirror them [2:54] the definition of a mirror from the [2:56] methodology in my book never split the [2:58] difference is repeating a selected one [3:01] to three words or the last one to three [3:04] words of what someone has [3:07] said a brilliant client of ours and a [3:10] great [3:11] friend always mirrors each of the other [3:14] side's [3:16] positions any expansion of the points on [3:19] their positions indicates [3:23] flexibility always go silent after a [3:26] mirror let it sink in count thousands to [3:30] yourself if you have [3:32] to they'll respond before you get to [3:37] 101,000 number three the gentle [3:41] differential [3:43] label the next thing you want to do is [3:46] use a [3:47] label it sounds like there's no movement [3:51] on any of these [3:53] points tone of voice is critical [3:57] differential gentle [4:00] and an upward inflection at the [4:03] end this isn't an accusation but an [4:06] inquiry again say it like [4:09] this it sounds like there's no movement [4:13] on any of these [4:16] points again say it like [4:19] this it sounds like there's no movement [4:23] on any of these [4:26] points you could even tilt your head to [4:28] the side when you say it helps with the [4:30] upward [4:32] inflection now go silent and wait for [4:36] them to answer it's critical you let [4:38] them [4:40] respond the label Act is a very gentle [4:43] form of a question that doesn't make [4:46] people feel [4:49] questioned you want their comfort level [4:51] high here so they're happy to continue [4:55] to [4:56] talk then to make sure that you thir [5:00] clarified their response use a [5:02] mirror this is a great tool to get [5:04] someone to expand on what they've just [5:08] articulated while at the same time [5:11] feeling completely in control they don't [5:13] feel [5:14] challenged number four if all else fails [5:17] generosity this is another [5:19] label if all else [5:22] fails you want to use a label you've [5:25] been very [5:26] generous it looks like there's nothing [5:28] more here you could do [5:31] notice that downward inflected at the [5:34] end if there's anything at all left that [5:37] they can do here's where they will look [5:40] to find it for you generosity is a trait [5:43] people love to be even when they seem [5:46] the [5:48] opposite using this label brings it out [5:50] in them it's also a great way to finish [5:53] the interaction is the only thing more [5:55] important than how an interaction begins [5:58] is How It Ends [6:00] the last impression is a lasting [6:02] impression here's some more words to [6:05] live by never be mean to someone who can [6:08] hurt you by doing nothing it's pretty [6:11] much a universal truth that everyone you [6:12] deal with can probably hurt you in some [6:15] fashion by in action if you can accept [6:18] that that's true then the opposite is [6:20] also [6:21] true pretty much everyone you deal with [6:23] can help you if they just feel like it [6:26] your overall goal in the interaction is [6:28] to be respectful differential and [6:30] pleasant to deal with so that when the [6:33] final decisions come as to what small [6:36] thing if anything they can do to help [6:37] you they will do [6:39] it all right to sum up number one the no [6:42] oriented question opener number two [6:45] Mirror Mirror number three the gentle [6:48] differential label and number four if [6:50] all else fails [6:54] generosity Make It Rain

===FILE=== R38m5g_-W4M - How to listen between the lines to turn Adversaries into Partners.txt
https://youtu.be/R38m5g_-W4M
How to listen between the lines to turn Adversaries into Partners

[0:00] that's and that's what that that story I [0:02] just talked about you know you break it [0:04] down listening was the most important [0:06] part of that story I heard her banging [0:09] the keys I don't made more work for her [0:14] I heard her [0:16] sigh I was listening for that when I [0:19] heard that I recognized [0:21] that she was not happy with [0:25] me because I was adding more work on her [0:28] plate when I hit her with the [0:30] accusations audit and I brought a little [0:31] humor into it it diffused the negatives [0:34] that she was thinking it calmed her down [0:36] her amigdala stopped being as fired up [0:39] and then she stopped looking at me as a [0:41] problem but she looked started looking [0:43] at me as an opportunity to do something [0:45] good for somebody and she did and then [0:48] she felt good about it and when I [0:50] acknowledged it and gave her some [0:52] positive feedback about it it made her [0:54] Dave and more to where she didn't want [0:56] to get off of the phone right [0:58] away that little bit of an exchange made [1:00] that big of a difference and had I not [1:02] been listening and paying attention to [1:05] how she was hitting the keys the little [1:07] sigh I would have missed it and she [1:09] would have stayed in that in that same [1:11] mindset the whole way through and may [1:13] not have may have said well we just have [1:15] to re redo all these [1:18] flights instead of saying look I fixed [1:20] it for [1:23] you it's simply [1:26] this there is a there is a very basic [1:29] need with within us humans to be heard [1:31] and understood to be listened to and the [1:34] fact is no matter how much of this [1:37] training we give the bulk of the [1:39] population does not listen well and they [1:44] all the vast majority of the people that [1:47] you're going to meet on a day-to-day [1:48] basis in the business World in your [1:50] world in family wherever the vast [1:53] majority of people are not they do not [1:55] feel like people listen to them well [1:58] that's why they that's why they launch [2:00] off into their goals that's why they [2:02] launch off into trying to explain [2:04] because they feel like nobody listens to [2:06] them so they got to get it out quick and [2:07] get out in front of it before anybody [2:09] can stop them from talking and if you [2:11] take like what Troy did if you take [2:14] those few seconds to listen and listen [2:16] for the affect changes what he's talking [2:18] about she didn't speak anything in that [2:22] way she was sighing she he could hear [2:24] the loud Keys [2:26] tapping um you're listening for those [2:28] affect changes as well that's part of it [2:31] and when you do that the other side is [2:33] getting from you that which they are not [2:35] getting fulfillment with in any other [2:38] venue in their lives that is being [2:40] listened to and when you listen to [2:42] people their guard comes down their [2:45] shoulders come down their all their [2:48] defenses come down because you're doing [2:51] something for them that they desperately [2:52] need that they almost never get you know [2:56] Don I was just thinking about something [2:58] and everything you were saying was right [3:00] on point I was thinking about another [3:03] time that people don't really listen to [3:04] you if they don't think you're important [3:08] enough and it made me think about an [3:10] instance where we were at an [3:12] event [3:15] and one of the participants or people [3:17] there thought that I was somebody else [3:20] so they rushed over to speak and hey how [3:22] you doing and you know oh who are you [3:26] and I said my [3:27] name and when they said well what do you [3:30] do I said I work for the black swne [3:33] group in Chris Voss and that individual [3:35] turned to the other person on their left [3:37] and said oh he ain't [3:39] nobody so I found that to be very funny [3:43] because it you know by the end of the [3:45] night that individual was asking for [3:48] coaching but in the beginning I wasn't [3:50] anybody in in their in their eyes so [3:54] nothing I said [3:56] mattered that I'm so glad you said that [3:59] because at least once a week either at [4:02] an event or in a [4:04] coaching somebody asks me or asks one of [4:08] us what do you do when you're trying to [4:11] get to the decision maker and the [4:14] decision maker won't call you back the [4:15] decision maker won't talk to it's always [4:17] his you know executive assistant or it's [4:19] her uh her uh other person her assistant [4:23] that's her her receptionist just won't [4:25] let me through to talk to her she won't [4:27] return any of my calls I can't get and [4:29] what they're doing is they're completely [4:31] ignoring that gatekeeper they're comp [4:34] because again not important enough right [4:35] they want the decision maker well let me [4:37] tell you who the shot caller is because [4:40] that executive assistance that keeps you [4:42] away from the boss that is that is [4:45] helping them with all their time that [4:47] person has probably more influence than [4:50] anybody you'll ever meet and so listen [4:53] to them well just like you'd listen to [4:57] the decision maker because that's who [4:59] not only is going to get you to that [5:00] decision maker but if you make them feel [5:02] important by listening to them they're [5:05] going to have influence very often in [5:07] the decision they're going to come to [5:08] that decision maker and they're going to [5:10] say so- and so has been trying to call [5:12] he wants to sign this contract or [5:14] whatever and um you know he's he seems [5:17] good to me he's I he's been really nice [5:20] on the phone and blah blah blah blah [5:21] blah and Troy Troy let me sit in early [5:24] in my Black Swan uh Journey on a [5:27] coaching client and [5:30] um he was in a very competitive business [5:33] they met um after weather events they [5:36] met with all these potential clients and [5:38] they would just hand out business cards [5:39] over and over and over it was it was [5:41] just bulk quantity over quality and he [5:44] started using the Black Swan skills so [5:46] when he would go in and hand the card to [5:49] the front desk person whoever it was [5:52] he'd use some Black Swan skills and talk [5:54] to them and listen to them a little bit [5:56] a year later in one case this guy calls [6:00] him and says hey I want to use you to do [6:02] this this and this and he he did a proof [6:05] of life and he's you know why would you [6:08] uh why would you call me back out of all [6:09] the business cards that you guys get and [6:12] he said oh I've only got one business [6:15] card my my uh receptionist threw all the [6:17] rest of them away she kept your card for [6:19] some reason over a year later and it [6:23] turns out that the receptionist that he [6:26] had treated well was the owner's mother [6:29] and she worked for the company and that [6:33] little few minutes of conversation where [6:35] he took her seriously and he listen to [6:37] her well she dumped every other business [6:41] card that they got from the same she [6:43] didn't know anything else about the guy [6:45] she knew about his business card and [6:47] that he made her feel valued because he [6:50] listened to her and a year later no [6:54] advertisements no revisits that's who [6:57] that's who got the job so I remember [7:00] that yeah yeah and I know we're we're [7:02] running up against time but Chris put in [7:05] the chat um how might an ego label work [7:07] with that person amazing because you're [7:11] you're s you're at you're showing that [7:13] you recognize the significance they have [7:16] in the business in the transaction in [7:19] the negotiation whatever it is um it [7:21] seems like you're the only person that [7:25] uh I can trust to get this message [7:27] across or it seems like you're the only [7:29] only person that puts in work around [7:31] here you can do a little fun little [7:32] label but a little bit of an ego label [7:35] it it goes It goes Miles when you [7:38] recognize them because they don't get [7:40] recognized the hundred people in before [7:42] you ask to ask for time with the other [7:45] person asked for um you know a call back [7:48] or wanted to leave a business card or [7:50] wanted to do an email and never even [7:54] considered that the person that they [7:56] were talking to was a real person and [7:58] like Troy said [8:00] the executive or the the leader whoever [8:03] it is they got enough going on if [8:05] they're if they're executive assistant [8:08] if their gatekeeper comes to them and [8:10] says out of everybody we've talked to [8:13] everybody you've seen this is the person [8:15] that seems to be no BS this is the [8:18] person that and you may not have said [8:21] any of that you just listen to them for [8:23] a while they might not know anything but [8:24] your first name but they're going to [8:26] have a good feeling about you and and [8:28] the executive [8:30] they don't want any more work they don't [8:31] want any more decisions if that person [8:32] trusts them and they trust that person [8:35] they're good with that decision so [8:38] listen well [8:40] [Music]

===FILE=== SvOio6YabIY - Use this Secret To Ask for Something and INCREASE Sales.txt
https://youtu.be/SvOio6YabIY
Use this Secret To Ask for Something and INCREASE Sales!

[0:00] so it's about 10:30 in the morning I'm [0:02] sitting down at my desk getting ready to [0:03] pay a medical bill for about [0:06] $3,300 and I'm thinking you know what [0:09] I'm feeling kind of happy I'm in a [0:11] playful mood let me see if I can get a [0:13] discount on this baby now 10% discounts [0:16] are a full usually if you call somebody [0:19] up on the phone and make a reasonable [0:21] case and if the bill feels a little [0:23] older than I gu probably over 30 days [0:25] old might even be 60 days old they'll [0:29] probably open a 10% discount as long as [0:31] I'm not a complete jerk about this you [0:34] know the rule is never be mean to [0:36] someone who can hurt you by doing [0:38] nothing so the flip side of that is they [0:41] like you they could probably do a lot [0:43] for it so I figured yeah $3,300 bill by [0:47] spending half an hour on a phone 10% [0:49] discount qu about $600 an hour so yeah [0:53] I'm better work for $600 an hour so I [0:56] decided to go ahead and Di these people [0:58] up see what they have to say so I follow [1:00] them Mon and of for I get their phone [1:03] tree BR this number for that this number [1:06] for that this number for that and [1:09] finally if yours money press this number [1:13] it didn't say that exactly that's pretty [1:16] much what it [1:17] meant so I press that number and it [1:19] rings through and the young lady on the [1:21] other end of the phone says hello which [1:24] isn't even high how can I help you [1:26] nothing at all this is straightforward [1:29] hello [1:30] so I'm thinking all right so this is a [1:32] little bit of a tough cookie but I'm in [1:34] a playful mood so I think the heck with [1:36] it let's have fun with this and I say I [1:40] owe you money in a very playful kind of [1:43] fun self-facing way you [1:46] know in a I admit I'm guilty sort of [1:50] playful and fun tone of voice she [1:53] hesitates for a second and she says you [1:56] got an identification number I go yeah [1:59] she looks at up She Goes go oh yes you [2:01] do and she's getting a little playful [2:04] not herself and I go look I need to pay [2:06] you guys before you come to my house and [2:09] drag me out of my house and she starts [2:11] to laugh she says yeah we will do that [2:15] and I say if I pay the whole thing now [2:18] what kind of a discount can I get she [2:20] says let me check again you know her H [2:24] voicey is she's working with me she's [2:26] she's not fighting me so I hear talking [2:30] a little bit away from the phone and [2:32] then I hear $700 in the background so I [2:35] think all right awesome I was hoping for [2:37] 10% it sounds like it's going to be 20% [2:40] kind of hold my breath she comes back on [2:42] the line she says 700 [2:45] off now I'm [2:47] shocked I'm like whoa I was looking for [2:50] 10% and this looks to be like 20% so [2:53] confirm I say $700 off she says no we'll [2:58] settle the whole thing for $7 [3:01] $0000 now I got to tell you I am Gob [3:04] smacked by this response I can't pay [3:07] this baby fast enough really kind to her [3:10] on the phone I tell her I appreciate it [3:13] I give her my credit card number and we [3:15] settle that thing on the spot she sends [3:18] me an email invoice showing the whole [3:20] amount has been paid now let's dig into [3:22] this a little bit as to why this worked [3:24] out and it's why it was my advantage the [3:27] two things I'd like to point out that [3:29] were critic elements of why this [3:31] works number one I was in a playful mood [3:36] you're 31% smarter if you're in a [3:39] positive frame of mind being positive [3:41] and playful makes you more depth makes [3:44] you quicker to understand makes it [3:46] easier for you to say the right things [3:48] in the [3:49] moment now being playful the empathy [3:52] that I need to tap into comes from me [3:55] asking myself what do these people [3:57] thinking in their head what is a voice [4:00] in their heads saying to them about me [4:01] or the [4:03] situation if I call in and I get the [4:05] collections people which are not the [4:07] customer service people completely a [4:09] different animal they get no shortage of [4:12] complaints attacks arguments [4:16] excuses the person on the other side of [4:18] this call is heard at all she's thinking [4:21] you owe us money so I'm hitting her with [4:25] what are probably the exact words that [4:27] she's saying in her head to counter any [4:29] sort of ARG argument I might come up [4:30] with on a debt she's thinking that I [4:33] knowly entered into this because I [4:35] agreed to receive medical [4:37] service so I'm going to say what's on [4:39] her mind what she would say about me [4:42] even against [4:43] me and I'm going to put it in a really [4:46] playful mood so that I'm not making [4:48] excuses my tone of voice is not [4:51] indicating to her that I'm whining [4:53] complaining excusing or attacking in any [4:56] way shape or form I'm being playful [4:59] about this [5:00] this is self effacing humor this is [5:04] tactical empathy at its best you're in a [5:07] playful mood your tone of voice is [5:09] landing properly your words are landing [5:13] next Green Light [5:16] time what's green [5:19] light green light is a law enforcement [5:21] ter that tells a SWAT thing when it's [5:24] okay for the sniper to pull the trigger [5:26] well green light is also when it's okay [5:28] for you to make your [5:31] for you to pull the [5:32] trigger now what's the optimum time to [5:35] create green light [5:37] moments well in point of fact it's midm [5:40] morning usually 10ish in the morning [5:43] depending upon your day that's probably [5:45] when you at your [5:46] sharpest and I happen to have all this [5:49] occur to me to do at about 10:30 in the [5:52] morning I've still got a lot of mental [5:55] gas in the tank I'm fully caffeinated I [5:58] haven't been burned turned out by the [6:00] day I'm naturally more inclined to be in [6:03] a good [6:03] mood now as it turns out the other [6:07] person I'm calling on the other end of [6:09] the phone is in the same time zone and [6:11] as it turns out there's a pretty good [6:13] chance this person is in green light [6:16] time also when she hasn't been worn out [6:19] by the day most likely it's not a [6:21] guarantee we're talking about things [6:23] that highly correlate with [6:27] success it's a pretty good chance that [6:29] the person on the other end of the phone [6:31] is in their Optimum receptive [6:33] collaborative time frame as well if I [6:36] come in with the right [6:37] approach now I get her on the phone and [6:41] it isn't High how may I help you it's [6:44] just a simple hello which tells me this [6:47] person is kind of TI dors calling in and [6:51] making excuses so when I hit her with a [6:54] positive tone of voice playful tone of [6:57] voice and she catches it in response she [7:01] comes back with yes you [7:03] do so now I'm on pretty firm ground and [7:06] I'm probably in a good position probably [7:08] finding myself in the midst of a green [7:11] light moment but I'm not stopping there [7:14] I got to create some more imagery in her [7:16] head I got to take any possible threat [7:18] on me seem to manifest out of her mind [7:21] and what in fact really happens with [7:23] debtors if it gets bad enough yeah they [7:25] send a sheriff to your house to take you [7:27] out of your house I need to go all the [7:30] way there and laugh about that [7:32] possibility with her so I say I gotta [7:36] pay this thing before you guys come and [7:38] drag me out of my [7:39] house if she's in debt collection she [7:43] probably has had it go to that and she [7:46] laughs about this with me yeah because [7:48] we will do that and we aligned laughing [7:52] together about the same [7:53] thing I'm not making any excuses and [7:56] I've got her in a playful tone of voice [7:58] also which is completely going to impact [8:01] when she turns around to whoever she [8:03] works for and pitches it is there tone [8:05] of voice going to say this guy's a jerk [8:07] and he's whining complaining on the [8:09] phone or is she going to be positive in [8:11] the approach to the person she works [8:14] for now last she throws a discount at me [8:18] that I cannot believe and I actually [8:21] give her an excuse for it to be a $700 [8:24] discount instead of $700 to settle the [8:27] whole [8:28] bill I go back there to confirm it [8:31] because I think it's 20% off in point of [8:34] fact it's basically 80% off which I [8:38] haven't realized yet and I say $700 off [8:43] and she says no [8:45] $700 to settle the whole [8:48] thing she's not looking to cut my throat [8:50] she's not looking to gain some Advantage [8:53] because of my [8:54] Approach my application is with empathy [8:58] and a playful tone of voice voice and we [9:01] settle [9:02] it so this is a combination of the [9:04] playful tone of voice and the advantages [9:07] it gives you plus how much better you [9:10] feel if you're in a playful mood [9:12] combined with is it green light time and [9:16] even if it's not can I create the green [9:20] light moments so that I have the [9:22] opportunity to pull a trigger and make [9:24] my ask can you create the green light [9:28] moments so that you had the opportunity [9:31] to pull the trigger and make your [9:33] ass and have it turn out the maximum way [9:37] it possibly can the best chance of [9:42] success create green light moments to [9:45] make your ask

===FILE=== XuMsG-PoIPE - Talk Like a Pro Master Labels Mirrors  Questions to Win Any Conversation.txt
https://youtu.be/XuMsG-PoIPE
Talk Like a Pro： Master Labels, Mirrors & Questions to Win Any Conversation!

[0:00] Is this crazy? You felt stuck in a [0:04] conversation like you're trying to [0:05] connect and it's just not clicking. What [0:08] if I told you there are three simple [0:10] tools that can make you a communications [0:13] ninja? Whether you're talking to your [0:16] partner, your boss, or a barista, [0:20] today we're breaking down labels, [0:21] mirrors, and nooriented questions, three [0:23] ridiculously powerful techniques that [0:26] can transform everyday interactions. [0:28] Let's dive in. Let's start with [0:31] mirroring. It's like a Jedi mind trick. [0:34] It's simpler. It's just repeating the [0:37] last few words of what the other person [0:39] said or a selected few words. One to [0:43] threeish. Could be one, no more than [0:46] five. With a slight upward tone like a [0:50] question [0:52] like this. [1:03] Next up, labels. Labels are when you [1:07] identify or guesstimate what someone [1:10] might be feeling and say it out loud. [1:13] Not in a cheesy way, but in a way that [1:16] makes people feel seen. Labels help [1:19] diffuse tension, validate emotions, and [1:22] show empathy. You don't even need to be [1:25] right. People will correct you and feel [1:29] good about that and that's a helpful [1:32] tool. Start your labels with [1:35] it seems like and then finish it off or [1:41] it sounds like or even it looks like. [1:46] Try it in your next conversation. It's [1:48] seriously [1:50] a superpower. [1:52] Now, let's talk no oriented questions. [1:56] What in God's name is a no-oriented [1:58] question? It's a question that doesn't [2:01] lead a person to a yes, but you're kind [2:04] of fishing for a no. When people say no, [2:08] it makes them feel comfortable, safe, [2:10] protected. [2:12] So, instead of do you agree, try do you [2:17] disagree? [2:19] Is this a good idea [2:21] or is this a ridiculous idea? And boom, [2:25] a whole door opens up. Use what and how [2:28] questions to dig deep without sounding [2:32] pushy. Avoid why. It can sound [2:36] accusatory. [2:38] Instead of why' you do that, try [2:42] what led you to do that. Now, here's the [2:45] magic. Use all three together. Imagine [2:49] this everyday conversation flow. [3:03] That's how you build connection. Real [3:05] talk, not small talk. And you didn't [3:08] give advice, fix anything, or hijack the [3:11] subject. You just listened with tools. [3:16] Whether you're navigating tricky [3:17] conversations or just want to deepen [3:20] your daily chats, these tools, mirrors, [3:23] labels, and no-oriented questions will [3:25] level you up. Try one today. Seriously, [3:29] just one. See how many people respond. [3:32] Then come back and tell me how it went [3:35] in the comments.

===FILE=== ZqXiJlBfmO4 - Top FBI Negotiator The Art Of Negotiating To Get ANYTHING You Want  Chris Voss.txt
https://youtu.be/ZqXiJlBfmO4
Top FBI Negotiator： The Art Of Negotiating To Get ANYTHING You Want ｜ Chris Voss

[0:00] my goal is for you to tell me something [0:01] that you've never told anybody else I'll [0:03] get that out of here really fast I'll [0:05] get you telling me stuff early well [0:07] David at about 830 this morning four [0:09] people at least two believed to be armed [0:11] attempted to hold up the Chase Manhattan [0:13] Branch this is Chris my name is Chris [0:16] Joe's gone now and I'm going to be [0:18] talking to you now we want to get back [0:20] to uh talking about resolving this thing [0:22] we agree that we're going to get [0:23] everybody out safely okay listen right [0:25] now you and I are going to work on that [0:26] together and we're going to work this [0:28] out when when the time comes for you to [0:31] come out you need to walk out the front [0:33] door very slowly with your hands up you [0:37] going to come out now today's episode I [0:39] sit down with one of the world's leading [0:41] experts in negotiation I'm looking at [0:44] this bundle of stuff mostly built around [0:47] fear fear of loss is the number one [0:50] dominant decisionmaking influence in our [0:53] thinking fear of loss of identity fear [0:55] of loss of opportunity fear of loss of [0:58] membership in the tribe but your fears [1:00] and my fears are going to be very [1:01] different so I got to dial into you and [1:03] find out what yours are he spent 24 [1:05] years in the FBI negotiating with [1:07] terrorists and in this interview we [1:09] break down all things when it comes to [1:11] analyzing people and what it takes to [1:14] become a masterful negotiator your first [1:16] name is is a precious commodity your [1:18] first name is often weaponized against [1:20] you we find ways to make the bad guys [1:23] use the name of the hostage because we [1:25] knew it increase their survivability [1:27] it's harder for the bad guys to harm a [1:29] hostage once they know their name and if [1:31] you stick around to the end we did a [1:32] live role play where he's negotiating to [1:34] me and I played as a bank robber having [1:37] people as captive and you can see how he [1:40] got me out of the bank I need a car in [1:42] 60 seconds or she [1:44] dies this interview is super freaking [1:47] cool and this is the second time we've [1:48] had this guy on the show so without [1:50] further Ado please help me and welcome [1:52] the bestselling author of never split [1:54] the difference Mr Chris [1:58] Voss all right Chris Voss welcome back [2:01] to the Dream Out Loud podcast round two [2:03] thanks for coming back on the show my [2:04] man I'm happy that we're back together [2:07] again it's cool I'm very very excited [2:09] for this conversation last time we had a [2:10] lot of fun so I want to take it a kind [2:12] of different approach this time and [2:14] before we do get started though you [2:15] spent 24 years in the FBI as a [2:18] negotiator you've got a lot of [2:20] experience there what can people really [2:22] expect from this interview like why [2:24] should they pay attention stop whatever [2:26] they're doing and listen or watch for [2:28] the next little while first of all I'm [2:30] I'm I'm a simple guy um I'm not I don't [2:34] got a super high IQ what I am is [2:37] coachable so if you're [2:39] coachable like these skills are you can [2:42] learn them they're not that hard and [2:45] proam inspired by it like there isn't a [2:47] single negotiation that I'm afraid of [2:49] being in like it doesn't matter what it [2:52] is so imagine what that's [2:55] like and I always like getting [2:58] better so I mean if you're nervous about [3:01] negotiations imagine what it's like to [3:03] not ever be nervous about any [3:04] negotiation 2 millimeter shifts make it [3:06] really simple one of the things we [3:08] talked about you know when I walked in a [3:10] door I'm not adversarial the adversar is [3:13] a situation like you might be [3:15] adversarial you might think we're in [3:18] combat but I if I don't comply we're not [3:21] in combat we can make a great deal so I [3:24] mean if you if you want to just really [3:27] enjoy negotiation now there some people [3:29] out already that they're like I'm [3:31] already a great negotiator I love to [3:34] negotiate well if that's your thought [3:38] process I bet I could teach you some [3:41] stuff that could raise your skill level [3:42] to the next your skills to the next [3:45] level so I I've been found I've learned [3:48] from Great [3:50] negotiators and The Black Swan method we [3:52] haven't run across to anybody we can't [3:54] help get better now what what it takes [3:56] for you to get better it's generally one [3:59] of [4:00] Falls in one of three [4:01] categories it's not the same thing for [4:04] everybody but whoever you are out there [4:05] listening you know we're going to touch [4:07] on them all I love it and negotiation is [4:10] in every area of life as well right like [4:12] even if like we were talking right [4:13] before we got started here on how to [4:15] negotiate my way to get a late checkout [4:17] Hotel here in Vegas sweet upgrade I'm [4:19] sure he probably use it for I'm flying [4:21] tonight to Mexico actually I'm already [4:22] flying first class so but I check in [4:25] some Mexico huh yeah you may need [4:26] negotiations to get out of Mexico [4:30] um so you could be there much longer [4:32] than you anticipate I got to share some [4:34] things off record give you room and [4:35] board when that happens but the rooms [4:37] aren't good and the food isn't good [4:39] either yeah so so the the point is [4:42] though like for negotiation is in [4:44] everything so for the people that I [4:45] might be thinking and be like oh why why [4:46] would I listen negotiating like [4:48] everything is a deal we're doing deals [4:50] we're selling it's negotiation selling [4:52] its influence and correct yeah um uh [4:56] never be never be mean to somebody could [4:58] hurt you by doing nothing so anybody [5:01] that you interact with you're at looking [5:03] for their cooperation their [5:05] collaboration anybody you're talking to [5:07] if they simply say I can't help you that [5:09] was a [5:11] negotiation come on it's always at stake [5:13] in negotiations it's [5:15] time you're trying to get somebody's [5:18] help you're trying to get somebody to [5:20] give you late checkout you know and and [5:22] do they have do they have it in their [5:25] inventory and like if they don't have it [5:27] in the inventory like what what else can [5:29] it do for you you know you want to be [5:31] able to make an ask so that if you think [5:33] of something else you can make that ask [5:36] you know is it at one time I'm looking [5:38] for a sweet upgrade they didn't have any [5:41] and just off the top of my head I go is [5:44] is it a ridiculous idea for you to make [5:45] it up to me at the bar and guy's like no [5:49] no G gives me all these free drink [5:51] tickets now think about the absurdity of [5:54] that question yeah I'm asking him make [5:57] it up to me [5:59] like somehow he failed by not giving me [6:03] something for [6:04] nothing and that's when you look in a [6:07] collabration and see how the other [6:09] person's seeing it like it's in [6:11] everything it's in everything asking [6:13] directions that's a [6:15] negotiation anytime I want or I need is [6:18] in your head you're in a negotiation [6:21] sales is trying to get I want or I need [6:22] in somebody's head the moment it's there [6:24] you're in a negotiation what's the most [6:26] important thing we need to know when it [6:28] comes to being a [6:31] negotiation [6:33] um [6:35] probably the more likable you [6:38] are the more successful you're going to [6:41] be now there's a big difference between [6:43] needing to be [6:45] liked and being likable what's the [6:48] difference I got no control whether or [6:50] not you like me you know there could be [6:53] a whole bunch of stuff going on in your [6:54] head that I'm just never going to [6:57] overcome I just need to sharpen my eye [7:00] by being [7:01] likable so if you're likable to begin [7:04] with are you know are you Pleasant are [7:06] you do you smile I'm sitting with a guy [7:11] yesterday at [7:13] lunch [7:15] and he he doesn't say he's a great [7:18] negotiator his colleague says he is all [7:20] right so that's pretty good reference [7:22] he's not saying it about himself so I'm [7:24] thinking let me drill down on this a [7:26] little bit and I'm all right so you know [7:28] what is it about about you it's great [7:31] what makes you great and he started [7:33] getting into basically he never wants to [7:36] hurt you he wants a long-term [7:38] relationship he wants to uh have great [7:42] interaction he wants you to [7:45] feel liked by him so intention has a [7:51] smile the his counterparts all know that [7:54] his heart's in the right place based on [7:55] his approach and he exudes it so if if [7:59] if if your heart's in the right place [8:01] you don't want to hurt people you want [8:03] to you want them to have something that [8:05] they could genuinely help them I [8:06] remember hearing Mark Cuban once saying [8:09] uh sales is helping well if your intent [8:12] is to help then it's going to it's going [8:14] to bleed into everything that you do and [8:16] so that's the first thing a lot of [8:18] people don't realize like if you see it [8:20] as adversarial and I think we're win [8:23] lose and I think giving into you is [8:25] going to make me lose I'm going be [8:27] defensive I'm going to see you as a [8:28] threat it's going to be hard for me to [8:30] maintain the intent that I want to help [8:32] somebody who's a threat to me so it's it [8:35] kind of starts with your demeanor from [8:36] the very beginning what what what are [8:38] you trying to get out of this what are [8:40] some things that we might do consciously [8:42] or unconsciously to be more likable or [8:44] unlikable like I know like when I get [8:47] into a conversation with somebody if I'm [8:48] meeting somebody I'm instantly looking [8:50] for how can I build rapport quickly [8:52] build rapport find Common Ground I want [8:54] to connect cuz I I do like I prefer to [8:56] like people than to not like people so [8:58] when I meet someone I'm always is [8:59] looking for like where are they from [9:01] where like have I got any interest and [9:02] and I think that's very a very [9:04] unconscious competent thing I do now [9:06] when I when I just connect and meet [9:07] people but what are some like am I on [9:09] the right track with that are we looking [9:11] to build rapport quickly to be likable [9:12] or is are we doing things that we may [9:14] not be aware of that we might become off [9:17] we might come off as more unlikable or [9:21] okay so first of all there's a lot of [9:22] really cool stuff in there let let let [9:24] me break down different pieces finding [9:26] common ground are you weaponizing common [9:29] ground [9:29] no your intent for using common ground [9:32] is to connect M like your intent from [9:34] the very beginning is you're trying to [9:35] connect that's a whole different ball of [9:38] wax from people who uh want to weaponize [9:42] Common Ground you know where you from um [9:45] I get I get an approach a couple years [9:47] ago I make I uh guy says to me you know [9:51] I'm a country boy like you I'm not a [9:53] country boy I'm a small town guy from [9:57] Iowa and I say that constantly [10:00] you know small town guy from Iowa Mount [10:01] Pleasant Iowa Richard and Joyce Voss my [10:04] parents Blue Collar [10:06] upbringing he comes back at me in an [10:08] email says yeah I'm a country boy like [10:10] you I'm I'm from Michigan I'm a country [10:12] boy like you I like you know that's a [10:14] lie you weren't listening and you're [10:16] trying to weaponize Common [10:19] Ground [10:20] and does the opposite like what's his [10:25] intent and a lot of people try to [10:27] weaponize Common Ground [10:30] you know let let me let me let me get [10:31] you to drop your guard because I'm going [10:32] to pretend we're like and then I'm going [10:35] to try to hustle you I'm going I'm going [10:36] to bambooz with you you know famous line [10:39] from uh [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] Le's movie um but your [10:43] intent is to [10:45] connect so intention as a smell that's a [10:49] great way to start off with like as a [10:52] general [10:53] rule the real idea of common ground is [10:56] so that we understand each other [10:58] theoretically if we have common [11:00] background and the strongest aspects of [11:03] Common Ground are geography geography [11:06] and time [11:08] usually more than anything else like uh [11:11] small town in Iowa I grew up in I look [11:14] back on it now you know we had a whole [11:15] variety of [11:17] ethnicities but we're all from Iowa you [11:20] a small town and blue collar Place Shar [11:23] a common core values based on our [11:26] geography so you know I look back Roger [11:28] was mixed race didn't know it rich was [11:31] Hispanic didn't know it Dennis Norwegian [11:34] didn't know it David was Jewish didn't [11:37] know it because we were all we had that [11:39] GE geography common ground that has a [11:42] lot of [11:44] limitations I'm going to just show you [11:47] that I understand right off the bat you [11:49] know I'm I'm going to start digging in [11:51] where you from to to as insights to you [11:56] I find where people are from to be [11:58] fascinating cuz I you know you know I [11:59] want to know what made you tick you know [12:02] how do you think about this stuff Alo [12:04] you're looking for where they're from to [12:06] sort of gather information on potential [12:08] motives and who they are and you know [12:10] and then if I if I start digging into [12:13] where you're from and I'm actually [12:15] listening and I'm looking I'm looking [12:17] for Clues with you to deeper areas my [12:20] goal is for you to tell me something [12:22] that you've never told anybody else or [12:25] for you to tell me something that [12:27] normally somebody [12:29] most of the people around you don't [12:32] know and or that it's you don't let [12:36] people know that till you've known for a [12:37] long time like I get that out of you [12:39] really fast I get you telling me stuff [12:41] early and do you think one of the things [12:43] you do CU you're you're very I know one [12:48] of the things in negotiation and [12:50] influence is to actually speak less the [12:52] more you the the more you speak in a [12:54] conversation the more you feel like you [12:55] need to keep feeling space and you do [12:57] that very well because you you say very [12:59] few words you walk in you're like hi I'm [13:02] like hey man like how are you good I'm [13:06] like [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] like do you think that's one [13:09] of the things like or is that is that [13:10] just naturally how you are or have you [13:12] developed that is that have you learned [13:14] that as a skill to be like if you talk [13:16] less it creates more space for people to [13:18] potentially say things they shouldn't be [13:20] saying no I think it's 100% [13:22] learned Daniel Cole wrote a book called [13:25] um the Talent [13:27] Code about how people people learn mhm [13:31] and um pretty much his contention is [13:33] that everything is learned and I'm I'm [13:36] pretty close to that uh you know some [13:39] people might be born with some [13:43] innate music skill you know possibly is [13:47] a famous uh record producer produced [13:51] like everything I'll think of his name [13:53] eventually but the the story he tells is [13:56] somebody bumped the piano key when he [13:57] was three years old and he and he told [14:00] him what note it was all right so he was [14:01] probably gifted with something but the [14:04] vast majority of it has learned we're [14:05] all pretty much a blank slate so yeah um [14:09] I've never been a super [14:12] loquacious person none of the people [14:15] that I learned [14:17] from taught me that they got stuff by [14:19] talking people into it my dad wasn't a [14:23] big talker successful blueco collar [14:26] guy so nobody in my formative years I [14:29] didn't see success based on baffling [14:32] people with [14:34] BS and then if if you're coachable and [14:37] you're really looking at success you [14:39] know baffling someone with BS is short [14:42] term it's it's high [14:46] maintenance like I want to I want to [14:48] have as much influence as I can have [14:50] with you with a minimal amount of effort [14:52] because I got a limited amount of [14:54] energy we all have [14:56] finite um decisions we can make making a [14:59] given day so I want mine to count as [15:02] much as possible so having gotten more [15:05] success by saying [15:07] less and the great negotiators that I [15:11] learned from of all less is more you [15:15] know the whole thing you everybody's got [15:16] their mom's voice in their head you [15:17] should listen twice as much as you speak [15:20] it's actually more like five to one [15:22] because you got to pull in information [15:24] with your eyes with your ears with your [15:25] mouth again I I'll refer to uh the [15:29] a lunch I had yesterday with some really [15:31] influential people I was I was lucky to [15:34] be at the table with [15:36] them food [15:39] came I'm done eating well they're not a [15:42] third of the way into their [15:43] food and one of the guys says well you [15:46] didn't like that it's all gone I'm like [15:48] dude I'm [15:50] listening you're busy [15:53] talking you know I can listen and eat [15:55] because I'm not using my mouth to take [15:57] my brain offline to make a point I'm I'm [16:01] listening to everything you guys are [16:02] saying and you guys are doing all the [16:04] talking and you haven't touched your [16:05] food so yeah I listen a [16:09] lot I want to talk about so one of the [16:12] things one of the biggest negotiations [16:14] you did was the terrorist negotiation [16:17] these people held up a bank in New York [16:20] how a while ago you can I forget how how [16:22] many years ago last century last century [16:24] a while ago right but um you know so [16:27] these guys they've gone into a robber [16:28] Bank bank which doesn't happen very [16:30] often and then they call you and you're [16:34] the guy on the phone talking to the bank [16:36] robbers inside they have hostages and [16:38] you've got to somehow convince them that [16:40] it's a better idea for them to come out [16:42] and talk to the police I want to really [16:45] break this down but the first thing I [16:46] want to understand [16:48] is how is what's happening in your head [16:50] what's happening in your your your body [16:52] your nervous system cuz I would imagine [16:54] if I picked up that phone and I know [16:56] I've got these people's lives in my [16:58] hands if I said the wrong thing they [17:00] could shoot someone my body is freaking [17:02] out so the first thing I want to know is [17:05] going into something like that how are [17:07] you like what are you telling yourself [17:08] how are you calming your body down so [17:10] you can actually think clearly and do [17:12] and say the right thing yeah well let's [17:13] break the setup down a little bit too [17:15] because how you get into anything is as [17:17] important as what you do when you're [17:20] there and so the setup is your uh [17:23] preparation in advance and the fact that [17:25] it was a team [17:26] effort all right so I wasn't called I [17:28] show [17:30] up and that can often be a big [17:32] difference like just show [17:35] up and don't be and then fall into [17:39] place like so I showed up with another [17:41] colleague uh you know we I'm I'm in the [17:44] office in the bureau Charlie budwin [17:46] buddy great guy comes up and says [17:48] there's a bank robbery with hostages in [17:50] Brooklyn let's go so we just went we [17:52] didn't get called now I had missed out [17:54] on a couple of previous [17:56] opportunities by not showing up [18:00] and afterwards when I approached the [18:03] person who was in charge of the [18:04] negotiation team she's like look show up [18:08] just show up show up and be willing to [18:10] do anything they want you to get coffee [18:13] go get coffee show up be a team [18:16] player don't show up and look to be the [18:18] primadana don't don't don't whine and [18:20] complain if you don't get to be the [18:22] first person on the phone so I showed up [18:26] and I'm a team player and so we start [18:29] falling into roles and nobody's we're [18:32] getting a briefing on the intel on the [18:33] inside nobody's writing their stuff down [18:35] on what we call situation boards big [18:38] pieces of paper you know big Note Paper [18:40] that a lot of times you're in a seminar [18:42] somebody's writing stuff on on terway [18:44] sheets of paper they look like that so I [18:47] look around I go like all right so let [18:49] me start taking [18:50] notes I ain't trying to prove I'm there [18:52] by speaking up I'm paying attention so I [18:55] start taking [18:57] notes and uh and ypd Commander uh [19:00] Lieutenant McGowen starts dropping a [19:02] team into place we got a great [19:04] collaborative relationship he's most [19:06] experienced guy on on the scene he hands [19:09] the phone to one of his guys first [19:11] negotiator up and then since we're [19:13] collaborating and I've already shown [19:14] that I'm a team player he points to me [19:16] and goes You' be the coach cool I'm cool [19:19] I'm not I'm not I'm not kicking the [19:21] chairs because I can't FBI I should be [19:23] on a phone this a bank I'm playing [19:26] whatever role you ask me to play you [19:28] know what Chris Rock's got a routine [19:29] says sometimes you play a tambourine mhm [19:32] I'm there to play a tambourine if [19:34] necessary so we're uh we're about five [19:37] hours in I'm coaching as best I can me [19:41] and the primary not exactly on the same [19:43] sheet of music because our training and [19:44] our approach is different I'm I'm way [19:46] into crisis intervention so someone's [19:48] already sted in the negotiation yep the [19:50] uh primary negotiator first negotiator [19:53] was a detective from the PD guy named [19:54] Joe Joe was very talented dude [19:59] and so I'm sitting there listening I'm [20:01] coaching where I can I'm [20:03] absorbing and uh the uh Lieutenant [20:06] decides to swap negotiators looks at Joe [20:09] says you know Joe you're out Chris [20:10] you're in this is what I want you to do [20:13] I'm [20:14] coachable I've been a team player up to [20:17] that point I'm not [20:19] disruptive I follow his [20:22] guidelines now your your original [20:24] question was what did it feel like lives [20:28] possibly in your [20:30] hands if you lean into a process and [20:33] you're happy that the process works and [20:36] I'd been volunteering on a crisis [20:38] Highline for about two years at that [20:40] point in time I felt that my skill level [20:43] was sharp I'd been sitting there [20:45] listening I'm getting coached by a guy [20:48] who I believe is giving good coaching [20:50] you get lousy coaching from the wrong [20:51] guy I've gotten lousy coaching plenty of [20:53] times and I'm coachable so at that point [20:57] in time I'm ready to just lean lean into [20:59] a process I believe in I feel like I'm [21:01] part of a [21:02] team and I had a surrender about 90 [21:05] minutes [21:06] later so I want to break this down a [21:09] little bit and because I've heard the [21:13] tape Joe Joe's gone where is it going [21:17] this is Chris my name is Chris Joe's [21:20] gone now and I'm going to be talking to [21:22] you now we want to get back to uh [21:24] talking about resolving this thing yeah [21:27] we're sitting dog and trying to trying [21:30] to uh resolve you you're sitting down [21:33] and talking about it [21:36] inside who's talking about it everybody [21:40] okay I got to put on I come back hello [21:43] this is Chris who this okay hi who's [21:46] this tell me your name please I am okay [21:49] you're okay hello this is Chris hi Chris [21:52] all right is this Billy all right Billy [21:55] listen it it's very difficult for me to [21:56] speak to you when you keep putting me on [21:58] hold like that we need to keep talking [22:00] to each other so that we can resolve [22:02] this so we can get everybody out safely [22:04] guys the other guys are talking in they [22:06] trying to resolve something [22:08] [Applause] [22:10] okay I need to know what you what you're [22:12] thinking about in there I can't tell you [22:14] because nobody talking yet okay how is [22:16] everyone in there everyone's fine every [22:18] everybody's doing fine you put the uh [22:21] you put one of the ladies on the phone a [22:22] little bit ago what was that [22:25] for one of the ladies got on the phone a [22:28] little bit ago and said that she was [22:29] okay okay okay okay we agree that we're [22:32] going to get everybody out safely okay [22:34] listen all right now you and I are going [22:35] to work on that together and we're going [22:37] to work this out we're going to bring [22:39] everybody out safely all right Billy [22:41] okay let me talk to them and I come back [22:43] to you no no don't put me on hold now [22:45] Billy this is Chris again Hey listen I [22:49] got a a couple of questions I need to [22:50] ask you we've uh we've got a van out [22:53] here a blue and gray van um we've been [22:57] able to get handle on the owners of all [22:59] the vehicles out here except this one in [23:01] particular do you know anything about it [23:03] well are the vehicles not out there cuz [23:05] you guys Chase my driver away we chased [23:08] your driver away oh when he seen the [23:10] police he [23:11] cut okay we don't know anything about [23:14] this guy is he the one that was driving [23:16] the van oh um your driver you said we [23:19] chased your driver away was he driving [23:21] the van my driver is in front of the van [23:24] in front of the um the bank okay but is [23:27] this your van out here the balloon Gra [23:28] van we don't have one vehicle you have [23:30] more than one vehicle we only have one [23:33] vehicle um listen I've got a name that [23:36] this van is registered to it's [23:37] registered to a Chris wats okay is he [23:40] there is this you no is is he in there [23:43] with you I don't he's not one of us okay [23:46] you said okay you know who Chris want is [23:49] um you want to tell me about him what [23:52] are you talking about well Chris wants [23:54] the owner of this van is is he with you [23:57] do you know him [23:59] hello this is Chris who am I speaking to [24:02] please what I I'm having trouble hearing [24:04] you can you speak up a little bit please [24:06] let you talk to somebody okay right [24:08] let's talk a while about it okay we got [24:11] see if this is good you guys are talking [24:13] about coming out yeah okay plus you know [24:16] we got to talk about some some kind of [24:18] agreement here I mean as long as you [24:20] take keep your word we kept our word on [24:23] everything so far we've done everything [24:25] we said we're going to do we've kept the [24:27] whole situation safe [24:29] we still we got to talk about a vehicle [24:31] or something so we can turn ourself in [24:33] with no well the only way that we can [24:36] make sure that everybody is safe we know [24:38] how once you get us you know you're [24:41] going to change your mind but if you if [24:43] you [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] me up that's going to be a part [24:45] of it it it there isn't going to be any [24:47] problem every we showed you already How [24:49] concerned we are to make sure that [24:51] everybody including you stay safe know [24:53] you don't have to be nice to us you know [24:55] but at least keep you word okay we have [24:58] kept our word and we will be nice we'll [25:00] treat you like gentlemen okay so okay [25:04] what what's going to happen now after [25:06] you've let all the hostages out one at a [25:08] time nice and easy everybody stays safe [25:12] everything keeps under control we'll [25:14] talk about who's coming out one at a [25:16] time and we'll make sure that nobody [25:18] gets hurt we're going to do it slow and [25:20] easy and everybody's going to be fine [25:23] after all the hostages are brought out [25:25] then we'll talk about bringing you out [25:27] one at a time [25:28] we'll take it slow and easy everybody [25:31] will stay safe everybody will be treated [25:34] fairly I listen I promise you when you [25:36] I'm going to talk to I can't make that [25:38] decision by myself you can make the [25:40] decision for yourself can't you yes I [25:42] can you told me that you didn't even [25:43] want to be there that's true and then [25:45] you got caught up in this thing and I [25:47] thought I thought I was going somewhere [25:49] else between you and me all right it [25:50] wasn't your fault was it no I didn't [25:52] know this this is what was supposed to [25:54] be happening you really regret that this [25:56] happened don't you I regret that this [25:58] what it is I didn't know what it was you [26:00] know to this extent you know you wish [26:04] that this hadn't [26:05] happened I surely do well this is your [26:08] chance to get yourself out listen how [26:11] can I get out of this without I mean [26:12] it's not like I'm squealing or anything [26:14] but the girls will tell you you know [26:16] what I'm saying that treated them [26:18] they'll be Witnesses for [26:20] you you know how can that be once people [26:24] have have gone through a terrifying [26:26] experiment and nobody got hurt that's [26:29] the whole point nobody has gotten hurt [26:31] all the money is still here you're [26:33] exactly right all the money is still [26:35] there you those are even it might be [26:37] scattered a little bit hey that's just a [26:39] message somebody can clean up right feel [26:42] like ending it but I ain't got the guts [26:43] you know that's not the right thing to [26:45] do that's you're right the the the right [26:48] thing to do is for to resolve this so [26:51] that everybody's safe you making [26:53] progress with me you can tell the [26:55] captains you can tell the commissioner [26:57] you want to come out first you can tell [26:59] anybody that that uh do you want to come [27:01] out [27:03] first don't know how to do it though I [27:06] can personally guarantee that you will [27:08] be treated fairly and with dignity [27:10] you'll be safe and you can come out [27:12] first I'm saying coming out and then [27:16] facing you know what I ain't get if I [27:19] come out then that means that I got to [27:22] get something out of the deal you know I [27:24] I know you don't want to hear that word [27:26] I'll stand up for you but you can count [27:30] on me to stand up for you when when the [27:32] time comes for you to come out you need [27:35] to walk out the front door very slowly [27:38] with your hands up as soon as you come [27:41] out the door you need to start moving to [27:44] your right you you need to leave any [27:47] weapons that you may have have to stay [27:49] inside you got to come out unarmed so if [27:51] I about how we going how I'm going to [27:53] get the the rest of them out I mean you [27:56] know what we'll worry about them one of [27:57] the time right now I'm woring about you [28:00] you you going to come out now yeah I [28:03] want to end this [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] okay so the first [28:05] thing cuz obviously doing your [28:08] experience and I think stress [28:09] conditioning you'd probably get used to [28:10] being in situations of high pressure and [28:13] for the beginner person who might be out [28:16] you know they're asking for their first [28:17] deal or they're you know they're selling [28:19] their business they're doing something [28:21] and someone's a little bit more [28:22] experience perhaps or they're really [28:23] putting the heat on them and it can [28:25] really trigger last time we did a role [28:27] play which by the way can we do another [28:29] role play at the end of this episode why [28:31] of course let's do it okay so stay tuned [28:33] we'll see uh last time we did that I [28:36] felt my my body just went like [28:39] adrenaline up right away it was insane [28:42] how how fast it happened and all you did [28:44] you just put the pressure on me quick I [28:45] was like [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] wasn't expecting that so [28:48] have you got any tips or for someone to [28:50] be able to minimize that feeling in [28:52] their body to calm themselves down to [28:54] regulate themselves better so they can [28:56] think clearer well think about [28:57] negotiation is a human performance event [29:01] which also makes it sound like [29:03] performing in a sporting event so [29:06] there's a couple things there how do how [29:08] do you loosen up how do you warm up um [29:11] how do you prepare how do you practice [29:13] like pick any sport no athlete is ever [29:18] going to try a new technique for the [29:21] first time in a big game in a [29:23] championship game just not going to [29:24] happen not when the pressure's on you [29:27] know they're willing to practice they're [29:30] going to they're going to spend more [29:31] time in practice and preparation like [29:33] that you know there's some teams who [29:35] work so hard in practice the players [29:37] joke that game day is the easiest day of [29:40] the week CU they don't have to because [29:42] they work so hard getting ready my my [29:44] boxing coach used to tell me train hard [29:46] fight easy yeah our training was hard [29:49] and then fighting was quite simple yeah [29:52] yeah yeah I'm watching a clip one of the [29:55] great uh soccer SL football players [29:58] in the whole world the interview is [30:01] going like what's it take to be like you [30:02] and he goes I'll tell you but you're not [30:04] going to do it because I work that hard [30:07] here's my training but you want you you [30:10] you want to be the best you prepare you [30:12] don't you don't have to sacrifice your [30:14] whole life to becoming a better [30:17] negotiator but you you know you look at [30:20] little little opportunities through [30:21] throughout the day I'm I'm thinking [30:23] about it I interact with somebody you [30:26] know I think you are aware of our no [30:28] oriented questions where instead of [30:30] trying to get you say yes I I I ask you [30:32] to say no so I say to people is it a [30:35] ridiculous [30:36] idea all the time is is it a ridiculous [30:39] idea if you help me carry my boxes out [30:42] to my truck cuz they're [30:44] heavy [30:46] um I don't ask people how they [30:49] are I take a look at them and I'll do a [30:53] read [30:55] because I need to stay warm and need to [30:58] stay loose you know my negotiation [31:00] muscles need to stay warm I may be in a [31:03] negotiation in 10 minutes so instead of [31:05] saying how are you what are you what are [31:06] you saying I say you know looks like [31:09] it's a tough [31:10] day or looks like there been a lot of [31:13] idiots through here already [31:14] today [31:16] or seems like you're having a good [31:19] day with that tone of voice because I'm [31:22] practicing my tone of voice all the time [31:25] so the playful tone of voice is like [31:28] ridiculously powerful like you can get [31:31] away with Incredible ass if it just [31:33] starts with a playful tone of voice so [31:35] I'm practicing it all the [31:37] time I just came from the store where I [31:41] got a UPS post office box just an hour [31:46] ago and young lady recognizes me and she [31:49] comes up and and she's kind of on it and [31:52] so I go like seems like it's been a [31:53] pretty good day so far and I'm smiling [31:56] when I say that just a little bit [31:58] um and she feels connected because I [32:01] paid attention to her I'm I'm getting my [32:04] practice in all the time because I don't [32:05] know when I'm going to be in a high [32:07] stakes negotiation uh going through [32:10] airports I practice with TSA all the [32:13] time now you don't have to be accurate [32:15] you know TSA is usually pretty [32:17] overstressed you know it's a tough job [32:20] they don't get paid a lot I got a lot of [32:22] demanding unhappy people rolling through [32:24] the airport so I get through the TSA [32:27] line and I'm getting ready to pull my [32:29] bag and there's a guy standing there and [32:30] I realized you know I haven't practice [32:32] on [32:32] anybody so I look at him and one of my [32:35] favorites is tough day when you're [32:37] having a I could tell somebody stressed [32:40] now he doesn't look particularly [32:42] stressed and I go tough day and he just [32:45] kind of he kind of gets a confused look [32:47] on his face like my read was wrong and [32:50] it was and so I read that and I said [32:55] just another day and he goes yeah just [32:57] another day [32:58] today so 5 minutes later I'm in an [33:02] extremely important [33:04] negotiation I get a call from somebody [33:07] that I've been trying to get on the [33:09] phone and I closed the deal in very [33:12] short [33:13] order if I hadn't loosened up with the [33:16] TSA guys and had it already in my [33:20] brain to do a read and use my skills I [33:25] don't think I would have done that well [33:26] in that phone call I don't normally do [33:29] unplanned phone calls when I talk on the [33:33] phone I want you to get my complete [33:34] attention I'm not driving I'm not going [33:37] through the airport I want to be sitting [33:39] someplace where I can completely focus [33:41] on [33:42] you but I had no choice on this one [33:45] because this dude is just horrible to [33:46] returning calls and he's a good friend [33:48] and I love the hell out of him so I took [33:51] his call at a bad time but fortunately I [33:54] loosened up so I'm practicing all the [33:56] time [33:59] what would you say would was the pivotal [34:01] point if there was any when you did the [34:04] negotiation in the bank for the bank [34:05] robers the people that are listening to [34:07] the tapes [34:10] and was there anything like key would [34:12] would you say like when I said that like [34:14] that that when I knew it started to flip [34:16] and I started to kind of reel them out [34:18] was there something [34:19] specific that you could really sort of [34:21] put it down to yeah and I wasn't [34:23] responsible for it okay that's why you [34:26] know if you want to go fast go Alan you [34:28] want to go far go as a team don't ever [34:30] be in a high stakes negotiation by [34:32] yourself you need another set of ears [34:35] there are two the pivotal points were [34:37] first of all I got great coaching before [34:39] I got on the phone and I listened and I [34:41] followed the [34:42] guidance [34:44] secondly initially my my [34:48] voice works in my [34:51] favor and so the guy that I talked out [34:53] about 90 seconds into the conversation [34:55] with him he said I trust you [34:58] so we're working on this guy trying to [35:00] get hostages out of course that's what [35:04] we're there for we're supposed to get [35:05] hostages [35:07] out and somebody who was [35:10] listening his gut instinct told him that [35:13] this guy wanted to come [35:16] out and so I get a [35:21] note I don't find out for maybe two [35:25] years who I got the note from [35:28] he didn't I didn't see him I take notes [35:30] I'm coachable he waited till I was given [35:33] a presentation about two years [35:35] afterwards and he was waiting for me to [35:36] talk about that moment and he wanted to [35:38] see if I took credit for it and he [35:40] walked up to me afterwards he says you [35:42] know who gave you those notes I'm like [35:43] no I got I got no idea because it was me [35:46] it's a friend of mine anyway he gives me [35:48] the note says ask him to come [35:51] out and so I see I see this note and I'm [35:55] like all right [35:58] and I go [35:59] and how about you you want to come out [36:02] and he [36:03] says I don't know how I do [36:06] it now that is a great big giant yes [36:09] yeah that is give me implementation I am [36:12] out of [36:13] here and we continuing the negotiations [36:16] and I'm working on them and I'm coming [36:19] at it from a completely different [36:20] approach [36:22] now [36:24] and uh as a as a general I negotiate a [36:27] face to face face which is generally [36:28] against Bureau Pro policy NYPD does it [36:31] all the time PDS do it all the [36:33] time the bureau that is not that is not [36:36] on our list of accepted [36:37] protocols but I get another note it [36:41] says tell them you meet him [36:44] outside same guy gave me the first note [36:47] still don't know it at the time and it [36:48] looks to me and I go I go you want to [36:50] meet me outside he goes yeah I'm ready [36:52] to end this [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] and that was that was a [36:54] final deal so the pivotal moments came [36:57] from [36:57] [Music] [36:58] me not just listening to the bad guy but [37:02] listening to the people on my team who [37:04] had good [37:05] ears because there's just there's more [37:08] information coming off of you in a [37:10] negotiation than I can absorb by myself [37:12] even if I'm not [37:14] talking like what like what are you [37:16] looking for uh your tone of voice uh [37:19] your body language and your words and [37:21] I'm looking for alignment between the [37:23] three and I'm looking for the nuances [37:26] what people sort of of inaccurately [37:28] referred to as [37:29] tells now your tells are always [37:32] contextual and that's why we don't my [37:35] company we don't teach body language we [37:37] teach Conta [37:39] context like for example if you look [37:41] angry when you're talking to [37:44] me I might speculate that you're angry [37:48] and that speculation is was going to be [37:51] right about a third of the [37:52] time which is a good success rate [37:57] however [37:58] more often I'm going to be [37:59] wrong so you could be angry because you [38:03] got [38:04] gas that could be the look on your face [38:07] or I have what I refer to as the resting [38:10] serial killer face like what when I'm [38:13] listening intently to [38:15] you I look like I'm planning on chopping [38:18] you up and servering you with a glass of [38:21] wine and I scare people so but I'm [38:25] listening MH you know and I'm had people [38:28] freak out with the intensity of my [38:30] listening I'm what are you talking about [38:32] I'm really engaged in this conversation [38:34] yeah you're scaring the hell out of me [38:37] dude like what what do you what are you [38:39] fig you're going to serve me with a [38:40] potato salad or something I'm listening [38:44] yeah so you got to be careful reading [38:45] the body language you got to find out [38:48] you got to find out uh you know what the [38:50] context is and you use a negotiation [38:52] skill like if I'm looking at you like I [38:53] want to eat you for [38:56] breakfast you could say [38:58] like seems like you're planning on [39:01] serving me like a roasted turkey MH and [39:05] if you say it in a playful tone I'll be [39:07] like oh no man I'm sorry I'm sorry look [39:09] I just I'm listening and then you found [39:11] out yeah you found out what my listening [39:14] face looks like and that [39:17] probe that I use just now is what we [39:20] call a label you know in the Black Swan [39:22] method we call these labels my son and I [39:24] went back and forth a lot do we call [39:26] them probes do we call them PS cuz that [39:28] was effectively a [39:30] probe every word was very specifically [39:33] Chosen and I know it hits your brain in [39:36] a certain way as opposed to a [39:39] question or it's a it's a it's a finely [39:42] carefully worded [39:45] observation and I need an [39:48] answer and I need info and I need to get [39:50] it out of you in a way it doesn't make [39:51] you feel questioned so that's why I [39:54] don't ask you a question because you [39:55] don't want to feel questioned make an [39:57] assumption like it sounds like this [39:59] looks like I would call it uh B my son [40:03] once Brandon once pointed out [40:05] hypothesis yeah you are going to [40:08] generate a [40:09] hypothesis and you know he liked and I [40:12] like the word hypothesis because it [40:15] requires an experimental validation you [40:19] know people make assumptions they don't [40:20] test them you got a hypothesis oh let me [40:25] test this baby see how accurate it is m [40:28] what what's happening under the surface [40:29] on the human brain like what are we what [40:31] are we [40:32] deeply very unconsciously motivated [40:35] towards and away from like I know I know [40:39] we'll do a lot to gain significance I [40:41] know we've all got an ego that likes to [40:43] be talked to even if we're not aware [40:45] like even Mother Teresa had an ego um I [40:49] know [40:50] obviously it's important for us to be in [40:52] the tribe and be accepted so we're [40:55] fearful to ever be not accepted and [40:57] things like this I know these kind of [40:59] get people but from your perspective and [41:02] your training what are these things [41:04] really doing to people like the language [41:05] you use on that that terrorist guy the [41:08] the robber to get him to actually go I [41:10] want to come out I want to end it what's [41:12] really happening deeply like [41:14] unconsciously that's really motivating [41:16] people [41:17] emotionally um we're 75% [41:21] negative our survival mechanism the [41:24] natural human state is to be roughly 75% [41:29] negative the amydala the limic system [41:32] all the [41:33] overrides They you know they mapping it [41:35] out and and about 75% of the real estate [41:38] in there is dedicated to negative [41:41] thoughts this is wiring that we've been [41:43] inherited from 10,000 years ago we can't [41:46] change it it's [41:49] there because that was we was required [41:52] to be negative to survive when perils in [41:56] our environment would kill it [41:58] the negative stuff in our environment is [41:59] going to kill you if you survived one [42:01] negative uh interaction you you weren't [42:04] going to survive a second so we to [42:07] survive we were wired we are wired to [42:10] overly react to negative [42:12] thinking that's what you wake up within [42:15] the morning unless you've got a [42:17] conscious override system where you're [42:19] con constantly overriding it your [42:22] negatives your fears are going to come [42:24] into play Fast than anything else so the [42:27] most impactful thing fear of loss is the [42:29] number one dominant [42:32] decisionmaking influence in our thinking [42:35] fear of loss not the only just the [42:38] biggest there are other things there too [42:41] but so I'm starting for fear of loss [42:43] some of the stuff you talked [42:45] about fear of loss of identity fear of [42:48] loss of opportunity fear of loss of [42:50] membership in the [42:52] tribe what does this say about me does [42:55] this say I'm a loser does it say have [42:57] been I've been taken advantage [43:00] of people will refuse to make deals that [43:03] would make them better [43:05] off because they're [43:08] afraid that it makes them look like a [43:10] loser they got manipulated into it they [43:12] got you know like I'm I'm my way over [43:15] here I'm seeing people uh you know that [43:18] are that are hustling for money on [43:20] street corners we're in Vegas in a [43:22] sunshine in Vegas it's getting ready to [43:24] be July 1st tomorrow it's hot [43:28] here and I'm looking at somebody's got [43:30] their act together standing out in a [43:33] sun I I know like not everybody's [43:37] homeless by choice but if you're hust in [43:39] a street corner that's your territory [43:41] you've carved it out you like that [43:43] location you pick the busy street corner [43:46] because there are more people coming by [43:47] you're an [43:48] entrepreneur you made a sign you got a [43:51] nice sign you taking a time to make [43:54] yourself as clean as possible as [43:56] appealing as possible [43:58] and you stand out there in the sun with [43:59] no [44:01] water now if I have said to you all [44:04] right I'm whatever you made in the last [44:06] hour you start working for [44:09] me I'll double whatever you bring [44:13] in but you got to stand out here in the [44:16] Sun and you can't have any water and you [44:19] can't sit down and you got to stay out [44:22] here and it's blazing hot sun for [44:24] another [44:25] hour now you see that as a loss of your [44:28] autonomy and you'd be like I'm not [44:30] working under those conditions for [44:33] anybody but if I don't say anything to [44:35] you you are going to work happily under [44:37] those conditions for the next hour [44:38] because you're working for yourself [44:40] that's an identity [44:42] issue that's what's motivating [44:45] you so and it's an autonomy issue too [44:49] autonomy is one of the key drivers of [44:51] human nature so I'm starting to look for [44:55] you know how are you interpreting your [44:57] autonomy how how do this interpret your [44:59] identity what are you [45:02] losing by change of behavior or contined [45:07] behavior I'm going to start to calculate [45:08] this stuff out if you and I see things [45:12] differently I'm looking at a different [45:14] opportunity cost than you are so I got [45:18] to start knowing how you're seeing this [45:19] loss and that's you know the whole point [45:21] of empathy and the application of [45:24] tactical empathy I start feeding back to [45:26] you [45:28] what I think's driving you you're going [45:30] to tell me when I'm on track and you're [45:33] going to tell me when I'm off [45:35] track and what I really need to know is [45:38] when I'm off [45:39] track and it's you're telling me that is [45:44] you're correcting me and I can get you [45:47] to tell me a lot more stuff by [45:48] correcting me than I can by by asking [45:50] you so I'm you know I'm looking at this [45:53] bundle of stuff mostly built around fear [45:57] but your fears and my fears are going to [45:59] be very different so I got to dial into [46:01] you and find out what yours are yeah it [46:03] it is it is a delicate dance as well cuz [46:05] I could see like I've been in deals [46:07] before where I'm like I can see it on [46:10] both sides right now yes the deal is [46:12] good cuz I want the deal done but I'm [46:14] pissed off at how it got done right cuz [46:16] you [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] me yep like and I want the [46:19] deal sure but [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] you and it was done [46:22] wrong and you know so I can tell that [46:25] like and and I and I'm you you know when [46:27] I I I recently just acquired a company [46:29] and I remember sitting him one of my [46:31] closing things cuz I'm like I'm good [46:33] like put me and you in the room I'm [46:34] probably going to walk away with with a [46:36] better outcome um I'm like I'm I'm [46:39] mindful that I don't want to like screw [46:40] this guy like we want to do business [46:41] together so one of my final things was [46:43] I'm like what would make this an [46:45] absolute no-brainer for you and for you [46:46] to be really excited and feel really [46:48] good about the decision and he threw the [46:51] number out and it was actually um pretty [46:54] damn close to what I was originally [46:55] going to settle on anyway I said look if [46:56] you're happy with that then let's just [46:57] go with that and I was like great cuz I [47:00] was and which this is what I want to [47:02] come to next actually in a deal cuz I've [47:05] had conflicting I think last time we we [47:07] talked you were like you never want to [47:10] put your offer on the table you want to [47:11] do what what Adis did yeah what what are [47:13] you what are you looking for here um [47:15] because they might do what he did came [47:16] in actually higher than what I was going [47:18] to originally get asked for um and then [47:21] there was another negotiator I met in [47:22] Australia where he was completely the [47:23] opposite he's like no I rock up and I [47:25] tell him exactly what I want and I say [47:27] hey today's your lucky day I'll do it [47:29] for only half he puts it straight on [47:31] right away and uh can you break that [47:33] down like when we're going for a deal [47:35] who's what sort of strategy are we [47:37] looking for all right so the vast [47:39] majority of the highly successful [47:41] negotiators which doesn't mean it means [47:44] not all of them do it like this just [47:46] more than any other believe he Oru names [47:50] price first [47:52] loses now that ain't to say there ain't [47:55] some people there aren't some people out [47:56] there making money that want to go [47:59] first but the the the the people that I [48:03] have the most respect for that have the [48:04] most long-term [48:06] relationships they want to find out [48:08] what's going to make you [48:09] happy and and they're may be some [48:13] bargaining and some some positioning [48:15] after the fact but they want to find out [48:18] what you're going to look for it's [48:19] probably going to be it's probably going [48:20] to save time and it's going to cement [48:23] the [48:24] relationship plus if this you know I'm [48:27] coming in high and settling for [48:29] half first of all that that you got to [48:32] be sure you're coming in [48:35] high like you might not have come in [48:37] high [48:39] enough and I'm horrified at my number [48:42] being [48:43] low which I thought it was high you know [48:46] one of the guys on um that's part of my [48:50] training and coaching team now uh here [48:53] in Vegas uh former Vegas metro PD [48:56] detective member of the negotiation team [49:00] I catch him right after he retires he's [49:02] doing some private investigator work [49:04] he's actually now back with Vegas doing [49:06] cold cases because that was that's what [49:09] he always want to work cold cases and he [49:11] was he's a very effective guy and the [49:15] Cold Case quad came to him and said you [49:17] know we need we need some some guys [49:18] that'll come on parttime and you're [49:20] sharp as hell and we could use you so he [49:23] went back for it you know because it's [49:25] like you know he gets to do something he [49:26] you always wanted to do as a kid but [49:28] anyway he's in a [49:30] negotiation uh with a law firm to do [49:32] some [49:33] work and they're trying real hard to get [49:36] him to tell him what his what his his [49:38] fee is and he knows what his fee is and [49:41] he works with a lot of guys you know [49:43] they say yeah come in high you could [49:44] always go [49:45] down but he you know he he doesn't want [49:47] to throw a number [49:49] out and he uses a [49:51] label uh which again it's the L do not [49:54] underestimate the effectiveness of a [49:57] label and he says to him you know it [49:59] seems like you guys have already got a [50:00] number in [50:02] mind and the guy goes look I want to [50:04] tell you something we're not paying more [50:05] than XXX per [50:07] hour that was more than he would have [50:09] asked for high yeah that was higher than [50:14] his high so if he'd have come in [50:16] thinking he was asking High he'd have [50:19] cheated himself out of some money and [50:21] they probably their natural instinct to [50:23] bargain would have knocked them down [50:24] some more but in instead they come in [50:28] and they give him his number like [50:29] everybody on my team is horrified that [50:31] we're going to leave money on the table [50:32] by calling price first MH now the other [50:35] thing that a lot of people don't realize [50:37] is if you come in high how many deals [50:39] you drive from the [50:41] table like I'm also horrified at not [50:44] making a deal I should have made and the [50:46] high ask people will say I never lost [50:48] money on a deal I didn't make well [50:50] that's not true CU you lost time and [50:51] times [50:53] money and you come in too high you come [50:56] in too high on me you extreme ask me [50:58] it's the last time we've [51:00] spoken what do you mean by that if I [51:02] come in extreme High well if if you're [51:04] ask is too much or you're offering too [51:08] little we will never speak again [51:12] interesting isn't that what you teach [51:13] though to come in a lot law and then [51:16] work your way if you're in a bargaining [51:18] situation if you're in a hard barking [51:22] but if I don't don't open that way yeah [51:25] and I you know I got you know [51:28] you it'll be like you you you start out [51:30] on with an extreme mask on me just flat [51:34] and then tell me all the reasons why [51:35] it's a great [51:37] deal soon as this conversation is over [51:39] you you'll never hear from me again like [51:43] why is that uh because you're wasting my [51:45] time you're you're wasting my you're [51:47] trying to pick my pocket how you do [51:49] anything is how you do everything if [51:51] you're trying to pick my pocket now plus [51:53] now is the nicest you're ever going to [51:55] be m [51:57] you you people don't get nicer over time [51:59] they get you know it's you know it's [52:00] kind of like the old dating thing the [52:02] person a person you're you're dating [52:03] their representative for the first six [52:04] months six months later you find out who [52:06] they really are yeah like people in a [52:08] business deal don't start off being [52:09] their worst [52:11] self that's probably the best person [52:13] you're ever going to see and if you're [52:16] trying to pick my pocket from the [52:19] beginning like this is what our [52:21] relationship is going to look like till [52:23] the end of time So eventually I'm going [52:25] to end it I'm I might as well end it now [52:27] mhm is there a way that I can profile [52:30] people better like I want to learn some [52:33] FBI secrets on you sit down with someone [52:36] if you a profile like how are you [52:37] looking for deceptive Behavior how are [52:39] you looking for if people are their [52:41] values what motivates them like when [52:43] we're sitting down to perhaps interview [52:44] someone for a job what are we looking [52:47] for when we interview what are we [52:48] looking for in the early months what are [52:51] you kind of looking for to profile [52:52] people effectively well uh [52:56] I'm glad you asked that [52:58] question what's up dream Nation have you [53:01] ever wondered how far ahead your life [53:03] would have already been if you had to [53:04] got access to this type of content at a [53:06] younger age look this is why I need your [53:09] help I'm trying to build the number one [53:11] personal development platform out there [53:12] to teach you guys the tips tricks and [53:14] attitude of what it takes to live your [53:16] dream life and to bring the type of [53:18] education that we all wish we had in [53:20] school this show only Grows by word of [53:23] mouth and new subscribers so it would [53:25] mean the world to me if you could smash [53:27] that subscribe button right now leave us [53:29] a five-star written review or drop a [53:31] comment below and share this episode [53:34] with a friend I would be forever [53:36] grateful all right now let's get back [53:38] into this episode you know there's a [53:40] phrase that we've been using a lot more [53:42] lately that I can find out instantly a [53:44] lot about you really [53:45] fast and I'll pick where you're from [53:50] what you're doing [53:52] currently where we happen to be what you [53:55] happen to be doing [53:57] I'll [53:58] say what do you love about [54:01] Australia I [54:03] love the weather the weather is [54:08] laidback cool place to [54:12] live it's it [54:16] yeah what about being laidback works for [54:20] you um I think I like like a Carefree [54:23] lifestyle I don't like as much rules and [54:26] even though Australia has increased the [54:27] rules lot lately so I like the it's [54:30] quite we have a lot of freedom there [54:31] it's a quite free country so yeah okay [54:35] all right [54:36] so to start with the design of what I [54:38] just asked you [54:40] MH if you if you ask a [54:43] question uh it should either start with [54:45] the words what or [54:48] how the word what is principally but not [54:52] exclusively designed to find out about [54:55] things [54:57] obstacles [54:59] preferences the word how is principally [55:02] but not [55:03] exclusively designed to find out about [55:07] implementation how to deal with things [55:10] how to overcome obstacles how to move [55:13] forward so both of those words trigger [55:16] with Danny conoman uh Nobel Prize winner [55:19] behavioral economics his book Thinking [55:21] Fast and [55:22] Slow trigger slow thinking indepth [55:26] thinking [55:27] pluses and minuses there it's [55:34] exhausting if you say to uh your [55:38] significant [55:39] other how was your [55:43] day when they come home they're already [55:46] exhausted you just ask them a question [55:48] it's going to exhaust them even [55:51] more it's going to all the all the [55:54] mental gas is out of their gas tank [55:56] it's really hard it's well-intentioned [55:58] it's really hard to answer that question [56:00] so should we be asking a what question [56:02] what did you love about your day ah now [56:06] the second part of that question though [56:08] deep thinking it basically the what [56:11] question I'm going to open a portion of [56:12] your mind I'm going to dive in deep if I [56:16] add in what do you [56:18] love it's an energizing emotion it's [56:21] positive emotion it's energizing at the [56:23] end of the day [56:26] if or no matter where you are when I go [56:28] what do you love about [56:31] X I'll watch you [56:34] re-energize I'll watch you shift into a [56:39] state of love and contemplate it and [56:41] it'll bring your energy [56:42] back so if I say what do you love about [56:46] X whatever it is you're going to instead [56:49] of being drained by that question you're [56:51] going to be energized by it and you're [56:54] going to start to tell me about yourself [56:55] when you you start talking about the [56:57] things that you love you're like a [56:58] laid-back atmosphere you don't like you [57:00] don't like high pressure people you you [57:03] don't you don't want to work with high [57:04] pressure people this is what you got [57:06] from me yeah yeah you know you like you [57:08] like the laid-back easy environment and [57:11] simultaneously you also like to get [57:13] things done but you're not a high [57:15] pressure high hustle person so what do [57:18] you love about if I'm listening and I'm [57:20] putting in context I'm going to learn a [57:23] lot about you as a human being very very [57:25] quickly it's also not a uh a scripted [57:28] answer the first time I ever did this [57:30] I'm in La at this party you know it's [57:33] for uh forced uh forc Tucker [57:37] forced um brilliant brilliant um [57:41] African-American actor and I'm stupid [57:44] for not uh Force Whitaker right my yeah [57:48] anyway great guy friend of a friend is [57:52] and so separately this Hollywood dude [57:54] walks up to me super good-look typical [57:57] La guy just based on his demeanor I [58:00] could tell how impressed he is with [58:03] himself and I got to talk to this guy [58:06] and I don't want to hear his [58:08] Spiel what he do for living you know any [58:12] any of that that they got a Cann answer [58:16] for and so said instead I say to him [58:19] just out a survival I go you know what [58:22] do you love about LA and I watch him [58:24] shift in front of my eye [58:27] and instead of giving me a canned [58:29] answer he reveals to him to me who he is [58:33] because when you start talking about [58:34] what do you love about something you're [58:36] telling telling people a whole lot about [58:38] yourself what' he say I don't I don't [58:41] even remember what he said but I I'll [58:43] I'll I'll give you the flip side of it [58:46] what if they hate what you ask them [58:49] about I'm in Dubai eight nine months ago [58:53] train train a bunch of salespeople [58:57] we are I'm working them on the what do [59:00] you love question that oneon-one role [59:02] play is using the skills I see a guy [59:03] sent by [59:05] himself we don't allow inactivity in our [59:08] training you're going to participate if [59:10] you're the odd guy out I'm going to sit [59:12] down with you so I sit down I go like [59:15] okay uh um I'll I'll I'll use the skills [59:19] on [59:19] you so you know how how it [59:22] feels I go what do you love about the [59:24] buy and he goes I don't love anything [59:26] about the buy I think the buy is a [59:28] polished piece of and he uses the [59:32] word he doesn't love the buy but I know [59:36] he's in the [59:38] buy so the reasons he he's here he has [59:41] love behind [59:42] them I begin to dig into his past he's [59:46] there for his family he's hustling on [59:49] behalf of his family he's sending money [59:51] home he's from a segment of society they [59:54] grew up disadvantaged [59:56] and he's someplace doing in a place he [59:59] doesn't like because of his dedication [60:02] to his [60:03] family so like now I'm learning about [60:06] this guy family oriented Family [60:10] Values [60:12] loyalty long-term yet prized [60:16] relationships so if I'm listening I'm [60:18] considering the implications you know [60:20] they got to love what they're doing or [60:22] where they [60:24] are but unless they're it's the [60:26] condition of their [60:27] parole why they're there they love that [60:31] and so you get you get a quick download [60:33] of what the other person is like or you [60:36] get a mercenaries download what's that [60:40] talk to a [60:41] CEO CEO of a water [60:45] company I think delivering water [60:47] worldwide is cool like I dig that [60:49] mission I'm a mission oriented person [60:52] okay what do you love about being CEO of [60:54] the company oh I Love Leading teams I [60:57] Love Leading teams and I love giving [60:59] shareholders a great return on their [61:01] investment love giving shareholders a [61:03] great return on their investment oh and [61:04] then we deliver water I like that too [61:06] and then he named a third thing that had [61:07] nothing to do with our [61:09] mission this guy's a [61:11] mercenary he could he could be selling [61:13] toilet [61:14] paper now you want a team leader cool I [61:19] love leading teams he's saying things [61:22] that are going to be music to the ears [61:24] of his board [61:26] I love to lead teams and I love giving [61:28] shareholders a great return on their [61:30] investment now how's that going to land [61:32] with his [61:35] employees those that are mission driven [61:37] would be like you know you you don't [61:40] care that we delivering clean water [61:43] globally and saving lives that is not on [61:45] his [61:46] list and so in that brief interaction I [61:49] learned from that Sky you could never [61:52] work for [61:53] me because we're mission driven and if [61:56] you're not Mission driven you're a [61:57] mercenary and it's going to be totally [62:00] transactional I could never work for [62:03] you because I'm Mission [62:06] driven and you're complete [62:09] mercenary and anytime that I'm enthused [62:12] about our mission your reaction to me is [62:15] is going to be neutral at [62:16] best and you're not going to be [62:19] supportive in that so we got a mismatch [62:21] of values and that's how you find out [62:24] about whether or not you're going to [62:25] make a d great deal with [62:27] somebody that has definitely been this [62:29] has definitely been one of the best [62:30] things I've ever done when I hire people [62:33] like everyone in my team I'm here in [62:35] America right now and I'll be gone for [62:36] another five or so weeks and everything [62:39] gets run as per usual because every [62:41] person in our team is there because [62:43] what's very important for them in their [62:45] life they get fulfilled through what we [62:48] do and we have a team of leaders cuz I [62:51] will sit down one of the first things I [62:52] ask people I'm like what is it you doing [62:54] why is it important for you yeah I'm [62:55] looking for just deep value motivators [62:57] and then I actually ask a question cuz I [63:00] find what's their biggest because if we [63:01] have things that were really important [63:03] for us to do then we also have things [63:04] that are very important for us to not do [63:06] right and I asked the one question I say [63:09] what would have to happen here that [63:10] would make you want to leave and they [63:13] straight up say well this and this great [63:16] and as long as that's an alignment I'm [63:18] never going to do that and that then I [63:20] know that that's that's their boundaries [63:22] and someone who has healthy boundaries [63:23] like that is also a good person so I [63:25] like to people around me who are like [63:27] I'm filled by this and these are my [63:29] boundaries and it helps me have the the [63:32] thing so if someone's like or what would [63:34] make me want to leave is underpaid and [63:36] not valued or always working virtually [63:39] right if we have people that always [63:41] working virtually but we have a virtual [63:43] team that's not they're not going to [63:44] really last very long with us yeah so I [63:47] like to find those things see I love [63:49] that question I [63:51] mean for a whole bunch of reasons I love [63:53] that question um but and when we were [63:56] talking earlier before we came on we [63:57] were talking about obstacles MH you know [64:00] what are the what are the barriers to [64:01] implementation and that that is [64:02] definitely along the lines of that and [64:04] then it's also sort of prepping people [64:07] in advance and yeah knowing somebody's [64:09] boundaries I mean I love that question [64:11] it's Brant I may probably start think [64:13] I'm G steal that I'll give you credit [64:15] Str name you know stroke your check [64:18] every time we make a good hire love it [64:21] um I had a story that you were walking [64:24] to a bar you got to sit down I I want [64:26] you to tell a story but essentially you [64:27] walk into a bar and a guy threatens you [64:29] to not come near him and then you [64:31] completely switch it around just by [64:32] actually introducing yourself right can [64:34] you explain the story and I want to know [64:36] exactly why it's kind of my it's kind of [64:38] my favorite bar trick and my favorite [64:40] confrontation trick too especially in a [64:42] crowded environment which usually [64:43] happens in a [64:44] bar but yeah I mean [64:48] um if I ask you your [64:50] name for a variety of reasons your your [64:54] first name is is a precious commodity to [64:57] you and so and it often your first name [65:01] is often weaponized against you again [65:03] different things that the the the [65:04] hustlers you know the fast Buck [65:06] transactional love them love them and [65:08] leave them I'm going to get as much [65:09] money as I can out of your pocket as [65:11] quickly as I can once I got it all I no [65:13] longer have any use for you you know [65:15] they're going to weaponize somebody's [65:16] first name against them so I'm going to [65:18] catch you off [65:19] guard so yeah we walk into this bar [65:22] place place is crowded there's four of [65:23] us four hostage negotiators like a joke [65:26] right four hostage negotiators walk into [65:28] a [65:29] bar and uh I they got free drinks all [65:31] night long yeah there you go exactly [65:33] nobody [65:34] pays um and I and we may not have paid [65:37] that much that night as as it turns out [65:39] or somebody else did but I I see this [65:42] empty chair like I'm I'm coming in it's [65:44] it's it's at the bar it's just precious [65:46] real estate and I get ready to sit down [65:48] in a chair and dude sitting there goes [65:51] uh don't even think about it and [65:56] I'm a hostage Togo I'm going talk to [65:58] this guy there's no way I'm not talking [66:00] to him and I go why is that he goes cuz [66:04] I'll kick your [66:06] ass and I hesitate for a second I go I [66:09] don't need that I'm Chris and I hold out [66:12] my [66:13] hand cuz I know it's harder for the bad [66:17] guys to harm a hostage once they know [66:19] their [66:19] name I I know that for a [66:22] fact and I I knew that from all my time [66:25] in a [66:27] negotiation uh talking directly to bad [66:30] guys we find ways to make the bad guys [66:33] use the name of the hostage because we [66:35] knew it increased their survivability [66:38] not not just on whether or not they [66:40] would live but how they would be treated [66:42] because it's harder to hurt somebody [66:44] when you know their first name and you [66:46] see this show up all over the world in [66:49] all sorts of [66:51] interactions and he [66:54] freezes because he's getting ready to [66:56] hit the guy who's the [66:58] nameless [67:00] Intruder but now he can't hit Chris [67:04] because I'm Chris and I'm also you know [67:06] I'm using a tone of voice I don't need [67:08] that I'm [67:09] Chris I didn't ask him his name I never [67:11] asked him his [67:13] name he gave it to [67:15] us as soon as you know I broke the [67:19] attention by holding out my hand like [67:21] that and he froze [67:23] clearly the other negotiators I with [67:26] came up say hey man how you doing let us [67:28] buy a drink you know let's talk let's [67:29] find out what's going on we find out [67:32] this guy's a former Vietnam vet his life [67:35] has been a train wreck since he came [67:36] back to the US he's unemployed uh he [67:39] doesn't have a girlfriend and he's in a [67:42] bar he's got he's got barely enough [67:44] money to be there and he perceives the [67:46] world as being celebrating and happy and [67:49] that's why this chair and a crowd of bar [67:50] is empty cuz he has chased away [67:52] everybody that tried to sit down there [67:53] he tried to pick a fight with everybody [67:55] that sit down and instead by breaking a [67:58] barrier by just saying I'm [68:01] Chris everything [68:03] changes and we get to know him and we [68:07] have great interaction with them and [68:09] I've done that more times in more [68:13] bars and I'm I'm in another bar in [68:15] London it's crowded young lady I'm with [68:18] good friend she's getting elble by the [68:19] dude next to her and I keep pushing [68:21] pushing pushing and she's not a push [68:23] back kind of person and I and I keep I [68:26] I'm like why are we moving here why are [68:27] we moving here why don't you stand still [68:29] she this guy over here just keeps [68:30] crowding me so I reach over and I give [68:33] him a couple sharp Taps on a [68:35] shoulder which is you know usually a [68:39] sign that [68:41] somebody's gonna start trouble and he [68:44] spins around and he looks at me and I go [68:47] I'm [68:48] sorry I'm [68:50] Chris he's like like like like what [68:56] and I go I'm [68:58] sorry you know you keep bumping into us [69:00] we're trying to stand still over here [69:02] we're trying to hang on to our real [69:03] estate oh oh I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm [69:05] sorry and he and he stops crowding her [69:07] he spun around expecting a [69:10] fight but Chris was there that's so [69:13] fascinating hey do you think uh like [69:16] Rapport and tone and these sorts of [69:18] things play like a big role in this type [69:21] of thing as well or is it mostly down to [69:23] what you say well it's first tone [69:26] tone tone spins everything about what's [69:28] about 35 38% of our communication I [69:30] think it's tone yeah and at least yeah [69:34] like um I can say to [69:37] you wow that was a great question or I [69:41] could say well that was a great question [69:43] you know the first one's a compliment [69:45] the second one's an insult like I can I [69:47] could do so much with my tone if you're [69:50] if you're a master of tone it's one of [69:52] the great overlooked skills of [69:54] communication [69:56] you can get away with almost anything [69:58] you know I could say you know when I [70:00] told you that when I said that to you [70:02] before you thought I was lying and my [70:04] tone of voice there says you're an [70:07] idiot and I could say someone said that [70:11] before thought I was [70:14] lying that lands differently you'd [70:17] collaborate it was an [70:19] insulting so there's so much you can do [70:21] with tone just to begin with it's almost [70:24] irrelevant to the word is there anything [70:26] that most people do especially in sales [70:29] where they're just completely going [70:30] wrong with tone like what what I'm aware [70:32] of is the upward in Australians there a [70:35] lot especially Perth [70:38] Adelaide I don't know if you you like [70:41] it's it's it's such a funny any [70:43] Australians watching this they're like [70:44] that's true we have a conversation and [70:46] oh my God and at the weekend it was so [70:49] good and like it's a very begging sort [70:52] of thing and so I've been aware of that [70:54] at the end of a a downward inflict and [70:57] it's like lands it's Authority so I'm [70:59] aware of that one are there any things [71:02] that people do when it's like when you [71:03] do this that's why people aren't paying [71:05] attention to you that's why it's not [71:07] working it's why you're not getting the [71:08] sale well if if you're locked into your [71:11] affect that I sense very quickly it's [71:14] got nothing to do with [71:16] me that you're not being authentic to [71:18] the [71:19] communication like I I don't mind you [71:21] coming up with like super bubbly super [71:24] wired [71:25] but if you're just so locked into it [71:28] that it no matter how this conversation [71:30] goes and if I'm paying attention I'm [71:32] going inside of three or four minutes [71:35] like you're not talking to me you're not [71:37] talking with me you don't see me you're [71:40] not making it you're not listening [71:41] you're not making any adaptation into [71:43] this conversation at all if you know I [71:47] you say how was your [71:48] day and uh I go well you [71:53] know and that's a vague answer and you [71:57] go great yeah they're just on autopilot [72:00] they're on autopilot yeah so if are you [72:03] on autopilot when you start out with or [72:06] are you immediately adapting to the [72:08] conversation that's the biggest thing [72:10] are you adapting into [72:12] me what do we do when somebody ghosts us [72:17] we're in communication with them emails [72:19] or messages and they're just not getting [72:21] back to us all right so your system is [72:24] perfectly designed to give you the [72:25] outcome you've [72:29] obtained so nobody ghost somebody they [72:32] feel listen to [72:35] by you've been [72:38] pitching and they started sending you [72:40] warning signals a while ago and you [72:42] ignored them because and you weren't [72:44] listening because you've been [72:47] pitching people ghost when the [72:49] conversation is not doing them any good [72:52] and there's only two reason it's not two [72:54] reasons it's not doing them any [72:56] good you're not [72:58] listening and they don't have an [73:00] opportunity to influence the outcome [73:02] from their end so they've given up why [73:03] should they talk to you it doesn't do [73:06] them any good you've demonstrated to [73:08] them it's no good so you can you can get [73:09] them back but you have to realize how [73:12] you got there in the first place they [73:14] probably said your right to you a few [73:16] times your right is what people say when [73:19] they're trying to get you to leave them [73:20] alone and preserve the relationship so [73:23] they've been signaling you to you for a [73:26] while and they've noticed that you [73:28] haven't picked up on it so you could you [73:31] got a one shot reset if you're going to [73:33] get them back at all it works 999 times [73:36] out of a thousand which means there is a [73:39] one in a thousand time it doesn't work [73:43] and a One-Shot reset has got to be this [73:45] exactly have you given up on and name [73:47] whatever it is don't add or [73:50] subtract don't change the words send [73:53] that in a text send it in an email do [73:56] not an ad is also a change you got to [74:00] send that word for [74:02] word one of three people are [74:04] accommodators accommodators are scared [74:06] to death to send that by itself they an [74:10] accommodator um we're from cademan days [74:15] we cope with Conflict by fight flight [74:17] make friends oh the world splits up [74:20] pretty evenly into thirds we got more [74:22] than enough data to back up that [74:24] hypothesis [74:25] and a third of the people of the make [74:27] friends type the accommodators they're [74:29] very hope focused so the other two are [74:32] fight and flight fight and flight okay [74:34] assertive natur uh who are the poster [74:36] children so you might be able to grasp [74:38] it in your mind Donald Trump's poster [74:41] child for the [74:43] assertive um Warren Buffett the [74:47] analyst Elon mus is an [74:50] analyst um and uh Richard Branson the [74:56] accommodator accomodator total [74:58] relationship Branson I [75:00] don't when he dies there'll be a smile [75:02] on his face like always got a smile on [75:04] his face hope focused extremely hope [75:07] focused hope focused also has problems [75:09] with implementation occasionally so is [75:12] it is this a good way to sort of profile [75:14] people in a way as well well it yeah [75:17] profile is initial indicators and two [75:20] out of three people are not going to be [75:21] your [75:22] type if the black sworn group Chris Voss [75:25] is anywhere near accurate and the world [75:27] splits up evenly into thirds and it does [75:30] regardless of gender or ethnicity [75:33] geography any of that [75:37] um impass is usually a result of type [75:42] mismatch and the primary Black Swan [75:44] skills of labels and mirrors all three [75:47] types [75:48] like so if you can just master and [75:50] that's one of the reasons why I'm so [75:52] confident in my negotiation I've [75:53] mastered labels of mirrors that's why I [75:55] feel like I can deal with anybody under [75:57] any [75:58] circumstances and it's I got to tell you [76:01] I like feeling that way you know if you [76:03] can imagine what that's like it's great [76:05] I love [76:06] it I it doesn't matter how soon I figure [76:09] out you're an accommodator an analyst or [76:11] an assertive I'll figure it out pretty [76:12] soon but I'll start labeling a miring [76:14] right away so the accommodator very hope [76:17] focused poor implementation so [76:19] accommodator hope focused poor at [76:22] implementing is that you said yeah poor [76:24] at details yeah I I think I'm probably [76:27] that I've never heard of this before I'm [76:29] proba quite that one I I'd prefer to be [76:32] friends and fight but I bet I'll get to [76:34] the point if if not going to be friends [76:36] and the still T then I'll fight that's [76:38] the the exactly when when an commentator [76:41] feels there's no longer the possibility [76:43] of being friends MH they are deadly [76:47] creatures yeah this is funny that that [76:49] is that is me that is me I'm like like [76:51] my first goal here is let's just make it [76:54] work and if you're just going to keep [76:55] being a dick and it's not going to work [76:57] then all right now you forc me to [77:00] unleash yep yep y so accommodators [77:03] assertives assertives what what are they [77:05] looking for and what are they avoiding [77:08] uh assertives actually want to be heard [77:11] and [77:11] respected and they feel respected if [77:13] they feel hurt which is why empathy [77:15] works with them really well that's a [77:16] trump yeah it's a Donald Trump you know [77:18] they're going to be very [77:19] attacking they think they like a good [77:22] fight um you know they'll you call an [77:25] accommodator a name and it might be [77:27] years before they get over it you know [77:30] you could call Donald Trump any name in [77:32] a book and call him back up on a phone [77:34] ask him he wants to play golf the next [77:36] day he'll go yeah because he he gets [77:38] over you know they they heal a uh Ceres [77:41] heal from emotional wounds kind of like [77:44] Wolverine does like super fast yeah you [77:47] know we get wounded but we get over it [77:49] ridiculously fast and the third one the [77:52] analyst the analyst you know he's a more [77:54] flight people are they yeah because [77:57] conflict is [77:59] inefficient yes and it's only an [78:03] outcome and there are so many more [78:06] outcomes that are not as [78:10] inefficient and so you know they're just [78:13] like you want to fight I got better [78:14] things to do I'm just going to turn and [78:16] walk away yeah this is awesome all right [78:20] it's come to the time me to prepare [78:23] we're going to play games here okay play [78:24] a game that's the beginning of the [78:26] movies the Saw movies right let's play a [78:28] game ah so um yeah I'd love to do some [78:32] let's trial of role play what would you [78:34] like to do what's well we do 60 seconds [78:36] so she dies it's your op option to be [78:39] cuz you had time to study I know and I [78:41] was thinking I was like [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] I hope we [78:42] don't do it again I I should have done [78:44] more um you could you could be either [78:46] one you could be the good guy or the bad [78:48] guy we can flip it this time we whatever [78:50] you'd like [78:52] ah okay well that could be good because [78:54] cuz last time I was on the other end I [78:58] didn't bad guy or was the good guy you [79:00] were the good guy yep I screwed it upad [79:02] guy yeah I could be bad guy how do I be [79:05] bad guy [79:06] though I'm just I just be be the RO [79:09] become become the bankrupt come bankrupt [79:12] so I was going to be the assertive guy [79:13] so what I want I want a car okay okay [79:16] how do how do we play the game give me [79:17] the you trapped in a bank y some trapped [79:20] in the bank how many people was not your [79:22] plan was not your plan that that is not [79:24] the way when you saw these when you saw [79:26] these you got up in the morning you're [79:28] bank robber it's how you get your cash [79:30] mhm you know you rob [79:32] banks um and there are people like this [79:36] like I remember talking to a guy who's a [79:38] bank robber in LA and um he was they [79:42] actually his father's hero was Jesse [79:45] James and I named this guy [79:47] Jesse and he grew up idolizing Jesse [79:50] James a bank robber and he thought of [79:52] robbing banks as this great [79:55] daring sexy glamorous lifestyle when we [79:59] landed in prison for the third time he [80:01] decided it wasn't so sexy and glamorous [80:02] anymore but he's laying out how he got [80:04] into it in the first place yeah so you [80:06] know you see maybe Jesse James your here [80:09] growing up I don't know but that you [80:10] decide you want to be sexy and glamorous [80:12] and it's easy it's powerful okay you [80:15] know you wave guns around people get [80:17] scared M they hand you money so you go [80:20] away an adrenaline rush it's exciting to [80:23] get in there but trapped in a bank [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] [80:26] okay cuz in my head it's it's like who [80:28] would Rob because I'm like if I was to [80:29] ever robber bank I I would there's not a [80:32] percentage where I would ever think that [80:34] I'd get away with it Robin Banks is a [80:37] dumb idea you know they're Witnesses [80:39] they take your pictures everybody knows [80:41] they got cameras that's why when this [80:43] when this guy was finally laying out to [80:44] me why he was a bank robber he saw it as [80:48] this great dopamine Rush yeah and it [80:53] finally the third time he landed in jail [80:55] it took him three times to go down for [80:57] bank robbery before he figured out it [80:59] was a stupid idea okay all right so I'm [81:02] rubbing in bank I'm with how many [81:03] friends do I have inside how many how [81:05] many am I I don't know how many how many [81:07] you want okay there's four of us okay [81:09] you don't I don't have to know that any [81:11] okay I don't have to know any of that [81:12] okay and do you need to know how many [81:14] hostages we have i' I'll I'll work on [81:17] I'll find out that's my job okay all [81:19] right so this is the first time we're [81:20] talking I'm going to call in you're [81:23] going to answer and you the 60 seconds [81:25] she dies whatever you want [81:28] okay so I I'll say ring ring and you'll [81:31] answer and you and and you go with it [81:33] and it's up to me I'll be Ginger Rogers [81:35] you be Fred [81:36] aair okay all right okay ring [81:41] ring I need a car in 60 seconds or she [81:45] dies sounds like I don't care what it [81:48] sounds like and in a car in 60 seconds [81:50] we can all get out of [81:51] here we can all get out of here you're [81:54] not getting out of here we're getting [81:56] out of here you have 50 seconds how much [81:59] I have a hostage I'm going to got a gun [82:00] to a head I'm going to shoot the first [82:02] person if I didn't get a car 40 seconds [82:03] left doesn't sound like you're going to [82:05] give me a chance I need the chance here [82:09] you got 40 seconds if you don't give me [82:10] a chance how am I supposed to do [82:12] it I don't know that's your job to [82:14] figure this out you've got to figure [82:16] this out how we're going to get out of [82:17] here today it's your job you're going to [82:18] get us out of here today you have 30 [82:20] seconds or she dies if you're I'm going [82:22] to hang up if you're not going to give [82:23] me time well how do you expect any of [82:26] this to work out today well that's my [82:29] question to you so what's your question [82:31] which car would we like how am I how am [82:33] I supposed to do that I need I'm not [82:36] sure but you're the guy's going to [82:37] figure that out we got 20 seconds left [82:41] click you hung up at me [82:45] [Laughter] [82:49] mhm last yeah last time you killed her [82:55] see all right so why why do I hang up [82:58] yeah cuz I wasn't I wasn't uh I was just [83:01] trying to tell you how things are going [83:02] to happen and so in the wind down you [83:06] require me to be on a phone for you to [83:10] beat me up to get to where you want to [83:12] go [83:13] MH so if you are winding down and you're [83:18] not showing any openness at all to [83:20] anything I'm [83:21] saying my last move is to win withdraw [83:25] from your vision of how this is going to [83:28] happen right so that at least I you [83:32] talked before about pattern [83:35] interrupt I got to interrupt your [83:38] pattern now chances are you're going to [83:41] call right back you're going to call me [83:44] yeah yeah and you're going to be what [83:46] the hell did you do hanging up on me how [83:47] dare you and your goal now is to berate [83:52] me which now I I gain a little bit of [83:55] space you got the upper hand kind of now [83:58] I might as long as I'm as if I remain [84:00] deferential so in my in and in my whole [84:03] approach and you call me back start [84:05] yelling you for hanging up I'm going be [84:07] like look I if if you're not going to [84:08] give me a chance how am I supposed to do [84:11] anything and if you're not I need to [84:13] know whether or not you're going to give [84:14] me a chance I also need to know whether [84:16] or not you actually want to live or [84:18] whether that's just a Roose like you [84:20] might not want to [84:22] live I need to know in advance [84:24] what I've really got on my hands and so [84:28] I know there's there there's a journey [84:30] in your head and and hostage negotiation [84:32] we call it a killing [84:34] Journey but in in human beings they [84:37] always have a vision of the [84:39] future I I got to I got to figure out [84:41] what the journey in your head is and the [84:43] initial interaction my initial [84:45] assessment is your journey requires you [84:49] to manipulate me on the [84:51] phone so I got to at least pull out from [84:54] moment I I didn't I didn't make any [84:57] demands what a lot of people don't [84:59] understand about hanging up on somebody [85:02] is we usually hang up on people and [85:05] we've lost [85:06] it but the other side is just like [85:09] startled a little by like wait a minute [85:11] did did you just hang up on me so your [85:15] irritation is nowhere near as heavy as [85:16] mine is you know that's a whole issue [85:19] about empathy what's your experience [85:20] what's my experience I got to know what [85:22] the difference is I can't get caught up [85:23] in my experience cuz I'm not going to [85:25] see yours and so in the in the [85:28] interaction that you were laying out [85:30] your principal purpose is to kick my ass [85:34] MH so I just you know it's like one you [85:37] know it's a boxer swinging at somebody [85:39] who's not you're now swinging at the air [85:42] it's a little exhausting for you yeah [85:44] it's going to be irritating but not [85:46] maddening buys me a little bit of time [85:49] I'm just we're going to reset you're [85:50] going to call [85:51] me and then I'm going to see where we're [85:53] at when when you call [85:55] me so you want to keep going you want [85:58] now that I've laid it all out to you now [86:01] you want to know what's going on cuz I [86:02] can I can already feel like what you [86:04] were doing to me I'm like and cuz I was [86:06] cuz I remember last time you were like [86:09] so at me like that you're like I don't [86:11] care what you say I'm not telling you my [86:13] name and I'm like [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] wasn't think and [86:15] I'm like sounds like you're mad he's I [86:16] don't give a f you're like and I can [86:19] feel it like what you were doing was a [86:22] complete redirect of what I was was [86:24] thinking and you took me off like I [86:26] think like the second or third time I [86:27] did it you took me off where I asked the [86:29] question back and I was like ah he got [86:30] me on that one so I gave in to the you [86:32] said well how do you expect me to do [86:33] that I didn't care how you do that like [86:35] I actually answered your question and [86:37] and see that's actually good for me to [86:39] know because um in in business deals [86:42] like how am I supposed to do that might [86:45] be the single most game-changing [86:47] phrase across the board in business [86:50] negotiations especially when you're [86:52] dealing with a difficult adversary a lot [86:54] of people even if the adversary is not [86:56] difficult they they'll vastly change the [86:59] conversation in an [87:01] instant in eight out of 10 times which [87:04] is a ridiculously high success rate so [87:08] what happens when they how am I supposed [87:09] to do that they're using that they're [87:11] rocking and rolling and then suddenly [87:12] somebody comes back with I don't care [87:14] how you do it that's your problem just [87:15] like what you did yeah and people come [87:18] back to us and say it didn't [87:21] work and I'll say no as a matter of fact [87:24] did work how am I supposed to do that as [87:26] a diagnostic for PO for potential [87:29] implementation [87:33] collaboratively what that guy just told [87:35] you is he's never going to collaborate [87:37] with you so it's just a sign that this [87:40] deal probably isn't going to happen in a [87:41] good way it's not going to happen in a [87:43] good way now it's your it's your [87:45] decision now you you you wondered [87:48] whether or not you had a highly [87:51] transactional highly adversarial person [87:54] now you [87:56] know going from wondering to knowing is [87:59] always a good thing now the other thing [88:02] about working using a skill that works [88:03] so well so often is like when it when [88:06] you got a different outcome people are [88:07] just like wow I don't know what happened [88:10] and never happen before because the [88:11] success rate so high I get I'm talking [88:14] to an executive an extremely high level [88:17] negotiation lots of money on the table [88:19] and he's how am I supposed to do that [88:21] and the guy says I don't care how you do [88:23] it I don't care if you get fired I don't [88:24] care what happens to you you're going to [88:27] do it and he was so thrown he actually [88:31] get had to get up and leave the room and [88:33] he came back to me after the fact and [88:35] says you know it didn't work I'm said [88:37] all right so the bad the bad news is it [88:40] did work it G it's a [88:43] diagnostic you now know exactly who [88:46] you're dealing with yeah now the next [88:48] move after that with that that kind of [88:50] you need to find out if it's [88:51] manipulation or they're actually under [88:54] overwhelming pressure so if somebody [88:56] comes back I don't care I don't care how [88:58] you do it I don't care if you get fired [89:00] your first answer to that is [89:03] wow it sounds like you're under a lot of [89:05] pressure because that's exactly how [89:07] somebody's going to react who's under [89:10] extreme pressure their head is on a [89:12] chopping block you need to know is their [89:15] head on a chopping block or they [89:16] manipulating me again I got to know two [89:20] vastly different counterparts M I got to [89:23] know which one I'm dealing with with so [89:24] if I say to you sounds like you're under [89:27] an extreme amount of pressure if that [89:30] doesn't relieve how you're coming at me [89:34] instantly then it's [89:38] manipulation now I know who I'm dealing [89:40] with yeah now do I want this do I have [89:43] to have this deal maybe the boss says if [89:45] I don't get this deal I'm fired or maybe [89:48] this is critical to the survival of the [89:49] company cool you could make that deal [89:54] but it's that old the metaphor about the [89:57] scorpion and a frog frog lets a scorpion [90:01] on its shoulders and the scorpion stings [90:03] them anyway they both [90:04] drown Scorpion's never going to change [90:07] you just don't let them on your [90:08] shoulders I love that I haven't heard of [90:10] that one before I'm going to steal that [90:13] one I love it Chris this has been [90:15] amazing uh having you on again and that [90:17] was so cool to reverse it so for anyone [90:20] watching listening to this you got to go [90:21] back and watch our first episode we did [90:22] cuz then they can see the live [90:25] um role play that compare compare the [90:26] role play complet different and just see [90:28] you kill it yeah hang up on me oh I love [90:31] it so where can everybody find you on [90:34] social media everything you guys do the [90:36] Black Swan all right so uh on Instagram [90:39] I'm at the FBI [90:40] negotiator uh the [90:42] website is blackswan ltd.com BL a c k s [90:47] SW an [90:48] ltd.com buy the book never split the [90:51] difference never split the difference [90:52] how many you've sold a lot of that now I [90:54] think globally it's over 4 million yeah [90:56] I think last time we you were one or 2 [90:58] million I saw that the other day I'm [90:59] like good on you 4 million it's [91:01] incredible the it sells in every country [91:05] it's in [91:07] 36 countries 33 languages because people [91:11] universally want to be understood buy [91:13] the book take the master [91:16] class those are your two [91:19] cornerstones then after that if you [91:22] subscribe to our newsletter when you're [91:24] ready there'll be more training there [91:26] for you and if you go to the website you [91:29] find out about the newsletter it's free [91:31] it's complimentary it's actionable you [91:33] get it every week you need skill [91:36] maintenance and get to the point where [91:38] you're delighted to be in negotiations [91:40] imagine what it's like to always be [91:43] delighted to be in a negotiation it's a [91:44] lot of fun I love it man um all right [91:47] final question I would have asked you [91:49] this last time so I can't remember what [91:51] your question your answer was so we'll [91:52] see if it's changed if you were to go [91:54] back to your 18-year-old old self and [91:56] give him 30 seconds of advice what would [91:58] it be it's probably just the same answer [92:00] be nicer be nicer [92:03] um that advice whether you're assertive [92:06] you're an analyst or you're accommodator [92:08] I [92:09] realize your default type how you're [92:12] wired I'm a natural born [92:14] assertive I'm not changing who I am I'm [92:17] just being nicer in the implementation [92:18] I'm sticking to my core values I'm [92:21] learning I'm making [92:22] mistakes but as an assertive generally [92:25] speaking we cause a lot of problems for [92:27] ourselves I just dealing with us is like [92:30] getting hit in the face with a brick if [92:31] you're an accommodator your relationship [92:34] you're hope oriented you you're nice [92:36] that advice doesn't do you any good if [92:39] you're an accommodator you know stick to [92:41] your guns a little bit [92:42] more if you're an analyst the analysts [92:46] in regret they they they came off they [92:49] need to be a little nicer too but for [92:51] different reasons analysts come off as [92:53] cold and and distant everybody thinks [92:55] they don't care andless [92:57] care but their natural tone is to come [93:00] off is cold and distant so for me as an [93:02] assertive being nicer is would have got [93:05] me a lot of mileage

===FILE=== ZwgndW0CCF4 - Chris Voss - Author of Never Split the Difference.txt
https://youtu.be/ZwgndW0CCF4
Chris Voss - Author of Never Split the Difference.

[0:00] cool afternoon everybody this is John [0:03] bells make it happen Monday is hopefully [0:04] all had a fantastic weekend I did [0:08] because I was preparing for this podcast [0:11] and I am very honored to introduce our [0:14] guest today who shouldn't really need an [0:17] introduction to my audience because I [0:18] talked about him a lot but I'd like to [0:20] introduce everybody to Chris Voss the [0:23] founder of the Black Swan group and [0:25] author of one of the best negotiation [0:28] books on the planet never split the [0:29] difference Chris how's it going today [0:30] thanks Jenn it's going really well [0:32] thanks for having me on I really [0:34] appreciate you taking the time here and [0:35] one things I want to kind of start with [0:37] was Black Swan that the whole concept [0:40] itself could you and how it relates to [0:43] negotiation could you the audience here [0:45] on the concept of Black Swan and and [0:47] kind of white swans versus nobody ever [0:49] thought there was and how it relates to [0:51] negotiations yeah well you know the idea [0:54] on two levels little things that make a [0:57] big difference the impact the highly [0:59] improbable stuff that would change [1:02] things in ways that no one ever expected [1:03] you to change so the negotiation [1:07] techniques are counterintuitive really [1:11] such as you know not even balling with [1:14] the word yes I mean how do you do that [1:16] and have a massive impact on how [1:18] effective yours in negotiator and then [1:21] also the idea that the tiny little [1:23] pieces of information that'll make all [1:25] the difference in the world that the [1:27] other side is holding on till you just [1:28] get it out of them you know that that's [1:32] so it's on two levels a dual metaphor if [1:34] you will I like it and so it the idea is [1:37] like you know and I think the original [1:39] thing of Black Swan was nobody ever [1:42] everybody always assumes swans were [1:44] white right and so there was that [1:45] perception and then all of a sudden [1:47] somebody saw Black Swan it was like holy [1:48] [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] like what's that all about and it [1:51] came out of nowhere and it reshaped [1:52] people's mind says so is it our goal to [1:54] try to uncover those black swans [1:55] throughout the negotiations yeah [1:57] absolutely and and and then does this [1:59] accept that they're there I mean when [2:02] we're training people in negotiation if [2:04] you don't if you can't write down [2:05] something new that you learned in the [2:08] interaction that surprised you you [2:09] didn't do a good job cool [2:12] so with that what's what's the different [2:15] what do you see is the major differences [2:17] between hostas negotiations that you've [2:20] obviously been a part of and business [2:22] negotiations what are the mean outside [2:24] the bank the potential of death but what [2:27] are what do you see is the big [2:28] differences between hostage and business [2:31] negotiations hostage negotiations are [2:33] generally calmer no [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] really yeah I [2:39] got to tell you something you know in [2:42] hostage negotiation you know since we [2:45] learned we didn't know his emotional [2:47] intelligence but we learned how to dial [2:49] into people faster with some [2:52] neuroscience tools emotional [2:54] intelligence tools they really tend to [2:56] be they tend to be calmer I mean [2:58] business people have far more stories of [3:02] people screaming at him yelling and I'm [3:04] storming out of the room trying to [3:06] destroy negotiations then any of the [3:08] hostage negotiators I ever worked with [3:10] did and it's just just crazy if you [3:13] think about it but if if you the idea is [3:16] to use really tactical emotional [3:19] intelligence from the beginning that it [3:20] makes sense that it that ours are calmer [3:23] and and probably more effective overall [3:25] and is it because I my assumption here [3:29] on on houses is that they might start [3:32] really emotional but then I mean they [3:34] might start really aggressive but then [3:36] through some tactical stuff you can kind [3:37] of calm down and come to an agreement [3:39] whereas business do they do they keep [3:41] the emotions throughout or do they keep [3:43] the hostility throughout well people get [3:48] mad when they don't when they're not [3:49] heard I mean it seems like ridiculously [3:54] obvious but very few business people go [3:58] into a negotiation to hear the other [4:01] side out because they're so determined [4:02] to be hurt I got a case I gotta make I [4:06] got a value proposition I got a give I [4:07] got an argument I have to make I have to [4:10] explain to them what my position is and [4:14] you know the Stephen Covey advice from [4:16] from way back seek first to understand [4:18] and be understood this is a tactical [4:20] application of that you know seek first [4:22] to demonstrate understanding in order to [4:25] be understood [4:26] I'd get my point across much quicker I [4:29] can get it into your brain if I know [4:31] that the biggest obstacle to you here in [4:33] my case is you have to be heard out [4:36] first I mean it's just it's it's so [4:40] stupid that it's so true but you know [4:43] we'll progress faster by applying these [4:45] ideas and business negotiations [4:47] you know we tell people we accelerate [4:49] their deal-making ability we save a [4:50] massive amounts of time and that that's [4:53] how I mean it's a counterintuitive [4:54] approach so why do you think that is why [4:57] do you think we've been wired in [4:58] business to be so I guess opinionated or [5:03] forceful with our mentality of why we [5:06] are so valuable and why you should do [5:08] business with us is there something that [5:09] is that we've done as organizations from [5:12] a training standpoint or an onboarding [5:14] standpoint that has wired us to be that [5:16] way I think there's a couple things out [5:18] there that have contributed to the [5:20] problem [5:21] you know this whole nonsense about the [5:23] yes momentum or momentum selling where [5:26] you know yeses are micro agreements and [5:29] and you get a bunch of micro agreements [5:32] on the other side and actually call them [5:33] tie downs yeah they and they can't get [5:36] away so it's this idea that you're gonna [5:38] tie the other side down with a series of [5:40] yes oriented questions which is [5:42] basically you trying to make your case [5:44] in some fashion as if the other side [5:46] doesn't know what you're doing right I [5:48] mean that that's so stupid and it's so [5:50] commonplace that's part of it and then [5:53] for whatever reason and I'm talking to [5:55] an executive probably about two or three [5:56] years ago and he said yeah I went to [5:58] this negotiation training and they said [6:00] make sure the other side other side [6:03] understands your position that's your [6:06] you know make sure they understand your [6:08] position I thought think about in [6:11] practicality if that's your goal then [6:14] it's two sides talking at each other and [6:17] trying to make sure the other side gets [6:19] their position and which then means [6:21] nobody's gonna get the other side's [6:23] position because you're so determined to [6:25] be understood first instead of bit of [6:28] understanding and I think that's that's [6:30] probably the other contributor to it and [6:33] so does that because because I've always [6:35] been taught that win-win right [6:37] that you want that win-win so I know the [6:39] bunch of yeses I want come back to that [6:41] but then the mentality of going in [6:42] win-win you talked about how we we need [6:47] to understand and to me in business [6:51] negotiations the goal is win-win but [6:54] you're saying the mentality of that is [6:55] bad could you walk me through why the [6:57] mentality of walking into a negotiations [6:59] with a win-win mentality is a bad thing [7:01] yeah well first of all if you got a [7:03] win-win mentality praat you're [7:04] vulnerable to being taken advantage of [7:06] yeah and so and since and since you are [7:09] vulnerable there nothing to go shooters [7:11] out there that they're going to drop [7:13] those words win-win on you real early on [7:16] to see if you bite and and they're there [7:19] the deal there the throat cutters [7:21] I mean consistently when we come into [7:24] companies will be doing a training [7:26] session and some exact it's not in the [7:30] training session with the company will [7:31] stop me in a lunch room and he'll say I [7:34] hate you guys a bad-mouthing win-win and [7:37] I get taste but I make deals like that [7:38] all the time and I say well you know the [7:41] reality is you know the person offers to [7:44] meet you in the middle is often a poor [7:45] judge of distance and and they kind of [7:48] smile and they go yeah you know I say [7:52] win-win but I always anchor really high [7:54] so I can end up where I want yeah and so [7:57] these guys are out there I mean these [7:58] guys know that they're getting you and [8:00] and and anytime that somebody approaches [8:02] us if the words win-win come out of [8:05] their mouth in the first three minutes I [8:07] know they're trying to cut my throat I [8:10] know they want me to do it for nothing [8:12] else they are you know you're gonna get [8:14] so much exposure there's so much [8:16] opportunity if you if you come into [8:17] business with I mean that's a con job [8:19] let's try and take me hostage to the [8:21] futures what that is I mean you speaking [8:26] a lot more stuff than I do but a lot of [8:27] these conferences allows me to come and [8:29] speak for free at this point oh no we're [8:30] gonna get you in front of thousand [8:32] people and they're all gonna do business [8:33] with you and all that other stuff and [8:35] I'm just like yeah I know I've heard it [8:37] and and they're trying to get something [8:39] for free at the end of the day but isn't [8:41] it a good mentality to have I mean I [8:43] understand the actuality of if I were to [8:46] say to you there's some red flags [8:47] absolutely just like the word fair you [8:49] talk about a lot right [8:51] there there's the there's the tactical [8:53] when somebody says it but isn't it the [8:55] right mentality you have to try to walk [8:57] away because if somebody wins and [8:59] somebody live and this is where I kind [9:01] of get to the difference between hostage [9:02] negotiations and business negotiations [9:04] hostage negotiations they're really I [9:07] mean you again you know more than me [9:09] there's it doesn't seem like there's a [9:10] win-win it's like oh you don't go to [9:12] jail and I get my people back like yeah [9:14] right so you need to make sure that [9:16] those people don't die but in business [9:17] when we when we sign up especially in [9:20] the industry that I mostly sell into [9:21] which is SAS right and we're looking for [9:23] long term contracts with clients where [9:26] as customer success and all that other [9:27] stuff so if we if we don't get somewhat [9:31] of a win-win those renewals don't happen [9:33] there's animosity and the implementation [9:35] and all that other stuff so so how do [9:38] you rectify that yeah well so it's a [9:42] difference between the outcome and have [9:43] a process felt okay um first of all it's [9:47] got to be collaborative and secondly for [9:50] you to be able to continue to do [9:52] business with me at all you have to be [9:55] better off as a result of the deal [9:57] because even if you felt good about it [10:00] which you should you know I don't want [10:02] you to feel like you lost right so I [10:05] don't want you to feel like you lost I [10:06] want you to feel like you want and I [10:08] need you to be better off simultaneously [10:10] so but most people like I've run into so [10:15] many people that tell me about this you [10:17] know I you know I let me tell you about [10:18] this negotiation I had the other side [10:20] over a barrel [10:21] well if you're describing a negotiation [10:24] like that that means that they felt like [10:26] they lost the you hammered them and you [10:30] made sure they knew you hammered yeah so [10:34] you you cut your own throat because they [10:36] never want to do business with you again [10:38] so again it's it's it's the mentality [10:42] and focusing on the outcome and not [10:45] being taken hostage to a couple of ideas [10:47] you know first of all I don't want to be [10:49] taken hostage to yes in any way shape or [10:52] form I don't want to be taken hostage to [10:55] the future where you're you're painting [10:56] this rosy picture for me in the future [10:58] it's gonna happen and I also don't want [11:01] to be taken hostage by feeling like I [11:03] can't say no [11:05] as soon as soon as I've reconciled [11:06] myself to those ideas then there's [11:09] pretty chance we're gonna have a highly [11:10] collaborative negotiation and you're [11:12] gonna want to continue to do business [11:13] with me and is that the big thing that [11:16] people like what I found is that [11:18] especially some of the younger reps that [11:20] I train you know they think of [11:23] negotiations as in when the price comes [11:26] up right now we're negotiating I always [11:29] try to say look you were literally from [11:31] the minute someone picks up the phone [11:32] you're negotiating yeah right so so is [11:36] that one of the bigger mistakes that [11:37] people think is that they're not in a [11:38] negotiations from the minute they start [11:40] engaging with somebody yeah exactly the [11:42] most dangerous negotiation is the one [11:44] you don't know your rent and you know we [11:46] call that a law of negotiation gravity [11:49] you may not like it but gravity's there [11:52] and you step off that building you're [11:53] gonna smack the concrete one way or the [11:56] other anyway when you fall and if you [11:58] and if you're not aware of that then [12:00] yeah by the time price comes up you've [12:02] been in a negotiation for a long time [12:04] you didn't even know I mean when I first [12:06] started working on never split the [12:09] difference the first author I spoke to [12:11] or a writer that I tried to engage you [12:15] know we went back and forth on a process [12:18] of how we were gonna get together and [12:20] when this writer finally made said to me [12:23] you know what what the what she wanted I [12:26] just flat rejected it and no and and and [12:31] stopped talking to her I mean people are [12:33] startled when I stop talking to them [12:35] well we've been in a negotiation for a [12:37] long time she said you know I I thought [12:40] we were negotiating I you know I thought [12:41] you were gonna give me a counteroffer [12:42] and what I didn't say because I don't [12:45] have to but I like you we've been [12:48] negotiating since we first started [12:49] talking and you've been a pain in the [12:52] neck getting to this point for the last [12:55] two months and the best indicator future [12:58] behavior is past behavior and you've [13:01] demonstrated to me what implementation [13:03] with you is gonna look like every step [13:04] of the way and I don't want any part of [13:06] so yeah the most you've been negotiating [13:08] for a long time if you think the [13:09] negotiation is kicking in now did prior [13:12] it started when the phone was when the [13:14] phone was picked up when the cold call [13:16] was made right and so let's go back to [13:18] that getting to [13:18] no and I think you know from a tactical [13:20] standpoint when you're making you know I [13:22] deal with again when we talked about the [13:24] demographic sir I probably about 75% of [13:27] my audience are the SD rbdr as the ones [13:29] who are making the cold calls not [13:31] necessarily negotiating the entire you [13:33] know the the entire deal but negotiating [13:35] for that next step and so you talk about [13:38] the power of no and and starting a cold [13:41] call for instance and saying hey did I [13:43] catch you at a bad time and that no [13:46] gives them that like usually it's a well [13:49] no but what and that and you're saying [13:51] that no gives them power that no right [13:54] up front gives them makes them more [13:55] comfortable yeah the crazy thing is is [13:58] that anytime you try to get a yes out of [13:59] somebody if you asking a question [14:02] whether the answer you're driving for is [14:04] yes it stops them it makes them worried [14:07] what am I let myself in for what's the [14:09] hook how much have I committed myself [14:11] what am I not seeing if I say yes I mean [14:14] literally once I ask my girlfriend about [14:17] a shirt that I wore that she [14:20] complimented me on earlier in the day [14:22] and and I said so you say you like this [14:24] shirt right and she's like if I say yes [14:26] what am i laying myself in for she [14:28] literally said that but that's you know [14:31] that's what everybody thinks if I say [14:33] yes what am i letting myself in for now [14:36] as much anxiety as yes creates no does [14:40] the opposite like it's stupid that you [14:43] can simply flip the question and people [14:46] feel protected and safe when they said [14:48] no as a parent and when your teenage kid [14:50] says dad can I I say no I used to say no [14:54] before he finish the sentence but you [14:57] know I said once I said no I felt [14:59] protected and I'd say right now now tell [15:02] me again what you wanted because I felt [15:05] like I can now listen with no commitment [15:07] and as stupid is changing from have you [15:11] got a few minutes to talk to is now a [15:13] bad time I mean you could hear people [15:16] dial in and focus on you when they say [15:18] that they'll hesitate for a second [15:20] they'll clear their head and they'll say [15:21] now it's not a bad time or no it's not a [15:24] bad time but woody after the point is [15:27] you want their focus and yes creates [15:30] distractions and [15:32] and no clear distractions is there do [15:35] you see a difference between us is this [15:37] a good time versus is this a bad time [15:39] I never asked anybody if it's a good [15:41] time ever it's a you know it's [15:42] counterproductive because is this a good [15:45] time [15:46] well I don't know what you want to talk [15:47] about I don't know how long you want to [15:49] talk I don't know that I want to talk to [15:53] you I mean is now a good time to talk is [15:55] actually a solid four individual [15:59] questions do I want to talk to you do I [16:02] want to talk about what you want to talk [16:03] about how long are we gonna be on the [16:06] phone how do I get off of the phone you [16:09] can't answer that question without [16:11] having all those subsequent questions [16:13] running through your mind which means [16:15] you're completely distracted and that's [16:17] why something as simple as it's now a [16:19] bad time is a really bad question let's [16:23] um talk about the the preparation all [16:27] right some of you talked a lot about [16:29] there's a fine line between preparing [16:30] for any negotiations where it sometimes [16:33] you prepare too much and so there you [16:35] have assumptions and verses hypothesis [16:37] so I've always been taught you know walk [16:41] into a negotiation with as much [16:42] information as you can you understand [16:44] their situation you understand they're [16:45] off their options your competition all [16:48] of it so that what would would that [16:50] preparation you can go in and be ready [16:53] for whatever they throw at you but use [16:56] you say a couple of times in the book or [16:57] when I was reading and rereading it [16:59] again that you know sometimes less is [17:02] more when it comes to preparation for a [17:04] negotiation could you get it and then [17:07] let me answer that after I go back to [17:09] what I said a second ago because um I [17:11] think I misstated the question that I [17:13] said was bad have you got a few minutes [17:15] to talk is a bad question yes okay and I [17:19] think somehow I misstated a moment ago [17:20] okay so now let's go forward to [17:22] preparation all right so we got to look [17:25] at the negotiation process as an [17:27] information gathering process so you [17:29] don't gather your information and then [17:31] negotiate you gather some information [17:33] and then dive in to confirm there's [17:40] always going to be pieces of information [17:41] you can only get from the negotiation to [17:43] start with those are black swans [17:45] no matter how much research you do [17:48] there's no way you can find out what [17:51] time pressures they're really under [17:53] without talking to them no matter what [17:56] their take is on what you think their [17:58] problems are you can't find out if [18:01] there's anything about your value [18:03] proposition you can't research it and [18:07] find out exactly what they value most [18:10] without getting into the negotiation [18:13] there's there's no way you can find that [18:14] you can guess but you can't confirm so a [18:19] lot of people are scared to get in a [18:21] scare to get caught off-guard in the [18:23] negotiation you better get caught [18:25] off-guard like I said if you didn't [18:26] discover stuff in the in the interaction [18:28] then you're actually a horrible [18:30] negotiator you're not discovering [18:32] anything and then then you know like and [18:36] there was one guy in sales that was [18:38] applying I must have talked to him two [18:41] years ago he's he's getting the second [18:44] meeting 80% of the time and his job is [18:48] to get on the phone get a second meeting [18:49] and I said so you since you're applying [18:52] our skills among which is he starts out [18:54] with the question have I caught you in [18:55] the middle of something he said every [18:58] single time the answer is no but what's [18:59] this about and that sort of a response [19:01] tells you that they're completely [19:03] dial-in to you which is where you want [19:05] to be but I I asked him how much [19:08] research is he doing on are you doing [19:10] more research or less and he said oh [19:12] wait less I didn't tell me more and I [19:13] could ever find out anyway their [19:15] LinkedIn profiles not gonna tell me what [19:17] I need to know they're their Facebook [19:18] page not gonna tell me what I really [19:20] need to know I got to get it from them [19:23] so I totally any would be I guess what [19:29] what is what is too much right I mean [19:32] what are some of the core things that [19:33] you should prepare for I mean obviously [19:36] who you're talking to what their title [19:38] is and their background and those types [19:39] of things but I like what you talked [19:41] about as far as instead of role-playing [19:43] things you you create hypotheses or you [19:45] create like what's up what are all the [19:47] reasons they shouldn't do business with [19:50] us or something like that is that the [19:51] right is that what we should prepare for [19:53] you know I'm going to tell you something [19:55] and anybody that's ever asked me if I've [19:58] looked at their way [19:59] say the only answer they wanted out of [20:03] my mouth was yes like I have not had [20:07] anybody grill me on the content of the [20:11] website where they went to college the [20:14] anything beyond the first line of their [20:18] LinkedIn profile none of that stuff you [20:22] know there's this they want they're [20:23] dying to tell you all that stuff I mean [20:26] they're dying to tell you about it and [20:28] if you spend two weeks researching and [20:32] learning everything about them they [20:34] still want to tell you about it you just [20:36] blew two weeks yeah I mean it's insane [20:39] people are dying to tell you but I mean [20:41] you're proud of that LinkedIn profile [20:43] they don't want you to read about it [20:45] they want to brag about it to you so [20:47] minimal exposure to this information is [20:49] all you need [20:50] can I can I ask you some on that note [20:52] specifically though is that a byproduct [20:55] of their desire to want to talk or is [20:58] that a byproduct in the sales world of [21:00] bad sales and let me give you an example [21:02] historically before LinkedIn and before [21:05] website you know but not before websites [21:07] but before LinkedIn and stuff like that [21:09] back when I was selling or early 2099 [21:12] type of thing you know it was a valid [21:14] question or it was a valid statement to [21:17] get in front of you and say so Chris [21:18] tell me about your business right and so [21:21] it would promptly well we were founded [21:23] in this and we did that and that would [21:25] be their chance to tell you about their [21:26] business right now I actually think that [21:29] very generic phrase is very insulting [21:31] thing to say because they put so much [21:33] effort into telling the world about [21:34] their business there that you not being [21:37] prepared and understanding their [21:39] business and look I'm all for actual [21:40] contextual questions about your business [21:42] but not the broad statement tell me [21:44] about your business and I and I feel [21:46] like we've done the the prospects of [21:49] disservice and there so conditions [21:51] because most sales reps are still lazy [21:53] they don't do homework and so people [21:55] jump right into well John let me give [21:57] you a little background on us and and as [22:00] they're doing that like I appreciate [22:02] that but it's almost like I want to [22:04] preempt that and I've had it before [22:05] where I've been like look Chris I [22:06] appreciate you know I take a look at [22:09] your quick website I know where you will [22:10] found it I know what yeah now I have [22:11] some qualified oh absolutely [22:13] questions about your business but we [22:15] don't we don't have to go through the [22:16] history here and it's almost like they [22:19] you feel them being like oh okay [22:24] wait we can have a real conversation [22:25] here with a sales rep who's actually [22:27] done you know like isn't gonna ask me [22:29] the [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] questions so what are your [22:31] thoughts on on that where we've [22:33] conditioned them to do that versus their [22:35] true desire to talk about all right so [22:40] it's an interesting question and I think [22:43] it's really how salespeople get off [22:45] track because really me not none of your [22:51] clients care as much about whether or [22:55] not you know their history as to whether [22:58] you know their challenges now there's no [23:01] shortage of b2b surveys that say the [23:05] vast majority of buyers prefer to talk [23:09] to experts on the industry by definition [23:14] that means they prefer to talk to people [23:18] that know nothing about them an expert [23:22] doesn't know you from Adam an expert [23:26] understands the challenges of the [23:28] industry now it might be cool that you [23:32] know that I was founded in 2008 and I'm [23:37] founder CEO owner it's a family business [23:41] it might be cool again to give me warm [23:44] and fuzzies but if you don't know [23:47] anything about my industry as soon as I [23:49] find out you don't know anything about [23:50] the industry not me the industry I got [23:54] no time for you and I will dial somebody [23:57] up on the phone who's an expert on the [23:59] challenges in the industry who doesn't [24:02] have any idea about any of my history so [24:07] you know this idea you know [24:10] relationships are great but business is [24:13] more important than friendship [24:14] friendship should follow from business [24:16] not vice-versa I can love you as a [24:19] person our kids could play softball [24:21] together maybe you love coaching Little [24:24] League the same way I love coach [24:26] if you don't understand the challenges [24:28] of my industry you're wasting my time [24:30] so the what people need to research [24:33] which sales people need to research are [24:35] actual challenges as opposed to company [24:39] histories because what I was faced with [24:42] back in 2008 it's not when I'm faced [24:44] with today you could give me chapter and [24:47] verse about what happened when I founded [24:48] my company how long I've been in existed [24:50] I still have no idea whether or not you [24:53] understand the challenges I'm faced with [24:55] right now like so so let's kind of talk [25:00] about that as far as challenges versus [25:04] opportunities if you will I mean loss [25:06] aversion is huge okay and and it's what [25:09] is a three or four acts let me stop you [25:11] right there please it's not huge it's [25:14] the single driving decision factor it is [25:17] the biggest factor in decision making it [25:20] outweighs everything else and nothing [25:23] else is close the concept here is you'd [25:25] much I'd if you save two hundred [25:28] thousand or gained two hundred thousand [25:31] I'm sorry not lose two hundred thousand [25:33] or win two hundred thousand most people [25:35] would do everything not to lose the two [25:37] hundred thousand then get the [25:38] opportunity to win the two hundred [25:40] thousand is that effectively kind of an [25:41] easy breakdown of it yeah absolutely and [25:44] then I couldn't tell you what the [25:46] sources with somebody that was quoting [25:48] sales stats to me not long ago so I [25:50] satisfied with the person said that [25:52] seventy percent of buy decisions are [25:54] made to avoid loss not to accomplish [25:56] gain seventy percent to avoid a loss do [25:59] you think that's dependent on who in [26:02] this sense that I talked a lot about the [26:03] power line right people below and above [26:05] the power line people below the power [26:07] line are focused on today or yesterday [26:08] which is usually pain right because [26:10] they're in it whereas people above the [26:11] power line like decision makers those [26:13] other things are focused on the future [26:14] so my general guidelines to reps is you [26:19] know the the c-level executive doesn't [26:21] want to talk about feature function pain [26:23] stuff because that's what they delegate [26:25] to they want to talk about where am I [26:27] going like how are you gonna help me get [26:29] to where I want to be which is aligning [26:30] with their priorities so do you think [26:32] that loss aversion is as strong with a [26:35] with an executive leader who's trying to [26:38] bring a company to the next level over [26:39] the next twelve [26:40] twenty-four months what are you talking [26:41] about what their vision is and their [26:43] fear over losing that vision aren't you [26:45] fair enough [26:47] Sina and that's why you gotta be real [26:49] careful over assuming that you know what [26:51] their their loss is okay and that's why [26:55] you know hostage negotiation techniques [26:57] are designed to get into somebody's head [27:00] and find out what's in there [27:01] right you know we got we got to get in [27:04] there we got to find out what's in there [27:05] and simultaneously they're the same set [27:07] of techniques that you can get in there [27:09] you know you've gotten permission to get [27:12] in and find out what their vision is [27:13] with the fear of losses and the way you [27:17] got in gives you the opportunity to make [27:18] some changes because of the way that you [27:21] got in it gives you the opportunity to [27:23] have what we call trust based influence [27:25] so you know the the executive like if [27:30] he's got his eyes fixed on growing to a [27:33] hundred million dollars in the next two [27:36] years and he's got a path what he's [27:39] afraid of is not as losing that [27:41] opportunities in that growth and so that [27:43] the fear of loss saying you gotta be [27:44] careful about where your assumptions [27:46] that you're making and then also you got [27:48] to be really careful about how you wield [27:50] that power how you get into [27:52] understanding what that potential loss [27:53] is takes you from being someone who's a [27:57] trusted adviser to someone who's trying [27:59] to take them hostage so I mean it it's [28:04] really as a matter of definition but [28:05] they're there it doesn't matter where [28:07] you are in the world the overriding [28:10] driver of decision-making so much so [28:13] that's why in a book we call it bending [28:15] reality yeah because you've been [28:16] people's reality when you understand [28:18] what the losses that they're trying to [28:20] avoid are and is this more of them is [28:26] this almost always a personal thing as [28:28] it relates to that person when you're [28:30] talking negotiations cuz you know we've [28:32] all been taught like people buy on [28:33] emotion they back up with facts right so [28:35] when you're selling and first of all I [28:39] wanted to see if you believe that second [28:41] of all if you do or don't when you're [28:44] when you're negotiating with somebody is [28:46] is your goal to understand the personal [28:49] drivers of that person to be able to [28:51] uncover this or is it really more to [28:52] focus on the business drivers [28:54] yeah well the dominating decision is [28:57] gonna be how it affects them personally [28:58] what's in it for me how you gonna help [29:00] me you know and that's why and if it [29:02] wasn't that I mean executives and [29:04] business people and you know contracts [29:06] people you know across the board no one [29:08] would ever make a stupid decision that [29:11] would hurt their company but when it [29:13] comes to answer you know people are [29:14] people are worried about themselves [29:15] first and depending upon the company [29:18] environment you know it might not be a [29:20] team atmosphere you know they you know [29:23] the culture code Daniel Daniel Coyle [29:30] yeah hey culture code and talent code [29:33] two great books by the same guy he talks [29:36] about I think the staff that he quoted [29:39] that only six percent of people a [29:41] business people know their company's [29:44] values six percent Wow [29:49] if that's true and it's probably pretty [29:52] close then this is not a team oriented [29:56] culture so they've got to be out for [29:57] themselves you don't even know what the [29:59] company's values are your executives [30:01] aren't living it if your executives [30:04] aren't living the values then you you [30:06] better you're looking out for yourself [30:08] because the other people are not looking [30:09] out for you they're looking out for [30:10] themselves I mean cultured cultures a [30:12] dicey issue and that a lot of people [30:15] overlook well we should think as a team [30:18] we should think as a team it makes it's [30:20] only smart to think as a team yeah it's [30:23] true but should you know it's a if [30:25] you're saying the word should that means [30:29] that reality and philosophy are not [30:33] lined up or out of alignment so I've [30:35] been talking a lot about values recently [30:37] so you kind of struck a nerve there [30:38] first of all why don't most organism in [30:41] there's mission statement vision [30:42] statement stuff but why don't you think [30:44] more companies define and live their [30:47] values from a from a leadership [30:49] standpoint I well it takes a lot of [30:52] effort it's a hard thing to do [30:53] and you also become fear driven and you [30:56] know have did you define a few stuff and [31:02] you know problem is [31:05] if they just it's it's hard to get him [31:08] to line up you know it's we focus on [31:11] that all the time I mean internally [31:13] under company we're always talking about [31:15] it now you know relatively new company [31:17] were family-owned business were you know [31:19] we're define ourselves as we go and we [31:22] know some companies that are really good [31:24] people out there I mean we just stopped [31:26] doing business with one company because [31:28] of values I don't know what their core [31:30] values are as articulated but I can tell [31:32] you the values that they live are [31:35] contrary to ours so with that my I said [31:40] this the other day on a panel you know [31:42] communities they would ask me about [31:43] building communities and I said that the [31:45] most important thing about a community [31:46] is that you you have shared values you [31:48] can argue you can debate we can we can [31:51] disagree as long as we have shared [31:53] values do you think that's the same [31:55] first of all do you agree with that [31:56] second well do you think that's the same [31:57] in business negotiations where you and I [32:01] at least from a value standpoint [32:03] treating people right not being an [32:05] [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] you know whatever those are like [32:07] we have to align at least a little bit [32:08] in order for this relationship to work [32:09] is that is that like a critical factor [32:11] to try to uncover yeah well we're never [32:14] gonna be able to implement and otherwise [32:16] you know and it can be they could be [32:19] little things like a company that we you [32:22] know we've had some value alignment [32:24] mismatch recently they've been very [32:27] successful lately so they're in the [32:31] entertainment industry so now their risk [32:35] aversion is high which means they're [32:38] scared to death of not having a success [32:41] you know we want to engage in something [32:44] with them where there's no guarantee of [32:46] success so they're horrified that [32:49] they'll drop something in the [32:51] entertainment industry it's not as [32:53] successful as the other things that [32:56] they've done now they're extremely rich [32:59] risk-averse they're no longer [33:00] entrepreneurial they're no longer [33:02] willing to take the risks that they were [33:05] willing to take three years ago they [33:07] throw something out there and say you [33:08] know we'll work like crazy we'll make it [33:10] successful you know it's it's like [33:12] somebody I can't you know on author [33:15] who's a lot who's had a great book who [33:16] refuses to do another one because [33:18] they're afraid this [33:19] we'll be as successful as the first [33:21] peoples fear of failure increases highly [33:23] after their successes and they lose [33:26] their entrepreneurial edge and that's [33:27] really the biggest problem with our core [33:29] value mismatch now which I pointed out [33:31] to him I said you know we're willing to [33:34] do this and it might not be that great [33:36] and I said you guys are terrified that [33:38] you'll drop something out there that's [33:40] not as successful as your last project [33:42] and then you'll be criticized over and [33:44] they went yeah yeah that's it exactly so [33:49] did their values change I think so I [33:52] think I think that's what happens with a [33:53] lot of people did they don't feel like [33:55] their values have changed and they [33:57] probably feel like the same people they [33:59] just haven't become aware of how [34:00] risk-averse they are right now so I've [34:04] really been trying to think this through [34:05] from a sales training but also for my [34:07] own approach of you know I talked when [34:09] we we do when we do prospecting for [34:11] instance look for triggers hey you know [34:13] they opened up a new office they [34:14] launched a new product and make a [34:15] connection to that say hey I saw that [34:16] happened you know we help companies [34:18] we're in that stage let's talk it's just [34:20] a you know personalized way but I've [34:21] been really toying around the idea of [34:23] trying to figure out how to align values [34:26] because I think once if I can come [34:28] across somebody who I can connect with [34:30] pretty much immediately because I can [34:32] tell their values are similar than me [34:33] similar to mine like I don't want say [34:35] the sale takes care of itself but man [34:37] it's so much easier to have that real [34:39] conversation and not [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] [34:41] conversation where it's you know real [34:42] surface oriented and I'm trying to [34:44] figure out how do I get to that early so [34:46] that so that I can get in and out of [34:48] deals faster with people who I know [34:50] share a core value of I is there [34:54] something you do to to uncover that part [34:57] early well not as we're probably looking [35:02] at the values right after the fact that [35:04] we try to figure out whether or not [35:05] there's a deal there anyway [35:07] okay this is something that we [35:10] discovered is a much bigger problem in [35:12] in a business community than we realized [35:14] before the book came out because we're [35:16] consulting on time now but you know for [35:19] example there's no such thing as an open [35:21] mind [35:21] period nobody that you encounter has an [35:25] open mind and b2b data out there now is [35:28] that 50% of people have made up their [35:33] and the buyers have made up their mind [35:34] before their first contact with a [35:35] salesperson half made up their mind [35:38] before they contact the salesperson and [35:40] nobody's closed rate is 50% which means [35:44] you know what's wrong with the math [35:46] problem well I came across a book to [35:49] challenge your sale recently they pegged [35:51] a number at 20% of opportunities that [35:54] come sales peoples way that come [35:56] businesses way are actually fake you [35:58] know they don't usually fake they have a [36:00] different different term but it's fake [36:01] opportunities people are doing due [36:03] diligence they're checking that you know [36:06] you're the competing bit they get [36:09] somebody they want to go with they need [36:10] three competing bids so they go with who [36:12] they want to go with they just want a [36:14] price with you they just want to terms [36:15] with you to prove that they can they're [36:17] doing due diligence is what they're [36:19] doing and in effect and why this number [36:22] is low is because in this survey they're [36:25] asking people how often they lie to [36:27] sales people now there's no way that [36:30] then they're inflating then amount of [36:32] time that they're lying to sales people [36:33] they're hedging on that if you know [36:36] nobody's gonna admit to all the times [36:37] that they like so there's that 20% [36:39] number has to be low to start with and [36:42] then then the second problem is there's [36:45] more b2b data out there that says that [36:48] even if they haven't made up their mind [36:50] there's somewhere between 70 and 80% of [36:53] the way through the decision-making [36:54] process before they talk to a sales [36:56] person and that's admitted I mean there [36:59] are a lot of people out there that I [37:00] think feel that they have an open mind [37:03] I'm willing to be talked into this [37:05] but I'm so prejudiced to begin with you [37:09] know I've made I've done so much [37:10] research that you know what you've [37:12] probably never had a chance at all so we [37:15] got to find out in the opening [37:17] conversation whether or not there's any [37:19] opportunity there at all and now we'll [37:24] talk about cultural values but you may [37:26] be just looking for free consulting or [37:28] due diligence and I got to know about [37:30] those things before putting more time [37:31] into us so that's I call that happy [37:34] years right the reps who hear what they [37:36] want to I think you have a dist [37:37] selective listening or whatever but I [37:39] call it happy years right they hear what [37:40] they want to hear the crank it's a deal [37:42] oh yeah I'm interested and we are [37:45] negotiations it's a really [37:46] simple but effective give get right so [37:50] what we do is we do brainstorm all the [37:53] games what are other things your clients [37:54] ask of you they want information you [37:55] want discounts on proposals or one ROI [37:57] and well all that stuff [37:58] prioritize it one to talk like 20 say [38:00] that's a number you know could be more [38:02] could be less but easy to give away hard [38:03] to give away and then flip it over and [38:05] say what do we want one of the gets all [38:07] right so we want so gives to the client [38:10] and then gets for us which is we want [38:12] decision process timeline signed [38:13] contract testimonial early late and then [38:16] match it up so when somebody asks for a [38:17] 5 I'm asking for a 5 in return [38:18] 10 10 we score deals right so I gave [38:20] away a 1 a 5 and a 6 I got a 2 a 4 and a [38:23] 7 that score 12 to 13 tells me how [38:25] healthy the deal is objectively and it's [38:27] works off of reciprocity which I know [38:29] you're a fan of which is when somebody [38:30] asks for something they feel obligated [38:31] to give you something in return the [38:33] funny thing is is when we get everything [38:36] right and don't give anything in return [38:38] sometimes reps that's half years but [38:41] what they're not realizing is if [38:42] somebody if you're not giving somebody [38:43] something that means a you're [38:45] consciously not doing it or B they're [38:48] not asking for anything and if they're [38:50] not asking for anything that's a that's [38:51] a dangerous sign so how do you prevent [38:54] happy years how do you prevent a rep [38:57] early on from hearing what they want to [38:59] hear as they as they enter a negotiation [39:03] because that that's what kills reps is [39:05] that those deals that they think they [39:07] say they're saying there's a chance [39:08] and so they sit in their pipeline [39:10] forever and those are the ones that the [39:12] managers get pissed off at month over [39:13] month because they they share what [39:15] they're so how do we prevent that well I [39:17] mean you got to you got to be willing to [39:19] challenge the contacts from the very [39:21] beginning I mean the question you got to [39:24] be willing to ask is like you know that [39:25] there are a lot of people out there now [39:28] we got a lot of competitors you get you [39:30] get people that are good I mean I'm [39:31] impressed with our competitors what made [39:34] you choose us now if they if they don't [39:40] give you an answer that you're in [39:41] trouble you know that I found you on [39:45] Google right yeah well they you know [39:48] they if they say I found you on Google [39:51] they haven't chosen you right or you [39:54] know a big one is will you tell me this [39:59] we're right back on [40:00] yeah you you you're in trouble now [40:05] you're in trouble [40:06] right now but you you hope that you have [40:11] such a great value proposition you can [40:13] win the day you hope these sales skills [40:14] are so good you could win the day and [40:16] you won't take you won't you won't [40:19] listen you know and that's the biggest [40:22] problem I mean the biggest thing is that [40:24] customers clients people who are buying [40:27] they hate not being listened to more [40:30] than anything else and yet every sales [40:33] person wants to make a case wants to [40:35] make a value proposition wants to tell [40:37] why they're the best choice that by [40:39] definition is not listening should you [40:42] almost disqualify more than you qualify [40:44] you should be ready to instantly [40:47] disqualify somebody now I think the [40:50] number is is well in excess of 50% so if [40:55] if that's any more true and we've got [40:57] clients now that we're coaching on this [40:59] you're telling us that the number can be [41:00] as high as 80% then just by sheer [41:04] numbers yeah you should be just [41:06] qualifying more than you talk to I mean [41:07] everybody out there you know some of the [41:09] stat and some of the stats out there 3% [41:12] of the 3% of the people there are you [41:15] should convert 3% then that means that [41:17] 95 97 percent of the meet is qualified [41:19] but nobody acts like that's the case [41:22] although everybody knows that those what [41:23] the stats are yeah that's unfortunate [41:26] because I think that we're in this world [41:28] of like short-term results which is [41:31] driving bad behavior which is preventing [41:33] people from you know what I mean wanted [41:35] like forcing all most reps especially [41:37] young ones who are inexperienced and [41:38] haven't gone through the heart of having [41:39] a huge pipeline that nothing closes in [41:43] you know they so we push them towards [41:45] these monthly things which drives bad [41:47] behavior so I don't I actually am I'm [41:50] worried that we're in this world where [41:52] we're in there almost a transition world [41:55] I think right now where it used to be a [41:57] numbers game and so that's kind of how [41:59] sales was approached in a lot of ways [42:00] and so kind of Gen Xers like that's how [42:04] we grew up I mean when I grew up in [42:05] sales was here's your quota here's your [42:06] territory there's a phone go okay right [42:09] now I think everybody understands [42:11] qualies the issue empathise qualities [42:13] the ants [42:14] empathy is the answer but we're stuck in [42:16] this old school mentality forcing [42:18] because it's way easier to coach towards [42:20] numbers like did you make your fifty [42:22] dials today did you hit your quota today [42:23] versus actually coaching on quality so [42:27] is there a way as managers for instance [42:30] we can help drive and help rubs drive [42:34] short-term results while having that [42:36] tactical empathy while having that [42:38] disqualification mentality especially in [42:40] you know you were a lot of publicly [42:42] traded companies you know what I mean if [42:43] they miss their numbers on a quarterly [42:44] basis you know all of a sudden Wall [42:47] Street comes down on them pretty hard so [42:48] are there things that you talk to people [42:50] about about how to put them in a [42:52] position to be able to listen while [42:56] still hitting their numbers and those [42:58] short-term results that we're looking [42:59] for yeah you know I mean it's it's [43:02] stupidly simple you know all you're [43:05] gonna do is change the way you evaluate [43:06] on me compensated nobody's willing to do [43:09] that I mean I I gave a keynote [43:12] presentation to a company the other day [43:14] that I'm really impressed with because [43:17] of their dedication to their clients [43:19] it's sa P and I'm sitting around with [43:22] them at dinner and I'm like wow you guys [43:25] you guys you guys learn fast you guys [43:28] seem to like each other [43:30] I mean I'm blown away at not only how [43:33] fast you guys learn but the fact that [43:34] you guys enjoy working together and one [43:37] of the executives said yeah well you [43:38] know one of our main core vices and we [43:40] can't let our clients fail which means [43:44] work they all unify over this great [43:46] purpose can't let you know because they [43:49] agree that they got to knock themselves [43:52] out for the clients so that goes back to [43:55] the value conversation right yeah but [43:57] and at the same time though you know in [43:59] in the train station they said alright [44:01] so how do we handle a procurement guy [44:04] calling us with two days left in the [44:07] course I said that's easy don't make the [44:12] deal [44:14] but value stop grading your people and [44:16] quarterly results you're taking your [44:17] people hostage if you're putting them on [44:20] quarterly results I Got News for you [44:22] that procurement guy he's praying to God [44:26] because he thinks he's got leverage for [44:29] 48 hours and he or she is not prepared [44:32] to wait three more months for this [44:33] window to come back up so in reality the [44:36] person on the other side is a lot more [44:38] scared than you are if you're just [44:39] willing to accept that that they think [44:41] they're done if they don't cut the deal [44:43] with you next 48 hours but they're [44:45] taking themselves hostage over quarterly [44:47] results and you just said something you [44:49] know Wall Street's holding these on [44:50] these people to quarterly results only [44:53] if you care for Wall Street bad-mouth [44:55] sure or only if you care if you stop fix [44:58] dips by five five cents and as soon as [45:03] you pull yourself as soon as you stop [45:05] taking yourself hostage over quarterly [45:06] results as soon as you stop taking your [45:09] people hostage over quarterly results [45:10] now they can perform now now now with [45:14] two days left in a quarter they're not [45:16] scared to death they're they're willing [45:18] to wait so how would you do how if you [45:20] would have built a company and [45:22] compensate what to compensate you know [45:25] we do have to drive results on a [45:27] consistent basis right so it all doesn't [45:28] happen at the end of the year or [45:30] something like that so kind of in a [45:32] utopic scenario if you well what would [45:35] your best approach to organizations be [45:38] as far as compensating sales reps on [45:39] their on their results there's a fair [45:41] amount of data out there that sales were [45:43] up to do better if they just don't [45:45] straight salary okay you know so you [45:50] know take a look at the people that are [45:52] working for you [45:53] you know everybody responds to [45:55] compensation differently I mean be [45:57] willing to tailor your compensation some [46:00] person just some guys just want to work [46:02] on Commission they wanted all the sky's [46:03] the limit you know you got that guy guy [46:06] or gal fine they thrive under that [46:09] environment some people just want to [46:11] know that they can make their monthly [46:13] mortgage payment and if if they're [46:15] satisfied they can make that payment [46:17] then work 24/7 for you I mean you know [46:21] when I when I was with the FBI I was on [46:23] straight salary I was I worked my last [46:27] seven years [46:28] the job I don't know that I had two days [46:30] off in a row because I loved what I was [46:33] doing I mean I was into it [46:34] I mean people used to say to me you [46:37] Breeze what you do I didn't have to [46:39] worry about how much money was coming in [46:41] the door I knew exactly how much money [46:42] was coming in on my paycheck every two [46:45] weeks and I was the type of person that [46:47] would just knock myself out because they [46:50] didn't have to worry about the amount of [46:51] money that was coming in so you know be [46:54] willing to tell your compensation to [46:56] your people so that they could try and [46:58] then have an ongoing conversation with [47:01] them and make sure they continue to [47:03] thrive because there's a pretty good [47:04] chance that however you dial it up for [47:06] them at the very beginning is gonna be [47:08] wrong or at least need adjustment so say [47:12] all right so here's a compensation [47:13] package that we're gonna start out with [47:14] and then let's talk about how things are [47:17] gone in three months in four months in [47:20] five months to see whether or not you're [47:21] thriving and let's make the adjustments [47:24] so you can thrive I mean and look I'm [47:26] running my company and that's the way [47:27] that that's we're changing our [47:29] compensation slightly tweaking it all [47:31] the time because we want our people to [47:33] thrive going back to that procurement [47:37] example that you used and and also bad [47:41] behavior by reps when I one of the [47:44] things I come across all the time and [47:45] and I you know biggest challenge I see [47:47] sales reps having is creating urgency [47:50] like how do you how to create urgency [47:52] when it's seemingly not there right when [47:55] when they don't have to do it it's a [47:58] like to have not a must have those types [47:59] of things right [48:00] what do you try to do to uncover urgency [48:05] so that the reps don't default to end of [48:08] the month discounting and those type of [48:09] sad sad things any insights on urgency [48:13] in the issue what's top of mind with [48:16] people and what can you count on to [48:19] consistently either people you know the [48:21] great question you know what's keeping [48:23] you up at night all right so you yeah [48:25] you get you got to get in their head and [48:27] find out what's keeping them up at night [48:28] and then you know you know there's a [48:31] presumption here that what you're [48:32] offering actually has value I mean one [48:35] of the one of the great your greatest [48:36] sales pitches I ever heard a gentleman [48:39] had a company that put together a [48:40] compensation package [48:42] retirement packages for executives you [48:44] know effectively golden handcuffs no we [48:47] put together such a great package for [48:49] you you're never gonna leave [48:50] so was pension investing golden [48:55] handcuffs if you will so his pitch to [48:57] companies wasn't here's how much money I [48:59] can make for you here's how much I can [49:01] help you retain your executives he said [49:03] let us take a look at the package that [49:05] you've got now and we'll compare what we [49:08] could do versus what you're doing and [49:11] then he would come back and say all [49:12] right stay where you are now don't [49:15] change a thing and this is how much it's [49:17] gonna cost you every day okay that keeps [49:24] people up at night when the status quo [49:26] you need top of mind when the static [49:29] when your vision of what's going on now [49:32] when will you perceive the status quo to [49:34] be to be costing you every day day in [49:38] and day out that's what keeps people [49:39] tough that's what keep saying keeps [49:41] things top of mind and so cuz I believe [49:45] that you know there's I don't know if [49:46] you follow Gong but you know the gong [49:47] dot IO blog I don't so if you caught a [49:52] lot of stats go to Gong IO and check out [49:55] their blog they got one blog post it's [49:57] fifty five sales tips that the best [49:59] sales tips you've ever read and it's and [50:00] it's off the charts because if they do [50:02] they use artificial intelligence to [50:04] analyze phone calls like millions of [50:05] phone calls that reps make through their [50:07] system and they tailor like what you [50:09] know great people do versus what average [50:11] people do and one of their things is you [50:14] know the number one goal that we have as [50:15] sales professionals is to get you to it [50:17] before I can sell you anything I have to [50:20] get you to agree that status quo is not [50:22] okay like you have to make a change and [50:24] if you can if I can't convince you that [50:27] you have to make a change then the rest [50:29] of that stuff doesn't matter so there [50:31] for instance like selling to the c-suite [50:32] it's about coming up with your Nexus [50:34] like what do you believe that that that [50:37] in this industry that is a polarizing [50:39] statement that either people get people [50:41] to say holy [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] yes or no I completely [50:43] disagree so in our world right now you [50:46] know sales training one of my nexuses is [50:48] I think sales methodologies of [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] [50:51] I think the historical sales methodology [50:54] is [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] [50:55] and because if you're not in agile sales [50:58] right now and constantly iterating and [51:00] trying new things you're going to be a [51:01] dinosaur if you subscribe to any one [51:03] singular methodology now there are [51:06] people out there that are flat-out [51:07] methodology people you know I'm a Miller [51:09] Heiman guy I'm at as guy I'm a sailor [51:11] guy that type of stuff and going back to [51:13] values like you and I aren't on the same [51:15] page so let's stop talking now but once [51:17] you hit that Nexus then it's what's the [51:19] statistic that says we're you know [51:22] whether you like it or not the industry [51:24] is changing and so you have to make a [51:26] change and then you talked about your [51:27] unique piece there and then you share a [51:29] story so it's kind of a four step [51:31] process of selling to the c-suite which [51:32] I'm a huge fan of so do you agree that [51:35] it's our first job to get people to [51:36] commit to the fact that they have to [51:38] make a change [51:40] well I the status quos got to be the [51:47] problem yeah yeah the status quos got to [51:51] be the source of loss how big of a [51:53] losses that have to be in order to get [51:56] you to move it's interesting question I [52:01] mean lost things twice as much as as an [52:03] equivalent game according to prospect [52:06] theory would say won a Nobel Prize for [52:08] and behavioral economics and Danny [52:10] Kahneman then gave an interview where he [52:12] said that it's actually five times as [52:16] much we just lowered the number to two [52:18] because we want to fewer arguments from [52:21] our academic colleagues so in any loss [52:25] is a distorted perception so you got to [52:28] find out what's in the other guy's head [52:30] you know guide generic guy or gal and [52:33] it's not something you can calculate in [52:35] advance because your calculations are [52:38] not bent by the feeling of loss the way [52:41] it is when a person you're talking to [52:44] and so there's a lot so so I'm trying to [52:47] focus a lot more these days on like [52:48] impact questions like how can I ask [52:50] questions that uncover the impact of you [52:52] making this or not making this decision [52:54] but what are your thoughts on like [52:56] quantifying that impact and like you [52:58] know and going to down the road of like [53:00] ROI calculator type stuff because and [53:04] you know some reason I ask is because [53:06] I've always looked at our live [53:09] calculator [53:09] even if a rep uses my numbers and all [53:12] that other stuff you know okay fine that [53:15] dollar figure good but there's still [53:17] something that I don't trust about it so [53:20] what's your stance on quantifiable pain [53:23] if you will and then using that but but [53:27] it's not always as obvious that now I [53:30] don't I don't think you can do it [53:31] not at all I mean because that and [53:36] here's an example one of the one of the [53:40] negotiation cases at Harvard that Wiest [53:42] exercise all the time is called radio [53:44] station the sale of a radio station [53:45] where the guy who was selling was just [53:49] not taking any sort of offer whatsoever [53:52] for his radio station that ended up [53:54] being a real case that Roger Fisher that [53:59] you know the author of getting to yes [54:00] actually solved the interesting thing [54:03] about Roger Fisher is his emotional [54:04] intelligence was through the roof there [54:07] isn't any emotional intelligence in [54:09] getting to yes it is utterly rational [54:11] and people are utterly emotional which [54:14] is why unfortunately getting Jess is not [54:16] going to do any good but I remember [54:18] hearing this story and when Roger Fisher [54:21] solved this and got the guy to sell the [54:22] radio station you would talk to the guy [54:25] the guy said my wife's gonna kill me if [54:29] I sell this radio station so how do you [54:33] calculate that ROI yeah I forget I think [54:38] gary vaynerchuk's the one who says how [54:39] do you calculate the ROI of your mom you [54:42] know what I mean I mean so what what's [54:44] really driving at people it is not gonna [54:48] be quantifiable in a spreadsheet and you [54:52] can sit down and run every number that [54:55] they give you and have them agree that [54:58] everything about your analysis is [55:00] flawless and it's gonna cost them this [55:03] amount of money and it's not going to [55:06] matter to them because of what's really [55:07] driving them is gonna be some emotional [55:09] factor that you can't put in a [55:11] spreadsheet and so with that to your [55:15] point of you know going back to urgency [55:19] they're losing you know by not doing [55:23] this [55:23] losing every day like that that example [55:25] that you used right there okay so great [55:29] I'm losing you know by not doing this [55:30] I'm yeah okay I'm losing a hundred [55:32] thousand dollars a day what's missing is [55:37] that is there is there that the [55:38] emotional connection to it like hey I [55:40] don't like yeah that makes sense and [55:42] we're losing 100 hundred thousand [55:44] dollars a day by not doing this I get it [55:47] was there something else other than that [55:49] number that got that deal to go through [55:52] well yeah now if somebody if you if [55:55] you're not making a case based on your [55:57] numbers and you're not paying any [55:58] attention to what's driving them okay so [56:01] yeah you you you got to you got to get [56:03] in there and find out what's going on I [56:04] mean this gets us back into get into [56:07] their head and find out what they're [56:08] really seeing and you're not gonna be [56:11] able to find that out unless you unless [56:13] you come in with an emotional [56:15] intelligence approach which assumes that [56:17] people are not rational and that you [56:20] know it's it's the iceberg is the cliche [56:23] to everything but the unfortunately the [56:26] reason it keeps coming up is there's [56:28] more here than meets the eye and your [56:31] analysis is based on what meets the eye [56:33] so how does it possible your analysis [56:36] could be accurate I could keep this [56:39] conversation going forever I got one [56:42] more question that I'm personally [56:44] curious about you talk a lot about [56:45] mirroring where you say the last three [56:48] words or what somebody says and the [56:49] power of that and then you just shut up [56:53] mirroring versus layering example when [56:56] you object okay or when you say [56:59] something that's like look we don't have [57:00] the budget for this right mirroring is [57:02] so you don't have the budget so let it [57:06] sit so layering would be helped me [57:09] understand what do you mean by you don't [57:10] have the budget is one more powerful [57:13] than the other because what you're both [57:14] trying to do is get them to talk more [57:16] and and really uncover the true like [57:18] meaning behind what they're saying there [57:20] is there a difference between that and [57:22] and do you see one as more valid than [57:24] the other in certain circumstances yeah [57:26] well yeah absolutely because two to [57:30] begin with if you're at the point where [57:32] somebody says we don't have a budget and [57:35] you say help me understand what do you [57:37] mean by you don't have the budget you're [57:39] telling them that you've not been paying [57:40] attention up to now kind of a very [57:45] simple example plate but you just see [57:47] what I'm saying like layering questions [57:48] does it tell me more about that could [57:50] you explain to me could you give me an [57:51] example of versus all that by the first [57:56] thing you said tell me more about that's [57:57] not a question it's command and then you [58:00] followed up with two straight yes [58:01] oriented questions with your trap [58:03] questions okay [58:04] but nobody wants to say yes to any [58:06] she hit me with what three straight bad [58:11] communication tag techniques okay that [58:15] tell me more about that it's not a [58:16] question it's a command it's a grant for [58:19] autonomy it's an attempt to take control [58:22] of a conversation taking control is [58:25] taking away somebody's autonomy which we [58:28] will die to preserve our time but when [58:31] you talk about calibrated questions [58:33] isn't don't you talk about how you want [58:35] to make the illusion of of them on in [58:39] control when you're actually in command [58:42] well we want to have the upper hand we [58:45] want to have control yes and and I'll [58:49] taste something else we don't try to get [58:51] information by asking questions these [58:52] questions to shape thoughts questioning [58:57] to gather information is a third of the [59:00] people that you run into will be so so [59:03] with it and two-thirds of them are not [59:06] gonna like it at all the very the very [59:08] analytical person every time you ask [59:10] them a question they stop and they think [59:13] I have to think through the implications [59:15] of every possible answer before I get [59:19] back to you so I can't answer you for at [59:22] least two days so yeah so so I mean we [59:28] don't really use questions alright so if [59:29] somebody somebody says what was that [59:32] it's too much what was your example [59:35] before so it's like it's we don't have [59:37] the budget for this yeah we don't have a [59:38] bunch of it this is out of our budget [59:40] range or something right so you you want [59:42] to demonstrate understanding what do [59:44] they tell you if they don't have the [59:45] budget for it they're telling you one of [59:49] two things either under pressure or what [59:54] you're offering is not delivering [59:56] adequate value the value alignment so a [60:00] demonstration of understanding would be [60:02] seek first to understand then be [60:04] understood demonstrate understanding [60:06] sounds like the value is just not there [60:09] for you they had just communicated to [60:14] you very clearly that something's wrong [60:17] with your proposition and [60:20] instead of you demonstrating any [60:22] understanding of that in any way shape [60:24] or form instead you want to challenge [60:26] them as if they weren't lessening help [60:30] me understand here well what's not here [60:32] for you which is equivalent I'm saying [60:33] you know you haven't been paying [60:35] attention so I'm gonna have to go back [60:37] over my value proposition again because [60:38] you're not paying attention so let me [60:40] let me see if I can isolate where you [60:42] weren't paying attention so I can go [60:44] back and correct you I mean that's what [60:46] you're communicating when you say help [60:47] me understand what about this isn't [60:49] valuable for you and and in most cases a [60:53] lot of people probably say it in a tone [60:55] of voice that indicates that you think [60:57] they're stupid yeah so but to say sounds [61:01] like the values is not here for you is [61:03] it is an indication of understanding and [61:07] it's an invitation to fix it and it's [61:11] taking responsibility on your side to be [61:14] to be responsive to them instead of them [61:16] being responsive to you and what you're [61:20] searching for is the that's right not [61:22] your right and well exactly at some [61:25] point of time you get you you you if [61:27] somebody saying your right to you [61:29] they're trying to finish the interaction [61:32] ago all you want gonna watch it's the [61:35] same reason why you don't say I [61:36] understand [61:37] cuz what's the what's the negative part [61:40] of me like after you tell me so just one [61:42] about summarizing and rephrasing back to [61:44] you but then after you tell me something [61:45] of me saying I understand what's the [61:46] danger of that well alright let's [61:49] pretend like you actually do understand [61:52] right but when you say that they're not [61:55] clear on what you understand I mean [61:58] you're trying to give them the Cliff [61:59] Notes version of it I mean how do they [62:01] if you say on I understand [62:03] how did they know how do they really [62:06] know that they got their points across [62:08] if you don't repeat back to them the [62:11] points that they in fact that across I [62:13] mean you know since we were kids we [62:15] played the telephone game you know tell [62:18] somebody a secret by the time you tell [62:20] for other people the secrets completely [62:22] changed I mean it's it's nearly [62:25] impossible to hear somebody's side of [62:28] things the first time and get it right [62:31] so to say I understand [62:34] if you do chances are let's see you [62:38] invest listener in the world chances are [62:41] you've got at 80% right and you're [62:43] taking a real risk on a percentage that [62:45] you got wrong so I understand is that's [62:48] just too nebulous you tell me that you [62:50] understand I'm not sure I'm getting a [62:53] warm and fuzzy feeling they actually do [62:55] in most cases I understand proceeds but [63:00] here's where you're wrong is it is it [63:06] okay to say let me make sure I heard you [63:08] correctly and then rephrase it back to [63:11] them or is there a better way of of [63:13] summarizing what you heard from them [63:15] that makes them more open so understand [63:17] that you really do understand no that's [63:19] not bad at all I mean you know we don't [63:21] coach people to say it like that there [63:22] are other ways of saying it I mean let [63:26] me make sure I heard you correctly as a [63:27] command and it's a it's a grab at [63:31] control again and it's to take autonomy [63:33] from the other side and you know i mean [63:37] i just--that's just commands just they [63:43] just don't sit well with other people I [63:44] mean if you're a frontline salesperson [63:46] and your CEO set you down you you might [63:51] be a little bit slow to say tell me more [63:53] about that or let me make sure I [63:56] understand you know you might you might [63:59] want to demonstrate your understanding [64:01] or you might change the tone of voice [64:04] but you know we like a deference to [64:07] begin with which is not to take control [64:10] you know we love deference as an [64:12] approach because there's great there's [64:14] great power in deference I mean we love [64:18] deference because everybody loves it if [64:20] I'm deferential to you you're gonna give [64:23] me a lot more opportunity to talk [64:25] because I'm deferential you're gonna [64:26] feel like you can stop me at any time I [64:28] mean we love we love deference so it's [64:31] more in the sense of it seems like [64:32] you're those that instead of let me make [64:35] sure I heard this correctly scenario [64:37] yeah and again tone of voice is gonna [64:40] make a big difference when you get away [64:42] with a lot of bad words with great tone [64:47] you know and we were on a coaching call [64:51] just the other day and you know we coach [64:54] people to identify negatives identifying [64:56] a negative diffuses and you say okay [64:59] that makes sense to me and we say and [65:02] identifying a negative never plants it [65:03] and they go okay that makes sense to me [65:06] and then we say all right so let's be [65:08] proactive let's say are you proud you [65:10] probably upset with us oh my god that's [65:12] you know they they're gonna respond to [65:14] us well I wasn't but I am now but wait a [65:17] second two seconds ago you agreed that [65:18] we couldn't plant negatives and now [65:20] you're now you're arguing so we'll get [65:23] somebody arguing with us and so I just [65:26] stopped and I said so it sounds like [65:29] when I said identify negatives doesn't [65:33] plan him you thought it was wrong now [65:37] listen listen that my tone was clear [65:40] there right and I could have said so it [65:43] sounds to me like when I said identify [65:45] negatives doesn't plan him you thought I [65:48] was wrong same words different tone of [65:52] voice on a second one kills me but the [65:55] first one you know I'm the the tone of [65:57] voice I'm makes all the difference in [66:00] the world I mean I'm a thousand percent [66:02] convinced that you know the wolf of Wall [66:04] Street Jordan Belfort hey you know [66:07] everybody wants to learn from Jordan [66:08] Belfort god no and what they do right [66:12] yeah so what what was there what was [66:15] there to learn from them and in my view [66:18] well the guy I think the guy mastered [66:21] tonality I mean a thousand and and [66:23] clearly mastered something because he [66:25] wouldn't know 100 million dollars in [66:27] restitution which means he stole way [66:30] more than that you know but I mean so [66:33] what did he do because yeah you take a [66:36] look at straight-line selling and it's [66:38] no matter what the client says your [66:41] widget is the answer I mean that by [66:43] definition is not listening so how did [66:46] how did he how did he get over so much [66:48] and in my view the guy mastered tonality [66:50] and and that is something that's fair [66:52] for anybody to master yeah I'm not a fan [66:56] otherwise don't get me wrong I you know [66:58] guy was the only reason that if you [67:00] should ever [67:01] considered buying his book would be to [67:02] help give some of the 100 million [67:03] dollars back because he owes restitution [67:05] based on book sales [67:07] whenever anybody asked me what my [67:09] favorite sales movies are you know and [67:10] they wolf of wallstreet boiler-room [67:11] Glengarry Glen Ross they tell him no [67:13] there's a little literally the worst [67:15] sales movies I've ever seen in my life [67:16] you know the great movies they're funny [67:18] but they're literally everything that's [67:19] wrong about selling yeah everything [67:22] that's wrong about selling and I tell [67:23] them to go look the two best sales [67:25] movies under actually I'll finish with [67:26] this and want to understand what yours [67:27] are my two favorite sales movies pursuit [67:31] of happiness right will smell Wow and [67:34] Tommy Boy you ever watch Tommy Boy I [67:37] didn't I never thought of as the [67:38] salesman but you know it's a it's a [67:40] great thought because I talked about [67:43] catching your sales groove right and [67:44] there's there there's a moment in every [67:45] sales reps life where they wake up and [67:47] it's just a little bit easier today than [67:48] it was yesterday and you don't know what [67:49] it was but it's when you stop pitching [67:51] your solutions and you start having [67:52] conversations about your solutions [67:54] hearing more about the clients needs [67:56] than you do about your commission check [67:57] and there's that beautiful moment in [67:59] Tommy Boy where it catches the sales [68:01] move Helen look like a Helen let me tell [68:04] you why I suck as a sales rep and he [68:07] goes through this whole like Jojo the [68:08] idiot circus boy with a pretty good pet [68:09] and she's like wow you're twisted you [68:11] know I'll go fire up those wings tell me [68:12] like you tell me what winging you know [68:14] in that moment he was he would be caught [68:16] in a sales group because before that he [68:18] was pitching he was trying to be like [68:19] his dad you could stick your head up a [68:20] butcher's ass type of stuff right and [68:21] couldn't figure it out and then after [68:23] then it was just him and it was empathy [68:25] it was self deprecation and so it's a [68:27] it's a beautiful sales movie if you [68:30] should get a chance to go see it again [68:31] I'll probably go back and watch it again [68:33] yeah you put this lens on because I you [68:36] fight your first is like yeah that's fun [68:38] you know big fat guy making fun of [68:39] himself but look at what the sales lens [68:41] on it's it's a blast that's really cool [68:43] yeah all right very good you know well [68:49] then I look at it through a different [68:52] lens I look at it through negotiation [68:54] right and as opposed to as opposed to [68:57] sales it's a lens I'm gonna have to go [68:59] back and take another look at it awesome [69:01] well Chris this has been like I said I [69:03] think I'd love to have an entire day [69:05] with you asking all these questions just [69:07] for myself and learning online but um [69:09] but I think we gotta cut this up tell [69:11] everybody how they can learn more I know [69:14] public workshops I know you got your [69:16] blog I know you got a bunch of things so [69:18] tell everybody how they can find out [69:19] more information and pretty much mandate [69:21] I'm gonna mandate everybody who listens [69:22] to me go pick up never split the [69:24] difference if they haven't already [69:25] because it's it's one of my favorite [69:27] negotiation thanks so how can people [69:29] learn more yeah well our newsletter [69:31] slash blog is a great supplement to the [69:33] book I mean a lot of people get a long [69:35] way out just a book in the blower long [69:37] Elsa you know the newsletter is a [69:39] gateway to everything it training [69:40] announcements a gateway to the website [69:42] you know we're training across the [69:43] country the announcements are in the [69:45] newsletter is short it's sweet and it's [69:47] free it's it's not a lot of work [69:50] some newsletters are a lot of work yeah [69:53] and the best way to sign up for the [69:54] newsletters and we got a text to sign up [69:57] function okay to the number 22 828 and [70:01] the number you're texting to again is 2 [70:03] to 8 to 8 the message you send to that [70:06] number is FBI empathy all one word don't [70:09] let the spellcheck put a space between [70:11] FBI and empathy make sure it's one word [70:13] then FBI empathy one word to two to [70:16] eight to eight you get a response back [70:18] asking for your email address you signed [70:20] up off to the races [70:22] yeah you know I think I read never split [70:26] the difference probably about 10-15 [70:28] years ago and so with our interview here [70:30] and refresh myself but one of the [70:31] biggest things I went to is that blog [70:33] and just picked up a lot of them nuggets [70:35] and the tips along the way that really [70:37] are if you put that entire blog together [70:38] you'd pretty much have never split the [70:39] difference but I'm a big micro learner [70:42] as far as those tips and nuggets and [70:44] small things that we can do a little [70:45] proof so I really appreciate what you do [70:47] Chris thanks man cool well this has been [70:49] awesome [70:50] everybody hopefully you as much value [70:52] out of this as I did check out Chris's [70:55] blog check out his workshops that he's [70:57] doing and bring him into your company I [70:59] know you know I do negotiation training [71:02] too but this is next-level [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] here so [71:04] bring Chris and go to some of those [71:06] public workshops and hope everybody got [71:08] some value thank you all very much have [71:10] a great week and go make somebody happy [71:12] today if you do nothing else and you [71:13] make somebody smile you know you had a [71:15] good day [71:15] thank you all very much make it happen [71:17] thanks Chris all right man my pleasure [71:20] thanks for having me

===FILE=== bGSc8d7Gvn0 - USE This Skill To Remove You as The Threat in Negotiation.txt
https://youtu.be/bGSc8d7Gvn0
USE This Skill To Remove You as The Threat in Negotiation!

[0:02] we've talked [0:04] about it looks like it seems like it [0:06] sounds like we've talked about the [0:09] importance of labeling the negatives to [0:13] remove ourselves as a [0:16] [Music] [0:20] threat negotiation and negotiating and [0:23] bargaining are they the same or are they [0:25] different I hear different here [0:28] why what what makes you say that as [0:32] bargaining sounds like you're trying to [0:33] compromise and negotiating is more about [0:35] dealing with the emotions he said [0:38] negotiation is more about dealing with [0:39] the emotion bargaining sounds like [0:40] you're trying to compromise not bad [0:43] bargaining is offering something andse [0:46] what's so what's nego [0:48] negotiating what we're doing here it [0:50] seems much different we're questions [0:52] without offering all right which one [0:56] makes you more comfortable negotiating [0:58] or bargaining [1:00] bargaining makes you more comfortable [1:02] why we used to used it's easy you're [1:05] used to it it's our default because take [1:09] negotiation out of the Lexicon and [1:11] replace the word negotiation with [1:14] difficult [1:16] conversation what do difficult [1:18] conversations make [1:19] you uncomfortable and when you're [1:22] uncomfortable what do you want to do [1:23] more than anything else get comfortable [1:26] again what's the fastest way in a [1:28] difficult conversation or a negotiation [1:30] to get comfortable again solve the [1:33] problem as quickly as possible the [1:35] sooner I cut my price the sooner I get [1:37] out of the room the sooner I get out of [1:39] the room the sooner my comfort level [1:42] recovers we all have negative [1:44] connotations about [1:46] negotiation because it's a difficult [1:48] conversation any difficult conversation [1:50] there are going to be negatives that the [1:52] other side has about you that they have [1:54] not yet voiced or maybe they have voiced [1:56] it I don't know but there are negatives [1:59] that they have about you that if you do [2:01] not [2:03] address upfront they're going to kill [2:06] you remember you don't get in life [2:08] what's fair you get what you negotiate [2:11] if you want to become a better [2:12] negotiator click the link in the [2:14] description [2:17] below [2:19] arguably one you know Chris talked about [2:22] it earlier he said that you know we when [2:26] we started this stuff we thought labels [2:28] and mirrors spe specifically [2:32] labels were the easiest skill to employ [2:36] and [2:38] thereby um not the most important and we [2:42] have come to find out that they are [2:46] probably the most [2:48] important labeling the negative is three [2:52] times as powerful as labeling a [2:56] positive you get three times the bang [2:58] for the buck by labeling a negative than [3:00] you do labeling a positive doesn't mean [3:01] that labeling a positive is not [3:04] appropriate or Justified it's just that [3:07] attacking the [3:09] negatives get you more [3:12] faster so in any difficult conversations [3:15] uh there is a perception about you about [3:19] the circumstance that the other side has [3:21] that you're going to want to go after [3:23] almost [3:25] immediately how do you do it with [3:27] preemptive labels being proactive with [3:30] your labeling labeling things that [3:32] aren't even spoken yet we call them [3:35] accusations audits a list of opinions [3:38] assumptions and Impressions that the [3:40] other side has about you your [3:44] Circumstance the company you [3:48] represent the [3:51] environment and when I say you it's not [3:53] just you in a professional sense it may [3:55] be you in a personal [3:58] sense it may be fair or [4:02] unfair you may view it as sane or insane [4:06] but it is certainly a an important part [4:08] of what they're trying to uh wrestle [4:11] with [4:13] internally they may not have said it [4:15] they may be just thinking it if they [4:16] were if they were to stand on the street [4:19] corner out [4:21] here and yell at the top of their [4:26] lungs about you what would you want to [4:28] deny [4:32] how is what you're going to ask them for [4:35] going to create issues for [4:38] them how have they viewed other people [4:43] in your space that they've dealt [4:46] with how do they view your [4:49] company how do they view you as a man [4:51] how do they view you as a woman what [4:55] would you want to deny how would you [4:56] deny it [5:00] by labeling it part of your preparation [5:03] for any difficult conversation is going [5:05] to be to make a [5:08] list preemptive labels of the negative [5:11] opinions assumptions Impressions that [5:13] the other side has about you why do we [5:15] want to do it at the beginning of the [5:17] conversation we do it at the beginning [5:19] so they don't throw it back in your face [5:20] later subscribe to the Black Swan groups [5:23] negotiation newsletter which is free [5:26] doesn't cost you anything I had a [5:28] colleague with the FBI the used to like [5:30] to say if it's free I'll take three [5:33] here's how you subscribe to the edge if [5:35] you're in the United States send the [5:37] text to the number is 337 that's [5:41] 33777 the text message that you send is [5:44] Black Swan method Black Swan method [5:48] 2337 comes your email inbox on Tuesday [5:51] mornings when you're ready to rock and [5:53] roll and get after the week guys get [5:56] that we do it in the beginning so they [5:58] that they don't don't throw it back in [6:00] our face later what do you mean throw it [6:03] back in our face later so if uh [6:07] afterwards like you put a put a bunch of [6:10] stuff out there and they come up with [6:12] their own negative at the very end uh [6:14] and it was something that you could have [6:16] thrown out at the beginning now all of a [6:18] sudden it's something that they can uh [6:21] you know hold against you as Travis was [6:26] saying we want to snatch permission and [6:29] Authority away from the other side for [6:31] using the negative against us in the [6:33] course of the [6:35] conversation and that's have you done it [6:37] before he says [6:39] yes apparently the mic's not working [6:42] anymore yes and has it been successful [6:46] for you yes what um how has it benefited [6:50] you how is using the negative opinions [6:53] assumption that other other people had [6:54] about you been a benefit to you so there [6:57] was a situation where I had a bunch of [7:00] my team and my colleagues um they were [7:03] kind of asking a bunch of questions [7:04] about like kind of where the project is [7:06] going uh how I was managing it uh and [7:09] how I was taking control of it so I [7:11] started out with the accusation audit [7:13] and I said um you guys might think that [7:17] I don't know what I'm doing here uh you [7:19] might not think you might not you might [7:21] think that I'm not um I'm not [7:24] experienced enough you might think that [7:26] I'm taking this in the wrong direction [7:28] uh you might you know I I I threw out as [7:31] many things that I thought uh anybody [7:33] could say against me and then after a [7:36] while I actually had each one of them [7:38] individually come back to me and say I [7:41] didn't think any of those things and I [7:42] actually think you're doing a really [7:43] good job with this excellent and that's [7:45] how you started the conversation before [7:47] you got into the meat of your ask that's [7:51] right all right so living example living [7:54] uh Testament to how uh powerful these [7:57] skills are and we say make it your [8:00] Matrix moment because you don't know how [8:02] deep their negatives go when it pertains [8:05] to you how are you going to know how [8:07] deep the negatives go you got to follow [8:09] them down the rabbit hole

===FILE=== cgTZayRBIDc - Dont Let Them Trick You into a Lower Price.txt
https://youtu.be/cgTZayRBIDc
Don't Let Them Trick You into a Lower Price!

[0:00] give me what I want con see to us or [0:02] we're going [0:04] elsewhere that's what they say said [0:07] that's not what they [0:09] meant and our knee-jerk reaction because [0:12] of this idea of scarcity [0:15] is H we better concede or we're going to [0:19] lose the [0:21] business and this is coming after [0:25] they've already told [0:27] you how wonderful you are how you the [0:30] best thing since sliced bread can't wait [0:32] to do business with you cut your price [0:34] from I'm going to a competitor I don't [0:37] know how many people on Fireside today [0:39] have the courage to challenge that and [0:41] when I say challenge that [0:45] meaning words and behavior are not [0:47] aligned and shut up Don and so when [0:51] there is a [0:53] misalignment you're not doing anybody [0:55] any favors if you're going to ignore [0:58] it you cannot on the one hand say that [1:02] you are the best thing in the world and [1:04] then say you're not worth it [1:07] because I mean you can say that but from [1:11] my perspective that's got to be [1:12] challenged [1:14] Marcel so a lot of this is about you [1:17] know we teach it's all about the other [1:19] side um we we've been conditioned to not [1:22] trust our intuition we live in a society [1:25] that doesn't listen and we've been [1:27] taught to not say things and pick up on [1:29] things or at least pick up on it but [1:31] definitely don't say [1:33] it particularly with people who've been [1:36] using these skills for a while and are [1:38] finding that they're not doing it but [1:40] can identify it later it's because [1:41] you're not trusting your gut you need [1:43] the Reps to know that you're right to [1:46] know that if you feel that and sense [1:47] that and you see the hesitation or [1:49] there's a deeper meaning to that that [1:51] you just don't want to say slow yourself [1:54] down and label it sounds like the value [1:57] is just not there for you it's [2:00] uncomfortable but if you get the Reps in [2:03] enough you'll see that your intuition is [2:05] guiding you well a lot of this is about [2:08] trusting [2:13] yourself yeah a lot of it is about [2:16] trusting yourself it and [2:20] and I'm not I didn't use that statement [2:23] earlier um [2:25] cavalierly [2:27] that subconscious in [2:31] thing has been placed into us for [2:34] survival [2:37] purposes and therefore it rarely gets [2:40] anything [2:43] wrong you gotta you gotta you guys have [2:46] heard me the um before talk about the [2:50] biology of the of belief that's the name [2:53] of the book the author is Dr Bruce [2:56] Lipton in that book He's he says that [3:00] the subconscious brain otherwise known [3:03] as your intuition processes 20 million [3:06] bits of information per [3:08] second not in a minute not in an hour [3:11] not in a day in a [3:14] second it's a supercomputer why would [3:17] you not rely on [3:19] that it's just it's just insane to me [3:23] and um equally insane is the people that [3:27] run for the for the hills the minute [3:30] somebody says do this or [3:33] else and it's especially problematic in [3:36] in Nick's case when when the guy [3:39] says he he speaks your value [3:42] proposition and you still are fear so [3:45] fearful that you're going to turn tail [3:47] and run and and that's and I'm not [3:49] beating up on Nick's client because [3:51] everybody does that instead of digging [3:54] deeper getting off of the surface level [3:56] of do this or else they go back to their [3:59] team and say hey we got to do this or [4:02] we're going to lose the business fear of [4:06] lost single biggest driver of human [4:07] decision making and behavior use it to [4:10] your advantage Don [4:13] Juan you just use your team to your [4:17] advantage you know you're in tunnel [4:18] vision you're being driven by fear so [4:20] when your teammate who's Nick in this P [4:22] particular P you know experience when [4:25] your teammate tells you something [4:28] different [4:30] second guess yourself because you're [4:32] going to be driven by fear in the moment [4:34] so use your team as your [4:38] strategy that so my I'm I'm sitting here [4:42] listening to you guys and I realize we [4:44] talk a lot about how to use the [4:47] strengths of the different negotiator [4:49] conflict personality types uh you want [4:52] to use the accommodator voice tone 80% [4:55] of the time and then the analyst voice [4:57] tone about 20% of the time [5:00] we talk about how to be assertive using [5:03] tactical empathy but we what we're [5:05] talking about here no matter what your [5:07] conflict personality type is is how to [5:10] channel your inner analyst and get into [5:13] that deeper information that's the [5:16] strength of the analyst's uh conflict [5:18] personality type is the information and [5:20] the [5:22] data it came easiest to me when I [5:24] started having fun with it with [5:26] unlocking people with the situ situation [5:30] that Nick talks [5:32] about when you're when you're channeling [5:34] that inter analyst don't just do it in [5:36] your conversations for practice do it [5:39] when you're listening to someone else [5:40] talk about the conversation they just [5:43] had with the boss or a difficult [5:45] negotiation they were in because what [5:47] you'll find yourself doing is you when [5:49] they're telling you the story you'll [5:52] start to get curious about what might [5:54] have been and you'll point it out to [5:56] them you know were you curious at all [5:58] about this were you curious at all about [5:59] that and when you when you start helping [6:01] others stay curious it'll come more [6:04] natural for you in your own [6:06] conversations it really [6:09] is a lot of fun if you can get past the [6:12] fear of knocking into some subject that [6:16] you don't want to knock into or or [6:18] having somebody walk away if you can get [6:20] past the fear and really want to get [6:21] into the why behind their behavior and [6:23] unlock them a little bit that gets you [6:26] off the surface almost without effort [6:29] you will put in effort but it'll come so [6:32] naturally to you after a while as you [6:34] practice this and you'll see the benefit [6:36] the money it makes you the the [6:38] relationships that it builds when Derek [6:41] says they'll think you're a mind reader [6:43] that's just what you want because that [6:46] person wants to talk to you again about [6:48] other stuff there's other opportunities [6:50] there [6:52] so we talk about difference we talk [6:55] about uh all these things just remember [6:58] your your genuine curiosity and remember [7:01] that you're leading any sensitive [7:03] conversation you're in we talk about the [7:06] accommodator voice tone and deference [7:08] and things like that you're leading the [7:09] conversation you're just doing it as a [7:12] good leader you're opening the other [7:14] side up and letting them tell you all of [7:16] their fears all of their information and [7:19] that's how you lead them to where you [7:21] want to get

===FILE=== ghaFAiXT3G0 - STOP Making This Negotiation Mistake Listening Is Key.txt
https://youtu.be/ghaFAiXT3G0
STOP Making This Negotiation Mistake! Listening Is Key!

[0:00] one of the problems is you as [0:01] Professionals in in in your in your [0:03] business you already have the [0:07] answers [0:08] and there's an interesting element that [0:11] it doesn't matter if you have the [0:12] answers or if the answers are [0:16] right if you're automatically giving [0:18] them answers you're not listening to [0:20] them even if you ask great questions and [0:22] you trigger response you're not [0:24] listening to [0:26] them so why take the time to start to [0:29] listen to listen to to them to encourage [0:30] the reciprocity because at some point in [0:32] time you're going to need them to listen [0:34] to [0:41] you and if I'm in an interaction with [0:44] someone and I picked up that they're not [0:46] listening to [0:47] me I'm I'm done with them I'm not going [0:50] to listen to you if you don't listen to [0:52] me [0:54] first even if you're [0:57] right I'm in a conference with [0:59] commercial uh Real Estate Investors just [1:01] a few months back so I'm at the VIP [1:04] lunch and a guy sitting next to me [1:07] starts asking me about whether or not [1:08] I'm interested in investing in [1:09] commercial real estate so I'm like all [1:12] right you know I'll bite I'll listen to [1:13] what this guy has to say and he asked me [1:16] a great open-ended question you might [1:19] notice we're trying to get you out of [1:20] questions and into labels that's an [1:23] underlying theme [1:26] here so he asked me a what question [1:29] great great question and I answer and he [1:31] comes back at me with an answer right [1:34] away and I'm thinking that was a little [1:40] fast it wasn't that his answer was [1:44] wrong it was just fast because I know as [1:47] a human being at some point in time he's [1:49] gon to he's going to be off track and if [1:52] he isn't listening to me now he's never [1:54] going to know when he's off track and I [1:56] know that moment is [1:58] coming so he asked me another question I [2:01] answer it and he's got an answer right [2:03] away now he's done his research he [2:06] probably figures that whatever question [2:07] he asked me I'm going to come up with [2:09] one of three [2:10] answers and he's going to have the [2:12] perfect response tailored for that in [2:14] advance he's going to be ready to go [2:15] ready to go ready to go ready to [2:17] go and the second time he did that to me [2:20] I just turned to the person on my other [2:22] side and I never spoke to him [2:25] again notice the fact whether or not his [2:29] answers were right wrong had nothing to [2:33] do with my Fe I have no time for [2:35] somebody who doesn't listen to me [2:37] because I know at some point in time [2:40] they're going to have [2:41] to so this encouragement of reciprocity [2:44] now what's the other part of why take [2:46] the time to listen to somebody to hear [2:49] them out to use the labels in the [2:50] mirrors anybody know what the magic [2:53] response [2:55] is exactly that's right [3:00] every time someone feels [3:05] hurt they get have two magic [3:09] neurochemicals [3:11] oxytocin and [3:14] serotonin what happens when you get a [3:17] dose of oxytocin most people know it as [3:19] the bonding drug or the love drug you [3:23] know there's a lot a lot of people are [3:25] talking about oxytocin they're kicking [3:26] it around they don't know what the hell [3:27] they're talking about AR we look at this [3:30] stuff hard all the time Derek and I are [3:33] constantly kicking ideas back and forth [3:35] I'm talking to Troy talking to everybody [3:37] on the team we're constantly looking at [3:38] this stuff oxytocin yes is a bonding [3:41] drug you feel bonded it's a one-way Bond [3:44] a lot of people don't realize that it's [3:47] a one-way Bond they're bonding with you [3:49] when they get ah hit of oxytocin a [3:51] hostage negotiation business for years [3:53] and years people uh the SWAT guys were [3:56] always worried that the negotiators were [3:58] going to bond with the hostage taker [4:01] because it was clear the hostage taker [4:02] was bonding with [4:04] us again this is invisible the people [4:07] watching don't know what's going on and [4:09] we were all like you know what are you [4:10] out of your mind I'm trying to line this [4:13] guy up for a shot between the eyes if if [4:15] need be I'm not bonded to this guy he's [4:17] threatening to kill [4:19] people so it's a bonding they're bonding [4:22] with [4:23] you Andrew huberman podcast huberman's a [4:26] great source of Neuroscience information [4:28] I'm listening plus he's a good guy [4:31] Andrew happens to be a friend and I [4:33] think the world of him um but the uh [4:37] podcast on relationships he throws out [4:39] the stat the figure the fact that when [4:41] they get [4:42] oxytocin it also inclines people to tell [4:45] the [4:47] truth you want them to be honest with [4:49] you about their [4:52] situation you want them to reveal to you [4:55] what their questions are in the process [4:58] you want them to reveal to you what you [5:00] don't yet know about what's driving them [5:02] why they want that price what's behind [5:04] it all these things that are landmines [5:07] if you don't uncover [5:09] them they're more likely to tell you [5:12] about it if they get a hit of oxytocin [5:15] and inclines people to tell the truth so [5:17] they're bonding with you and now they [5:19] feel like telling you because they want [5:20] to tell you the [5:22] truth serotonin is a kicker serotonin is [5:26] the neurochemical of satisfaction [5:30] what does that [5:31] mean they want [5:36] less their home is [5:41] overpriced you want them to bond with [5:43] you be honest with you and to want [5:46] less you got to get them to lower the [5:49] price on their house or it won't [5:51] sell they need to feel heard so that you [5:55] can drug them with their own [5:56] neurochemicals [5:59] so you can take them to where they need [6:01] to be and they don't feel shoved into [6:04] it because when they feel shoved into it [6:08] there goes your [6:10] referral and notice from our panel [6:13] earlier the way they conducted [6:16] themselves on their [6:17] first sale the first time they got paid [6:21] led to [6:23] referrals and referrals are your [6:27] Lifeline so the process of making them [6:30] feel heard listening to them and hearing [6:33] them out exactly as Derek has described [6:36] is critical on all of these levels

===FILE=== hV4sAxhiRBc - Your Addiction to This Word is LOSING You Deals.txt
https://youtu.be/hV4sAxhiRBc
Your Addiction to This Word is LOSING You Deals!

[0:00] I'm going to ask you to change your [0:01] wiring because you got an [0:04] addiction I'm here to talk to you about [0:06] your addiction you didn't know was going [0:08] to be one of those meetings right you're [0:09] thinking I went to that one last [0:12] week here's what you're addicted to you [0:15] love this word you love this [0:18] word feels so good to hear yes woohoo [0:22] you love hearing [0:25] yes but here's a [0:27] problem it's always a hook right [0:32] now you [0:34] guys get addicted to [0:37] this and there's actually a study out [0:39] there that says you should do it because [0:42] it says all you got to do to get to yes [0:46] which even to this day is sold more [0:49] copies than my [0:52] book first you ask somebody to say yes [0:54] to something [0:56] little then you get him to say yes to [0:58] something else little [1:01] then you get the third little one and [1:03] then bang you got [1:05] him right it's called momentum selling [1:08] it's called the yes [1:10] momentum in sales it's called the yes [1:12] momentum or momentum selling and it says [1:15] give them to say yes to the little [1:16] things and you tie them down they can't [1:18] get [1:19] away do you like that it's a violation [1:22] of your basic basic nature to autonomy [1:25] your right to [1:26] autonomy if I if you pick up the phone [1:29] phone Rings you pick up the phone voice [1:31] on the other end of the phone says have [1:32] you got a few minutes to talk what's [1:34] your gut reaction your gut reaction a [1:36] lot of quick automatic notes wait a [1:39] minute I'm just trying to get you to say [1:42] yes or something little what's matter [1:43] with that well the problem is whenever [1:46] you say yes you don't know what yourself [1:47] what you're letting yourself in [1:49] for and have you got a few minutes to [1:51] talk it's pretty simple you ask yourself [1:53] if I have a few minutes to talk do I [1:54] want to talk to [1:55] you I have a few minutes to talk and I [1:57] want to talk to you do I want to talk [1:58] about what you want to talk [2:00] about there's a man or woman alive that [2:02] haven't hasn't gotten a call from a [2:04] significant other and he or she on the [2:06] other end of the phone says can we [2:09] talk and you think to yourself [2:13] well I like talking to you but I don't [2:15] think I want to talk about what you want [2:17] to talk [2:18] about then after that is how long is a [2:21] few minutes my next young younger sister [2:23] calls me on the phone when she's got an [2:25] hour drive in front of her have you got [2:27] a few minutes to talk that's all o code [2:30] for I'm going to talk and you're going [2:31] to [2:33] listen uh another friend of mine [2:35] colleague happens to be an attorney but [2:37] it's just that just happens to be how [2:39] he's wired he lays out this entire [2:41] agenda he's going to have you on the [2:42] phone for at least 45 minutes and he [2:44] says hey you got a few minutes to [2:46] talk typically a few minutes is 45 to an [2:49] hour and then the last question you ask [2:51] yourself at the end of it how do I get [2:52] off the [2:53] phone so the first problem is you guys [2:56] got to stop this you gotta you got to [2:58] get out of this yes stuff I'm here to [3:00] tell you that every time you try to get [3:03] somebody to say yes it makes them [3:06] concerned and they get defensive and [3:08] they get to back up and they start to [3:10] worry about what they're letting [3:11] themselves in [3:12] for experiment with it don't take my [3:16] word for it look around you couple of [3:19] years ago before my my son is's now my [3:21] director of operations and our best [3:24] negotiator while he was still trying to [3:27] grasp us we come out of a training to [3:29] security guard that led us in to the [3:31] secure building the same guy that leted [3:33] Us in in the morning is there waiting [3:35] when we come out he's got on a uniform [3:37] that says he works for Allied security [3:39] and at the time my son is saying I don't [3:41] think people are always nervous about [3:43] saying yes so we're standing in front of [3:46] the security guard he's at work he's [3:48] seen us before he's got his Allied [3:50] security uniform on and I look at him [3:52] and I go do you work for highlight [3:55] security and he goes [4:01] what makes you [4:02] ask I just look at my son and I [4:07] go what do you want from [4:10] me you you'll be shocked doesn't matter [4:13] what it is it's today Friday somebody [4:17] asked you that you know they're going [4:18] someplace with that and you're going to [4:21] be reluctant there may have been a point [4:23] in time and actually there's an academic [4:25] study that refers to this as mere [4:26] agreement and they say it works when you [4:28] look at any study make sure you look at [4:31] how they gathered the data and decide [4:32] for yourself whether or not they thought [4:34] it was legitimate data cuz they seen a [4:37] lot of studies and I have no doubt [4:39] there's one out there that says playing [4:40] basketball makes you [4:44] tall people will misinterpret the [4:47] data this doesn't work ask yourself how [4:51] much you like [4:53] it so some of you should be thinking [4:55] like all right now now what am I [4:57] supposed to [4:58] do you guys know who this [5:01] is [5:03] Jack Jack wels right jack welz at a book [5:07] signing in Los Angeles a couple of years [5:09] ago I'm going to the book Sig I'm going [5:11] to ask Jack to come speak to the [5:12] negotiation course I teach at USC I'm [5:15] going stand in line with 300 people [5:18] everybody how many of the people in that [5:20] line when they get up to Jack wels you [5:21] think are they're going to try to ask [5:23] Jack wels to do [5:25] something pretty much all of them right [5:27] how many people that day [5:30] try to get Jack Welch to say yes to [5:33] something how jumpy are they when I come [5:36] up and I get within arms length of Jack [5:38] Welch am I going to stand there and talk [5:40] to him for 20 minutes they got 300 [5:42] people in line behind me do they know [5:44] who I am have they got my ID have they [5:47] put me through a metal detector do they [5:48] know whether or not I'm carrying a gun [5:50] as it turns out I am carrying a [5:53] gun they don't know that I get this [5:56] close to Jack Welch I could do whatever [5:58] I want to him I can hurt them if I want [6:01] they can't stop me no shortage of [6:03] reasons why people are jumping you or me [6:05] what do you [6:12] say you want to come talk to my class [6:14] trying to get him to say yes or [6:15] something [6:17] right yes is a trap I told you yes is a [6:20] trap but you haven't been willing to to [6:23] experiment with and see yet but you will [6:25] if you look for it at all here's what I [6:26] said to Jack Welch and this is this part [6:29] of the hack is just insanely [6:31] stupid he said is it a ridiculous idea [6:35] for you to come and speak at the [6:36] negotiation course I teach at [6:38] USC notice which word I'm looking [6:41] for he looks at me and he looks up into [6:44] the left and he gets this intense scowl [6:47] on his face just really intense scowl [6:49] and he [6:51] freezes and does a [6:54] move and I think to myself I just killed [6:56] Jack Welsh [7:00] cuz this dude's old [7:01] right he's so Furious he just had a [7:04] stroke and he's going to fall over dead [7:05] right in front of me so when he doesn't [7:07] die initially I'm relieved but he still [7:10] doesn't unfreeze now I'm thinking he [7:12] looks Furious think he's going to start [7:14] yelling [7:16] scaredy instead he looks at me and he [7:17] says this is my personal assistant's [7:20] name this is a special Twitter account [7:22] we have set up to communicate with her I [7:23] will call her and tell her who you are [7:25] and what you're after I think we're [7:27] going to be in Los Angeles in the fall [7:29] if we're in Los Angeles in the fall [7:31] we'll come and speak to your [7:34] class how many answers was [7:38] that how many [7:40] questions would you have normally had to [7:45] ask to get that many [7:49] answers who should I speak to how do I [7:52] get a hold of them will you call them [7:54] and let them know that I'm going to be [7:57] calling will they know who I am what's [8:00] your schedule look like give that some [8:03] thought on a consistent and regular [8:05] basis as nervous as people are about [8:07] saying yes they feel so comfortable [8:10] saying no which you will be shocked at [8:13] what people are willing to say no to [8:17] comfortably that they will then lay out [8:20] what five more answers a calibrated no [8:23] is worth at least five yeses you guys [8:26] think you like [8:28] yes what if you could get five to seven [8:31] yeses all in a [8:33] row based on one question we see this [8:39] regularly when it's important I do not [8:41] bother with the word yes I have no use [8:45] for the [8:48] word I get five times farther triggering [8:53] no [8:55] regularly any one of your yes questions [8:58] can be switched to are you against do [9:00] you disagree have you given up on is it [9:03] a ridiculous idea is it a bad idea drop [9:07] that in the front of your yes questions [9:09] you'd be shocked at how much farther you [9:11] get [9:13] instantly most of the people that we [9:14] train don't even bother with the word [9:16] yes anymore it's a useless word yes [9:18] first of all yes is nothing without how [9:20] anyway because there's three kinds of [9:21] yeses commitment confirmation and [9:23] counterfit and since that yes momentum [9:25] nonsense has been used on us so much [9:28] people get real good at getting count [9:29] given the counterfeit [9:31] yes cuz you've heard it before when and [9:34] thought you had a deal and had it fall [9:35] apart haven't [9:38] you it's happened to everybody don't [9:41] bother with the word now what happens if [9:43] triggering no is not [9:46] enough here's where you want to [9:50] be this is the response you want to get [9:53] out of [9:54] people not your [9:56] right cuz your right is what they say [9:59] when you're making your case and you [10:02] know when they say you're right to you [10:03] when you're making your case what do [10:05] they [10:06] want they want you to shut [10:10] up and we joke around this about this [10:13] inside my company we say your right is [10:14] code for shut the [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] [10:17] up but people say it in order to [10:19] preserve the relationship but it gets [10:21] you to shut up as a matter of fact you [10:22] do it all the time you got a colleague [10:24] who won't leave you alone you want him [10:26] to shut up and go away you look him in [10:27] the eye and go you're right and they [10:29] leave [10:30] and you go back to what you were [10:32] doing they come storming back in the [10:33] next day I thought I agreed we talk blah [10:35] blah blah you look at him again you go [10:37] you're right and they leave [10:40] again you help people think by switching [10:45] out of yes and into no I don't bother [10:47] with [10:48] yes we don't bother with yes I could I [10:52] could go I could belabor it at length [10:54] yes is commitment commitment creates [10:56] anxiety no it's protection protection [10:58] makes people feel safe and secure and [11:00] helps them think anxiety interferes with [11:03] people's thought processes every time [11:05] you try to get somebody to say yes to [11:06] something you're creating anxiety [11:09] because they say to themselves what have [11:10] I let myself in for what's the catch [11:11] what's the hook where's this going what [11:13] are you trying to do to me these are [11:15] anxiety creating instances which [11:18] interfere with their ability to make [11:22] decisions it's not me telling you this [11:24] this is neuroscience anxiety slows the [11:28] brain don't take my word for [11:31] it remember you don't get in life what's [11:33] fair you get what you negotiate if you [11:36] want to become a better negotiator click [11:38] the link in the description below yes is [11:41] the most useless word out there we don't [11:44] even bother with it if we need to close [11:46] something I never use it to close ever [11:50] we don't we don't it's a useless word [11:52] there three kinds of yeses commitment [11:53] confirmation and [11:56] counterfeit but on the flip side of it [11:58] is you all got a bad Jones to yes you're [12:02] addicted to it bad this going to be hard [12:03] for you to get out of it because [12:04] typically first of all you bring [12:06] somebody and you said would you like to [12:08] have wonderful office [12:10] space would you like to retain your [12:13] employees for [12:15] years would you like to have great [12:18] terms take a look at our [12:23] proposal every yes is a [12:26] hook everybody knows yes is a hook [12:29] everybody knows there's a hook buried in [12:31] every yes the crazy thing about that [12:34] this is a word it depends upon what side [12:35] we're on how we react to it CU hearing [12:38] it we want to hear it it's been yes has [12:42] been described as one of the most [12:43] beautiful words in the language the most [12:47] beautiful word in the language and [12:48] there's a story John lenon John Lennon [12:51] began to fall in love with Yoko Ono when [12:52] he went to an art exhibit she had and it [12:54] was kind of an obacle course saying you [12:56] crawled over stuff and you climbed up [12:57] stuff and you came to a ladder and you [12:59] Crown this rickety ladder and the top of [13:01] a ladder was a telescope and you look [13:03] through the telescope and a little bit [13:04] of letters on a far wall was [13:07] word [13:10] yes so we' love to hear [13:13] it but we're completely blinded as the [13:16] how we start to react instantly when [13:17] somebody tries to get us to say [13:19] it phone rings you pick it up and the [13:21] other and the voice says have you got a [13:23] few minutes to [13:24] talk what's your gut [13:27] reaction yeah [13:29] everybody's got reaction is no is there [13:31] anybody seriously is there anybody in [13:33] this room that when somebody says have [13:34] you got a few minutes to talk you go [13:35] thank God you called yes oh yes yes yes [13:40] yes just ask me anything every time I [13:43] say yes I'm going to feel [13:45] wonderful no where's the hook what's the [13:48] catch what am I letting myself in for [13:50] where's this going have you got a few [13:52] minutes to talk as only an individual [13:54] example first question you ask yourself [13:57] if I have a few minutes to talk do I [13:58] want to talk to you [14:00] you if I have a few minutes to talk and [14:02] I want to talk to you do I want to talk [14:03] about what you want to talk [14:06] about there isn't one of us who hasn't [14:09] received the call from our significant [14:10] other man or woman man gets a call from [14:13] a significant other most important [14:15] person in the world to him she says can [14:17] we [14:19] talk he thinks [14:22] well I like talking to you but I don't [14:24] think I want to talk about what you want [14:25] to talk about [14:30] so essentially what you're going to do [14:32] when you're doing no oriented questions [14:34] is you're going to make no work for you [14:35] okay you're going to get them to give [14:37] you a yes but they're actually going to [14:39] be able to say [14:41] no yes when you're when you're going for [14:44] a yes from somebody and you're [14:45] constantly trying to get them to say yes [14:47] you're taking away their autonomy and [14:49] when someone says yes sometimes it seems [14:51] like a trap to them it also seems like [14:54] no matter what the question is if they [14:55] say yes it's some kind of a commitment [14:57] that they might not be ready to get into [14:59] so instead ask them a question that they [15:01] can answer no to but it actually means [15:04] yes to you because saying no makes [15:08] people feel protected makes them feel [15:10] safe makes them feel like they still [15:12] have all their cards hidden and they [15:14] just feel better about it so if you put [15:17] that question um in a way that allows [15:20] them to be [15:22] negative it works out better for you [15:26] also when you're constantly asking [15:28] questions that you want a yes answer to [15:30] you look like that demanding mother who [15:32] says did you clean your room did you do [15:33] the dishes did you do this did you did [15:34] you make your bed cuz you know everyone [15:36] heard that from Mom growing up right [15:38] yeah and you're like yes yes yes yes and [15:40] it's just like so annoying so no one [15:42] wants to be equated to the demanding mom [15:45] so instead you can say would it be [15:49] impossible for you to make a copy of [15:50] this for [15:51] me and they're going to want to say no [15:54] because maybe they don't want to make [15:55] the copy I don't know but they're going [15:56] to say no but is it going to mean no [15:57] it's no it's going to mean yes to you [15:59] because the way you phrase the question [16:00] so it's really kind of magical how this [16:03] works [16:05] um essentially you are demonstrating [16:07] concern for what this ask what the [16:10] impact that ask is going to have on that [16:12] person because you know when you're [16:14] asking someone to go run an errand for [16:16] you oh would it be impossible for you to [16:18] run to the store and get this for me [16:21] okay you're you're saying Yeah by my [16:22] tone of voice I'm letting you know that [16:24] I know this is might be inconvenient for [16:25] you but would it be impossible for you [16:27] to just do this for me proper tone is [16:30] important [16:32] um Davey take the next one sets of the [16:35] powerful feeling of graciousness you're [16:36] better at this one than I am okay [16:39] yeah so um because you can use the I [16:42] mean there are a few phrases that are [16:44] really go-to for no oriented questions [16:47] so would it be impossible to would it be [16:50] ridiculous would it be um out of the [16:53] question like those are three really [16:56] good [16:57] goto um if you want to make it a little [16:59] bit more specific so for example like um [17:03] say that you have to move a meeting like [17:05] this happens to me a lot right um then [17:08] you say would it throw off your whole [17:11] like I know you're already busy would it [17:12] throw off your whole schedule if we [17:15] moved this meeting so it's it's almost [17:17] this opportunity again to express [17:19] understanding to express like hey I know [17:23] you're busy this might throw everything [17:25] off so you can even phrase the question [17:28] in that way right or something I really [17:31] like to do is would it be really [17:32] difficult to or would it be bothersome [17:35] to so like you can use whatever you [17:38] think like well they might feel like [17:41] this is annoying or they might feel like [17:44] um this is going to be really [17:46] problematic for them and so then you say [17:49] that in the in that no oriented question [17:51] it's almost like a way that you can kind [17:52] of address whatever it is that they're [17:54] going to feel within the no oriented [17:56] question essentially so it makes it feel [17:58] feel kind of gracious because you've [18:01] thought about this you've thought about [18:04] how is this going to impact you instead [18:06] of just making an ask and making sure [18:08] they do it you're thinking about okay [18:10] this is going to impact this person in [18:12] in this way and you express that and [18:15] then they're even more likely to want to [18:17] do what you're asking [18:20] essentially it also depending on the [18:22] kind of question that you're asking and [18:24] some of the things that Davey was just [18:25] saying kind of fall under this makes the [18:27] other side feel like the decision to do [18:29] the action was theirs so if you and you [18:32] can double Wham him with an accusations [18:33] audit um yeah you may think I'm I'm [18:37] being so irresponsible with my time and [18:39] my schedule would it be impossible or [18:43] would it put you in a bad position if we [18:45] could move the meeting to three o'clock [18:48] and then they're going to say oh no no [18:50] it's okay we can move the meeting it's [18:52] going to feel like the decision was [18:53] theirs because you you basically asked [18:55] that question in a way that it feels [18:57] like they can decide whether or not they [18:59] can make the movement but because it was [19:00] kind of geared at a no oriented question [19:03] it makes them feel like they were nice [19:06] enough to take that action for you and [19:07] it was their decision yeah like the ball [19:09] was in their Court they're doing this [19:11] for [19:12] you let them feel like they're being [19:14] nice exactly and that is huge when [19:16] you're talking about um where you stand [19:18] psychologically with somebody because [19:21] the more you make somebody feel like [19:22] they are in control the better they feel [19:25] even when they're not in control because [19:27] you know you're asking the questions in [19:28] such a way that you are literally in [19:30] control but you're letting them feel [19:31] like they have the control um so that [19:35] that does do something for people in [19:36] their brains so it's just something to [19:37] really keep you know in the Forefront of [19:39] your mind when you're about to ask [19:41] someone a yes question that you want a [19:43] yes to take two seconds to frame it so [19:46] that they can say no but still mean yes [19:48] to [19:50] you yeah exactly then they feel like [19:52] they're the ones that are that they're [19:54] maintaining power essentially yes [19:57] because no is powerful thing to be able [19:59] to say to someone hi Chris great meeting [20:02] you the other week and I loved your [20:04] story about meeting Jack Welch and uh [20:07] asking him to come speak at your uh [20:10] class I believe was at SC um by Framing [20:13] it in a no question I want you to know [20:15] I've been using that with my girlfriend [20:17] I've been using the would it be [20:18] ridiculous or would I be out of line if [20:21] I asked for this and I wanted to know if [20:23] you had any other good no questions to [20:26] ask that are really yes questions [20:29] you know I don't I I don't all of them I [20:32] mean I don't ask any yes questions uh I [20:34] I just know that people it works better [20:37] it hits the brain better so you know uh [20:41] is now a bad time to talk um is it a [20:44] ridiculous idea have you given up on um [20:48] is it a bad idea are you opposed do you [20:50] disagree I mean with with the slightest [20:53] amount of practice you could switch any [20:56] yes question into a no question and it [20:59] it just works it works better across the [21:01] board I mean we don't nobody in my [21:03] company asks yes questions nobody nobody [21:06] asks uh have you got a few minutes to [21:08] talk nobody says do do you agree it just [21:11] across the [21:13] board it makes it safer for people to [21:16] answer and also the real issue always is [21:19] if there are problems I want you to feel [21:22] free to tell me what the problems are [21:25] and you're going to feel free to tell me [21:26] those problems after no so with just a [21:29] little bit of practice uh and it takes [21:31] practice you know all of these are are [21:34] you know get your practice reps [21:36] in in the low stakes conversations and [21:39] pretty soon the stuff starts starts [21:42] flowing out of your mouth I'm uh a [21:43] couple of weeks ago I'm I'm in a uh I'm [21:45] making a pitch in a hotel for a room [21:48] upgrade and I don't got any room [21:50] upgrades but I've worked so much on no [21:53] oriented questions and because like I am [21:56] pushing this guy hard for something [21:58] extra that I'm not paying for and [22:01] finally he I says well is it ridiculous [22:04] for you to make it up for me at the bar [22:06] and he's like he's like no no and he [22:10] goes and gets a bunch of free drink [22:11] coupons for the bar so you know no [22:14] warranted question is a great one to [22:16] practice you'll find it'll bail you [22:19] out when you're trying to get free [22:22] drinks I I don't even bother with the [22:25] word yes and when we were when we were [22:26] working on the book uh one of the guys [22:28] that I was working with he said hey how [22:30] how'd you get the as a hostage [22:32] negotiator how'd you get kidnappers to [22:33] say yes only question I can remember [22:35] being thoroughly stumped by cuz I never [22:36] really thought about it that hard at [22:38] that time and I said no we never did [22:41] it's a useless [22:43] word so we didn't even bother with [22:46] it so some of you sitting there sitting [22:48] there thinking right now like okay fine [22:50] now what you want me to [22:52] do cuz that's all I do and you know what [22:55] I close deals that way too you can't [22:57] tell me that I don't close deals getting [22:59] people to say yes no I'm not saying you [23:02] can't do it I'm just saying your batting [23:04] averag isn't anywhere close to what it [23:06] should be you're batting 125 when you [23:09] should be batting 350 for you baseball [23:12] players yeah stick to 125 you want to [23:15] stay [23:19] there because this is what it looks like [23:21] and this is why it [23:23] fails would you like to have a more [23:25] efficient [23:26] system would you like to have more [23:29] customers would you like to have more [23:31] free [23:32] time buy my [23:38] product now this is maybe there was a [23:41] point in time when this was a good idea [23:46] maybe but the swamp land time share [23:51] salesman the coupon book the $50,000 [23:55] coupon book [23:57] salesman has already battered them so [24:00] hard that they're battered by [24:04] yes you guys know [24:06] anecdotally what happens if you come [24:08] across a battered child and you try to [24:10] hug [24:11] him they still Flinch and jump back from [24:14] you but wait a minute I was trying to [24:16] give him a hug I'm a good guy I meant [24:20] well I wasn't trying to trap them I was [24:23] trying to have [24:26] integrity it doesn't matter they're bad [24:28] everybody's battered by us you you got [24:30] to stop [24:32] this you got to stop [24:35] it okay fine you convinced me now what [24:38] number one is now a bad time to talk [24:41] look this is a great way to get started [24:43] on relearning a lot of your [24:45] communication skills into the Black Swan [24:47] method and one of the greatest and [24:49] simplest ways is to start with no [24:51] oriented questions in place of a [24:54] question you ask all the time and a [24:56] question you ask all the time is have [24:58] you got a few minutes to talk how many [24:59] phone calls how many interactions have [25:01] you started out with have you got a few [25:03] minutes to talk that's a yes oriented [25:05] question we hate yes we love no and this [25:08] is how you begin to make the transition [25:10] and begin to take power and I'll explain [25:12] to you in a little while how just a [25:14] switch from yes to no can probably [25:17] increase your close rate at least [25:20] 23% so instead of have you got a few [25:22] minutes to talk is now a bad time to [25:25] talk now there are only two answers [25:28] question this happens all the time you [25:31] only are going to get one of two answers [25:34] a person is either going to say no no [25:37] it's never a bad time to talk what do [25:39] you got and you've got their complete [25:42] attention which is what you were after [25:45] to begin with or they're going to say [25:47] yeah it is a bad time to talk but I can [25:50] talk Tuesday at two if it is a bad time [25:54] to talk they always give a great time to [25:58] schedule a call where again you've got [26:01] their undivided attention now what's the [26:03] problem with have you got a few minutes [26:04] to talk ask yourself what do you feel [26:06] when somebody asks you have you got a [26:08] few minutes to talk all these things go [26:11] through your mind uh what do you want to [26:13] talk about uh do I want to talk to [26:16] you um how long is a few [26:20] minutes the point is and when all these [26:22] things are going through someone's mind [26:24] they're not listening to you so when [26:27] someone says no no it's never a bad time [26:30] to talk to you they've completely [26:32] cleared their mind and they're prepared [26:34] to talk to [26:35] you now what if they just say yes and [26:39] they don't give you a good time to talk [26:41] I've seen people ask this on LinkedIn [26:43] all the time this is insane how stupid [26:45] is that do you really want to talk with [26:49] someone when they just told you it's a b [26:52] a time to talk you really want to keep [26:54] them on the phone with you while they [26:57] just said they don't want to talk and it [26:59] is a bad time to [27:01] talk that sounds ridiculous doesn't it [27:04] speaking of ridiculous number two no [27:07] oriented [27:08] question is it a ridiculous [27:11] idea now we ask this instead of is it a [27:15] good idea we ask us instead of would you [27:19] like to is it a ridiculous idea this is [27:23] a question I use with Jack Welch very [27:26] generous Man based on my interaction [27:28] ction with him to get him to agree to [27:30] come and speak at the negotiation course [27:32] I was teaching at the University of [27:33] Southern California at the time I go to [27:36] a book signing they're a long line of [27:38] people in line trying to get Jack wels [27:41] to sign their book Jack and Susie Welch [27:43] are out on a book Tour on their most [27:46] recent book at the time the real life [27:48] NBA they're signing books in La I want [27:50] to go and get Jack to speak at the class [27:53] they're hustling people through the line [27:54] they're doing everything they can to [27:56] keep you from talking a jack while you [27:58] go through the line for a whole variety [28:00] of reasons you've got maybe 30 seconds [28:03] from the moment that you walk up to the [28:05] moment they want you to walk away this [28:07] is not time to engage in a negotiation [28:10] or conversation I walk up to Jack Welch [28:12] he has no idea who I am I'm just another [28:15] person at the book signing and I say is [28:19] it a ridiculous idea for you to come and [28:22] speak at the negotiation course that I [28:24] teach at [28:25] USC now he looks up and to the left left [28:28] and he gets this hideous look on his [28:30] face and he looks [28:32] Furious and he just freezes with this [28:35] look on his face I get horrified I'm [28:37] afraid of made him so angry he's had a [28:40] stroke or something he's getting ready [28:41] to [28:43] die finally he looks down at me and [28:46] says this is my personal assistant's [28:49] name this is a Twitter account that we [28:51] use to communicate with her I will call [28:54] her and tell her who you [28:56] are I think we're going to be in Los [28:59] Angeles in a fall if we are we'll come [29:01] in and speak at your [29:03] course this is one of the great things [29:06] that a no oriented question does it [29:08] triggers follow on thought while Jack [29:12] was looking up and to the left he was [29:14] thinking through implementation details [29:17] before he responded to me this is one of [29:19] the crazy things the crazy [29:22] advantages of no warranted questions [29:26] number three [29:29] are you [29:31] against we use this instead of are you [29:34] in favor of would you like to do does [29:38] this sound like a good [29:40] idea are you against in the name [29:44] whatever it is one of the times this [29:46] work great was we were teaching the [29:49] Black Swan team myself and Brandon we [29:51] were teaching a Black Swan [29:53] method to some people in the health care [29:56] industry one of the women in the room [29:58] who worked on behalf of this healthc [30:00] care company had been trying to get that [30:01] a head nurse in a particular hospital to [30:04] implement a program the head nurse had [30:06] been adamantly against it she was always [30:08] saying no no no no this is one of the [30:11] things that's interesting people get [30:12] into the mode of always saying no and [30:15] it's their automatic response this is [30:16] why no warranted questions [30:19] Works she wanted to test the idea to see [30:23] if we get no oriented questions to work [30:25] she walks out of the room she calls the [30:27] head nurse [30:28] and [30:29] says are you [30:32] against and then asked her to implement [30:34] the program that she'd been trying to [30:36] get the head nurse to say yes [30:39] to for [30:41] weeks when she simply went from a yes [30:44] response to a no response are you [30:46] against the head nurse said no I'm not [30:49] against it and they made the agreement [30:50] on the [30:51] spot she turned around and walked back [30:54] into the room and said you guys are not [30:56] going to believe what just [30:58] happened she went out and got an [31:01] agreement on the spot with a no that she [31:05] hadn't been able to get previously four [31:09] weeks now let's do something crazy let's [31:13] put the two of these things [31:16] together you'll find that people suffer [31:19] all human beings suffer from something [31:21] known as decision fatigue they can only [31:23] make so many decisions in a given day [31:25] and they beginning to run out of energy [31:28] for decision making sometime after lunch [31:31] in the afternoon and they begin to get [31:33] drained so a couple of years ago I had [31:36] an intern that only asked me what and [31:38] how questions because he was horrified [31:40] at doing something wrong all the time he [31:42] was just afraid to make a [31:44] mistake and he'd ask me what to do or [31:47] how to do something in in the middle of [31:48] the afternoon I'd be like I I don't know [31:51] leave me alone and finally I told him [31:55] anytime after 1:00 on any given day [31:58] don't ask me any questions unless the [32:01] answer is no and I'll be able to think [32:03] it through and then you could ask me at [32:05] the end of the day look I'm gonna do [32:06] this do you want me to do this and I'd [32:08] be like no do this and I'd give him an [32:11] answer I could give him direct guidance [32:13] straight away people can answer no [32:16] oriented [32:18] questions even when their decision [32:21] fatigued now how can I prove this to [32:24] you several years ago I had the pleasure [32:27] of meeting Robert hervik Robert hervic [32:30] very generous guy got introduced via an [32:33] email mutual friend we go to lunch [32:36] Steakhouse in La he happened to have an [32:39] office just down the street from where I [32:41] was living at the time and it was my [32:43] favorite kind of lunch free he paid [32:48] number one indicator of how generous a [32:49] guy is number two I got 90 minutes with [32:52] him second indicator of how generous a [32:55] guy was and is [32:59] so at the time we're getting ready to [33:00] teach the Black Swan method at uh a live [33:04] training session in New York I offer him [33:06] a free ticket now I don't expect him to [33:09] come I think he's going to send one of [33:10] his top guys I want them learning the [33:12] Black Swan method he looks back at me [33:15] and says how many can we buy another [33:18] indicator of a generous [33:20] guy so we're going back and forth with [33:22] his team over how many tickets they're [33:24] going to buy Brandon Brandon Voss [33:28] president of the Black Swan group calls [33:30] me on the phone and says we can't get a [33:31] commitment out of herik people and we're [33:34] getting ready to sell the event out our [33:36] tickets are expensive and they sell out [33:39] because the blacks one method is that [33:41] good people want the [33:43] value Brandon says to me if you don't [33:46] get hervik to commit to the tickets [33:49] now then we're going to be sold out by [33:52] tomorrow morning he's not going to get [33:53] any and I'm going to sell the free [33:55] ticket that you promised him now I'm in [33:58] Los Angeles at the time Brandon is on [34:00] the East Coast which means he's got a [34:03] three-hour advantage or we've got a [34:04] three-hour disadvantage in Los Angeles [34:07] and it is 4:30 in the afternoon now one [34:09] of the additional problems is we got to [34:11] get this executed because by the time [34:13] the business day starts in La it's three [34:16] hours into the business day on the East [34:18] Coast it's almost lunchtime I got to [34:20] execute this [34:22] now I send an email to Robert herik at 5 [34:27] 5:03 in the afternoon remember the [34:30] decision fatigue issues when was the [34:32] last time you tried to get an answer out [34:35] of somebody after five o'clock at [34:38] night I send him a TW line email number [34:42] one is it a ridiculous [34:46] idea for you to commit to three tickets [34:49] to the event [34:52] now second [34:54] line are you against [34:58] paying for [34:59] them before the business day [35:02] starts in New York [35:05] tomorrow that email goes out of [35:09] 503 I get a response at [35:15] 54 no we're prepared to commit to three [35:19] tickets [35:21] now no it's not a problem my assistant [35:26] will get back to you within the hour [35:27] hour and we will pay for the [35:30] tickets the tickets are paid for and [35:33] it's all wrapped up at [35:37] 523 in the afternoon from 50:03 to [35:43] 523 no oriented questions to close the [35:47] deal number four which is also the [35:51] number one way to restart [35:55] Communications have you given given up [35:58] on X and the name whatever it is send [36:02] that out in a oneline email with this in [36:07] the subject and if you put anything in [36:09] the body put only that in the [36:12] body send it out as a text message by [36:16] itself word for word this is one of [36:21] these things in a Black Swan method that [36:23] you have to execute word for word I once [36:26] had a woman say [36:28] you know I tried that have you give up [36:30] line and it didn't work and I said all [36:33] right well really okay [36:37] possible tell me word for word what you [36:40] said and she said well you know I [36:42] thought the way [36:44] you worded it was a little harsh so [36:46] instead of saying have you given up on I [36:49] said should we give up on having lunch [36:52] to discuss the [36:54] project I thought to myself I you know I [36:57] wouldn't answer that [36:59] either here's a side note in your choice [37:03] of pronouns you'll notice that a lot of [37:06] times people default and say we when [37:09] they mean [37:11] you couple of years ago I was talking [37:13] with Brandon about a project that wasn't [37:15] getting done and I called him on the [37:17] phone I said look we got a problem and [37:19] he said you know stop interrupting me [37:21] with that Wii stuff you mean I got a [37:23] problem let's be [37:25] honest change your Wiis to you when you [37:28] mean you the other side will actually [37:30] appreciate it but this is a common [37:33] problem that people do in their pronouns [37:35] be really careful if you mean you say it [37:39] people know the disguised we and they're [37:41] not fooled by it it actually makes them [37:43] feel very uneasy have you given up on [37:47] now context is [37:50] important this has to be something [37:52] that's [37:53] ongoing I got to tell you the black swor [37:56] group I get emails all the time first [37:58] time email somebody says have you given [38:00] up on doing business with me well since [38:02] I never [38:04] started I couldn't have given up so I [38:07] take this as a sign of a manipulative [38:09] person already I don't want to do [38:11] business with him many [38:14] times just to make the point I'll fire [38:17] back [38:19] yes because it was so out of context so [38:22] this is context driven this has to be [38:24] something that they have been working on [38:26] for a while now we really got on to this [38:28] line in a Black Swan team a number of [38:31] years ago when we were teaching [38:33] negotiation at Georgetown and one of the [38:35] students in a class and I mentioned this [38:37] in the book never split the difference [38:39] brilliant student at [38:41] Georgetown he's working on a republican [38:43] fundraising committee this was several [38:46] elections back I think it was the second [38:48] Obama [38:49] election and they're doing Dialing for [38:51] dialers at night what's Dialing for [38:52] Dollars at night they call people on the [38:55] phone they ask them three yes oriented [38:57] questions questions supposed to be tied [38:59] down supposed to be the yes momentum [39:00] then you ask for the money theoretically [39:03] the way this [39:04] nonsensical Theory works is that people [39:08] got to say yes to the last question [39:10] everybody's been hustled and ConEd by [39:12] this believe me they don't have to say [39:14] yes to the last question the idea that [39:16] each yes is a micro agreement or tie [39:19] down is nonsense however it's really [39:22] common in the real world and a lot of [39:23] people do this because much of the real [39:26] world is monkeys see monkey do and this [39:28] is caught on well he goes in that night [39:32] and he changes the yes oriented [39:34] questions to no oriented questions and [39:38] the first question was of course would [39:39] you like to take the White House back in [39:41] November so he changes it to the no [39:44] oriented question have you given up on [39:48] taking the White House back in [39:51] November they ran the no oriented script [39:55] side by side to the yes oriented script [39:57] that night in the morning they had a [40:00] 23% higher success rate with the no [40:04] oriented script 23% what happened with [40:07] the committee that he was working on [40:09] they came in that morning and they [40:10] looked at the results and they said [40:12] don't ever do that again that was a [40:14] fluke that's not the way we do things [40:16] around here have you given up on it's [40:20] got to be driven by something that [40:23] someone has been working [40:26] on here's something else that's [40:28] important for you to remember in this if [40:30] they've gone silent on you if they're [40:34] ghosting you and this is the response [40:37] for when someone has gone silent on you [40:39] when they're ghosting you this one line [40:42] will restart your communication it will [40:45] work and it is a onot reset what's [40:49] important to remember remember this [40:52] phrase the system you're employing is [40:55] perfectly designed to give you the [40:58] outcome that you've [41:00] achieved your communication system with [41:04] the person who's ghosting you is [41:07] perfectly designed to get them to ghost [41:10] you you cannot go back to the same [41:15] approach that you had that led up to [41:17] them going silent on you them ghosting [41:20] you you cannot I gave this advice one [41:23] time to a woman who's selling an [41:25] investment fund shares an an investment [41:28] fund she was having trouble getting a [41:31] man to get back to where that she wanted [41:32] to make the investment and I said look [41:35] send send this out send this text out [41:37] he'll respond she's like fine you know [41:39] he's not getting back to me but I got [41:40] nothing to lose so I'll go ahead and try [41:41] it [41:42] anyway the guy [41:44] responded and she went right back into [41:47] her sales pitch that led him to ghost [41:51] her in the first place and that was the [41:53] last time she ever heard from him so [41:55] don't go back to the communic ation [41:57] system that you were using now why did [42:00] they ghost you because the communication [42:03] was ineffective people continue to [42:05] communicate if it's effective if it's [42:08] working for them if it's [42:10] moving their agenda it's if it's helping [42:13] them get to their goals so one of two [42:16] things has happened in the midst of this [42:19] communication number one they've lost [42:21] all power and influence on their side of [42:23] the table they're embarrassed to tell [42:26] you about it you have to take that into [42:29] consideration number [42:32] two you're not [42:35] listening you're pitching you're [42:39] selling if you were listening to them [42:42] they'd still be in touch with [42:44] you if you were listening to them you'd [42:48] have heard the hints you'd have perceive [42:51] the signals that they were sending out [42:53] to [42:54] you about whatever the problems [42:57] were that they're losing power and [43:00] influence in their company on their side [43:03] of the table or that you're not [43:05] listening you have to take this into [43:08] account before you restart the [43:12] communication the most likely thing for [43:14] you to do after you've restarted the [43:18] communication is to summarize a [43:20] situation from their [43:23] perspective you want to reestablish [43:25] productive communication [43:28] you want to establish Rapport you want [43:30] to get them bonded back to you to [43:32] continue to find out what's going on you [43:35] got to get a that right out of them do a [43:38] great summary summarize the [43:40] communication from their perspective [43:43] summarize the negatives stay away from [43:46] your sales pitch stay away from your [43:48] value proposition get a that's right out [43:52] of them and you will have fully reset [43:54] the [43:55] communication how many of you have [43:57] people that are not getting back to you [43:58] on the [44:02] phone we call them nonresponders there [44:04] was the CEO of a company that we were [44:07] interacting with recently we gave him an [44:09] instantaneous fix for this which I will [44:12] give to [44:13] you and he sent us an email back and he [44:15] said I'm 12 for [44:17] 12 on my [44:20] non-responders all 12 got back to me [44:24] instantly now if the CEO of the company [44:27] 12 for 12 how many non-responders are [44:29] going on in his company and how much is [44:30] that costing them cuz your [44:32] non-responders are the the proposals [44:35] there there the deals that you're [44:36] chasing and there's an old saying in [44:38] business it's not a bad thing to not get [44:41] the deal it's a bad thing to take a long [44:44] time to not get the [44:46] deal that's what's killing [44:49] you and the nonresponders are the people [44:52] that you're chasing and chasing and [44:53] chasing you know how many non-responders [44:55] I have or anybody in my my company has [45:00] zero and I will happily tell you that [45:02] I'm a non-responder to a number of [45:04] people that are chasing [45:07] us because they're not dialing [45:09] in properly to me they're not taking the [45:12] time to pay attention give me this yes [45:14] nonsense or they're sending me an email [45:17] it's a page [45:19] loan how many of you like reading long [45:24] emails how many of you send them [45:28] one of the biggest surprises that I took [45:31] really to heart in the book was getting [45:33] to know yeah first where we're so wired [45:36] I mean we're completely wired for the [45:38] opposite for example on a recruiting [45:40] call if I call a typical agent you know [45:42] who doesn't know who I am I may say Hey [45:44] you know Chris this is Alex Vidal with [45:45] related D blah blah blah how you doing [45:47] today by the way I see you're a great [45:48] agent I was calling to see if you would [45:50] be interested in learning more about my [45:51] company and the typical answer is no I'm [45:53] happy where I'm at it's a 30 second call [45:55] right I read your book I sit down with [45:58] my leadership team and I say guys I want [46:00] to try something different just H just [46:03] hang out I'm going to put it on speaker [46:05] so I call Chris and now Chris answers [46:07] the phone and said hey Chris this is [46:10] Alex VI with related ASG International [46:12] realy how you doing today oh I'm doing [46:13] great how are you I'm like oh man I'm [46:15] doing great I already know you're a [46:16] great agent just the fact that you even [46:18] picked up your phone to begin with they [46:19] start laughing you know because and [46:21] realtors in South Florida never answer [46:23] their phone so then I followed I go let [46:25] me ask you a question do you want to [46:26] make make less money this year than you [46:29] did last year and they say no I'm like [46:33] no no of course not of course I want to [46:35] make more money this year than I did [46:36] last year oh it sounds like you want to [46:38] make this your best year ever I do well [46:41] that's why I was calling I want to show [46:42] you how my brokerage can help make that [46:44] happen for me and I got the know right [46:46] away and then you got the know out of [46:48] the way and I followed it up with you [46:49] know the mirroring and the labeling and [46:51] all that and it was very interesting my [46:53] average recruiting call went from 30 [46:55] seconds to 10 minutes wow and just using [46:59] that opening line and I don't care I'll [47:00] share it with my competitors I I really [47:02] doesn't really bother me they just [47:04] spewing out information literally using [47:07] the mirroring and the labeling what is [47:09] it about people's need to want to say no [47:13] and what are the benefits of getting [47:14] that no out of the way first yeah you [47:16] know um we're conditioned there's some [47:19] conditioning out there that that we got [47:21] to recognize it's just true y so we've [47:25] gotten conditioned that every time we [47:27] say yes somebody's trying to lead us [47:28] into a trap somebody's trying to get us [47:30] to say yes you know the momentum selling [47:33] says each yes is a tie down a tie down [47:36] takes away our autonomy a basic human [47:39] driver of what we are as human beings [47:41] not what we are as males or females not [47:43] what we are as westerners is human [47:45] beings and this is about human wiring [47:48] you can't point to a CI a civilization [47:51] in the history of mankind it was content [47:52] as slaves it's driven us since we [47:55] crawled out of the swamps [47:57] so these tie downs take away our [47:59] autonomy and immediately begin to [48:01] diminish Rapport as we take away [48:04] somebody's autonomy and so we [48:07] conditioned that if somebody's trying to [48:09] get us say yes we're under attack we've [48:11] also conditioned ourselves is when we [48:14] say no we've just protected [48:17] ourselves we've just done something to [48:20] preserve our autonomy we're safer every [48:23] time we say no which is why so many [48:25] people's default answer is no not [48:28] because they thought it's true but [48:30] they've conditioned themselves and which [48:33] mean they feel safe when they say no [48:34] that is a neurochemical response the [48:37] chemicals that you feel when you say no [48:40] make you feel safe and secure [48:43] consequently you're more willing to [48:46] listen your guard's not up you've [48:48] protected yourself so you start out with [48:51] that question right [48:53] away where somebody says [48:55] no Then they've just gotten a hit of all [48:58] the chemicals that make them feel [49:00] safe and now they're willing to talk to [49:03] you and then you've got to you've got a [49:05] your your follow on moves are all [49:08] designed to make them feel heard like [49:11] you're interacting with them instead of [49:13] against them I mean it sounds like you [49:15] like to make more money that was based [49:17] on their response you instantly prepare [49:21] yourself to go into a collaborative [49:22] conversation again they're not [49:23] threatened they're not being attacked [49:25] they're not under siege [49:27] and now it's it's I'm not the least bit [49:29] surprised you're going from 30 second [49:31] calls to 10minute calls CU soon as you [49:33] preserve the other side autonomy now [49:35] they could talk to you candidly plus [49:38] you're different than all the other [49:39] bozos out there that are trying to get [49:41] them to say yes that's it and you know [49:44] the the typical answer is well I'm happy [49:45] where I'm at oh it sounds like they take [49:47] really good care of you yeah they do [49:50] awesome what is it that they they take [49:52] you know maybe I can learn something [49:53] about I can do with my company what is [49:54] it that they do to take care of you and [49:56] then you start finding all these holes [49:58] and then the wall just keeps coming down [50:00] we had a conversion rate of 75% from [50:02] calls to appointments it was it was UN [50:05] unbelievable and that's why I believe so [50:07] much in the book I read a lot of books [50:09] but very few make an a direct immediate [50:12] impact the way the way yours did just [50:14] curious all right so you got to a [50:15] conversion rate of 75% what what roughly [50:18] were you doing before that oh probably [50:21] we would get maybe one out of maybe [50:23] every six seven eight calls Maybe we' [50:26] get an appointment wow and then those [50:28] appointments had to show up the the fact [50:29] was not only were we at a 75% conversion [50:32] rate but the the bond that we had [50:34] created with those people during that [50:36] phone call was so good that they [50:38] actually showed up for the appointment [50:40] versus and I don't even have questions [50:42] about the yeses but we you know you talk [50:45] about in your book the three types of [50:46] yeses that we get that we typically get [50:49] um and so by spending 10 minutes on the [50:51] phone with them we we actually get the [50:53] approval action-based yes that moves the [50:56] the ball forward not just something to [50:57] get us off the phone interesting [50:59] subscribe to the Black Swan group's [51:01] negotiation newsletter which is free [51:04] doesn't cost you anything I had a [51:06] colleague with the FBI they used to like [51:08] to say if it's free I'll take three he [51:12] say subscribe to the edge if you're in [51:15] the United States send the text to the [51:17] number is 337 that's [51:21] 33777 the text message that you send is [51:24] Black Swan method black on method [51:28] 2337 comes to your email inbox on [51:32] Tuesday mornings when you're ready to [51:34] rock and roll and get after the week

===FILE=== jr0L6Z9WciQ - Aggressive Negotiator Try This.txt
https://youtu.be/jr0L6Z9WciQ
Aggressive Negotiator？ Try This!

[0:00] what should you do if your counterpart [0:01] just won't stop being [0:03] aggressive continually being aggressive [0:06] and you know that this is several things [0:09] you have to consider is this their [0:11] normal Behavior Uh have you dealt with [0:14] them in the past and this is the way [0:16] they they they [0:17] are or is it something else going on in [0:20] their world that they that that that's [0:23] interfering with them talking in a calm [0:26] voice or you know [0:28] not taking their [0:30] their anger or their stress out on [0:32] you if you can figure those things out [0:35] and realize that that that uh that [0:39] that's the case a great label [0:43] is it seems like I must have done [0:45] something to offend [0:47] you and if you did do something they're [0:50] going to call that out yeah you did you [0:52] know you this that or they they'll [0:53] realize that they're attacking you when [0:55] they shouldn't be attacking you and then [0:58] they'll normally calm down a little bit [1:00] and your tone has to be right when you [1:01] say [1:02] it you know and when you say things and [1:06] the people start to feel better and say [1:08] oh man I I didn't realize I was really [1:09] attacking him or attacking her and and [1:13] it wasn't intended for you it's just [1:15] that you know I'm under so much pressure [1:17] or my boss is always getting on me and [1:19] all these things happen today but if [1:21] they continue to do it you say you know [1:24] what feels like we need to take a break [1:27] from this for a [1:28] while we remove yourself from that [1:30] situation give them time to calm down [1:32] and think about it especially if it's a [1:34] conversation or a difficult negotiation [1:37] that both sides know that if y'all can [1:39] get past that you'll end up having a [1:42] great relationship and and and it'll be [1:45] beneficial for both sides where both [1:47] sides get to [1:49] prosper yeah I love it I I I would just [1:52] also sometimes out and I'm sorry in [1:54] front of the label I'm sorry Troy looks [1:57] like I've done something to offend you [2:00] yeah and and you say it with the right [2:02] tone and um the beauty about the the [2:05] label like Troy said if it's wrong [2:08] they'll correct you and give you more [2:09] information and sometimes you may use [2:11] one knowing it's wrong just because [2:13] you're not too sure yet what's causing [2:16] that attack and good label will normally [2:19] pull it out and give you more more more [2:22] data for you to digest and and continue [2:24] the conversation a buddy of mine who [2:26] recently retired and he and I work [2:28] together in the United States Marshal [2:30] Service and uh we used to go out and we [2:35] all we did was hunt fugitives and he and [2:37] I were both passionate we we always [2:39] wanted to catch them so on particular [2:42] days when things weren't going well for [2:44] him he'd get angry man he'd slam his [2:46] fist on the on the dashboard and [2:48] everything you know and I'd always go [2:50] wooa wooa and you would see that you [2:53] know the anger the anger that he had man [2:56] is all over his face his body is tense [2:58] and so it got funny because he was start [3:01] going [3:03] W and then he he he he realized that he [3:07] was so so high strung that it would calm [3:10] him down so that got to be funny he used [3:12] that as his means of deescalate himself [3:15] and you know uh and calming himself down [3:18] and then he and I would laugh about it [3:20] so that became the running joke whenever [3:22] I start doing wooa he he'd scream it out [3:25] real loud first and then you know it [3:27] would help calm him down he get he get [3:30] get to a point where he realized it [3:32] ain't that bad yeah yeah and actually I [3:35] just said that even in martial arts Cho [3:36] something we both enjoy it's U you're [3:39] Tau right when you're under attack and [3:41] when someone is going at you like you [3:42] have to put in a lot of reps literally [3:44] in the in the J and the doo wherever it [3:46] is they make you go through some [3:48] stressful situations so you can [3:51] understand how to breed properly and how [3:53] to bring yourself to a a space where you [3:55] you you you're really you know more [3:58] under control and can actually navigate [4:01] whatever attack is happening that you [4:03] know you just brought up a good point [4:05] you know your breathing when you're [4:07] doing your breathing and and you start [4:09] to get stressed or anxiety or you know [4:13] you know you get angered or you get [4:16] triggered look at yourself and and see [4:19] how your breathing [4:21] is [4:23] just that you take that you take the [4:25] time to do that is going to help diffuse [4:28] yeah part of that attention because [4:30] you're going to start wondering how your [4:32] breathing is is it is it short and [4:33] shallow or is it you know [4:36] long and you're calming yourself down or [4:39] is it like rushed and labored you know [4:41] that those things are going to tell you [4:44] there're also things that will help you [4:46] to diffuse that that tension and it'll [4:50] be reflected in your tone

===FILE=== pKJHj1BX-YM - How Leaving Ego at The Door will Change Your Negotiation.txt
https://youtu.be/pKJHj1BX-YM
How Leaving Ego at The Door will Change Your Negotiation!

[0:00] uh I wanted to go back to Mia's original [0:02] question because she said how do you [0:03] prepare she also [0:04] said how do we detach from our own ego [0:08] and quite frankly that's the hardest [0:11] part [0:12] because remember what Derrick said [0:14] before the only thing that you are in [0:16] control of is the way you respond so you [0:20] have to get in the right mindset when [0:22] you go into that conversation and you [0:24] have to not be afraid to kind of [0:28] subjugate yourself to the other side and [0:30] people always get all up in their [0:32] feelings when I say that but if they're [0:35] attacking you you need to realize by [0:38] staying curious whether or not it's [0:39] something you've actually done and this [0:42] is part of figuring it out because if [0:44] it's something that you haven't actually [0:45] done then you just kind of say okay well [0:49] here what all they have to say I know [0:51] this I know this is something that um [0:55] you know I I I I may have done so I need [0:58] to own it you you have to not let your [1:01] ego get the best of you because if you [1:04] have done something wrong that has [1:05] caused the attack you need to own it and [1:09] if you don't own it if you don't put it [1:11] out there if you don't apologize that [1:14] interaction is over that communication [1:16] is done because once you've pushed [1:17] someone to that point bringing them back [1:20] is difficult especially if you then [1:22] react instead of respond to whatever has [1:25] happened and that we have we've said [1:29] this already reacting and responding are [1:31] two different things if you are someone [1:33] who constantly reacts you need to touch [1:35] base with yourself and figure out where [1:38] your ego is and put a little check on [1:40] yourself because you reacting in the [1:43] moment just makes the other side dumber [1:46] and you reacting in the moment just [1:48] shows that your amydala got triggered [1:51] and now you're both in a dumb place and [1:53] absolutely nothing can get accomplished [1:55] so don't be afraid to own it if you know [1:58] you made a mistake and that's the reason [1:59] for the [2:00] don't be afraid to just kind of sit back [2:03] and let them vent or let them say what [2:04] they need to say unless the manipulation [2:07] is what's happening and you'll know soon [2:09] enough because someone's going to go for [2:11] a minute and a half two minutes and [2:13] they're going keep coming at you and [2:14] you're going to realize by staying [2:16] curious where this is coming from and [2:18] you're going to realize if you're [2:20] listening on a really good level what to [2:22] what they're saying whether or not what [2:24] they're mad about is actually something [2:26] you had control over or that you were [2:28] responsible for and don't deny it [2:30] because if you try to deny something [2:32] they know you did wrong you know you did [2:33] wrong you've also ruined the interaction [2:35] there [2:36] too Sandy I also think attacks often are [2:41] misinterpretations of the other person's [2:43] intent yeah and um we bring our egos to [2:46] the table and we react to that [2:48] misinterpretation without really [2:50] understanding the fully what the [2:52] perception is of the other person and so [2:56] if you're not aware of your ego going in [2:57] you could walk into that and allow an [3:00] attack to happen and escalate whereas [3:02] you could have used that quote unquote [3:04] attack as an opportunity to label and [3:07] get black swans get that information [3:09] that they're kind of guiding you to so [3:12] sometimes attacks quote unquote attacks [3:14] are really great opportunities if you [3:17] look at it if you can put your ego aside [3:18] and look at it that [3:20] way yes yes and [3:23] yes this is why I I I told you guys [3:26] early on is you got to stay in the [3:29] moment to figure out where it's coming [3:30] from because there might be some gold [3:32] there and if you if your initial [3:34] inclination is is to fight back a run [3:37] you're going to miss the opportunity at [3:39] uncovering that go those goals that gold [3:42] now uh Sandy said something that I [3:43] wanted to [3:45] um kind of uh add on to [3:50] um manipulation in their attack on you [3:55] if it's coming from a the manipulative [3:58] corner of world that attack is going to [4:01] have an accusation in it they're going [4:03] to accuse you of something during that [4:08] attack you're not being [4:11] fair uh you're being [4:14] disingenuous uh your price is way out of [4:17] line with what the market says and you [4:19] guys are basically [4:23] stealing I'm not going to let that go [4:26] you want to call me a liar you want to [4:29] call me a th Thief you better bring [4:31] stuff to back up that [4:34] accusation and [4:36] so seems like you have a reason for is [4:41] huge in that moment if they're going to [4:44] call you a [4:46] liar because that's what when they they [4:49] couch it as you haven't been transparent [4:51] you've been disingenuous what they're [4:52] saying to you is that you are a liar you [4:56] guys seem to be playing fast and loose [4:58] with the facts and figures they're [5:00] telling you that you're stealing from [5:01] them that is an attack on your character [5:04] and integrity and I'm not sitting back [5:06] for that in a Black Swan way you want to [5:10] call me a liar back it up you want to [5:13] call me a thief back it up sounds like [5:16] you have something specific that I did [5:18] that indicates to you that I'm stealing [5:20] from you or that I'm trying to steal [5:24] from you would you be opposed to walking [5:27] me through the data that led you to that [5:29] conclusion [5:33] that's a very good way to smoke out [5:36] manipulation manipulator ain't G to have [5:40] it you know in your heart of hearts [5:43] you're not stealing and you're not a [5:45] liar so why would you sit back and take [5:48] that from [5:51] someone now the easy thing to do is say [5:53] F you [5:55] buddy I'm not a [5:58] thief but that gets you no [6:01] information would you be opposed to [6:03] walking me through the data that led you [6:05] to this [6:06] conclusion and let's see exactly where [6:10] it's coming [6:11] from now with all of these techniques [6:14] and we're talking a lot about [6:16] manipulation with all of all of these [6:18] techniques you better brace yourself for [6:20] an even more elevated response from them [6:24] because again the manipulators by and [6:26] large most of them have not been called [6:28] on it and when you try to call them on [6:30] it they're going to spin up and go [6:33] nuts because what their their impression [6:38] is I wasn't hard enough on them I've [6:41] never had anybody respond to me like [6:43] that so let me up the [6:45] Annie and so just brace yourself that [6:48] before it gets [6:49] better it's going to get worse [6:53] [Music]

===FILE=== qmdCDJtMXuE - How To STOP Verbal Attacks in Negotiation.txt
https://youtu.be/qmdCDJtMXuE
How To STOP Verbal Attacks in Negotiation!

[0:01] what one one strategy that has worked [0:03] also incredibly [0:04] well um for uh my team and I is we [0:09] actually will use a no oriented question [0:12] many times so for instance let's say [0:14] Troy is attacking me and and I see this [0:18] going into places that that are pretty [0:21] bad we would actually throw an oriented [0:24] question TR would you be against me [0:25] taking some [0:27] notes during this conversation and what [0:30] we have learned is that the ability for [0:33] us to actually take notes in Troy's mind [0:35] might now take this to wow he's going to [0:38] pay a lot of attention to what I am [0:41] about to [0:42] say and it has it has worked well for us [0:45] because in the middle of us taking notes [0:48] then we obviously will go and we [0:49] summarize it to Marcel's Point [0:52] ultimately but the M fact that we're [0:55] we're taking the time now to pay more [0:57] attention to what they're going to say [0:58] and you have to this is not for every [1:00] case but we have seen in the cases where [1:03] we know we [1:05] possibly have the solutions to what [1:07] they're asking or we were at fault or [1:09] something to that line taken notes have [1:12] work incredibly well and ultimately we [1:15] even use many of it to uh the notes that [1:17] we took to summarize the situation also [1:19] yeah that's a really good point I mean [1:22] bottom line is listening is a rare [1:24] commodity I mean people do not get [1:26] listened to we're we're craving being [1:29] being heard and so if you take the time [1:31] to truly listen especially when you're [1:34] being attacked especially when you don't [1:36] agree with them they're going to talk to [1:38] you and they're going to feel connected [1:40] to you and they're going to [1:42] reciprocate that kindness that you're [1:44] giving them um that's just the B I love [1:47] listening I'm a podcast listener I don't [1:49] know call me a nerd but I love these [1:51] long form [1:53] conversations because you're listening [1:55] to people apply these techniques and [1:57] people are getting comfortable to and [1:58] they're getting comfortable enough to [1:59] talk talk about things that you don't [2:02] hear Off You Know spoken about often [2:04] especially not in a public forum and [2:06] it's happening because the technique of [2:08] listening is being applied and so if [2:11] you're being attacked if there's [2:13] anything that I can help someone who's [2:15] dealing with a difficult person or [2:17] difficult conversation is what level [2:18] think to yourself what level of [2:20] listening am I at am I walking into this [2:23] conversation with an agenda or the the [2:25] need to correct or the need to set [2:27] boundaries at the top of my mind or am I [2:30] walking in listening at that higher [2:33] level that'll get you traction with the [2:35] other person it'll start to make them [2:38] feel more comfortable with you and [2:39] they'll open up to you and they'll work [2:40] through sometimes people just need to [2:42] hear their perspective to realize that [2:44] their perspective isn't necessarily [2:46] right sometimes that's all it takes is [2:48] them going yeah I guess that doesn't [2:49] really make sense or I just feel better [2:52] now that's strong yeah my curiosity to [2:56] meet her is going off with something [2:58] that George said when he was talking [2:59] about [3:00] you know taking notes asking about [3:02] taking notes would you be against me [3:03] taking [3:04] notes have you when you do that have you [3:07] noticed that they they actually slow [3:08] down their their their speech or even [3:11] lower their their tone when they do that [3:13] because they're starting to feel like [3:14] they're being heard yes a th% Troy [3:18] thanks for bringing that up a th [3:20] per. because they know if there somebody [3:23] like me I'm a two-finger typer so if I'm [3:25] writing you know I'm going to have to [3:27] spell check uh the letter A [3:31] so they know they have to slow down [3:33] because they want to make sure that I [3:34] get it and it starts to slow them down [3:37] enough that now they they're losing that [3:39] they're losing that steam because people [3:41] can only get angry they only they only [3:43] usually last anywhere from uh uh 45 [3:46] seconds to a minute it seems like a long [3:48] time but it usually last for 45 seconds [3:51] to a minute because they they run out of [3:53] steam they get fatigued from it yeah now [3:56] be careful though because what you don't [3:57] want to do I've been around people who [3:59] say oh I just I write things down so [4:01] that I can listen and then they're [4:02] totally tuned out of the conversation [4:04] just writing notes so be careful you [4:07] have to balance that as well yeah what [4:09] did you say again yeah like this is what [4:12] I do to listen and you're just totally [4:14] checked out yeah and then they want to [4:17] write it for you here let me write [4:20] it and you and you remind them you know [4:24] your thumb has something to do with your [4:26] learning process so if you're writing it [4:27] you're doing great [4:30] well it's [4:33] funny you touched on something so [4:35] important before we we leave and there [4:36] the summary part summarizing is so [4:39] powerful also it is so powerful because [4:42] how does Troy know that I'm looking at [4:44] things from his point of view from his [4:46] lens obviously if I'm using labels and [4:49] mirrors and dynamic silence he and I'm [4:51] doing it accordingly he's going to give [4:54] me information at some point I want him [4:56] to really see that I've been paying [4:58] attention and a summary is such a [5:00] beautiful thing to do once we put in the [5:02] Reps and we do it many times the summary [5:04] alone is going to just bring the [5:06] conversation back to an excellent level [5:09] or a level that you can just move [5:12] accordingly to wherever that is I've [5:14] seen it I've seen it where summaries [5:16] literally just dissipate the entire uh [5:20] negativity that we had on the table [5:22] because the person felt hurt they're [5:24] also so I from a different perspective [5:27] if you're in crisis and you just know [5:28] that you're not think [5:30] your emot your igdal is hijacked and you [5:33] really need to be par a participant in [5:35] the conversation um you're in a hospital [5:37] setting you're advocating for someone [5:40] they're coming you know with rounds and [5:42] you're getting information left and [5:43] right at you use summaries as a way to [5:48] instead of coming across as you know [5:51] pushy um uneducated asking direct [5:54] questions and um asserting yourself [5:57] which can feel like you are are not [6:00] respecting the um the profession you [6:03] know or the doctor's experience use [6:05] summaries summarize what they are saying [6:07] to you because I guarantee you you're [6:09] not catching it all and it doesn't come [6:10] across as accusatory so far you've told [6:13] me these are our you know this is what's [6:15] happening this is how you feel about it [6:17] this is what could happen and as a [6:19] result you feel you know comfortable [6:21] with the decisions that we we're going [6:23] to make moving forward they are going to [6:25] correct you and then you're also helping [6:27] yourself in crisis you're you are it's [6:30] kind of a stop gap for you who is not [6:33] receiving the information or at least [6:34] getting keeping the information because [6:36] you're you're in a mdala hijack so use [6:38] summaries they're one of my favorite [6:40] skills um particularly if you're in [6:42] crisis

===FILE=== s8oTmfx1c9Q - How to get 5X YES in Negotiation.txt
https://youtu.be/s8oTmfx1c9Q
How to get 5X YES in Negotiation

[0:11] [Music] [0:27] ladies and gentlemen please welcome to [0:29] the stage Chris boss I just want to warn [0:31] you guys in advance cuz if you've read [0:34] the book a night you may be familiar [0:36] with the hostage negotiators late-night [0:38] FM DJ voice and ask yourself is a whole [0:43] presentation gonna sound like that so I [0:46] just want you to know even though I [0:48] start out slow I kind of taper off after [0:51] that arch is a negotiator one of the [1:00] rules that we live by has never be so [1:02] sure of what you want that you wouldn't [1:03] take something better interesting all [1:07] right yeah but how do you make that [1:10] happen and it's hostage negotiation just [1:15] emotional intelligence you know it's an [1:17] empathy if you will [1:18] weaponized empathy hots hostage [1:20] negotiation and neuroscience and part of [1:26] emotional intelligence of what's [1:27] appropriate to the moment I don't tell [1:29] that joke in the middle of that CNN of [1:32] the parents Jeffrey Toobin doesn't give [1:34] my company the best commercial we ever [1:36] got the Black Swan group that is a [1:39] baddest-ass name I ever heard how many [1:43] times you guys figure I played that [1:44] video right but in the moment [1:49] appropriate to the moment because [1:51] something to learn the humorous humor is [1:53] uh effective and I don't think everybody [1:57] understands really how effective humor [1:59] is to be in a good mood to be in a [2:05] positive frame of mind makeup is 31% [2:07] smarter no joke [2:10] your brain has that's almost a pun right [2:13] no joke your brain has more capability [2:16] when you're in a positive frame of mind [2:17] 31% that's no small jump as I how am I [2:22] gonna use that as a hostage negotiator [2:23] huh am I gonna call inside the bank and [2:25] said hey I just flew in from Iowa boy my [2:28] arms tired [2:29] you know calling the bank say hey how [2:31] many Bank [2:32] it takes screw in a light bulb you know [2:33] I'm not gonna start out with jokes [2:36] because it wouldn't be appropriate to [2:37] the moment but appropriate to the moment [2:39] and I will tell you I'm sitting there at [2:43] CNN and the booth off to the side I'm [2:44] here in hostage this hostage that [2:46] hostage this and I'm thinking like this [2:49] is a straight line I'm just gonna have [2:50] to absolutely hit this I had Jeffrey [2:54] Toobin thought about that before I came [2:55] on and turned to Anderson Cooper or [2:57] trash Christiane Amanpour somebody else [2:59] I was sitting there and he said you know [3:01] Black Swan it's kind of badass you know [3:03] when he comes on I'm gonna ask him about [3:04] that [3:05] can you imagine what they would have [3:06] said the producer would have gotten a [3:08] Nazir and said no we're not telling [3:10] jokes here this seeing CNN does not [3:12] stand for comedy you're not telling a [3:14] joke but appropriate to the moment [3:17] appropriate to the context it helps [3:20] everybody it loosens the moment and it [3:22] makes you smarter here's an automatic [3:24] way to make yourself smarter those of [3:26] you in the room right now that are [3:28] frowning you're making yourself dumber [3:35] so we were looking at your colleagues [3:38] head see I told you no but seriously the [3:42] interesting thing about and what I love [3:44] about hostage negotiation is backed up [3:46] by neuroscience now and these different [3:47] things are completely backed up by newer [3:49] neuroscience because I can I can reach [3:53] into your brain I can flip flick a [3:54] switch you can't you can't stop me you [3:57] have things called mirror neurons I've [3:59] been reaching into your brain since I [4:04] took the stage I've reached into your [4:08] brain just now I'm inside hostage [4:15] negotiators use what we call the [4:16] late-night FM DJ boys we don't know why [4:20] it worked we just know worked you have [4:23] something in your brain called mirror [4:24] neurons when you hear my voice I begin [4:27] to change how your brain functions [4:29] before I finished a sentence we just [4:33] knew that the late-night FM DJ voice [4:35] seemed to calm people down I hit mirror [4:37] neurons in your head the mirror neurons [4:39] react it's an involuntary response [4:41] there's a bunch of involuntary responses [4:43] in there they're all tied into the [4:44] mirror the limbic system marinara's and [4:47] other things like that I can actually [4:48] turn your brain down we do a negotiation [4:52] exercise very intense negotiation [4:54] exercise when we when we do training on [4:57] business negotiation we put my son likes [5:00] to say my son is my Director of [5:01] Operations we want to put so much [5:02] pressure on you it's gonna make your [5:04] nose bleed but then while we're in the [5:07] middle of doing that I'll hit you with a [5:08] late night FM DJ voice and just watch [5:11] people's voices turned down when I'm in [5:15] a business negotiation and I'm gonna lay [5:18] out a term that there's no movement on [5:21] none it's typically a contract term [5:28] we've always got people giving us [5:30] contracts that have work for hire [5:31] clauses in them and we don't do work for [5:33] hire period period because that gives [5:37] away our intellectual property those of [5:38] you that are intellectual property [5:40] attorneys know how [5:41] well it is and we're not gonna give it [5:42] away so how do I get and I was talking [5:46] to one of the what do you guys earlier [5:49] here and he says we don't get what you [5:51] want less you asked for it we don't ask [5:53] for this stuff we want and we get it how [5:59] does that work well if I ask you for [6:02] something and you give it to me I owe [6:04] you [6:05] Robert out child any was six principles [6:08] of influence that are universal [6:11] reciprocity human nature responds so I'm [6:14] going to get stuff for you but I don't [6:16] want to owe you for cuz that's how we [6:19] did hostage negotiation how am I gonna [6:20] do a hostage negotiation with a bank [6:22] robber and oh that's not gonna work out [6:26] it with a kidnapper and oh it's it's not [6:28] gonna work out for me I want my stuff I [6:30] don't want to owe anything we get into a [6:34] discussion over contract terms and [6:37] there's a work-for-hire [6:38] clause in there I just say we don't do [6:43] work-for-hire and then I shut up [6:52] two-thirds of you shutting up it's a [6:55] struggle [6:58] two-thirds of units not just because [7:00] you're attorneys because you're human [7:01] beings shutting up as a struggle for a [7:03] variety of reasons I was once on the [7:08] trying to coach an attorney happened to [7:11] be female didn't matter she was female [7:12] but she was one that had taught that if [7:15] you're if you're not talking you're out [7:17] of control so she had to talk all the [7:18] time and I literally said to her to try [7:21] to get her to slow down and again it [7:22] didn't matter that it was a woman that [7:24] person and this one happens to be a [7:27] woman she's a human being that's and I [7:29] said did it ever occur to you to not [7:31] talk and it was the only time she [7:35] stopped talking and there's a reason why [7:39] that worked which we'll get into shortly [7:43] which also was contrary to the way [7:45] you're wired there's a few things about [7:46] your wiring that I'm going to try to [7:49] enlighten you guys to and maybe get you [7:52] out of doing [7:52] and it's gonna be hard it's not gonna be [7:55] complicated I'm gonna give you an idea [7:58] right now how hard it's gonna be for you [8:00] buddy make a fist with both hands fist [8:02] with both hands you have to put down [8:03] your stuff to do this but it's important [8:05] for you to experience this this is an [8:07] experiential talk we're gonna experience [8:09] stuff together put your right thumb up [8:12] put your left forefinger out just the [8:17] forefinger there you go now switch [8:22] switch back switch again speed it up [8:28] come on let's go let's go make it work [8:29] some of you are going like right so [8:35] here's some cool stuff about that real [8:36] quick which you should get it kick at it [8:41] first of all did you need to be Elon [8:43] Musk to understand what I was asking no [8:47] it wasn't complicated but a win against [8:50] how your synapses in your head or wired [8:52] right now was awkward awkward is [8:54] simultaneously the barrier to learning [8:56] and necessary for accelerated learning [9:01] you don't feel awkward you're learning [9:04] in a snail's pace [9:05] awkward is accelerated learning and that [9:09] feeling even some of you had trouble [9:11] getting your left forefinger out to [9:12] begin with but there was actually a [9:15] feeling in your head that was actually [9:19] the feeling of creating a newer a new [9:21] neural synaptic connection in your head [9:23] it was kind of a cool idea and then [9:26] switching back and forth you're trying [9:28] to fire that synapse now you've got some [9:32] synapses that are build you want to go [9:33] to your default [9:35] yram it's gonna be hard getting out of [9:38] that initially a couple of things I'm [9:39] going to share with it's gonna be hard [9:40] getting out of it and it'll feel that [9:42] awkward as a side note these days since [9:46] we're so much into emotional [9:47] intelligence hostage negotiation which [9:50] gets us into brain science which is some [9:51] cool stuff like I'm really into how do I [9:55] create new neural synaptic connections [9:57] getting this safe from my health law [9:59] my mental health yeah I personally I've [10:01] got something called Project 120 I want [10:03] to live to be 120 years old so I got to [10:05] constantly be building my brain so I'm [10:07] doing wacky stuff that's good for my [10:09] mind like here's another one that I like [10:10] to do to build my mental health brush [10:13] your teeth with your opposite hand I'm [10:17] willing to admit the first time I tried [10:18] this I had to move my head back and [10:19] forth because it couldn't make it work [10:24] but then what's the point of the neural [10:27] new neural synaptic connections really [10:29] awkward at first how many times before [10:32] you can do this quickly or any other [10:35] habit how long does it take you to build [10:39] a new habit some of you guys know right [10:44] how long how long the pile won't adopt a [10:45] new habit about three weeks right [10:49] interestingly corresponds with about 63 [10:53] to 64 repetitions of engaging in a skill [10:57] but doing it right which is where you [10:59] got to do it slow at the very beginning [11:01] you got to take your time John Foley [11:04] Blue Angel pilot I heard him give a talk [11:06] about two years ago talked about how [11:08] they wire a new groove into their head a [11:10] new habit in their head because if they [11:12] haven't wired that habit in their head [11:13] when they go up in the sky Blue Angel [11:15] pilots crash into each other people died [11:17] he said about 63 to 64 repetitions [11:20] that's why if you do it a few times each [11:22] day it takes it takes about three weeks [11:24] to pick up the skill someone lay some [11:27] stuff on you today but you're gonna try [11:29] it after you get out of here you've got [11:32] to you've got to put in the reps it's [11:33] not that long but the first few times [11:35] you do it it's gonna hurt your head and [11:37] you know what that's when you'll quit [11:42] not knowing how close the goal is on the [11:45] other side awkwardness is both the [11:47] barrier to learning and necessary for [11:49] accelerated learning what Chris Foster [11:53] Chris Wallace was the fbi's lead [11:55] international kidnapping negotiator the [11:58] two kinds of negotiations hostage [12:00] negotiations they're one where we got [12:01] the bank surrounded the bad guys are in [12:03] the inside and they can't get away and I [12:04] did a bunch of those and in her [12:07] kidnapping negotiations which is really [12:09] commodities exchange [12:11] first time I went to to learn the magic [12:14] skills the magic kidnapping negotiator [12:16] skills got me stood in front of the room [12:18] and he said are you finding any country [12:20] you go into kidnappers there's gonna be [12:23] an expected initial demand roughly [12:25] ballpark they're gonna expect to settle [12:28] at a percentage of that and they're also [12:31] going to expect that the kidnap is gonna [12:33] take a certain duration [12:34] what is it sound like sounds like a [12:40] market doesn't it I'm gonna the first [12:43] time I heard that I thought you're [12:45] outlining a market to me you're [12:47] outlining a business transaction [12:49] and I remember initially being horrified [12:51] the market was human beings then I had [12:55] to learn it doesn't matter what it is [12:56] for me it matters what it is for them [12:58] what it is for them is it's a business [13:00] and they have a division of labor [13:02] how many guys felt a movie man on fire [13:04] with Denzel Washington right who did he [13:07] negotiate with in that movie The Voice [13:11] voices job was to negotiate that was his [13:14] end of the deal [13:14] kidnappers have division of labor they [13:17] the commodities human beings have people [13:19] that acquire the commodity they had [13:20] people that transport the commodity they [13:22] have people that house the commodity [13:23] there are people that negotiate for the [13:25] commodities release and they got a boss [13:27] that complains about everybody the works [13:28] for it's not like a business right so I [13:33] get a call because there's been a [13:34] kidnapping in Haiti twelve-year-old boys [13:36] been grabbed and in Haiti 12 your boys [13:38] an American citizen it's not that [13:40] uncommon hey at the time before the [13:43] earthquake is a revolving door of [13:44] kidnappings they're grabbing when they [13:46] grab Americans they don't realize [13:47] they're grabbing Americans are grabbing [13:48] dual nationals they think they're [13:51] getting locals how does that happen in [13:52] many of the industries kidnapping [13:54] industries in the world kidnap big [13:55] markets in the world when they're [13:57] grabbing Americans they usually grab do [13:58] them dual nationals they don't own the [14:00] gravid Americans how does that happen [14:04] how'd you get your citizenship you're an [14:08] American citizen how'd you get it born [14:11] here I got my citizenship I grew up when [14:17] I'll I know my voice doesn't sound like [14:18] it but I grew up in Iowa [14:20] so I thought born here that's just a [14:22] natural order of things [14:24] vast majority the people in this room [14:26] that's how you got your citizenship do [14:29] you have any idea how unusual that is in [14:31] world you know how many developed [14:33] nations think that's a natural right [14:40] it's argued that they're to the US and [14:42] Canada you're born in Australia you [14:45] think that gives you Australian [14:46] citizenship they think that was it funny [14:48] you're born in England you think that [14:51] gives you English citizenship again [14:52] laughable concept some of the reasons [14:54] why I'm an unabashed fan of the United [14:57] States a complete patriot I don't [15:00] consider myself a member of either [15:01] political party I talk about issues [15:03] based on what I think of the issues not [15:04] on which parties behind them but I'm an [15:07] absolute patriot the United States just [15:09] I think that's where things should be I [15:11] love that about this country you're born [15:13] here you're an American citizen as it [15:15] turns out it happens to be an idea [15:16] mostly the Americas North and South [15:18] America [15:19] the vast majority of countries in North [15:21] and South America believe if you're born [15:23] there and entitles you to citizenship [15:25] it's called just Soleil I think it's a [15:27] pronunciation those of you that speak [15:29] Latin can say it better than me which [15:30] means right in the soil that's cool what [15:37] does it have to do with haiti haitian [15:38] mobs know that the very best gift they [15:40] could give their child on the child's [15:42] literal first birthday is a gift of [15:43] american citizenship I mean how powerful [15:47] how much that gives you an advantage [15:48] over the rest of the world just being [15:51] born an American so one way another that [15:53] finding their way into u.s. also the [15:55] child can be born an American citizen [15:57] that's the case in this in this instance [15:59] 12 real boys citizen the family's not [16:01] kid gets grabbed in a carjacking now the [16:04] business model and Haiti at the time [16:06] carjacking I gotta tell you I'm [16:08] impressed with this business model this [16:09] is a great business model you want to [16:10] talking about business models fear to [16:14] commodities business carjacked a car [16:16] with more than one person in it you [16:19] don't need to do video marking at that [16:21] point in time you let one of those [16:22] people go you've already handled your [16:24] mark [16:25] it's a live in-person marketing event [16:28] for you they run back and say hey guess [16:30] who weren't business with if they were [16:34] riding a car together they probably [16:36] could go tell that person's family to [16:37] get kidnapped right it gets even better [16:41] from that point forward [16:45] you've pre-qualified your client if they [16:48] have money for a car and gas and hate at [16:51] the time they got money for a ransom [16:54] Haiti's a poor country they got a car [16:57] and they're driving around in it they [16:58] got ransom money and here's the best [17:01] part here's a part of absolutely love [17:03] what happens if you grab the one person [17:06] in the family that nobody likes you [17:11] still got a car every one of your [17:18] clients what if you got their car to [17:19] hold on to when you did but you get paid [17:22] every time it's pretty good that's what [17:26] Dunham's carjackings boy gets kidnapped [17:29] father's not an American citizen he [17:31] knows his son is it goes to US Embassy [17:33] says my son's an American citizen he's [17:35] been kidnapped you're supposed to help [17:37] me [17:37] they say the FBI is gonna be there to [17:40] help you now I don't know what went [17:42] through his mind when he was told that [17:43] the FBI was gonna be there to help him I [17:45] can imagine it was probably something [17:47] equivalent of 15 minutes later he's [17:49] gonna hear her on the front door and [17:52] these guys will be there they might even [17:57] have FBI hats on [18:00] no they're FBI agents but instead about [18:05] 15 minutes later he gets a call from [18:08] some guy in Washington DC named Chris [18:10] Wallace and it really literally sense to [18:13] me on the phone you're in Washington DC [18:16] how you gonna help me how much time do I [18:22] have before this father hangs up the [18:25] phone [18:27] you're mean what do you say seriously [18:35] what would you say gotta get your son [18:42] back logic lay some reality out to him [18:46] tell me what happened [18:48] interesting who thinks tell me what [18:49] happened is an open-ended question it's [18:53] command and it's a statement tell me [18:57] what happened when you run into people [19:00] in your businesses what's the first [19:05] thing they say themselves especially if [19:06] they're under stress is it any different [19:11] than what this father said to me do you [19:14] have any less time and what you need to [19:21] establish you know how much time you [19:22] have does anybody know how much time do [19:24] you have before they either literally or [19:26] figuratively hang up on you before [19:28] you're losing the game how much time do [19:31] you have seven you get seven seconds [19:39] tick tick tick tell me what happened how [19:45] much time does that take person under [19:47] stress can I go okay I'm really glad you [19:50] asked you know now that you think about [19:53] it let me go back through this think [19:55] about it one step at a time how did I [19:57] get it all started when I was seven [19:58] years old I can't answer that question I [20:01] mean who can under stress seven seconds [20:07] and what do you have to establish well [20:10] you have to establish it's the same [20:12] thing I had to stay [20:13] what at war what is it trust absolutely [20:17] trust and competence exactly right you [20:23] get two things trust in confidence not [20:26] confidence competence and you get seven [20:31] seconds what do you say confident if [20:45] that worked would you need videos to [20:48] market your practice probably not [20:55] trust me I'm from the FBI and I'm here [20:58] to help you how do I know how to do this [21:03] because it did it wrong in the past the [21:05] first time I was in the Philippines on a [21:06] case that I'm gonna touch on it before [21:08] we get done here this morning they [21:10] walked me into room that the the heads [21:12] of the government are all there from the [21:13] Philippines I'm there to express [21:15] personal invitation of the American [21:17] ambassador the head of the API Manila [21:19] has gone to the Ambassador and given him [21:21] my name and said we need this guy and we [21:24] have to officially invite him to come [21:25] and help and we need to walk him into [21:27] this room where everybody except the [21:30] president of Philippines is gonna be the [21:31] Secretary of Defense is going to be [21:33] there the head of the police is gonna be [21:34] there police in the Philippines is the [21:36] National Police Force so the head of the [21:38] police is the equivalent of a cabinet [21:39] level position and at the time the [21:41] president's two closest personal [21:43] advisers were the Secretary of Defense [21:45] and the head of the police the only [21:48] reason the president of Philippines [21:50] wasn't in the rooms because then his [21:51] personal confidential adviser was and in [21:56] some in substance they said to me how [21:59] you gonna help us and I took this is the [22:03] a Victorian lay out my resume FBI agent [22:07] so many years joint terrorist task force [22:10] New York City one of the Attorney [22:12] General's Award one of the FBI agents [22:14] Association Award for distinguished and [22:16] exemplary service not only teach from [22:19] the book of Quantico now I've I wrote [22:22] the book [22:22] teach from not only trained by the FBI [22:25] but trained by Scotland Yard as well [22:27] laid-out my extensive credentials and I [22:31] could tell you they were suitably [22:32] unimpressed they may as well be owned in [22:36] my face why is that you guys know why if [22:44] your credentials showed that you knew [22:46] what you were doing you would never hire [22:50] the wrong person in your from and you [22:53] would never fail would you your [22:58] credentials correlate loosely with [23:01] whether or not you know what you're [23:02] doing [23:03] loosely what I say to this father [23:08] simple here's what I said [23:12] all right Haitian kidnappers are not [23:14] killing each kidnap victims these days I [23:16] realize that's really stupid because [23:18] they kill each other at the drop of a [23:19] hat but they're not killing kidnap [23:21] victims but today is Thursday and [23:24] Haitian kidnappers love to party on [23:28] Saturday night if you say the things I [23:32] want you to say when I want you to say [23:34] him we're gonna have your son out late [23:37] Friday or early Saturday morning he said [23:41] tell me what you want me to do and we [23:46] had a son out Saturday morning so let's [23:51] break down a little bit of what I did do [23:53] and also more importantly what I didn't [23:55] do [23:57] by the way through the course of the [24:00] kidnapping the father never asked me how [24:02] many kidnappings had worked he never [24:06] asked me how long had been an FBI agent [24:08] he never asked me how long I'd been a [24:09] hostage negotiator he never asked me if [24:12] I spoke French [24:13] or Creole the languages he never asked [24:15] me how many times I'd been to Haiti you [24:17] guys may have asked yourself this guy's [24:19] a lead international kidnapping [24:21] negotiator he's negotiated all over the [24:22] world how many languages is this guy [24:24] speak by now the answer to that is [24:27] abundantly clear barely one [24:32] how many times I've been to Haiti you [24:34] guys know how many times I've been to [24:35] Haiti I've never been dating never asked [24:40] me that none of those typical confidence [24:45] indicators ever came up as soon as I [24:49] told him what he was looking at here's [24:51] what you're looking at and then they [24:57] offered him the slightest bit of insight [24:58] into how to navigate that and he said [25:01] tell me what you want me to do I will [25:04] also ask you to compare how long it took [25:07] me to say that with how long it took me [25:10] to lay out my resume which was shortened [25:15] most communication hacks most ways to [25:22] shortcut to the actual process and make [25:25] it last less time seemed really indirect [25:28] and save time it seems like you're going [25:33] in another direction and it ends up [25:35] short cutting the process significantly [25:38] he's also what I didn't do and here's [25:44] where you're I'm going to ask you to [25:47] change your wiring cuz you got an [25:48] addiction I'm here to talk to you about [25:52] your addiction you didn't know it's [25:54] gonna be one of those meetings right [25:55] you're thinking I went to that one last [25:56] week so what a guy stands up when he [25:59] says hi I'm Chris you all go high and [26:02] cruise here's what you're addicted to [26:07] you love this word you love this word [26:11] feels so good yes you love hearing yes [26:19] you know it's a story that John Lennon [26:21] when he first started falling in love [26:22] with Yoko Ono he went to an art exhibit [26:24] that she put together it was kind of [26:25] this obstacle course thing and he [26:27] climbed over stuff and you crawled under [26:28] stuff you came to this rickety ladder [26:30] you climbed up this rickety ladder in [26:32] the top of the ladder was a telescope [26:34] but you know look through the telescope [26:36] and tiny letters on a far wall was the [26:39] word [26:42] but is a problem it's always a hook [26:47] right now you guys get addicted to this [26:54] and there's actually a study out there [26:57] that says you should do it cuz says all [27:00] you gotta do to get to yes which even to [27:05] this day has sold more copies in my book [27:09] first she has somebody say yes or [27:12] something little they need get them to [27:15] see you as to something else little then [27:18] you get the third little one and then [27:21] bang you gotta write it's called [27:25] momentum selling it's called the S [27:26] momentum many of you if you've been the [27:29] trial you've been taught never ask a [27:30] witness a question you don't know the [27:32] answer to in advance which means you're [27:34] gonna close down the question you're [27:35] gonna make it a yes or no and more than [27:37] likely it's gonna be a yes so you're [27:39] willing to admit that you are on a [27:40] planet Earth because you're gonna lead [27:44] them down a path ain't no you'll lead [27:45] them down a path in sales is called the [27:49] yes momentum own momentum selling and it [27:51] says given say yes to the little things [27:53] in your time down they can't get away do [27:56] you like that it's a violation of your [28:01] basic basic nature to autonomy your [28:03] right to autonomy fight if you pick up [28:07] the phone phone rings you pick up the [28:09] phone voice on the other end of the [28:10] phone says have you got a few minutes to [28:12] talk what's your gut reaction your gut [28:16] reaction a lot of quick automatic notes [28:18] wait a minute I'm just trying to get you [28:21] say yes or something oh what's the [28:23] matter with that well the problem is [28:27] whenever you say yes you don't know [28:28] yourself what you're letting yourself in [28:30] for and have you got a few minutes to [28:34] talk it's pretty simple you ask yourself [28:36] if I have a few minutes to talk to I [28:37] want to talk to you if I have three [28:40] minutes to talk and I want to talk to [28:41] you do I want to talk about what you [28:42] want to talk about there's an a man a [28:45] woman alive they haven't hasn't gotten a [28:47] call from this significant other and he [28:49] or she on [28:49] other than the phone says can we talk [28:53] and you think you said well I like [28:58] talking to you but I don't think I want [28:59] to talk about what you want to talk [29:00] about then after that is how long is a [29:04] few minutes my next-gen younger sister [29:07] calls me on the phone when she's got an [29:08] hour drive in front of her have you got [29:10] a few minutes to talk that's also code [29:13] for I'm gonna talk and you're gonna [29:15] listen another friend of my colleague [29:19] happens to be an attorney but it's just [29:21] that's just happens to be how he's wired [29:23] he lays out this entire agenda he's [29:25] gonna have you on the phone for at least [29:26] 45 minutes and he says have you got a [29:28] few minutes to talk typically a few [29:31] minutes is 45 to an hour and then the [29:34] last question you ask yourself at the [29:35] end of it how do I get off the phone so [29:37] the first problem is you guys got to [29:40] stop this you got to you got to get out [29:41] of this yes stuff I'm here to tell you [29:44] that every time you try to get somebody [29:47] to say yes it makes them concerned and [29:50] they get defensive and they get their [29:52] backup and he start to worry about what [29:54] they're letting themselves in for [29:56] experiment with it don't take my word [30:00] for it [30:00] look around you a couple of years ago [30:03] before my son is not my Director of [30:05] Operations and our best negotiator well [30:09] he was still trying to grass this we [30:11] come out of a training the security [30:13] guard that led us in to the secure [30:15] building the same guy that led us in in [30:17] the morning is there waiting when we [30:18] come out he's got on a uniform that says [30:21] he works for allied security and at the [30:23] time my son is saying I don't think [30:25] people are always nervous about saying [30:27] yes so we're staying in front of the [30:29] security guard he's at work [30:31] he's seen us before he's got his allied [30:34] security uniform on and I look and I'm [30:36] gonna go do you work vanillite security [30:38] he goes what makes you ask I just look [30:48] at my son and I go you'll be shocked [30:57] doesn't matter what it is is today [31:00] Friday somebody asks you that you know [31:03] they're going someplace with that and [31:05] you're gonna be reluctant there may have [31:07] been a point in time and actually [31:08] there's an academic study that refers to [31:10] this Izmir agreement and they say it [31:12] works when you look at any study make [31:14] sure you look at how they gathered the [31:16] data and decide for yourself whether or [31:19] not they thought it was legitimate data [31:21] because they seen a lot of studies and I [31:23] have no doubt there's one out there that [31:24] says playing basketball makes you tall [31:28] people will misinterpret the data this [31:33] doesn't work ask yourself how much you [31:36] like it [31:38] so something should be thinking like all [31:40] right now what am I supposed to do you [31:43] guys know who this is [31:46] Jack Jack wells right Jack Woltz at a [31:51] book signing in Los Angeles it's a [31:53] couple of years ago I'm going to the [31:55] book signing I'm an actress Jack to come [31:57] speak to the negotiation course I teach [31:58] at USC I'm gonna stand in line with 300 [32:01] people everybody how many of the people [32:04] in that line when they get up to Jack [32:06] Woltz you think of their gun and try to [32:07] ask Jack wells to do something pretty [32:11] much all of them right how many people [32:13] that day try to get Jack Woltz to say [32:16] yes to something how jumpy are they when [32:20] I come up and I get within arms like the [32:22] Jack Welch am I gonna stand there and [32:25] talk to him for 20 minutes [32:26] they got 300 people in line behind me do [32:29] they know who I am [32:30] have they got my ID if they put me [32:32] through a metal detector do they know [32:33] whether or not I'm carrying a gun as it [32:35] turns out I am carrying a gun they don't [32:39] know that I get this close to Jack Welch [32:42] I could do whatever I want to I could [32:44] hurt them if I want they can't stop no [32:48] shortage of reasons why people are [32:49] jumping you're me what do you say [32:57] I'm gonna come talk to my class trying [32:59] to get him say yes or something right [33:02] yes it's a trap I told you yes is a trap [33:05] what you haven't been willing to to [33:08] experiment with and see yet but you will [33:09] if you look for it at all here's what I [33:11] said the Jack Welch and this is this [33:13] part of the hack is just insanely stupid [33:15] I said is that a ridiculous idea for you [33:20] to come and speak at the negotiation [33:21] course a teach at USC notice which word [33:25] I'm looking for [33:26] he looks at me and he looks up into the [33:29] left and he gets really into any freezes [33:35] and the move and I think to myself I [33:40] just killed Jack Walsh dude's old right [33:46] he's so furious he just had a stroke and [33:49] he's gonna follow her dead right in [33:50] front of me so when he doesn't die [33:52] initially I'm relieved but he still [33:54] doesn't [33:55] unfreeze nine things he looks furious [33:58] and he's gonna start yelling scary [34:01] instead he looks at min he says this is [34:03] my personal assistants name this is [34:06] special Twitter account we have set up [34:07] to communicate with her I will call her [34:09] and tell her who you are and what you're [34:10] after [34:11] I think we're gonna be in Los Angeles in [34:13] the fall if we're in Los Angeles in the [34:15] fall we'll come and speak to your class [34:19] how many answers was that how many [34:24] questions [34:25] would you have normally had to ask to [34:31] get that many answers who should I speak [34:36] to how do I get a hold of them will you [34:38] call them and let them know that I'm [34:41] gonna be calling will they know who I am [34:43] what's your schedule look like give that [34:47] some thought on a consistent and regular [34:50] basis as nervous as people are about [34:52] saying yes they feel so comfortable [34:55] saying no which you will be shocked and [34:57] what people are willing to say no to [35:00] comfortably that they will then lay out [35:05] five more answers a calibrated note is [35:08] worth at least five guesses you guys [35:10] think you like yes what if you could get [35:14] five to seven yeses all in a row based [35:19] on one question we see this regularly [35:24] when it's important I do not bother with [35:27] the word yes I have no use for the word [35:30] I get five times farther trigger and no [35:38] regularly any one of your yes questions [35:42] can be switched to are you against do [35:45] you disagree have you given up on is it [35:48] a ridiculous idea is it a bad idea drop [35:52] that in the front of your yes questions [35:54] you'd be shocked at how much farther you [35:55] get instantly most of the people that we [35:59] train don't even bother with words yes [36:01] any more two useless words yes first of [36:03] all yes is nothing without how anyway [36:05] because there's three kinds of yeses [36:06] commitment confirmation and counterfeit [36:08] and since that [36:09] yes momentum nonsense has been used on [36:11] us so much people get real good at [36:13] getting account given the counterfeit [36:15] yes because you've heard it before when [36:18] and thought you had a deal and had it [36:20] fall apart haven't you it's happened to [36:24] everybody don't bother with the word now [36:26] what happens if triggering know is not [36:29] enough here's where you want to be this [36:36] is a response you want to get out of [36:38] people not you're right cuz you're right [36:43] is what they say when you're making your [36:45] case and you know when they say you're [36:47] right to you when you're making your [36:49] case what do they want they want you to [36:52] shut up if we joke around this about [36:57] this inside my company we say you're [36:59] right is code for shut the [&nbsp;__&nbsp;] up but [37:03] people say it in order to preserve the [37:05] relationship but it gets you to shut up [37:06] as a matter of fact you do it all the [37:08] time [37:08] you got a colleague who won't let leave [37:10] you alone you want him to shut up and go [37:11] away you look him in the eye no you're [37:12] right leave [37:15] and you go back to what you were doing [37:17] they come storming back in the next day [37:18] I thought I agree we talk about libido [37:20] you look at it begin ago you're right [37:23] and they leave again I'm tell I know [37:28] that every person in this room did this [37:31] at least once this week but that's right [37:35] as the difference now the question [37:37] becomes does it work on social pass so [37:41] as that kidnapping negotiator I'm [37:43] working kidnappings all over the world [37:44] Americans doing stupid things and this [37:46] is an American that did something stupid [37:47] in the Philippines and this is a [37:49] sociopath that's God and this is the [37:53] negotiator than I am coaching and we go [37:56] round and round for months and finally [37:58] and make no mistake this guy in a [38:00] bandana is a murder and rape and killing [38:02] sociopathic murder and machine does [38:06] empathy work on sociopaths this guy's a [38:11] sociopath this is a poster child for [38:12] social class we're several months into [38:15] this and we're gonna lay a heavy-duty [38:16] dose of empathy on this guy which is say [38:20] everything they're thinking saying and [38:22] expressed from their point of view until [38:24] they say that's right ten million dollar [38:27] ransom demand for the American on the [38:29] table the ten million dollars for more [38:31] damages for five hundred years of [38:33] oppression from the Spanish to the [38:34] Japanese to the Americans now [38:36] immediately all of you are tuning tuning [38:38] out because you're saying to yourself [38:41] I've never been in an argument where the [38:43] person on the other side was bringing up [38:44] stuff from the past that didn't matter [38:46] anymore [38:51] that doesn't happen 500 years of [38:56] oppression after about four months of [38:59] back-and-forth I put my guy in a phone [39:02] get it that's right out of him lay it [39:04] all out [39:05] you're not asking for ransom for the [39:07] American you're asking for war damages [39:09] for economic harm the Southland [39:10] Philippines for five hundred years of [39:12] oppression from the Spanish to the [39:13] Japanese the Americans he ingested [39:15] suffer at all [39:16] you know Filipinos anyway your separate [39:18] moral independent homeland it's being [39:20] oppressed by the current regime and [39:22] Manila it's held up by the latest [39:23] colonial invaders who are the Americans [39:25] lay it on thick my guy talked to the [39:31] terrorists and laid it on thick [39:34] and it was a moment of silence and a [39:39] terrorist said that's right and the [39:44] ransom demand went away we went from ten [39:47] million dollars to zero in that moment [39:49] it went away the sociopath let it all go [39:59] the case took a couple twists and turns [40:03] about four months later on Maundy [40:06] Thursday the Thursday before Easter [40:10] then I Jesus prayed in Gethsemane the [40:14] American walked away walked away he's [40:21] walking down a dirt road local farmer [40:23] sees him says you must be the American [40:24] has been kidnapped it says I am the [40:26] alert the Philippine military the [40:28] military comes down picks him up flies [40:29] into Manila they hold a big press [40:31] conference the military says in a daring [40:36] rescue operation we have rescued the [40:38] American said there the game arrived [40:47] we got him out of the country I'm back [40:50] in Manila about three weeks later I [40:53] connect back up with my guy he says [40:55] you're not gonna believe who called me I [40:58] don't know who called you the terrorist [41:01] sociopath the killer the killing machine [41:05] called him and said have you been [41:10] promoted yet I don't know what it was he [41:14] said to me on the phone [41:17] you're really good they should promote [41:19] you hangs up the phone what's he saying [41:21] in that moment and think the context in [41:25] this negotiation the sociopath got [41:30] nothing and he called his counterpart to [41:34] say I felt respected by you I talked to [41:39] you again we're okay [41:45] which is the way that everybody you [41:48] interact what should feel when they get [41:51] done with the interaction regardless of [41:53] how the outcome goes they should feel so [41:56] respected and so heard that they can get [42:02] nothing and say to you we're okay I deal [42:07] with you again all right real real [42:12] quickly we got a free only if you want [42:16] more only if you want more because I [42:17] think I think everybody's getting a copy [42:19] of the book we've got a weekly [42:21] newsletter we put it out it's free and [42:23] federal colleague that his favorite [42:25] phrase was if it's free I'll take three [42:30] so only if you want more this is a free [42:32] newsletter comes out every Tuesday short [42:36] sweet articles it's not one of those [42:37] newsletters that has 50 choices where [42:39] you after you decide what you want to [42:41] read you got to go take a nap because [42:42] it's so exhausting short sweet concise [42:45] send a text [42:46] FBI empathy all one word don't let your [42:49] spellcheck make it two words send that [42:51] message FBI empathy all one word to the [42:53] number two two eight two eight two two [42:55] eight two eight it'll also let you know [42:57] about different training that we have [42:58] coming up we've got some stuff coming up [43:00] in LA next week as a matter of fact but [43:04] we've got a lot of free stuff too I mean [43:05] we've got a we got a lot of stuff we do [43:06] a lot to try to help you get better [43:08] a lot there's a lot out there that [43:11] there's no charge for avail yourself of [43:13] the stuff that's free first when you [43:16] approach people with an approach of [43:21] respect and understanding you'll make [43:22] mistakes I made I made a mistake here [43:25] they banned me from CNN you'll make [43:28] mistakes you take this kind of approach [43:31] with people that you interact with [43:33] trying to get it right that important [43:35] part is trying to get to get all right [43:36] you don't have to get it right here's [43:39] the kind of difference it can make in [43:40] your life gentleman who's wrote the book [43:44] read the book in Florida applying it in [43:47] real estate ridiculously successful said [43:53] you gave me my son back had serious [43:59] problems with his son used it to [44:02] re-establish relationship with a 16 year [44:05] old boy another colleague who's got a [44:09] great feel for this uses of stuff to [44:11] negotiate 100 million dollar deals is [44:14] that a family reunion was young a sister [44:18] is a primary caregiver for their ailing [44:20] father and he said she had too much to [44:25] drink if she started in on me I've seen [44:29] her do this before with my older brother [44:31] my sister now I know it's my turn [44:33] cuz it's never good he said I had one [44:37] goal in mind make her feel heard not [44:41] dispute anything [44:43] she said he said went on for an hour an [44:47] hour the next day she sent him an email [44:52] that said I attacked you yesterday and [44:58] you showed me nothing but love thank you [45:02] for being my big brother use this stuff [45:06] not just in your business but on the [45:09] people in your lives they'll make you [45:11] like better thanks for spending time [45:13] with me [45:14] [Applause] [45:16] [Music] [45:17] [Applause] [45:23] [Music] [45:26] [Applause]

===FILE=== sORtpnkq97U - STOP Losing Deals by  Saying at the Surface Level.txt
https://youtu.be/sORtpnkq97U
STOP Losing Deals by  Saying at the Surface Level!

[0:00] yeah you know it's something that I see [0:01] often with coaching clients I recently [0:03] had a coaching client that um was [0:06] working through a deal and they had told [0:08] him how he was so great and their [0:10] company was so great and all of these [0:12] things but then not long later he said [0:16] if you don't give us what we want we're [0:18] going to walk away and my client took [0:22] that those words for face value After [0:24] ignoring what I had suggested he do um [0:29] but the latent Dynamic underneath that [0:32] is there are pressures there are there [0:34] are things that are going to potentially [0:37] put him in a bad position there's people [0:39] that are going to breathe down his [0:40] neck if my client weren't going to give [0:44] him what he asked for those those latent [0:47] Dynamics the things underneath the [0:49] surface is what he needed to go after [0:51] but he wanted to stay at the surface and [0:54] stay with the words that this person [0:57] said and that's an in in every aspect of [1:01] things when I I've seen it so many times [1:03] in Live Events there'll be role plays [1:06] where there's frustration and anger and [1:08] the best label people can come up with [1:10] it sounds like you're angry sounds like [1:12] you're frustrated and I'm like there's [1:15] so many more emotions underneath there [1:18] that you are [1:19] missing and to dereck's point if you ask [1:21] them on the spot what other things are [1:23] you hearing they can tell [1:25] you all of the other dynamics that [1:28] they're picking up on but they're afraid [1:29] to say it and it you know it can be um [1:34] nerve-wracking to say some of this stuff [1:37] CU you're afraid of setting the [1:38] conversation you're afraid of setting [1:40] the other side off and putting the [1:41] conversation into a direction where now [1:44] you're on the defensive and you might be [1:45] on your heels and now you might have to [1:47] defend yourself and you you talk up all [1:50] of these bad things that could happen [1:53] when in reality you actually call those [1:55] things out the conversation turns in a [1:58] much more positive manner you might get [2:00] the D the bucket dumped on you for a [2:03] little bit but just stand in it for a [2:06] few moments and let that person vent so [2:08] that you can really hear all of those [2:10] pressures and things that they're [2:11] they're truly feeling from their [2:14] side yeah [2:17] so great points I want to take you back [2:20] to how you started this and that was [2:22] with a a coaching client so he came back [2:25] to [2:26] you and said this is what they said [2:32] and [2:34] um when he told that could you gauge [2:37] where he was leaning what he what you [2:40] thought his response was going to be to [2:42] that [2:42] ultimatum well I he he had this big [2:45] meeting um we had met prior to the [2:48] meeting uh that he had with this [2:50] potential client and in our coaching [2:53] session he had told me here are all the [2:55] great things they said about us how they [2:58] are were the favorite all of these these [3:00] things he said but I'm afraid that he's [3:04] going to walk [3:05] away and I basically told him wait a [3:07] minute you just told me how they spoke [3:10] your value proposition and now you're [3:12] afraid that they're going to walk away [3:14] there's something beneath the surface [3:15] here and you need to figure out what it [3:17] is and he shared some some insights into [3:20] what they could potentially be but when [3:23] I eventually received the message of [3:26] they told us we're going to walk away if [3:29] you don't seed to us was a few weeks [3:33] later via email and he had as a result [3:37] caved to their requests given in and [3:41] when in reality the the real problem [3:43] with the entire situation is [3:46] mindset number one you have a scarcity [3:48] mindset you're afraid that this is going [3:49] to be you know if you don't do what they [3:51] do or what they ask you're going to [3:54] you're going to lose out on things [3:55] that's that's problem one and then [3:57] beyond that it's going beneath the [3:59] surface [4:01] and I think that if you have the right [4:03] mindset going beneath the surface [4:04] becomes a whole lot [4:06] easier you know uh we we get so wrapped [4:09] up in fears of destroying [4:12] Relationships by identifying negative [4:15] emotions that it ruins things it it it [4:19] stops us from from truly speaking those [4:23] uh as possible emotions on the other [4:27] end yeah um [4:30] so I was making some I made some notes [4:32] here um because there was a couple of [4:34] good things in there number [4:37] one um the fear that we have that [4:41] prevents us from as you said blowing the [4:44] conversation [4:45] up um my take on that is for all of [4:50] you with the identification of the [4:54] motivations of the other [4:57] side understand that we're not [4:59] identifying that stuff and articulating [5:01] that [5:03] stuff based on stuff that we're pulling [5:05] out of the thin air in other [5:08] words what we identify is based on data [5:11] they gave us we're not making stuff [5:15] up and [5:17] so it's not your opinion it's not your [5:22] judgment it's you saying to the other [5:25] side this is what you gave [5:27] me situationally insight intelligent [5:31] guess that's what we're doing based on [5:33] information that we're getting from the [5:35] other side this the other thing that you [5:37] hit on [5:38] mindset mindset [5:45] mindset think of the iceberg the the [5:49] image of the iceberg very small portion [5:51] of that mountainous chunk of ice is on [5:55] the surface that's easy to see [5:59] you can't see what's beneath the surface [6:01] the only way to see what's beneath the [6:03] surface is to have a curious mindset

===FILE=== u2CYUa8DRB4 - This Secret Phrase Transforms Deals Instantly- Magic Wand Phrases.txt
https://youtu.be/u2CYUa8DRB4
This Secret Phrase Transforms Deals Instantly!- Magic Wand Phrases

[0:00] Imagine having a magic wand that can [0:03] instantly transform any [0:07] negotiation. Sound too good to be true? [0:09] Not if you study with me and my cadre of [0:12] black swan negotiators. [0:15] This is part one in a series revealing [0:18] all 10 of the black swan groups magic [0:22] wand phrases which unlock empathy, build [0:26] rapport, and transforms your [0:32] conversations. Today is it seems like [0:36] you have a reason for saying that or it [0:40] seems like you have a reason for saying [0:42] that. [0:44] This phrase transforms your counterpart [0:48] by inviting them to elaborate on their [0:52] position. Even if you agree, you need [0:55] them to reveal the underlying [0:56] motivations that drive their [0:59] behavior. If you [1:01] disagree, you need them to reveal the [1:04] underlying [1:05] motivations that drive their [1:08] behavior. It tells them, "I'm interested [1:12] in understanding you. [1:14] which accomplishes the objective of [1:17] interesting people are [1:19] interested [1:21] even [1:23] charming. And here's the crucial part. [1:26] After you say the phrase, be [1:29] silent. Dynamic silence is a critical [1:32] finishing touch to any communication [1:35] skill. [1:37] Look at them thoughtfully, [1:40] expectantly, like you know they have [1:42] great thoughts to share because they [1:45] do. Let it happen. Count thousands to [1:49] yourself if you have to. Just resist the [1:53] urge to fill the [1:55] silence. That dynamic silence provides a [1:59] space for your counterpart to open up [2:02] and share their perspective. [2:05] If you feel awkward doing [2:07] this, that's a good thing. Awkwardness [2:10] is an indicator of accelerated learning. [2:12] So, embrace it. Hug the [2:15] cactus. Find out that you can liberate [2:18] yourself from your amygdala. And by [2:21] embracing awkwardness, you'll become [2:24] more comfortable and confident in using [2:27] this skill. No one will collaborate with [2:30] you willingly until they feel heard and [2:32] respected. You need their collaboration [2:34] to get what you want. Bring them onto [2:37] your team. Life is a team [2:39] sport. You're building rapport and [2:42] creating [2:43] trust. You have to have the small stakes [2:46] practice to learn the skills and their [2:48] impact. Follow the 464 rule. Try this [2:51] four times today. Four [2:53] times to get the feel of it. Now, what's [2:57] 64? 64 repetitions build the skill. [3:00] After you've done it four times, you got [3:02] some data to get a gut feel for it. Now [3:05] do it 64 times so you wire it in. It [3:07] becomes [3:09] automatic. After the [3:12] silence, summarize [3:14] them. Keep at it until you get a that's [3:19] right. Then simply wait for good things [3:22] to [3:23] happen. Do not share common ground. It's [3:27] not about you. Make a day of this [3:30] tactical empathy day. Free yourself for [3:32] a day of [3:35] experimentation. What you will find is a [3:37] day of people opening up to you in ways [3:39] you haven't seen [3:41] before. At the end of the day, you'll [3:44] have had an amazing day. Start today and [3:47] see the difference it makes in all your [3:50] conversations. You'll be delighted at [3:53] how much people are willing to share [3:56] when they feel heard. truly [3:59] heard. Remember the saying from Bruce [4:01] Lee? I fear not the man who has [4:03] practiced 10,000 kicks once, but I fear [4:06] the man who has practiced one kick [4:08] 10,000 times. [4:10] Because you deserve a bonus for getting [4:12] to this point in the video. Click below [4:15] to take a complimentary quiz to [4:17] determine which type of negotiator you [4:19] are.

===FILE=== uaAvX-61zv8 - The One Phrase that Revives Ghosted Deals.txt
https://youtu.be/uaAvX-61zv8
The One Phrase that Revives Ghosted Deals!

[0:00] Let me tell you a phrase, seven words, [0:04] one sentence. I've had many companies [0:06] use it. And seven figure deals that were [0:09] dead got resurrected and closed. Ready? [0:15] Have you given up on this deal? [0:18] When someone ghosts your deal, [0:21] when you followed up three times and [0:24] still get nothing but radio silence, [0:27] you're probably thinking they're just [0:30] not interested anymore [0:32] or they don't like me [0:35] or, you know, I don't know, all this [0:38] self-doubt. But what if the silence [0:41] isn't rejection? What if it's fear, [0:45] confusion, or even more likely a busy [0:49] calendar? [0:51] Let me take you back to the 2025 [0:54] negotiation mastery summit. Rooms [0:56] completely packed. Energy is electric. I [1:00] step up and I say, "There's one phrase [1:02] that brings dead deals back to life. [1:04] It's your homework to use it on any deal [1:07] that's ghosted you." [1:09] Now, some people laughed. They thought I [1:11] was joking. when I shared the phrase [1:13] with him, "Too short, too simple." Fast [1:16] forward to day two. I get back on stage [1:19] and ask, "How many of you did the [1:22] homework?" [1:24] Four hands go up. [1:27] One by one, they grab the mic. Each of [1:30] them says the same thing. [1:33] Chris, the deal that we hadn't heard [1:36] back on for months, [1:38] it closed. [1:40] Same phrase, same outcome. [1:44] Four seven figure deals resurrected. By [1:47] the way, the 2026 Negotiation Mastery [1:51] Summit is on sale now. [1:54] Check the link in the description. Now, [1:56] for most people, when they don't hear [1:59] back, they double down on value or even [2:03] offering discounts [2:05] or pitching something. Just checking in. [2:09] I wanted to see if you had any updates. [2:13] You know, kind of like the person you [2:14] used to date that just won't go away. [2:16] That's the way you feel. [2:19] They try to sweeten the pot. Let me be [2:22] blunt. [2:23] Chasing is not negotiating. [2:27] It smells like desperation. And [2:29] desperation [2:31] kills deals. Do you date somebody that [2:34] was desperate? Why? [2:37] because you're trying to sell instead of [2:38] triggering a decision. The phrase that [2:41] closed millions in ghosted deals. [2:44] Have you given up on our deal? [2:48] It works in person or even over text. [2:53] Then shut up. Do not add anything to it [2:58] in front or behind such as, "Hi, how are [3:01] you? Just checking in. I was just [3:04] wondering." say, "By the way, have you [3:07] given up on this deal?" Because I [3:09] haven't. So, you know, just in case, and [3:12] get back to me when you get a chance. [3:13] Don't put any of that nonsense in there. [3:16] Just the phrase, nothing else. That's [3:19] it. [3:21] One of two things will happen. They'll [3:24] get back to you within three to five [3:25] minutes of seeing it and say, "No, I [3:29] haven't given up. Let's find a [3:31] solution." [3:33] or they will say, "Sorry, we've moved [3:36] on." [3:38] Either way, it's a win for you. You will [3:42] either close your deal and make money, [3:45] or you will be allowed to finally move [3:48] on from worrying about a dead deal that [3:50] is never going to close. Maybe they were [3:52] playing you and were going to go with [3:54] somebody else all along. Or they have [3:56] gone with somebody and they just didn't [3:58] know how to tell you. Here's what's [4:00] happening. Psychologically, [4:03] humans hate the idea of losing [4:05] something. Fear of loss is at least [4:08] twice as powerful as the promise of [4:11] gain. More decisions are made to avoid a [4:15] loss or to avoid being fired than it is [4:19] to accomplish a gain or get promoted. [4:22] It's basically a fear-driven world. [4:26] So, when you ask, "Have you given up? [4:29] You're not pushing them to say yes to [4:31] something that they're going to feel [4:33] trapped or cornered by. You're giving [4:35] them a moment to feel ownership [4:38] and safety and security and protection [4:41] and control. The type of things people [4:45] need to make clear decisions. [4:48] And when people feel these things, when [4:51] they feel ownership, they fight to keep [4:55] it. [4:57] It also flips the dynamic. [5:00] You're not chasing. You're calmly [5:04] signaling [5:06] it's okay to walk away. [5:10] But are you okay with walking away? [5:14] That's power. [5:16] That's real influence. [5:19] That's tactical empathy.

===FILE=== vPxdT4SNsrY - STOP Making This Mistake With Establishing Trust.txt
https://youtu.be/vPxdT4SNsrY
STOP Making This Mistake With Establishing Trust!

[0:00] does anybody know how much time do you [0:01] have before they either literally or [0:03] figuratively hang up on you before [0:05] you're losing the game how much time do [0:08] you have seven you got seven seconds [0:12] tick tick [0:15] tick tell me what happened how much time [0:17] does that take person under [0:20] stress can they go okay I'm really glad [0:23] you [0:24] asked you know now that you think about [0:26] it let me go back through this think [0:28] about it one step at a time how did I [0:29] get in started when I was seven years [0:31] old I can't answer that question I mean [0:34] who can under [0:37] stress 7 seconds and what do you have to [0:41] establish what you have to establish is [0:44] the same thing I had to establish what [0:46] what what is [0:47] it trust absolutely trust [0:53] and confidence confidence exactly right [0:56] you got two things trust and confidence [0:58] not confidence [1:02] confidence and you get S [1:09] seconds getting back to the question of [1:11] the through line what is it that you've [1:14] noticed through your life that grabbed [1:16] your [1:17] attention and landed you in what you're [1:21] doing yeah great question um you really [1:24] you really got me thinking and maybe two [1:27] different things I mean the first one is [1:29] you know I like figuring stuff out my [1:31] father had a very figured out [1:34] attitude uh his approach to life and [1:37] then growing up in my father under my [1:40] father's roof I mean he expected his [1:42] kids to to work and to figure things out [1:45] so I think it was and I had no choice [1:47] like you know my older sister and I he [1:50] my dad wanted a new garage he handed us [1:53] we had an old garage in the backyard he [1:54] ended his crowbars and said go figure [1:56] out how to tear the old garage down I [1:59] think it was about 11 11 or 12 years old [2:00] at the time so but I've always enjoyed [2:04] figuring things out and I think that's [2:05] the the biggest piece did you go through [2:08] a phase because you know I'm now seeing [2:11] my grandchildren and you know kids can [2:14] be a little bit ornery did you go [2:15] through a phase where he said figure it [2:17] out where you you know push back a [2:20] little bit but then as soon as you got [2:23] into it you got the self-satisfaction [2:25] hey it's pretty neat figuring stuff out [2:27] you feel pretty independent was well was [2:30] there a rebellious streak in you at all [2:32] yeah you know and everybody's everybody [2:34] has one at some point in time and it [2:36] manifests itself in different ways uh so [2:39] no I didn't I wasn't I was never openly [2:42] rebellious there was a period of time [2:44] when I was about 18 years old that I i' [2:47] literally my father never never struck [2:49] me the way you know a man would strike [2:51] another man um uh he spanked me when I [2:54] was little not a whole bunch of times [2:57] but you know when I got to be more his [2:58] size he never struck me and I made him [3:00] angry enough for good reason when I was [3:03] 18 that I was sure that he was going to [3:05] Pummel [3:06] me but what happened what happened you [3:09] know I just I just became uh at the [3:12] summer [3:14] between my uh senior year in high school [3:16] and my freshman year in college I became [3:19] just useless just completely apathetic [3:23] uh you know he sent me out on tasks and [3:25] I would I would do a horrible job you [3:28] know I was I was out L useless and he at [3:32] some point in time you know he's paying [3:34] me he's not paying me to be useless I I [3:37] remember he he had enough and he had you [3:40] know in his business where his office [3:41] was in Mount Pleasant Iowa I remember [3:44] him taking me in the alley behind the [3:46] office and beginning to completely lose [3:49] his cool at me and I was certain that [3:52] you know and I knew my father was very [3:54] good with his hands I never saw [3:56] firsthand but I I knew stories of him [3:58] brawling when he was in the rings I was [4:00] certain he was going to Pummel me and he [4:02] did not but he did get my [4:06] attention do you do you think [4:10] uh do you [4:12] think [4:14] it you didn't [4:17] uh you respected him didn't you yes and [4:23] do do you think that part of I'm a [4:25] shrink I dissect some of these things do [4:27] you think that part of it was thinking [4:30] geez are you charging me for this [4:32] session am I gonna have to pay for this [4:35] I'm on a couch right now right but I'm [4:37] seeing the situation he takes you back [4:40] there he's about to lose it he's really [4:43] pissed off at [4:44] you but if I'm Chris at 18 I'm thinking [4:49] geez I really disappointed this guy that [4:51] I [4:53] respect yeah well that there there's a [4:55] fair amount of cognitive thought there [4:57] that sometimes 18 year olds in in the [4:59] midst of all their homeown changes and [5:01] growth can't really connect the dots at [5:03] the time [5:06] um I'm not sure that I was bright enough [5:09] at the time for that to occur to me it [5:11] it did get my attention yeah um I I [5:14] straightened up right away I [5:17] um uh I remember the very next day uh he [5:21] found out that I did something right he [5:23] drove 30 miles to congratulate me wow [5:26] wow [5:28] and uh you know then I think I [5:30] slowly strained out my ACT I mean later [5:32] later that fall I actually went out of [5:34] my way to help him out on something that [5:35] I knew he was he was having a real [5:37] problem with and I knew he appreciated [5:39] that so I think it sunk into my my [5:41] subconscious if not my conscious that I [5:44] disappointed a man that I respected and [5:46] I need to straighten up yeah yeah yeah I [5:49] I I've been blessed I've had eight [5:51] mentors they've all died the last one [5:53] was Larry King and a guy named Warren [5:55] Bennis before him and an impressive list [5:59] yeah know you I was very fortunate and [6:01] uh but they uh I'll tell you not [6:04] disappointing them was the top of my [6:08] list I would never tell them I was ever [6:09] going to do something unless I was 150% [6:12] sure I was going to do it and because [6:15] their [6:16] esteem for me was was amazing you know [6:20] you know when you get someone to think [6:22] that hey you know you might be kind of [6:25] special in this way there was nothing as [6:27] good as that and uh uh my father my [6:31] brothers and I we had sort of a troubled [6:33] relationship so uh I think that's one of [6:35] the reasons I saw it out uh mentors and [6:37] things like that but get us back to you [6:39] you're the guest there so you straighten [6:41] out your life and then take us from [6:44] there and uh what what came to be [6:47] important to you as you started to [6:50] straighten out and get on with your life [6:53] well you know I I think you know doing [6:55] the right thing [6:58] um it [7:00] that sounds like a [7:01] cliche but it's always been something [7:05] that resonated with me and you know [7:08] despite all the stupid stuff that I did [7:10] you know through my late teens early mid [7:13] 20s like really stupid [7:17] stuff and we never stopped doing stupid [7:19] stuff of course but [7:22] uh can you just serve up one of those [7:24] because see one of the one of the [7:26] challenges my audience has is God you [7:29] have guests and they're just perfect I [7:32] mean I can't do what they do because [7:34] they're just perfect I'm just some guy [7:36] listening in or some woman listening in [7:39] and so the more that people can humanize [7:42] themselves with a little bit of a humor [7:44] so can you share one of the and I'll [7:46] match you stupid and foolish for stupid [7:48] and foolish trust me yeah you know and [7:50] that's that's a great point to bring up [7:52] too [7:53] because that myth needs to be pierced I [7:58] mean I fa book tools of the Titans I [8:01] think that I was looking at several [8:02] years [8:03] ago one of my big takeaway early on was [8:07] he said like all successful people have [8:09] deep flaws like there ain't nothing out [8:12] there is no such thing as an unflawed [8:14] human being probably no such thing as uh [8:18] someone who's not deeply flawed and all [8:20] of your Heroes and all of your Idols are [8:24] the same they get they got real serious [8:26] flaws and so yeah that's you know just [8:30] growing up in Iowa uh I grew up as [8:33] fairly goody two shoes like the worst [8:36] thing I ever did was drink beer [8:37] illegally in a [8:39] corn or drink you know drinking age in [8:42] Iowa when I was growing up was 18 and I [8:44] was I turned 18 when I was still in in [8:46] high school with it you know I mean even [8:49] drinking and driving at all I never got [8:50] arrested for drunk driving only by the [8:53] grace of God and which is why when a [8:56] judge can't and somebody is arrested for [8:59] drunk driving the judge realized that [9:01] ain't the first time this person was [9:02] drunk driving you know thank thank God [9:04] for Uber and lift CU there you know they [9:07] no excuse for getting behind a wheel [9:08] with any alcohol in your system now and [9:11] which is a rule that I pretty much stick [9:13] to I can't remember I don't think I'm [9:15] breaking that anymore but uh I did you [9:18] know and I was lucky enough that I I [9:20] never got arrested for it and and I [9:22] never got into an accident when I was [9:23] drinking grace of God only um and mostly [9:27] mostly stuff along those lines cuz I was [9:29] you know in Iowa and environment that I [9:31] grew up in like the worst thing I I [9:34] didn't smoke marijuana when I when I [9:36] left when I left High School I wouldn't [9:39] even talk to people that smoke marijuana [9:41] and I got to college and there were [9:42] people that I thought were really cool [9:44] and I'd be in a gathering and somebody [9:46] would break out a joint and I'd be like [9:49] what I thought you were cool how dare [9:50] you drink this or smoke this illegal [9:53] substance and and then then I can [9:55] remember then I didn't know how to [9:57] refuse it I was afraid to be around [9:58] people refusing and I'm sitting around [10:00] in my fraternity one night on the roof [10:04] bunch of guys drinking and then they [10:05] started passing around a joint and they [10:07] went to hand it to another guy in the [10:09] fraternity that I've really held a lot [10:11] of esteem for and he just went [10:14] noes and nothing bad happened to him and [10:17] I thought wow if it was it's that easy [10:21] just to say just to refuse if you don't [10:23] want it not suum to peer pressure so but [10:26] you know I did I just I struggle with my [10:28] life like everybody else [10:30] so so you just happen upon that example [10:33] where you said Gee that's pretty simple [10:35] just say no thanks because uh if you're [10:38] not familiar with Chris's work or never [10:41] split the difference he comes up with [10:44] these responses to almost any [10:48] situation that are what I call hidden in [10:51] plain sight brilliant I never would have [10:53] thought of that and I think that would [10:55] work so so can you share a little bit H [10:59] how that evolved because you are a [11:01] master I've watched you people could [11:04] could hit you with up with any [11:07] question and and you seem to have uh a [11:11] counterintuitive I never would have [11:13] thought of that kind of response it's [11:15] almost like you're almost an artist in [11:17] the way that you do that that's [11:20] very you know I just I I think my first [11:23] approach is first of all you know I I [11:26] don't care what works I just want to [11:27] know what works like um and you were [11:30] talking about Larry kinging being [11:31] curious you know when you and I were [11:33] talking earlier before and curiosity is [11:35] a superpower and like I just want to [11:37] know what works if if I got to figure it [11:39] out like you know what works and you [11:42] know nobody figures stuff out without [11:45] somebody spurring the thought in their [11:47] head like they either see it done or in [11:50] many cases when we're teaching a Black [11:52] Swan method we won't give you the answer [11:55] to a question till we burn the question [11:57] in your brain and we got an extremely [11:59] intense negotiation exercise we put [12:01] people through extremely intense called [12:04] 60 seconds so she dies we don't tell you [12:07] how to deal with it until we you know [12:10] until you feel like you've theoretically [12:12] been beaten with beaten with a baseball [12:14] bat having gone through it then [12:16] afterwards we started laying out how how [12:18] to handle a high pressure high intensity [12:21] negotiation and sometimes people say you [12:24] know why the heck didn't you teach me [12:25] that before you P me through the [12:26] exercise well you would have hung on to [12:29] it [12:30] until you understood that you had a [12:31] problem that you needed solving and so I [12:34] think probably that smoking marijuana [12:38] instance back you know when it was a [12:40] horrible thing to do you could go to [12:41] jail for serious time for even being in [12:43] possession of marijuana back in those [12:45] days right or wrong I ain't saying it's [12:47] right or wrong it's the way it was like [12:49] I didn't know how to refuse just and and [12:52] and not be ridiculed or embarrassed I [12:54] mean I was I'm up in my head my igula [12:57] which I know you're well familiar with [12:58] what that migdala does to you you know [13:00] my amigdala is whispering in my ear just [13:03] like it does everybody else's and and [13:06] then I see this guy just go no no thanks [13:08] and everybody was cool and I needed to [13:11] see somebody do it I knew I'd been [13:13] struggling with it somebody did it I was [13:14] like wow that's all there is to that wow [13:17] okay you know it didn't look that [13:20] hard so can you share a [13:22] few uh nuggets to wet people's appetite [13:26] that some of the things that you've [13:28] observed you've learned you've taught [13:30] that that when people hear it they'd say [13:35] that's not so hard and uh that would [13:37] work you know uh so to build on what you [13:41] just said I focus on what works you know [13:44] you know I'm not trying to be some super [13:47] intellectual academic type I look at a [13:49] situation it's got a problem what going [13:51] to work to fix it so can you share a few [13:54] examples that that uh when people [13:57] discover them they just they just smile [14:00] and disbelief like oh my God it's [14:04] just it's so [14:06] simple well yeah the opening story and [14:08] never split the difference revolves [14:10] around the phrase how am I supposed to [14:12] do [14:13] that and when somebody has given you a [14:16] challenge that either is ridiculously [14:19] difficult for you or you just can't [14:23] do like how how do you not refuse but [14:26] how do you begin to Telegraph to them [14:27] that this is going to be a problem or [14:28] how do you get them to maybe change your [14:31] perspective like and and the response is [14:34] not I can't do that the first response [14:36] is how am I supposed to do that and that [14:41] is like [14:43] transformatively effective for people [14:46] negotiating with difficult situations [14:48] now the downside of it is like eight out [14:50] of 10 times you get a 180 degree turn in [14:54] the [14:55] situation now one and one and 10 [14:59] you know I would say two in 10 to be [15:01] generous but one in 10 [15:03] maybe it doesn't work which you get and [15:07] people that are so used to that being a [15:09] home run will get back to us and say how [15:12] am I supposed to do that fail and we say [15:14] no it didn't fail it just gave you a [15:15] different picture what's going on the [15:17] one in 10 times that somebody turns [15:19] right back on you and says that's your [15:22] problem I don't care what happens to you [15:25] that's your [15:26] problem people are so flish by that they [15:28] said this failed well it didn't fail [15:31] what happened was you got feedback that [15:33] was different than what you expected [15:35] with that feedback you just the person [15:38] just blatantly told you they do not care [15:41] about you in any way shape or [15:43] form which now you got a se you got a [15:46] second decision to make do I want to [15:48] continue is this a business partner is [15:49] this a colleague is this a kidnapper is [15:52] this a proverbial terrorist but you now [15:55] know what you're dealing with and in our [15:58] business and our person life the real [15:59] answer there is move on as hard as it is [16:03] this is you know who wants to stay in a [16:05] business or personal [16:06] relationship with somebody that doesn't [16:08] care about you but how am I supposed to [16:11] do that I learned that question from a [16:14] Pittsburg drug [16:15] [Laughter] [16:18] dealer share that story a little bit [16:21] quickly well we we had a kidnapping in [16:24] the Philippines that had gone really bad [16:26] right after a really successful one the [16:28] very next one was a train [16:31] wreck the buram barrel case two out of [16:34] three of The Americans ended up dead a [16:37] bunch of Filipinos ended up dead and in [16:40] the midst of it I knew that someone had [16:43] acquired Proof of Life by getting one of [16:45] our hostages on the [16:47] phone and to me that was magic [16:50] like we we'd love to get proof of life [16:53] but we never got a hostage on a phone so [16:54] what the heck is going on if somebody [16:56] else got a hostage on a phone and not [16:58] only that who's doing that there are [17:01] multiple buyers for the same hostage [17:04] this is supposed to be a buyer's market [17:06] that supposed to be a bidding [17:08] Warrior and I'm and I'm and it flums me [17:11] never never got the answer in the case [17:14] and then there's a drug dealer on drug [17:15] dealer kidnapping in Pittsburgh few [17:17] months later one drug dealer grabs [17:19] another drug dealer's girlfriend now in [17:22] the United States when somebody in your [17:24] family gets kidnapped no matter what [17:25] your occupation is you're probably going [17:27] to the FBI so drug dealer went to the [17:29] FBI in Pittsburgh you know help so FBI [17:34] hostage negotiators are riding around [17:36] and the victim drug dealer's car taping [17:39] the conversations with the bad guy drug [17:41] dealer which I realize is a redundant [17:43] term but out of out of the blue the [17:46] victim drug dealer just [17:49] asks a [17:51] fair natural [17:54] question and he says I'll never forget [17:56] the words hey dog [18:00] how do I know she's all right the how [18:03] question and there's this long silence [18:06] on the other end of the [18:08] line and a drug dealer says I'll put her [18:12] on the [18:13] phone and that's what I went like [18:17] wow it took you know somebody like this [18:21] this was eating at me I didn't know the [18:24] answer and somebody in a very practical [18:27] situation who was not sophisticated FBI [18:30] hostage [18:31] negotiator just ask the natural and [18:34] normal question that the other side has [18:37] got to allow you to ask they may not [18:39] like you may not like the way that you [18:40] answer it but this is a legit question [18:43] we started using various forms of how [18:47] with every bad guy that you can imagine [18:51] on [18:53] Earth and it never made things worse and [18:57] nine out of 10 times it made things [19:00] exponentially better you know at worst [19:03] they always said that's your problem [19:06] that's actually not an [19:08] escalation and it's since it's more [19:10] information you're better off but it [19:12] never make things worse remember you [19:14] don't get in life what's fair you get [19:16] what you negotiate if you want to become [19:19] a better negotiator click the link in [19:21] the description below that's why they're [19:23] doing them in [19:24] carjackings boy gets kidnapped father's [19:26] not an American citizen he knows his son [19:28] is go goes to the US Embassy says my [19:30] son's an American citizen he's been [19:32] kidnapped you're supposed to help me [19:34] they say the FBI is going to be there to [19:36] help you now I don't know what went [19:38] through his mind when he was told that [19:39] the FBI was going to be there to help [19:41] him I can imagine it was probably [19:43] something equivalent of 15 minutes later [19:45] he's going to hear on the front [19:48] door and these guys will be [19:52] there they might even have FBI hats on [19:56] so we know they're FBI agents [20:00] but [20:01] instead about 15 minutes later he gets a [20:04] call from some guy in Washington DC [20:06] named Chris Voss and he literally says [20:09] to me on the phone you're in Washington [20:12] DC how you going to help [20:16] me how much time do I have before this [20:20] father hangs up the [20:24] phone you're [20:26] me what do you say [20:31] seriously what would you [20:35] say get son GNA get your son back logic [20:40] lay some reality out to him tell me what [20:43] tell me what happened interesting who [20:45] thinks tell me what happened is an [20:47] open-ended [20:48] question it's [20:51] command and it's a statement tell me [20:54] what [20:55] happened when you run into [20:57] people and you your [20:59] businesses what's the first thing they [21:01] say to themselves especially if they're [21:03] under [21:05] stress is it any different than what [21:08] this father said to [21:09] me do you have any less [21:15] time and what you need to establish you [21:18] know how much time you have does anybody [21:20] know how much time do you have before [21:21] they either literally or figuratively [21:23] hang up on you before you're losing the [21:27] game how much time do you have [21:33] seven you got seven seconds tick tick [21:39] tick tell me what happened how much time [21:41] does that take person under [21:44] stress can they go okay I'm really glad [21:47] you [21:48] asked you know now that you think about [21:50] it let me go back through this think [21:52] about it one step at a time how did I [21:53] get in all started when I was seven [21:55] years old I can't answer that question I [21:57] mean who can and under [22:01] stress 7 seconds and what do you have to [22:05] establish what you have to establish is [22:08] the same thing I had to establish what [22:10] what what is [22:11] it trust absolutely trust [22:17] and confidence exactly right you got two [22:20] things trust and confidence not [22:24] confidence [22:26] competence and you get seven s [22:30] seconds what do you [22:36] say trust me I'm [22:41] confident if that worked would you need [22:44] videos to Market your [22:47] practice probably [22:51] not trust me I'm from the FBI and I'm [22:54] here to help [22:57] you how do I know how to do this cuz I [23:00] did it wrong in the past the first time [23:02] I was in the Philippines on a case that [23:03] I'm going to touch on before we get done [23:05] here this morning they walk me into a [23:07] room that the the heads of the [23:09] government are all there from the [23:10] Philippines I'm there at the express [23:12] personal invitation of the American [23:14] ambassador the head of the fbii Manila [23:16] has gone to the Ambassador and given him [23:18] my name and said we need this guy and we [23:20] have to officially invite him to come [23:22] and help and we need to walk him into [23:24] this room where everybody except the [23:26] president of the Philippines is going to [23:28] be the secretary of defense is going to [23:29] be there the head of the police is going [23:30] to be there police in the Philippines is [23:33] the national police force so the head of [23:34] the police is the equivalent of a [23:35] cabinet level position and at the time [23:38] the president's two closest personal [23:40] advisers were the Secretary of Defense [23:42] and the head of the [23:44] police the only reason the president of [23:46] the Philippines wasn't in the room is [23:47] because then his personal confidential [23:49] adviser [23:52] was and in summon [23:54] substance they said to me how you going [23:56] to help us [23:58] and I took this is the opportunity to [24:00] lay out my [24:01] resume FBI agent so many years join [24:06] Terrace task force New York City winner [24:08] the Attorney General's Award winner the [24:10] FBI agents Association award for [24:12] distinguish and exemplary [24:14] service not only teach from the book in [24:16] quanico now I've I wrote the book we [24:19] teach from not only trained by the FBI [24:22] but trained by Scotland Yard as [24:24] well laid out my extensive credentials [24:27] and I can tell you they were suitably [24:30] unimpressed they may as well have yawned [24:33] in my [24:34] face why is [24:37] that you guys know [24:40] why if your credentials showed that you [24:42] knew what you were [24:45] doing you would never hire the wrong [24:47] person in your firm and you would never [24:51] fail would [24:54] you your credentials correlate Loosely [24:58] with what whether or not you know what [24:59] you're doing [25:03] Loosely what I say to this father [25:07] simple here's what I said right Haitian [25:10] kidnappers are not killing each kidnap [25:12] victims these days I realize that's [25:14] really stupid because they kill each [25:15] other at a drop of a hat but they're not [25:17] killing kidnap [25:18] victims now today is Thursday and [25:21] Haitian kidnappers love the party on [25:25] Saturday [25:26] night if you do say say the things I [25:28] want you to say when I want you to say [25:31] them we're going to have your son out [25:33] late [25:35] Friday or early Saturday morning he said [25:38] tell me what you want me to [25:41] do and we had a son out Saturday [25:46] morning so let's break down a little bit [25:48] of what I did do and also more [25:50] importantly what I didn't [25:54] do by the way through the course of the [25:56] kidnapping the father never asked me how [25:59] many kidnappings I'd [26:01] worked he never asked me how long I'd [26:03] been an FBI agent he never asked me how [26:05] long I'd been a hostage [26:07] negotiator he never asked me if I spoke [26:09] French or Creole the languages he never [26:11] asked me how many times I'd been to [26:14] Haiti you guys may have asked yourself [26:16] this guy's a lead International [26:17] kidnapping negotiator he's negotiated [26:19] all over the world how many languages [26:21] does this guy speak by now the answer to [26:24] that is abundantly clear barely one [26:29] how many times I've been to Haiti you [26:31] guys know how many times I've been to [26:33] Haiti I've never been to [26:35] Haiti never asked me that none of those [26:40] typical competence indicators ever came [26:44] up as soon as I told him what he was [26:47] looking at here's what you're looking [26:52] at and then they offered him the [26:54] slightest bit of insight into how to [26:56] navigate that and he said said tell me [26:58] what you want me to [27:00] do I will also ask you to compare how [27:04] long it took me to say that with how [27:06] long it took me to lay out my [27:08] resume which was [27:12] shorter most communication [27:16] hacks most ways to shortcut this the [27:21] actual process and make it last less [27:23] time seem really indirect and save time [27:29] it seems like you're going in another [27:31] Direction and ends up shortcutting the [27:33] process [27:34] significantly what business you in I [27:37] think you guys are in a trust [27:39] business what business was a hostage [27:42] negotiator [27:43] in I was in the trust business but take [27:46] the word trust out and drop in the word [27:52] predictability and then things begin to [27:55] change because as soon as you begin [27:58] to make things more predictable and [28:01] understandable now you begin to help [28:04] them in huge [28:07] ways your clients buyers and sellers [28:11] match almost exactly the psychological [28:13] profile reactions of the family members [28:16] of a kidnapped [28:18] hostage somebody's family member gets [28:21] kidnapped their child gets kidnapped and [28:23] their hopes and dreams for the future [28:25] have been host taken hostage have been [28:27] hijacked [28:29] when your home is for [28:31] sale or you're trying to buy a home [28:33] these are hopes and dreams for the [28:35] future very same [28:38] profile you can Google the most [28:40] stressful events in people's [28:43] lives and buying or selling a home [28:45] especially selling a home is very high [28:48] on that hit [28:49] parade and the other interesting thing [28:52] about this is the very same as a [28:54] kidnapping is when a kidnapping starts [28:57] the family doesn't know when it's going [28:58] to be over even though I know I can [29:00] guess within if I know the profile of [29:02] the case and I know the country that [29:04] it's in I can guess within either a week [29:06] or a month as to how long it's going to [29:08] take I know but they don't know they [29:10] haven't been through this before one of [29:12] the definitions of traumatic stress is [29:14] that it's unrelenting they don't know [29:16] when it'll be [29:18] over your clients your buyers and [29:21] sellers they don't know when this is [29:23] going to go [29:24] away they don't know when it's going to [29:26] be over and that is overwhelming for [29:29] people that's why they call it traumatic [29:31] stress in the kidnapping business we [29:33] found out that the families of kidnapped [29:35] victims suffered traumatic stress at the [29:38] same rates as the [29:41] victims because they didn't know when it [29:43] was going to be over hostage negotiation [29:45] I've read the book for those people that [29:47] don't or that haven't read the book um [29:50] you've you've been in some crazy [29:52] situations that led you to really have [29:55] to understand how people think and how [29:58] like the processes that goes through [30:00] people's minds and so you're there like [30:03] what are some of the big [30:05] takeaways that you learned in the FBI [30:08] are things that like you don't think you [30:10] would have learned elsewhere that you [30:11] think the FBI does really well when it [30:14] comes to understanding people well you [30:17] know the great thing about being a [30:19] hostage negotiator is [30:21] um you start out assuming that some of [30:25] the crutches that most people want I [30:28] never going to be there like there's a [30:30] crutch that for us to make a great deal [30:33] together that we have to have common [30:36] ground that's a crutch it's a handicap [30:39] there's a crutch that I have to have [30:40] Alternatives you know my Harvard [30:42] brothers and sisters Advocate this thing [30:45] called Bat best alternative to [30:47] negotiated agreement you know and if you [30:49] don't have a batet you're screwed that's [30:51] a crutch so it's really cool to start [30:54] out negotiation learning from the [30:55] beginning like I don't have to have [30:57] common ground with person I don't have [30:58] to have Alternatives I could still make [31:01] a great deal and that's what the [31:03] advantage of starting out from here to [31:06] begin with is [31:07] and [31:11] I have Alternatives I don't care if I [31:13] have no Alternatives I'm not going to be [31:14] taken hostage by that and I think those [31:17] are the great things about starting out [31:18] a negotiation where I started out from [31:21] and now you know we're taking this into [31:23] business when I started out there was no [31:26] such thing as emotional intelligence as [31:28] a phrase I mean if you're aware in sales [31:32] in business uh in any aspect of the life [31:36] in general today you know that you need [31:37] emotional intelligence well hostage [31:39] negotiation just emotional intelligence [31:42] so we really started out in in a master [31:45] class on emotional intelligence and how [31:47] to make a great deal with whoever you [31:49] come across I mean I think that's what [31:50] the FBI really gets [31:52] right so I do want to get into sales but [31:56] I know my audience is going to want at [31:57] least one story from the FBI days so [32:00] take us back to and I'll let you choose [32:03] either your first one or your most [32:05] exciting one that you were actually the [32:07] lead negotiator on what did that look [32:11] like and how like nerve-racking was that [32:14] for you as you're sitting there because [32:16] you've negotiated in some pretty [32:18] high-profile situations right yeah yeah [32:21] yeah and you know what I love about most [32:24] of the negotiations um you haven't heard [32:28] this most of the stuff I did because we [32:30] were successful you know there's a [32:32] phrase in the media if it bleeds it [32:34] leads well we get people out okay and [32:37] you're not going to hear about it [32:38] because everybody went home everybody [32:39] lived and so yeah we had some we had [32:41] some high-profile cases I mean I worked [32:44] on a case one time with a fox journalist [32:47] really very few people know about this [32:48] guy Steve Sani gets grabbed in a Gua [32:52] strip the reason you don't know about it [32:54] is because we we get Steve Sani out of [32:56] that um and he he went through a [33:00] horrific situation and we did it with [33:03] some really interesting approaches that [33:05] the bad guys never knew we were there [33:07] the most dangerous negotiation is the [33:09] one you don't know you're in we [33:11] negotiated through people where they had [33:14] no idea we were influencing him those [33:16] are great negotiations where your [33:19] negotiation is invisible so yeah um a [33:21] lot of the stuff that I did you haven't [33:23] heard of because we did it [33:25] well so going in into the sales part or [33:29] side of things and coming out of the FBI [33:32] what like I know you talked about [33:34] emotional intelligence and and you say [33:36] that like the FBI taught you a lot about [33:39] that but like specifically when it comes [33:42] to like the pressure of sales because a [33:44] lot of the audience that that listens to [33:46] this type of podcast and that you know [33:47] is in the Facebook group and on YouTube [33:48] and whatnot uh they're like hey I get [33:50] nervous right or you know a big deal [33:53] comes in you know I start to sweat I get [33:54] anxious or whatnot did did the FBI I [33:58] teach you things specifically on helping [33:59] you keep your calm and keep your nerves [34:02] down or how did you go about figuring [34:04] that out as we transition over to the [34:06] sales side of things maybe not so much [34:07] when you know people's lives are at [34:09] stake or high-profile cases but in this [34:11] setting of just I don't know intense [34:13] situations be that sales be that [34:15] negotiations of any sort how important [34:17] is and how did you learn that all right [34:20] so um couple couple things that I think [34:22] will be really helpful you fall to your [34:24] highest level of preparation you don't [34:26] rise to the occasion [34:28] you fall to your highest level of [34:29] preparation you perform as you've [34:32] rehearsed and when you're satisfied with [34:35] the process um then you just let the [34:38] process work its way out you don't you [34:40] don't you don't get rattled along along [34:42] the way i' I've heard an analogy [34:45] being um you know a guy's walking a [34:47] tight rope guy or gal they don't they [34:49] don't look at where they're going they [34:50] look look down at their feet and they [34:52] worry about the next step you know make [34:54] the next step properly don't get rattled [34:57] about what we're going let go of where [34:59] you're going and focus on a process and [35:03] then in the FBI I always learned we had [35:05] the best chance of success which [35:09] means we [35:10] fail sometimes because there's no [35:13] guarantee of success I just want the [35:15] best chance of success so get in your [35:18] head you like your process you got the [35:20] best chance of success you do as well as [35:22] you can the universe is going to let you [35:24] succeed as well as you as you possibly [35:26] can then you get your practice in you [35:29] get you get your reps in and understand [35:32] that there's no one move that ruins [35:35] everything it's always an accumulation [35:37] so if you got a bad feeling you're [35:39] headed down the wrong path there's a [35:41] pretty good chance you need an [35:42] adjustment maybe just a 2 millimeter [35:44] shift maybe a tiny little shift I mean I [35:47] love that phrase from Tony Robbins and [35:49] most of us that are Tony Robbins fans [35:52] use a phrase let's make a 2 millimeter [35:55] shift you know I would attribute that to [35:57] him so many people I know talk about [35:59] that so make a minor [36:01] adjustment and and then give yourself [36:03] the best chance of success and and and [36:06] and that's that's where you go and I [36:08] probably rambled a little bit answered [36:10] maybe one or your three questions no no [36:12] that's that's really really good and I [36:14] like that a lot especially with the 2 [36:15] millimeter um part I actually just wrote [36:19] A playbook it's about I don't know 65 67 [36:21] pages long or so about habits and about [36:24] the mind and about um you know [36:25] subconscious and whatnot and I I talk [36:27] that specifically in there not the 2 [36:29] millimeters but I say that like when [36:30] you're going to change your life when [36:32] you're going to go try to rewire your [36:33] identity your brain like you don't start [36:36] out by trying to go and change every [36:37] single area of your life you certainly [36:39] don't go try to go to your biggest habit [36:40] and try to eliminate it just like that [36:42] you start root cause and you adjust it [36:44] just a little bit and those I don't know [36:46] who is it Peter what's his name Peter [36:48] sen sang I think it's his name the [36:50] American systems guy was like hey you [36:53] know the the smallest changes yield the [36:55] biggest results but the areas of biggest [36:56] leverage are off you know the the [36:58] hardest to find and I think that's super [37:01] important uh to recognize and understand [37:03] right guys Chris Voss here author of [37:06] never split the difference CEO the Black [37:08] Swan group a team of negotiators really [37:11] will help you get better at negotiation [37:13] today what I want to talk to you about [37:15] is negotiating smarter not harder how do [37:18] we negotiate smarter not harder well the [37:21] first thing is to think about how we [37:22] treat the word maybe and things that [37:24] sound like maybe I'm kind of shocked H [37:27] Maybe maybe not shocked how many people [37:29] use maybe or something that masquerades [37:32] or maybe in the negotiations we just [37:34] exercise on a regular basis that we do [37:36] with our clients when we're training [37:37] them we call it 60 seconds so she dies [37:40] you get a role play a hostage [37:41] negotiation where I am the bank robber [37:44] and I get you started I say I need a car [37:46] in 60 seconds or she dies only problem [37:49] is the first rule of the negotiation is [37:51] I've already told you that you can't [37:53] give me Transportation the first thing I [37:54] do is I turn around and ask you for a [37:56] car you know I've been surprised that [37:59] the number of people that we train [38:01] that'll give me some version of maybe [38:03] maybe I could do that maybe I could get [38:05] your car if I just had more time this [38:07] overall theme of how to negotiate [38:09] without bargaining and again it gets [38:11] back to how do you negotiate smarter not [38:14] harder well treat every maybe like it's [38:17] a no or anything that sounds like a [38:19] maybe treat it like it's a no don't uh [38:22] don't sucker for the Hope side of it [38:24] maybe I could get this I'll try whatever [38:26] that might sound sound like in one way [38:28] shape or form treat your may like a no I [38:31] had a businessman a number of years ago [38:33] tell me as soon as he started treating [38:35] all his no all his May isn't know his [38:38] business really moved forward how do I [38:40] want you to do this label it come back [38:43] with a label you could even say you know [38:44] that that that sounds like a maybe to me [38:48] or you might say it sounds like there's [38:49] problems here focus on the no aspect of [38:52] this the stuff that sounds like [38:54] non-starters identify them get them out [38:56] of the way use labels to do that and [38:59] you'll be surprised at how much more [39:01] effective your negotiations are and how [39:05] far fewer times you get caught up in a [39:08] quick sand of maybe negotiate smarter [39:11] not harder I wish you the [39:14] best in your negoti negotiating days was [39:18] there an instance [39:19] where it really didn't go the way you [39:22] wanted it to go yeah and with 93% [39:25] success rate means 7% of the time is [39:26] going bad [39:28] and that just that's just the nature of [39:30] the game is there one that stands out [39:32] for you as being well every one of them [39:35] does but then then the issue is do you [39:39] learn like uh Nim Nicholas talb would [39:43] call it post-traumatic stress [39:45] growth like you go through a traumatic [39:48] event um or you traumatized Bo by it [39:51] which and then damaged and never [39:54] recover post-traumatic stress uh injury [39:58] harm [39:59] disorder or is there post-traumatic [40:01] stress growth where you took that and [40:04] decided to be better than you ever were [40:06] before because you never want to let [40:08] that happen [40:09] again when I say when I say this what is [40:12] the incident that comes to mind well the [40:14] first one uh that people died in was the [40:18] second case that I worked in the [40:19] Philippines the burnam saaro [40:21] case and early on before we could even [40:25] get our arms around uh like a situation [40:28] that [40:29] was moving really fast and the [40:31] Philippine military was engaged in [40:33] chasing the bad guys and a Chase had [40:37] been on for [40:38] weeks um guos Saar was murdered uh by by [40:42] the [40:43] ABF about 21 days into that case they [40:47] had already killed a number of Filipinos [40:49] prior to that and as they moved across a [40:51] landscape and the oceanscape and Island [40:54] to Island South of the [40:55] Philippines they would they would kill [40:58] hostages and pick up new hostages cuz [41:00] there were people in their way all the [41:02] time so that was an ugly case from the [41:05] beginning to the end in the end of it [41:09] uh the two of the three remaining [41:12] hostages were killed in a boted rescue [41:14] attempt and they were shot by Friendly [41:16] Fire Philippines got Rangers [41:19] inadvertently stumbled over the Abu sa [41:22] encampment um didn't realize it was one [41:24] that had hostages in it just open fire [41:27] they recognized it as a terrorist [41:29] encampment formed the Skirmish line on [41:32] the trees on the uphill side and just [41:34] started pouring um rifle fire down into [41:37] the [41:38] camp uh and so that was that was the [41:41] first time that I'd worked anything [41:43] where people had gotten killed does that [41:46] stay with you yeah it does it does and [41:49] and I felt sorry for myself for a long [41:51] time and it's not like I'm I'm I'm happy [41:55] about it but for I'll never remember the [41:58] moment that I got the call 5:30 in the [42:00] morning I was in Washington DC where I [42:03] lived and a voice on the other into the [42:05] phone set of got bad news Martin is dead [42:08] and it was just a few hours after Martin [42:10] Burnham had been killed and Deborah Yapp [42:12] the Filipino hostage been killed [42:14] Martin's wife [42:15] Gracia um was wounded and [42:18] lived and I I'll never forget that was [42:22] the worst that to to that point and [42:25] since was the worst professional moment [42:28] personal moment of my professional [42:30] career and I used to say it's the worst [42:32] moment of my personal career till I was [42:33] here in another hostage negotiator [42:35] talking about a Siege he was in when an [42:39] infant had had had died had been killed [42:43] and I remember sitting there watching [42:44] him talk about it and he's still very [42:46] definitely dealing with the scars and [42:48] the wounds from having been The [42:50] Negotiator on scene and I remember him [42:53] saying like you know I don't know why I [42:54] keep telling you know giving these [42:56] presentations maybe I just want people [42:57] to know something bad that happened to [42:59] me on a Winter's day and I was sitting [43:02] there [43:03] thinking bad for [43:05] you that wasn't your blood it wasn't [43:07] your [43:08] child and I thought you know we're [43:11] taking on too [43:13] much cuz it wasn't a member of our [43:16] family it wasn't my brother wasn't my [43:18] significant other it wasn't my son that [43:20] got killed and that's when I tried to [43:23] that's when I realized I had to put that [43:24] stuff in perspective it wasn't doing [43:26] anybody any good for me feeling sorry [43:29] for myself I couldn't and and what we [43:33] the changes we made as a result of the [43:35] Burnham so barel case saved [43:38] lives you know that was that was our [43:40] mandate all right so Martin Burnham is [43:42] dead what do we do with that do we quit [43:45] or do we get better if we get better [43:48] somebody else is going to live and a [43:50] whole bunch of people ended up living [43:52] based on strategy adjustments we made as [43:55] a result of of that case [43:58] seems like a big a very significant sort [44:01] of burden to to carry right it goes back [44:03] to what I said at the start you know it [44:04] takes a certain type of person to want [44:06] to be want to play with those Stakes [44:08] yeah some somebody who's naive yeah you [44:11] just don't know any better makes us [44:13] difficult sometimes just thinking about [44:14] you know the traumatic things we go [44:15] through it makes us much difficult [44:17] especially in forming relationships I [44:19] was I struggled with that a lot [44:21] struggled in having a girlfriend [44:23] probably because my my home life was so [44:25] traumatic that I would always run from [44:27] commitment but when you've lived in such [44:29] through and you hear the same with like [44:30] soldiers and stuff you know when you've [44:32] lived through such sort of traumatic [44:34] events and high [44:36] stakes coming home to hey babe you right [44:40] can be difficult right yeah yeah it can [44:43] be it can be it can be difficult you can [44:46] you can have difficulty [44:47] unwinding the other person depending [44:50] upon how you process [44:52] information like the other person might [44:54] genuinely doing their best to be there [44:57] with you to get you to talk about it [45:01] and you know if you're if if that isn't [45:04] the best way that you process it and [45:07] yeah one of the very difficult things [45:08] about me is I don't process stuff by [45:11] talking about it I'll talk about it [45:14] afterwards you know but I I kind of need [45:16] I need to unplug you know I'll need a [45:19] good night's sleep you know I'll I'll [45:21] need I'll need to let it run through the [45:23] data banks and kind of bake on its own [45:25] I'm probably pretty good the next day [45:27] which is interesting because in your [45:28] work you have no time for [45:30] that yeah well you know and maybe that's [45:33] why I need it more at home because in [45:35] the work I mean we're going to you know [45:37] we're going on it right now we're [45:39] dealing with it right [45:40] now mirroring something you talk about [45:43] as well in the book which I find really [45:44] interesting because again something with [45:46] my girlfriend I I started to explore [45:48] which was you know when she says [45:49] something to me when she does something [45:51] I to make her again feel hurt I guess I [45:54] just kind of repeat it back to her also [45:56] trying to is it a body language thing or [45:58] is it just how how does mirroring [46:00] mirroring work well the hostage [46:01] negotiators mirror the black swans [46:03] mirror you know the way that we teach in [46:06] business now is just all verbal verbal [46:08] okay you know you if if if you start [46:10] lining up [46:12] physically uh which is what the body [46:14] language mirroring thing is MH like if [46:17] you if you if that happens naturally [46:20] then so be it enough people try to do it [46:23] as a manipulative tool that were really [46:26] leery of [46:27] even coaching people on that at all like [46:29] if we're talking and suddenly we both [46:31] find and I'm actually listening you're [46:32] listening we both find ourselves leaning [46:34] the same direction that's cool cuz we're [46:36] dialed [46:38] in but the body language thing is is a [46:40] tool of manipulation so many times of [46:43] people that are just trying to exploit [46:45] you that aspect of it we stay away from [46:47] now the hostage negotiator miror the [46:49] Black Swan mirror repeating just the [46:51] last one to three words of what somebody [46:53] said or then taking surgically picking a [46:56] gist one or three words here and there [46:58] it's ridiculously effective ridiculously [47:00] effective yeah did you did very nice [47:04] it's and and the thing that I find [47:06] fascinating about it too [47:08] is like if we find somebody that's [47:11] really into [47:13] mirroring there'll typically be somebody [47:16] whose IQ and EQ both are real [47:20] high and there are a lot of people whose [47:22] IQ is real high you know their book [47:25] smarts are good but their people smarts [47:26] are AR [47:27] good and they tend to love mirroring [47:32] because [47:33] it's the least amount of effort with the [47:36] maximum amount of [47:38] response and they want to guide a [47:42] negotiation in a very gentle but [47:45] purposeful way while the and the other [47:48] side doesn't feel guided they feel like [47:50] they're [47:50] expanding and it's been real consistent [47:54] so the mor the story is [47:57] um never be so sure of what you want [48:00] that you wouldn't take something better [48:02] come up with a new strategy and be [48:04] willing for good things to happen that [48:05] you didn't expect and that's what [48:07] happened amazing amazing and what would [48:10] you say would be you know looking back [48:13] your biggest uh [48:19] mistake wow um there's so [48:24] many you know and well it was really was [48:27] really in a previous case that I was [48:28] talking about where things went [48:30] bad uh because our mistake [48:34] was and I I didn't even know this is [48:36] what happens to a lot of salespeople and [48:38] I heard a salesperson talked about it as [48:40] being single threaded like I met a sales [48:43] conference a couple years ago and This [48:45] Woman's talking about you know she had a [48:47] great relationship with the person on [48:48] the other side and the she thought the [48:51] deal was going down and they got a [48:53] signed agreement and then he took his [48:56] agreement back to his U his company and [48:58] they said no we're not doing this and um [49:01] since you separated yourself from us and [49:04] agreeing to this he her counterpart not [49:07] only did she not get the deal but they [49:08] got fired the guy her counterpart got [49:10] fired subscribe to the Black Swan groups [49:13] negotiation newsletter which is free [49:15] doesn't cost you anything I had a [49:17] colleague with the FBI that used to like [49:19] to say if it's free I'll take three [49:22] here's how you subscribe to the edge if [49:24] you're in the United States send the [49:25] text too the number is 337 that's [49:29] 33777 the text message that you send is [49:31] Black Swan method Black Swan method [49:35] 2337 comes to your email inbox on [49:38] Tuesday mornings when you're ready to [49:39] rock and roll and get after the week

===FILE=== wvi62jNHIfI - How Dynamic Silence Will Win You More Deals Than Anything Else.txt
https://youtu.be/wvi62jNHIfI
How Dynamic Silence Will Win You More Deals Than Anything Else!

[0:00] so what skill do you do you consider to [0:03] be a great way to to to enhance your [0:06] listening skills that we [0:09] have uh I and this is a bias I have and [0:13] different people like different things I [0:15] love labels I have since I since I very [0:18] first started uh when I when I started [0:23] even as a hostage negotiator labels were [0:26] so much fun for me and I used them in [0:29] work in uh criminal intelligence and [0:32] organized crime in talking to sources [0:35] because they just they allow people to [0:39] open up to you and most of our skills [0:42] they're not what to say they're how to [0:44] listen and labeles for me was a great [0:47] one but I got to [0:49] admit probably the one that helped me [0:52] the most was Dynamic silence [0:56] because I was really good at labels I [1:00] was really good at a lot of things but [1:02] Dynamic silence not so much and when I [1:05] started consciously putting Dynamic [1:08] silence into my conversations I learned [1:10] so much more because it gave people [1:13] permission to talk and my mindset at the [1:17] time was you need to shut up and that [1:20] lets that that turns off all your [1:22] multitasking all your other stuff when [1:25] you're when you're putting that [1:27] intentional void in your conversation [1:29] yeah it helps you get more focused when [1:31] you do that uh for me it was summaries I [1:34] realized that I made a game out of [1:36] summaries I would uh try to remember [1:39] everything that the person said so it [1:42] required me to have to pay attention [1:44] just that much [1:45] more and then some of the things I would [1:49] I would try to I would intentionally [1:50] leave out to see if they were important [1:52] to them and if they said yeah you forgot [1:55] this then okay or if they didn't act on [1:59] it later on I Circle back around to see [2:02] if it still had any importance or how [2:04] much of it did I get right you know we [2:05] used to do that little game when we did [2:07] the Live Events where you know we we [2:10] used to have um [2:13] uh the the deal that happened in the [2:15] Philippines with Chris and then we have [2:18] have the teams summarize everything that [2:22] was said and it was so amazing how much [2:25] stuff people left out in the [2:27] summary that it made me realize for me [2:31] to get better at listening summary [2:34] summaries was going to be the thing that [2:36] would help me because it forced me to [2:38] have to pay attention to everything that [2:39] you were saying and I I found myself [2:42] even looking at you more dialing in more [2:45] just focusing trying to listen with my [2:47] ears and my eyes and just focus in a lot [2:49] more and then I started realizing that [2:52] man it's helping me get better and [2:55] people start to feel heard and [2:56] understood and you get a lot more that's [2:58] rights that's a really good good idea [3:00] I'm going to start using that because [3:02] that that is with a summary you [3:05] can't like a mirror you only have to [3:07] listen for last one to three words you [3:10] know if you're if you're caught out with [3:12] a summary you've got to be dialed [3:14] in you've got to know what uh what the [3:17] other side was [3:19] saying and that's what started happening [3:21] to me and and then I started making it a [3:23] game and I realized I was getting [3:26] better good for you good for you so what [3:29] what else causes people not to listen [3:34] well what like we said not paying you [3:37] know not being focused on the [3:38] conversation you have other things going [3:40] on in your world so you're not paying [3:43] attention uh you think that you have the [3:45] answer so you just want the person to [3:47] shut up so you can hurry up and tell [3:49] them because time is time is a some [3:52] sometimes something that people don't [3:55] value as much and they're [3:57] like well you know I wish they would [3:59] just hurry up and get to the point and [4:01] so they're dialed out and I I I say that [4:03] that made me think about a conversation [4:06] I had with an assertive uh that had [4:08] reached out to me in an email and she [4:12] was complaining about how people take so [4:15] long to say what they have to [4:17] say and I asked her you know what is it [4:20] about that that makes you upset she says [4:23] well because they could they could get [4:24] it done in three or four words and then [4:27] she realized that she didn't really care [4:29] about the fact that it was taking them [4:31] that long it was just the fact that it [4:32] was cutting in on her time to be able to [4:35] talk yeah I said you want to talk so [4:38] badly that you start looking and getting [4:40] frustrated with the other side even [4:42] though they may be saying something of [4:44] importance you want to get your point [4:46] out so quickly and so badly that you [4:49] dial them out and you think a 10-second [4:52] monologue from somebody or 15sec [4:54] monologue is like an hour and it [4:56] frustrates you and then once you start [4:57] getting frustrated you you're listening [5:00] less and as soon as they get finished or [5:02] they start to take a breath you want to [5:04] jump that it's so funny because that's [5:06] one of the basics that we teach is [5:08] people listen to rebut you listen to the [5:11] other side to hear something that you [5:13] can argue with or support and and the [5:17] rest of the time you're waiting for that [5:18] chance to do exactly that and I I I [5:22] realize and it's funny when you're [5:24] dealing with the analyst you know they [5:25] want that quiet so that gives them time [5:29] to think [5:30] the accommodator you know we get nervous [5:33] because we think we may have offended [5:34] somebody and so we want to keep the [5:36] conversation going and we want to steer [5:38] back steer the ship right so if we did [5:40] offend you that we we get you back on [5:43] back on on our side so to [5:47] speak it's amazing how once you start [5:51] using these skills and you realize that [5:53] you start looking at the different [5:54] personality types that you're having a [5:56] conversation with and you recognize [5:59] what's important to them how much easy [6:01] or how much easier the conversation will [6:03] flow [6:05] [Music]

===FILE=== yPsvgmZlVuQ - Chris Voss on Tactical Empathy  Successful Negotiation  Performance Coaching.txt
https://youtu.be/yPsvgmZlVuQ
Chris Voss on Tactical Empathy & Successful Negotiation ｜ Performance Coaching

[0:00] [Music] [0:01] [Applause] [0:03] [Music] [0:07] Uh a few months ago, someone gave me the [0:10] book Never Split the Difference and [0:14] started reading it and immediately [0:16] immediately said, "Wow." [0:19] And so today we're we're very fortunate [0:23] to have with us Chris Voss. Chris, come [0:25] on down. I I I put this quote up here [0:28] from the book. A successful negotiation [0:31] negotiator has to get everything they [0:35] ask for without giving anything back of [0:38] substance and do so in a way that leaves [0:40] your counterpart feeling as if they have [0:43] a great relationship. [0:46] Now, who would like to acquire that [0:48] skill? [0:51] Let me ask the question again in a [0:53] different way. [0:55] Who would like to acquire that skill? [1:03] On that note, Chris, they're they're all [1:04] yours. [1:05] Thank you. [1:06] All right. [1:13] It's very cool to be here [1:14] today. Uh let's try a quick little [1:17] exercise. All right. I want everybody to [1:18] stand up, please. [1:23] All right. I want you to get a nice [1:24] solid stance. Feet about shoulder width [1:26] apart. You know, feel very grounded. [1:29] Make a fist. Arms at 90° angles. Put [1:33] your right thumb up. Put your left [1:36] forefinger out. [1:39] Now switch. Switch back. Switch again. [1:44] Switch back. Sweep it up faster. [1:47] All right. Thank you very much. [1:54] All right. So, [1:57] what was the point of that? [2:01] Did you need to be Albert Einstein to [2:03] understand what I was asking you to do? [2:06] Was it complicated? Do you need a Nobel [2:08] Prize? Is it there's some technological [2:11] breakthrough there? [2:13] But was it easy? [2:15] No, it was. And the barrier to learning, [2:18] a barrier to change is awkwardness. It [2:20] was awkward. [2:22] Now, the hostage negotiation skills that [2:24] work, some of them actually kind of like [2:27] Jedi mind tricks. [2:30] They're not complicated, [2:32] but the first couple times you do them, [2:34] they're going to feel awkward. [2:37] There's some interesting brain science [2:38] now that back backs this stuff up. Now, [2:40] sometimes I will when when I'm training [2:42] somebody, I'll stop and I'll say, "Say [2:45] these exact four words. say them [2:50] because and they'll they'll resist but [2:53] and sometimes I'll say write it down. [2:55] What happens on a new skill every time [2:58] that you say it and then I'll say finish [2:59] the sentence is it actually creates a [3:01] new neural pathway in the brain [3:04] and the first time you're doing it the [3:06] first time you're doing this [3:09] you are actually in a process of [3:10] creating a new neural pathway in your [3:12] brain if you went and practiced it in a [3:14] little while and there's actually a [3:15] finite amount of practice [3:18] every single time you go down that [3:21] neural pathway it goes faster the next [3:23] time faster faster faster faster. [3:25] emotional intelligence. Hostage [3:27] negotiation is emotional intelligence on [3:29] steroids. [3:31] Stuff that we we found out worked in [3:33] hostage negotiation. We found out it [3:34] worked 40, 50 years ago. [3:38] Now, the brain science is there backs [3:39] backs it up. Tells us that, you know, I [3:42] used to the class I used to teach, I [3:44] used to say, do this cuz I said I've [3:46] been doing it for a long time. I said [3:48] just do it. Now, the brain science backs [3:50] it up. Couple things that I heard [3:53] beforehand that I really liked. Um Pete, [3:56] the strategy guy, said, "You're in a [3:58] trust business." [4:00] What business was I in? [4:03] Yeah, I was in a trust business. [4:07] So, when I first wanted to become a [4:09] hostage negotiator, [4:11] I'm a I'm a former SWAT guy, recovering [4:13] SWAT guy. [4:17] And uh [4:19] I had no background. I went to the woman [4:21] that was in charge of the hostage [4:22] negotiation team, FBI New York City, Amy [4:24] Bondo, [4:26] and I say this with the most reverence. [4:30] Tough New York chick, you know, my kind [4:32] of girl. [4:35] And uh and by the way, I grew up in [4:37] Iowa. I know the accent doesn't sound [4:38] like it, but I did. It's a long story. [4:40] Kidnapped by gypsies, all that. [4:43] So, I go to Amy and and I'd been on the [4:45] SWAT team. I've been on a SWAT team in [4:46] Pittsburgh and I tried out for the FB [4:49] FBI's version of the Navy Seals. Uh it's [4:51] just a hostage rescue team. Reinjured my [4:53] knee and knew that uh every SWAT's got a [4:57] shelf life like a professional athlete. [4:58] You keep doing it till you get hurt too [5:00] many times and you can't do it anymore. [5:01] And I thought, well, let's not blow the [5:02] knee out completely. Let me do something [5:05] in crisis response. So, I knew we had [5:06] hostage negotiators and I thought, how [5:09] hard could that be? I talk to people all [5:12] the time. I can talk to terrorists. [5:19] Yeah. And and and that's a little bit of [5:21] the background. I grew up in small u [5:23] small town in Iowa, Midwestern blue [5:25] collar background, son of Richard Joyce [5:27] Voss. And my son and I like the kid kid [5:29] that the Vos unofficial Voss family [5:32] motto is how hard could it be? [5:35] Which is not quite the redneck saying [5:37] like, "Hey, watch this. [5:39] We usually don't die." [5:42] But uh I said, "How hard could it be?" [5:46] So I went to Amy and and uh she was we [5:48] were both assigned to the terrorism [5:49] branch and I kind of walked up to her [5:52] and I went, "Tada." [5:55] She kind of looked [5:57] done her classes and me. Hm. Okay. Want [6:00] to be a hostage negotiator? Huh? Yeah. [6:03] She says, "You got any training?" Nope. [6:06] Okay. Got any psychology degrees? Nope. [6:10] Okay. You were cop before, right? Yeah. [6:12] Were you a hostage negotiator on a [6:14] police department? Nope. [6:16] She said, "Just go away." [6:18] And and I'm sure I didn't stand at my [6:20] feet and go, "But come on." But I know [6:22] that's how I felt. I was like, "No, what [6:25] do you mean go away? I want to do this." [6:27] She said, "I don't care. Everybody wants [6:28] to do it. Everybody wants to be a [6:29] hostage negotiator. You and everybody [6:31] else. Go away." [6:33] I said, "No, seriously. There's got to [6:34] be something I could do." She said, [6:36] "There is. Go volunteer the suicide [6:38] hotline now. go away [6:42] until you've done that. [6:44] And I went and volunteered and 5 months [6:47] later I came back and I said, "Hey, just [6:49] wanted you to know I've been on hotline [6:50] for about 5 months." And she's like, [6:51] "You're kidding." I'm like, "No." She [6:54] said, "Which one helpline? That's why I [6:56] volunteered." Yeah, you know, Jim, you [6:58] know these people happen to be a suicide [7:00] hotline that was attributed to being [7:03] founded by Norman Vince Appeal. The [7:04] power of positive thinking. It was [7:07] really founded by his wife, Ruth [7:08] Stafford Appee. It was her idea and she [7:10] had no problem getting her husband to do [7:12] stuff. [7:14] [Music] [7:16] She was a classic. You know, behind [7:18] every successful man is a powerful woman [7:20] and and they were a great combination. [7:22] Ruth Stafford be Norman Vincent Beiel [7:24] and and just, you know, one probably one [7:26] of the original power couples ever. And [7:29] and but I volunteered there and uh and I [7:34] I couldn't believe that she couldn't [7:35] believe that I went there. [7:38] It's a little bit of what you know what [7:39] you're getting what you're getting [7:40] today. Ask the people who know how to do [7:42] it. [7:44] Ask them what to do and then do it. [7:46] Sounds really stupid. [7:49] And unfortunately, it's just I went back [7:51] when I wrote the book, I went back to [7:53] Amy because her name wasn't out there [7:55] publicly and FBI pre-ublication review [7:57] says you got to go to certain people and [7:59] get their permission to put their name [8:00] in the book, otherwise leave their name [8:02] out. I said, I'm not leaving Amy's name [8:04] out. She brought me in. I because after [8:07] I volunteered on the hotline, there were [8:08] literally five people in line in front [8:10] of me. She jumped me past everybody. [8:14] She said when I went to her said, "I [8:17] want to put your name in the book." I [8:18] said, "You said, you know, I must have [8:19] told a thousand people to do that. Two [8:21] of them did. You were one of them." [8:25] Simple simple stuff. [8:28] Real real simple stuff. [8:31] So, [8:34] what do we do that's different than what [8:35] you're doing? [8:37] By the way, if you walk in the men's [8:39] room, you catch me doing this. [8:42] Now, you know why? [8:44] I'm not signaling anybody in there, [8:46] right? [8:50] I got to practice before I go on stage. [8:52] I don't want to screw it up. [8:57] So, um, [8:59] we got this this great video that we run [9:01] all the time [9:03] where it's a simulation of a bunch of [9:06] FBI agents getting ready to to for this [9:09] boring training and they're new people [9:10] in the office and one of the new guys is [9:13] a SWAT guy and he gets introduced to [9:15] another guy in in in the office while [9:17] they're sitting waiting for the boring [9:18] speaker and the guy gets introduced to [9:21] who's a hostage negotiator and uh, SWAT [9:24] guy looks at the hostage negotiations. [9:25] Yeah. Really? [9:27] So, what do you say [9:30] if some guy's got a gun and he says, "I [9:33] need a car in 60 seconds or she dies." [9:36] What do you say? [9:39] If I were to ask some of you to role [9:40] play with me right now and I was a bank [9:42] robber and I asked you to be a hostage [9:43] negotiator [9:46] and I said, "You can't. Here's what you [9:47] can't do. You can do you can talk about [9:49] anything you want. You can't give me [9:50] transportation. You can't give me [9:51] weapons. You can't give me drugs or [9:53] alcohol. You can't exchange hostages. I [9:55] looked at you and I said, "You're the [9:58] hostage negotiator. I'm a hostage [9:59] taker." [10:01] Yeah. Yeah. Don't look at him. [10:05] I need a car in 60 seconds or she dies. [10:10] What would you say? [10:16] Need to talk to my supervisor. [10:17] Yeah. [10:19] Can I phone a friend? Right. [10:21] And we do that exercise [10:24] and and and I interact with people and I [10:26] I I I show people how to turn the 60 [10:30] seconds into an etern all the time that [10:32] you need. [10:34] I ran a video a thousand times and there [10:36] were certain things that stuck out in [10:38] front of me that I before I ever really [10:40] saw it and it was a thing that sold my [10:42] book to the publisher [10:44] and and it had to do with the question [10:46] that my one of my the guy who wrote my [10:50] uh proposal stumped me on cuz not once [10:55] does the hostage negotiator try to get [10:57] the other person to say yes. Not once. [11:02] And the title of the chapter, it's a [11:04] slightly different title now, but when [11:06] it originally went into the publisher [11:08] was yes is the last thing you want to [11:09] hear. [11:13] And when we were talking about this [11:15] concept with with my coowwriter at the [11:17] time, the book ends up I the the guy who [11:20] wrote the book is a guy named Tal Roz T [11:22] A HL L R A Z. Write anything about [11:25] business. Read anything about business [11:27] he's written. He's the world champion [11:30] business book writer. He also is [11:32] co-writer of a book called Never Eat [11:34] Alone 2005. Keith Farazzi. There's [11:36] probably people in the room here that [11:37] know Keith because Keith lives here in [11:38] town. Greatest networking book ever [11:40] written. Paul was a co-writer of that [11:43] book. And I used to carry that book [11:45] around to people I was going to uh work [11:47] with and say, "Write it like this." [11:51] Finally, I got the guy that wrote it [11:52] like that. [11:55] But the guy before him that did the [11:56] proposal, he said, "When you were a [11:58] hostage negotiator, how'd you get people [11:59] to say yes?" That was the only question [12:01] he ever asked me that I was thoroughly [12:03] stumped [12:04] at because I said, "No, we don't. It's a [12:06] useless word. It does me no good." And [12:10] what I'm here to talk to you about today [12:12] is your addiction to yes. [12:16] I I'm a realer. [12:20] I haven't said yes in 28 days. You know, [12:23] we're not one of those kind of meetings, [12:24] right? [12:26] But you're addicted to yes. Sorry. And [12:28] that's the biggest thing that you're [12:29] going to have trouble getting out of. [12:33] And here's how this happens for a couple [12:34] of reasons. [12:37] There's this nonsense out there called [12:40] it one one of the phrases for getting [12:42] somebody to say yes a whole bunch of [12:44] times that I wrote to get to what you [12:45] want. There's an academic term for it's [12:47] called mere agreement. And there's a [12:49] study out there that says that mere [12:52] agreement works. So, anytime somebody [12:54] refers to an academic study, [12:57] don't just stop at saying there's an [12:59] academic study. Take a look at the [13:00] study. [13:02] And the study is if it says if you get [13:04] people to say yes to little yeses, it's [13:06] more likely they'll say yes to the big [13:08] yes. Now, I'm not here telling you that [13:11] you'll never make a deal doing that. I'm [13:12] just here telling you that's a horrible [13:14] batting average. [13:17] And the study is taking place among [13:19] students in an academic environment that [13:22] are in role-play situations and they're [13:24] trying to make deals and and I teach at [13:27] USC and I teach at Georgetown and I know [13:29] the shortcomings of those deals. So [13:31] that's why I make the my students do the [13:33] majority of their negotiations outside [13:35] in the real world. [13:37] I let them do some inside, but I say you [13:41] got to test drive this stuff in the real [13:42] world. So I know the shortcomings of [13:45] simulated negotiations and their their [13:47] shortcomings are huge [13:50] and that's one of the things that mere [13:52] agreement is based on. But you can you [13:54] can Google it and they call it momentum [13:56] selling. They call it yesable [13:58] propositions. [14:00] They call it the yes momentum. [14:03] And you can find no shortage of stuff [14:05] out there that'll tell you that it's [14:07] really it's good. Yeah. And they call [14:09] the yes's tie downs. [14:12] Now, seriously, [14:14] somebody's trying to tie you down [14:18] and you like that. [14:21] We didn't even bother with it as hostage [14:23] negotiators. [14:26] Example, [14:28] how do you feel when the phone rings and [14:30] you pick up the phone and they say, [14:31] "Have you got a few minutes to talk?" [14:35] You automatically go, "Yes, thank God [14:37] you called." [14:39] And then if they say, "Would you like to [14:41] make more money?" Oh my god, yes. Thank [14:44] God you called. [14:47] No. [14:49] Here's the problem with, "Have you got a [14:50] few minutes to talk?" First of all, [14:51] there's four questions. [14:53] Number one, if I have a few minutes, do [14:56] I want to talk to you? [15:01] If I have a few minutes, I want to talk [15:03] to you. Do I want to talk about what you [15:04] want to talk about? [15:07] You know, there ain't a man alive or [15:09] woman probably who hasn't got a call [15:11] from their significant other and a voice [15:13] on the phone, the most important person [15:14] on the entire planet. And a voice says, [15:16] "Can we talk?" [15:19] And a man says to himself, "Well, [15:23] I like talking to you, but somehow I [15:25] know I don't want to talk about what you [15:27] want to talk about." [15:34] Then after that is [15:37] how long is a few minutes? [15:41] My next younger sister, she calls me on [15:43] the phone. She says, "Have you got a few [15:44] minutes to talk?" She calls when she's [15:46] got an hour drive in front of her. [15:50] And it's going to be she talks and I [15:52] listen. Which is also code for have you [15:56] got a few minutes to talk? [15:59] Shut up while I speak. [16:02] And the last one is, [16:05] how do I get off the phone? [16:09] Now, we have been hammered with this yes [16:11] thing [16:13] so much that if it ever worked, [16:18] we're now like battered children. [16:21] Nobody tries to get you to say yes to [16:23] anything unless they're taking you [16:25] someplace. [16:27] We're in Los Angeles, right? [16:30] What if we are? [16:33] Nobody tries to get you. Even if you're [16:35] trying to confirm, there's three kinds [16:37] of yeses. Commitment, confirmation, and [16:38] counterfeit. [16:41] And so many people try to lead us into [16:43] the commitment. Yes. By the confirmation [16:45] yes that people get really good at the [16:46] counterfeit yes. [16:48] One of my students uh at USC is trying [16:53] to set up his honeymoon. He's going to a [16:54] luxury resort. He's going in the [16:55] offseason. [16:57] He knows it's the offseason. He knows [16:59] what they do at the luxury resort is [17:00] they offer discount on the regular rooms [17:02] but they don't offer discounts on the [17:03] bungalows and the bungalows are largely [17:05] empty now. He wants to negotiate a deal [17:08] with the manager of the resort. [17:11] He wants a deal on a bungalow which he [17:13] knows they're not offering and he also [17:15] knows that they're empty because it's [17:16] the off season. So all he wants to do is [17:19] confirm a innocent fact. It's the off [17:22] season, right? [17:25] That's like what month it is, what day [17:26] it is, what planet we're on. The manager [17:30] knows it's going someplace. [17:32] Nobody ever tries to get you to say yes [17:35] unless it's going someplace. Our guard [17:37] goes up instantly. [17:40] And we're so battered by this. We're all [17:42] so battered by this. Like I'm on a plane [17:44] a few months ago between LA and New [17:45] York. And I'm a very strategic flyer. [17:49] So, I have taken the time to make sure [17:52] that I have a middle seat in economy. [18:00] Takes some planning, right? It's a [18:03] 5-hour flight. So, I got to get up. [18:05] Finally, I use a restroom. Nice lady [18:06] sitting next to me. I'm sorry. Can I get [18:08] up? I get up and I go in the back. And [18:11] when I come out, I see she's still [18:13] standing in the aisle. And I'm like, [18:15] awesome. It's a 5h hour flight. She [18:17] doesn't want to sit down right away. you [18:19] know, you got to get up and move around, [18:20] but I don't want to be rude. I want to [18:22] make sure this is okay to her with her. [18:24] And so I walk up to her and I say, "I'm [18:25] guessing you don't want to sit down [18:26] right away." She looks at me and she she [18:28] looks down, she looks at me, she looks [18:30] down, she goes, "I want to read my [18:31] book." [18:33] And she's worried about what what's it [18:34] going to mean if she says yes? What does [18:36] she let herself in for? [18:38] There's a uh there used to be a parking [18:40] lot in Washington DC when I lived in DC. [18:42] It's the stupidest thing. was uh they [18:45] finally took it down because of uh [18:48] renovation of the waterfront. So, this [18:50] parking lot had a machine, $8 cash to [18:53] get in, didn't take credit cards, exact [18:54] change only, and no time limit. [18:58] What does that mean? I once parked my [19:00] motorcycle there for four months [19:03] for $8. [19:06] So the locals that lived around there [19:08] who worked in the area knew knew about [19:10] this and so that you know they always [19:12] always go and parking there because it [19:14] was $8 all day and inevitably there'd be [19:17] somebody that wasn't familiar with it [19:18] and there sign sign cash only $8 exact [19:21] change cash only and there'd be somebody [19:23] right up there trying to put a credit [19:25] card in a machine that's 60 years old [19:29] and I I jump out. I walk up. It's a nice [19:31] lady sitting in sitting in a car and I [19:33] want to help her out. And I look at her, [19:34] I saying, "Do you have $8 cash?" [19:38] And she goes, "What if I do?" [19:48] I mean, to convince yourself of this, [19:50] finally, last but not this weekend, [19:52] tomorrow, [19:54] go to your favorite mall, go to your [19:56] favorite store, probably Nordstrom's, [19:57] right? I don't know what it is, but [19:59] stand right outside and stop people just [20:02] as they go in and say, [20:04] You like shopping at Nordstrom's? [20:07] I bet they don't go in. [20:13] I bet if they go in, they look over [20:14] their shoulder so much that they leave [20:16] without buying anything. [20:18] I bet if you do that for a half an hour, [20:20] security comes out and asks you to [20:21] leave. [20:23] Like, you you'll you you'll be you'll be [20:26] stunned. I mean, just just look for it. [20:28] Look for it in in different little [20:30] places. It's such an addiction. And it [20:32] becomes an addiction because yes has [20:34] been designated as the most beautiful [20:35] word in the English language if not any [20:37] language. We love to hear it. Oh god [20:40] feels so good when we hear it. And [20:42] there's a interesting story that John [20:43] Lennon first began to fall in love with [20:45] Yokoono Ono because he went to an art [20:46] exhibit that she put together and she [20:48] climbed over and it was an like an [20:50] obstacle course and you crawled around [20:52] on this stuff and then finally you came [20:54] to this ladder and you crawled up this [20:56] ladder and you looked through a [20:57] telescope and on a far wall was in tiny [20:59] little letters was the word yes. [21:05] And we love to hear it so much. We [21:07] forget in an instant, in the very [21:10] instant when you're trying to get [21:11] somebody to say yes, if I try to get you [21:12] to say yes, you'll back up. [21:15] So we didn't even bother with this at it [21:17] was never even a topic of conversation [21:20] in hostage negotiation. Never. But [21:22] because yes, first one of my rules is [21:24] yes is nothing without how. [21:29] And we were in a trust business. [21:34] The first major siege that I ever got [21:36] involved in [21:38] negotiated bank robbery of hostages in [21:40] Brooklyn [21:42] 6,000 years ago. [21:46] And interestingly enough, even though [21:48] they happen in the movies all the time, [21:50] a bank robbery where they actually [21:52] negotiate hostages out happens in the [21:55] entire country about once every 20 [21:57] years. [21:59] They're rare events. [22:02] When we were when we did the one in New [22:04] York, the last one before that was 20 [22:07] years earlier and it was Dog Day [22:09] Afternoon. The movie with Alpuccino [22:13] and And that's New York. That's how [22:14] often they happen in New York. When's [22:16] the last time you've heard of a bank [22:18] robbery with hostages in Los Angeles? [22:21] They like robbing banks in this town. [22:23] So, it just doesn't happen. [22:26] I was a second negotiator on the phone. [22:30] I I I started in with hostage [22:32] negotiation techniques. [22:34] The first guy was a highly manipulative [22:36] type. I had learned how to deal with [22:38] highly manipulative types on on the [22:40] telephone on the hotline. [22:43] When I when I finally got trained as a [22:45] negotiator from my time at the hotline, [22:47] I said, "I've been doing this for a [22:48] year. I just didn't have a SWAT team [22:50] outside." [22:52] But he was actually the extremely [22:54] manipulative businessman [22:57] and it was it was a business [22:58] transaction. [23:00] He wasn't really sure how to deal with [23:02] me. So, he actually hands the phone off [23:04] to another guy. [23:06] A minute and a half in, [23:08] the other guy who doesn't realize I'm [23:10] not the first negotiator. First guy up [23:13] was a guy named Joe. They hand it off to [23:15] me with some specific instructions. I [23:17] got on the phone. I just start doing my [23:19] my suicide hotline thing, my late night [23:22] FM DJ voice. [23:27] And a minute and a half in, [23:30] before he knew my name, the guy [23:33] literally says to me on the phone, I [23:35] trust you, Joe. [23:39] Before he even knew my name, he trusted [23:42] me. Which is an interesting sequence. [23:45] There's some there's a whole another set [23:47] of psychological impact things around [23:50] names. I would tell you that it would [23:53] teach you to use names differently than [23:55] you're using them now. [24:00] talking to a realtor just a couple of [24:01] weeks ago one day training we had here [24:03] in town. He says, "We sit down, you [24:05] know, I'm having trouble getting these [24:06] phone calls returned. I'm having trouble [24:08] getting phone calls returned. We do all [24:10] the research. We get to know everything [24:11] we can about our potential clients. We [24:13] get to know everything we can about [24:14] these people. I'm having trouble getting [24:15] phone calls returned." And I and he I [24:18] said, "Say that again." [24:21] He said, "Having trouble getting phone [24:23] calls returned?" He looked at me like, [24:24] "What are you stupid? I was pretty much [24:26] straight English, right? I said, "No, [24:29] what what'd you say before that? How how [24:31] what are you doing?" He said, "Well, we [24:32] get to know everything we can about [24:34] him." He said, "That's your problem. [24:38] What do they know about you?" [24:43] You know, I said, "It's easy for them [24:45] not to return your calls. They got no [24:47] idea who you are. [24:49] You're just some schmuck [24:52] leaving messages on our voicemail. [24:56] your whole desire to get to know them. [25:00] You didn't do it in a way where it was a [25:02] two-way street and where them getting to [25:05] know you was even more important. [25:07] And there's there's a lot of little sign [25:10] subtle tiny ways that you do this stuff. [25:12] The way we construct what we say. I'll [25:15] give you two different stories and [25:16] they'll feel completely different. [25:19] When I when I became an FBI hostage [25:21] negotiator, I went through uh the [25:23] training at Quantico, which is a [25:25] mystical place. It really is. And I'm [25:29] going through the training. It was one [25:30] of the best training I ever went [25:31] through. And while I was there, I began [25:33] to hear about these guys that traveled [25:34] internationally working kidnappings and [25:37] they all over the world saving people's [25:39] lives. And I the more I heard about [25:41] these guys and we and I finally heard [25:43] that these guys were on the scent team, [25:45] the critical incident negotiation team. [25:47] By the end of the week, they gave a a [25:48] presentation. And when I came out of [25:50] there, I knew I wanted to be on the [25:51] scent team. [25:53] Now, let me tell you the story a [25:54] different way. [25:56] When you become an FBI hostage [25:57] negotiator, you go to the training [25:59] academy quantico, and you find yourself [26:00] at a mystical place, this mystical place [26:02] of quantico, where lives are [26:04] transformed, and you begin to find out [26:06] about these people that travel all over [26:08] the world saving people's lives on [26:10] international kidnappings. And you find [26:12] out that these guys are members of the [26:13] sin team. By the end of the training, [26:15] you know you want to be one of the [26:16] members of the scent team. [26:20] Second story felt more personal, didn't [26:22] it? I engaged you more [26:26] cuz I know that each word has a [26:27] different emotional impact. And it's not [26:30] that the word has a bad impact. It's the [26:32] context in I switch from I to you. [26:38] When we're teaching people to interact, [26:40] a lot of people have been taught [26:41] inappropriately, like when they're [26:42] trying to confirm [26:45] something they've heard from the other [26:46] side. They say, "What I'm hearing is," [26:49] well, that's a misuse of the word I. [26:53] Instead, if I say, [26:56] "You sound like [26:58] I've immediately plugged the word you in [27:00] instead of I," and I began to engage him [27:02] in a very different way. [27:05] There's a lot of little things that I [27:07] was taught how to do that as a hostage [27:09] negotiator. Then when I started to teach [27:11] it and begin to see it in other ways and [27:13] and learn things in other areas, I began [27:15] to understand the difference of the [27:17] impact of those words. Every question [27:19] has an impact. Every time you try to get [27:22] somebody to say yes, you create anxiety [27:24] in that person. [27:28] Every time. [27:33] So, you got to get out of that. I'll [27:36] give you one of the ways. This is going [27:38] to sound stupid and we haven't quite got [27:41] the brain science that backs it up all [27:43] now, but the dumbest thing, the simplest [27:45] thing, you can get exactly what you want [27:47] by getting somebody to say no. [27:51] When you when you guys get home, when [27:53] you get back to your office, when you [27:55] get out of here, write down the [27:57] questions that you normally like to ask [27:58] people. The majority of them will be yes [28:00] questions. [28:02] Your first step in breaking your [28:03] addiction be simply to switch it to the [28:05] other side. Give you an example. About [28:08] two years ago, Jack Welch coming through [28:10] Los Angeles. He and he and his wife [28:12] Susie their recent book, The Real Life [28:13] NBA. They're doing a book signing. I'm [28:15] going to go to the book signing. I want [28:17] to ask Jack Welch to come and speak in [28:18] my class at USC. I I've had some really [28:21] interesting people come in and speak. [28:24] So, how many people try to get Jack [28:27] Welch to say something, say yes to [28:29] something in that book signing? How many [28:31] people there? 250, 300 people. Hey Jack, [28:34] come to my kids' birthday party. Hey [28:36] Jack, you want to come over the house [28:37] for dinner? [28:39] Everybody that speaks to him. So there [28:41] two problems here. Book signing, bunch [28:45] of people for an author as popular as [28:47] Jack Welch. Long line. They're running [28:49] you through like an assembly line, right [28:51] before you get there, they give you a [28:53] little coupon, write your name on it. [28:55] That way Jack says, "Hey, nice to see [28:56] you, Chris. Good luck. Next." [29:00] They got a logistical problem. [29:03] Problem one, what's problem two? [29:08] Jack Welsh, a legitimate celebrity. They [29:11] don't know who I am. There's no [29:12] background investigation. There's no [29:14] metal detector. They don't know I'm not [29:16] a disgruntled former shareholder of GE [29:18] that lost my life savings when I shorted [29:20] GE stock and Jack Welch took it up. [29:24] Right. Jane Fonda a few years ago she's [29:27] at a book signing former Vietnam vet [29:29] comes up to her and spits right in her [29:31] face. [29:33] A legitimate rockstar celebrity. I'm [29:35] going to be within arms length of this [29:36] person. [29:38] He has security. [29:41] Action is always quicker than reaction. [29:43] I'm going to get close enough to him. I [29:45] could do anything I want. They can't [29:46] stop me. I could come up. I could kiss [29:48] him on the lips. They don't know what [29:50] I'm going to do, right? Not that I would [29:52] kiss Jack Wilsh on the lips. [29:55] So, how much time do I got with Jack [29:56] Welch? [30:01] Probably five. [30:04] I walk up to Jack Welch and I say, "Is [30:06] it a ridiculous idea [30:09] for you to come and speak to the class I [30:12] teach at USC in the Marshall School of [30:14] Business?" [30:16] And he looks up and to the left, [30:19] he gets this really intense look on his [30:21] face. [30:23] And I think to myself, [30:26] just killed Jack Welch. [30:31] He's so angry at his stroke. He's going [30:34] to fall right over. [30:37] Security's going to tackle me. They're [30:39] going to drag me out in the handcuffs. [30:43] And and then when he doesn't unfreeze [30:44] and I see I'm relieved that he hasn't [30:46] died, but I then I'm thinking in my head [30:49] he's going to go scy. [30:53] Instead he looks at me and he says [30:57] my personal assistant's name. This is [30:59] special Twitter account we have set up [31:01] to communicate with her. I will call her [31:03] and let her know that you're going to be [31:05] reaching out for her. I think we're [31:07] going to be in Los Angeles in the fall. [31:09] If we are, we'll come in and we'll speak [31:11] at your class. [31:16] How does that happen? [31:20] Because I two things I did something [31:22] nobody else is doing. [31:27] Number one. [31:29] Number two, I know the psychology. [31:32] Psychological I don't know the [31:33] psychology. I know the psychological [31:35] reactions. Two different things. [31:37] I know the way the brain functions. I [31:39] know the different portions of the [31:41] brain. I know that we're three times as [31:43] more like we're six times more likely to [31:45] make a deal with somebody we like. I [31:46] know how to be likable without being [31:48] vulnerable to needing to be liked. I [31:50] know how the brain works in negative and [31:52] positive emotions. I know how those [31:53] influence your thought patterns. I know [31:55] how to turn negatives down. I know how [31:57] to turn positives up. As a hostage [32:00] negotiator, I learned to listen for the [32:02] different components and everything [32:04] everybody says. And there only about [32:06] five. There's not that many. And I know [32:09] how I can turn each one up and down at [32:11] will. [32:13] And I know the rules in the way the in [32:15] the universe of the brain. I know the [32:17] emotional rules. And there's some always [32:18] rules. [32:21] And I know certain things that I can say [32:23] will always have the same impact. [32:27] And how much of an impact will that be? [32:29] Give you just an example on switching [32:31] from yes to no. One of my students at [32:34] Georgetown [32:36] does an experiment because he is on a [32:38] Republican fundraising committee a [32:40] couple elections back, not the most [32:42] recent one. [32:44] And they're dialing for dollars at [32:46] night. [32:47] What are they doing? It's cold calling. [32:52] And what's the cold calling [32:54] system? Call them on the phone and get [32:57] three yeses in a row. Get your three [33:00] yeses in a row. You've built the yes [33:02] momentum. You buil built mirror [33:04] agreement. You tied them down. Then you [33:06] ask them the killer question, which is a [33:08] trap, which they know is coming [33:13] and ask for money. That's every cold [33:15] calling script on the planet is designed [33:18] to do that. Yes. Yes. Yes. Boom. [33:24] They take their three yes questions and [33:26] he makes them three no questions. [33:29] Takes the first question instead of [33:31] would you like to see the Republicans [33:33] back in the White House in November [33:36] and changes, have you given up on seeing [33:39] the Republicans take the White House in [33:41] November. [33:44] Changes the three yes questions to no [33:46] questions. They run the two scripts side [33:48] by side. The no script gets a 23% higher [33:51] rate of return. [33:55] Only that change change nothing else. [34:01] You're going to get at least 23% more [34:03] effective effectiveness. What would that [34:06] do over the coming year [34:08] if your batting average raised by 23%. [34:13] And how much do you got to raise your [34:15] batting average? I don't know how many [34:17] baseball fans there are in the room now. [34:19] Any baseball fans? [34:21] What's the Mendoza line? [34:25] 200. [34:27] So, for those of you that are not [34:28] baseball fans, the Mendoza, and I feel [34:30] bad for this guy. [34:33] I'm not sure what his first name. I [34:35] should know his first name. He was a he [34:36] was a guy that was in and out of the [34:37] majors, was a phenomenal fielder, but [34:39] wasn't a great hitter and always hit [34:41] around 200 215. and he kept washing out [34:44] of the majors and he couldn't stay in [34:46] and actually uh my understanding George [34:48] Brett a guy from the Kansas City Royals [34:50] joking about him one day said the you [34:53] know I'm trying to stay above the [34:54] Mendoza line in an interview and it just [34:56] caught so 200 the batting average for [34:59] Major League Baseball two about 200 215 [35:02] or you wash out of the league [35:07] what's your batting average got to be to [35:08] be uh in the all-star game [35:11] about 300 right you hit 300, how much [35:15] money you making [35:18] a day, right? These are the guys that [35:21] are signing $150 million contracts. [35:25] Batten 300 and above. [35:28] How many hits a month do you have to go [35:30] to get to go from the Mendoza line to [35:32] $100 million contract? [35:37] About nine. Nine or 10. Exactly. Right. [35:40] A month. [35:43] day after day after day, getting up and [35:47] going to bat day after day after day. An [35:51] incremental change takes people from [35:53] washing out of the league [35:56] to signing hundred million dollar [35:57] contracts. [36:00] changing from yes to no and getting re [36:05] doing your wiring, [36:07] getting a gut instinct on that one [36:08] alone, [36:11] probably raise your batting average 23%. [36:15] There's a bunch of other stuff that I [36:17] learned from hostage negotiation that's [36:19] in the book, [36:22] share with you in as many ways as we [36:24] can. Steve's going to talk about how [36:25] we're going to do that, but that's just [36:27] one. and and and back to it. In in case [36:30] you're wondering, none of it's [36:33] complicated. [36:36] Just takes some rewiring and some [36:38] practice. [36:40] If nothing else, if you haven't got the [36:42] book, [36:43] just read the reviews on Amazon. what [36:45] they say. The thing that I loved about [36:47] it more than anything else is like, wow, [36:51] just really counterintuitive stuff that [36:53] was really easy to do [36:56] and no shortage of people who were [36:59] making differences in their negotiations [37:02] before they finished the first chapter. [37:06] I wanted it to be usable. That's why I [37:08] brought Tall in because he could write a [37:12] digestible, understandable book. He [37:15] would put structure to it so that [37:17] because I, you know, I got I'm I'm the [37:19] original short attention span theater [37:21] guy. [37:23] So, I'll get about halfway through a [37:25] chapter and I'll have to stop because my [37:27] lips are tired. [37:29] Boom. Boom. [37:33] But sometime, especially when you're [37:34] reading to learn, your brain only has so [37:36] much capacity in a given day. And if you [37:38] have a chapter that's 50 50 pages long [37:40] and you can't stop 10 pages in, you [37:42] might not even pick the book up, you can [37:44] you can pull this stuff in in small [37:46] doses. [37:50] When we finished the bank robbery in [37:51] Brooklyn, [37:54] um we didn't do face-to-face surreners. [37:57] So Bobby, the first hostage taker to [38:00] come out, thought he was surrendering to [38:03] me personally. [38:05] I finally got the last bit to get him to [38:08] come out when I said, "I'll meet you [38:10] outside." And he said, "Yeah, I want to [38:12] end this." [38:13] We had to have him walk into the arms of [38:15] the SWAT guys because the SWAT guys had [38:17] the perimeter and they have security [38:20] control. And as soon as the SWAT guys [38:22] got their hands on him, he looked up and [38:23] he said, "Where's Chris?" [38:27] after he'd surrendered. [38:31] kidnapping that I talk about in the [38:33] Philippines [38:36] where we got a a hostage, walked away, [38:41] and we we thoroughly in the negotiation [38:44] defeated the other side and they became [38:46] disheartened. There was originally a $10 [38:48] million ransom demand. We had one [38:50] conversation in the in the middle of [38:52] that negotiation, which my director of [38:54] operations is also my son refers to as [38:56] the birth of the That's right moment. [39:02] And we went from $10 million to zero in [39:04] one conversation. [39:07] And we got a that's right. Not a you're [39:09] right, a that's right. When that was all [39:12] over and since our hostages walked away, [39:14] the terrorists and they were bad to the [39:17] bone. [39:18] Head shopping straight out of the movies [39:20] bad guys. [39:23] They got nothing. [39:25] I'm back in the Philippines about three [39:27] weeks later and I'm back with the [39:28] negotiator that I was coaching and he [39:31] said, "You're not going to believe who [39:32] called me on the phone." I'm like, "All [39:34] right, who?" And our bad guy's name was [39:37] Sabaya. He said, "Sabaya called me." [39:41] Really? Sabaya still had my guy's phone [39:45] number, his undercover phone number, his [39:46] undercover name. Didn't know who he was. [39:49] Knew he had to be with police of the [39:50] military. Didn't know his real name. [39:54] Sabaya calls my guy on the phone three [39:56] weeks after he'd been completely [39:58] defeated and got nothing and said, [40:03] "You've been promoted yet? [40:07] [Music] [40:09] I don't know what you said to me on the [40:11] phone, [40:14] but whatever it was, it worked. [40:17] They should promote you." He hangs up. [40:22] Remember the Robert Dairo Billy Crystal [40:25] movie? Analyze this. Diro says you [40:30] you got a gift. You you're good. [40:35] But that's the way to leave people in [40:36] your interactions. Hostage negotiators. [40:40] That's that was our currency. [40:42] We never knew when we were going to have [40:44] to face somebody again. And if they [40:46] lived, that meant either my I or one of [40:48] my colleagues would see them again. [40:53] So, we believed in long-term [40:55] relationships and reputation and getting [40:58] everything you want in a negotiation [41:01] and have and if the other guy got [41:04] nothing, [41:06] but if he didn't get what he was really [41:07] after, [41:09] our our conceit [41:12] was we still wanted to have a great [41:14] relationship with him no matter what so [41:17] that we could cross paths with them [41:19] under any circumstances. whether it [41:21] would be the next day or in 10 years [41:25] and they would remember us and be happy [41:28] to talk to us again. [41:31] And that's the way we raise the level of [41:34] our game and that's how we continue to [41:36] save people's lives [41:38] because hostage negotiators then have a [41:41] reputation of being people you can put [41:44] your your life in their hands [41:47] and you can trust them if they're if [41:49] you're in a trust game. If you're in a [41:50] trust business, you can trust a hostage [41:53] negotiator. [41:56] So [41:58] that's the stuff that I teach. [42:02] And it's kind of cool, [42:05] you know, it's kind of cool. You you [42:08] accumulation of relationships and people [42:10] who want to continue to do business with [42:11] you and feel connected with you separate [42:14] from how the transaction came out. [42:18] I dig it. I I I hope we get a chance to [42:22] work with you and help you do more [42:23] stuff. [42:23] So, let me ask you a question. The book [42:27] is called Never Split the Difference, [42:29] right? [42:30] This audience right here, raise your [42:32] hands, everybody. [42:34] Almost every negotiation they're in ends [42:38] with [42:38] splitting the difference. [42:39] Splitting the difference. [42:41] Can you talk about that's you know the [42:44] why do people do that? [42:45] So, all right. So when you split the [42:46] difference, every time you did that, [42:48] things were beautiful after that, right? [42:52] No. So splitting the difference never [42:55] solves any of the problems you're faced [42:56] with anyway. We think they will. We [42:58] think we think it's a hack to move [43:00] forward. We think it's a quick short [43:02] hack, but the vast majority of the time [43:04] splitting the difference doesn't address [43:06] any of the actual problems in the [43:09] transaction in either the implementation [43:11] or coming to an agreement or the [43:12] follow-on problems. and we think we have [43:15] an agreement when we split the [43:17] difference and agreed and now instead of [43:18] the problems being over the problems [43:20] have just begun and then you capitulated [43:22] on something that had nothing to do with [43:24] solving any of your problems. [43:26] So if you could solve those problems [43:29] with a delay that saves time [43:33] go a little slower you go much faster in [43:34] your transactions [43:36] and then you never had to split the [43:38] difference because it didn't solve your [43:39] problems anyway. [43:41] So if it's not going to solve your [43:42] problems, why do it? Solve the problem [43:45] separately. And other [43:47] Why do you think they do that? [43:49] Because you think it's going to work? [43:51] The the other issue too is there's a [43:53] fundamental feeling of fairness. [43:57] You're trying to be fair. [44:00] You're try you're and sometimes and [44:02] another aspect of it might be you might [44:04] not think you're entitled. [44:08] I you know some some of us sell [44:10] ourselves short. We're worried we're [44:13] worried that maybe we're not entitled to [44:15] the full amount. We're worried that [44:16] maybe we don't deserve the full amount. [44:19] Maybe we're being greedy. We're thinking [44:20] ah you know they're trying to make a [44:22] living too. [44:24] You know there's there's probably three [44:26] reasons why we split the difference on a [44:28] regular basis and it just doesn't work. [44:30] We're looking for a hack didn't solve [44:31] our problems. We don't think we're worth [44:34] it [44:36] but it doesn't help. It doesn't fix [44:38] things. If it did, you guys would be [44:40] holding the seminar and we'd be watching [44:43] you. It just And you know, my my great [44:46] example of splitting the difference is [44:48] like, you know, what should I wear with [44:50] this suit today? Should I wear black [44:52] shoes or should I wear brown shoes? So, [44:54] I'll wear one black and one brown. [45:00] In the book, a big part of the book is [45:04] um empathetic u tactical empathy. [45:08] Correct. [45:08] Right. [45:09] What is tactical empathy? [45:12] All right. First of all, it's not [45:13] sympathy. [45:16] Empathy is not sympathy. Empathy is not, [45:19] oh, I feel bad for you. I know how you [45:22] feel. [45:23] Like, stop saying that, please. [45:27] Empathy is understanding the other side. [45:30] And if you truly understand empathy, you [45:32] interestingly enough, you'll look out [45:34] and see how powerful it is. There's some [45:35] articles out there now called the dark [45:37] side of emotional intelligence. It's [45:39] ridiculously insanely powerful. True [45:42] empathy is you know who's best at [45:45] empathy? Sociopaths [45:52] because empathy is understanding where [45:53] the other side is coming from only. So [45:57] what do we take from that and why why we [45:59] coined the term tactical empathy? We [46:01] know so much more about it. I know how [46:02] the brain functions. I know I know I [46:05] know you have three negative thinking [46:07] buttons in your brain and you have one [46:10] positive thinking button in your brain. [46:12] The negative thinking button in your [46:13] brain is no less than three times the [46:15] size of the positive thinking. So I know [46:18] tactically how to address that and I [46:21] know that the reasons you won't make a [46:23] deal are three times more important than [46:24] the reasons why you will. So since I'm [46:27] lazy, I'm going to get rid of the [46:29] reasons you won't make a deal first. I [46:32] will make tactical choices knowing how [46:34] the emotions run through the brain. And [46:37] so we take empathy, which is just a [46:39] recognition of what emotions are going [46:41] on. In the last 40 years, we've learned [46:45] how to dial different things down and [46:48] up. Is it is it manipulative? [46:53] Is respect manipulative? [46:56] Is rep is appreciation manipulative? [47:01] Are are manners manipulative? [47:05] Not the issue of whether or not it's [47:06] manipulative. How many of you got one of [47:08] these? [47:11] But wait a minute. They're really bad [47:12] people that use these. [47:16] Don't Don't you feel it's morally wrong [47:19] to use a phone because bad people use a [47:21] phone? [47:23] Well, it's the same thing with the [47:25] negotiation tools. It's not that the [47:27] tools not the manipulation is bad. It's [47:29] why you're trying to manipulate [47:30] somebody. Trying to manipulate somebody [47:32] into a bad deal, [47:34] then that's that's immoral. [47:38] Trying to keep somebody on track while [47:41] you're moving them to the home of their [47:44] dreams is a completely separate issue. [47:49] Fair enough. So [47:52] often times they're in a situation where [47:55] they're representing a buyer who wants [47:57] to buy a property, right? [48:00] And there's a listing agent on the other [48:02] side. [48:04] From your perspective, how are you going [48:07] to approach that negotiation? How are [48:11] you going to prepare yourself? What are [48:13] you going to be thinking about as you [48:15] enter into that negotiation? [48:18] Um, [48:20] I want the listing agent to see me as a [48:22] straight shooter. [48:25] Uh, which means I want them to feel like [48:28] we've got a good working relationship, [48:31] but that I'm not necessarily going to [48:33] get pushed around. [48:35] I'm going to be I'm we're going to be [48:36] very collaborative. As long as we're [48:38] collaborative, things are going to go [48:39] wonderful. But at I know at certain [48:41] points in times, I'm going to have to [48:42] draw boundaries. I'm going to have to [48:43] say no. I'm going to say no. If I have [48:45] to say no, I'll let it out a little at a [48:47] time. I will say it very gently. I want [48:49] I want I want to be able to for people [48:51] to feel respected and appreciated and [48:53] also that I've said I've said no to him [48:55] in certain ways. I want empathy [48:58] established as a two-way street. I'm [49:00] going to exercise empathy because I want [49:01] to back from them. I want to get us to [49:04] the point where we've got a working [49:05] relationship where we can solve the the [49:06] actual problems and nobody's afraid of [49:10] cooperating. [49:12] And so then because I'm going to want to [49:13] communicate through the agent to the [49:15] other side and I'm going to do that in a [49:17] variety of ways. Some of which is I'm [49:19] going to say things to the agent that I [49:22] will want them to say word for word for [49:24] the other side. But I don't want them to [49:27] know that I did that to them. [49:30] And those and I will use something we [49:32] call the secret to getting the upper [49:33] hand in a negotiation is giving the [49:35] other side the illusion of control. [49:37] Like if I see something that's going to [49:39] be your problem, I'm going to say, [49:41] "How's that going to work?" [49:44] enough enough times till the agent says [49:46] it to themselves and the agent finally [49:48] says it sends it to the seller. [49:53] And so it's a constant communication [49:56] flow. I'm going to try to get going [49:57] between everybody. [49:58] And and how would you communicate to [50:00] someone that you are a straight shooter [50:03] and you're not going to be pushed [50:04] around? How how would you do that [50:06] specifically? [50:08] I'm not going to be afraid to say [50:09] negative things to them. Uh but I'm I'm [50:11] never going to say anything negative [50:12] that I haven't given them a little bit [50:13] of warning on like, you know, a real [50:16] counterintuitive. If I if I have [50:18] something to say to you that I know that [50:20] you're not going to like, I'm going to [50:21] say you're not going to like this. [50:25] Then I'll say it. [50:29] Um I and and I'm going to use a apology [50:33] strategically. I never apologize at the [50:35] end before after I've said something [50:37] they don't like. I'll sorry you're not [50:39] gonna like this [50:41] and then I will finish. We got something [50:44] we like to call the Oprah rule. [50:47] When's the last time you heard about [50:49] Oprah having a very public fight with [50:50] anybody? [50:53] What [50:56] a friend her 17-year-old Booker friend [50:59] of mine here in town. Same thing we did [51:01] in hostage negotiation. We control the [51:03] end of every conversation. [51:06] Controlled the end of the conversation, [51:08] not the beginning. Oprah's rule and her [51:11] booker's rule was they always let made [51:13] sure when people left, they were happy [51:14] when they left. [51:17] So if I have to confront you in our [51:19] negotiation, I'm going to say, "I'm [51:20] sorry, this is going to sound harsh. I'm [51:22] going to tell you what it is." And the [51:23] last thing I'm going to say is, you [51:25] know, I want us to be successful [51:26] together. [51:29] And it's a specific sequencing of [51:31] psychological impacts that I've had on [51:33] you. Finishing [51:36] with a statement that, for lack of a [51:37] better term, is nurturing, not [51:39] apologetic, [51:41] not um um disingenuous in any way. I [51:46] want us to be successful. I want us to [51:48] make this deal. And then when and the [51:50] Oprah ruled because the last impression [51:52] is a lasting impression. The last [51:54] impression is the lasting impression. [51:58] My mother always taught me, if you don't [52:00] make a good first impression, you might [52:01] not get a chance to make a second one. [52:03] And I never paid attention to the last [52:04] impression. [52:06] The last impression is the lasting [52:08] impression because I'm going to need to [52:09] talk to you on the phone again. And the [52:11] last thing that I say will ring in your [52:13] ears and the last thing I said was, you [52:16] know, I want us to be successful [52:17] together. That means he'll pick up the [52:19] phone and he'll listen to me next time I [52:21] have to talk. And he'll think of me [52:22] like, you know, he didn't let me get hit [52:24] with any surprises. He saw there was a [52:26] problem coming. He let me know what the [52:27] problem was and I feel like working with [52:30] him again. That's how you and he he'll [52:33] never know that because it was because [52:35] the last thing I said to him is, you [52:36] know, I want us to be successful [52:37] together. [52:38] So, let me add a few more variables in [52:41] the mix. I'm representing a buyer. [52:44] You have the listing agent. You have [52:46] other buyers that are going to be [52:48] bidding on the property also. So, [52:50] there's other agents trying to get the [52:53] attention of the listing agent. [52:56] and the listing agent isn't isn't [52:59] communicating. They're they're saying as [53:01] little as possible. [53:04] So, you're representing a buyer, there [53:06] are other buyers bidding on the [53:08] property, and the listing agent is being [53:10] non-communicative. [53:12] What would you how would you navigate [53:15] in that situation? [53:17] Probably the first thing I'd try is if [53:19] you're being non-communicative, then it [53:20] means um I'd probably send you an email [53:22] that says, "Have you given up on doing [53:24] business with me?" [53:25] Okay. [53:27] Remember, have you given up on seeing [53:28] the Republicans back in the White House [53:29] in November? [53:31] Have you given up on oneeline email? [53:34] Nothing more. You'd be stunned at how [53:36] quickly you get responses from that. I [53:39] mean, be ready to get a response as soon [53:42] as 3 minutes, [53:44] probably no more than an hour, usually [53:47] instantaneously when people see that [53:49] because you'd be stunned at what people [53:50] will say no to. Stunned. Secondly, if if [53:54] you're being non-communicative with me, [53:57] then you probably don't feel heard. [54:01] You pro in our interaction, whatever [54:03] time we were together, I was probably [54:05] trying to get you to say yes the whole [54:06] time, which means I just put myself in a [54:09] category of everybody else. [54:11] There's a pretty good chance you don't [54:13] remember me. I worked really hard to [54:15] remember your Steve. How you doing, [54:16] Steve? What's going on today? Steve, you [54:18] know, how the kids Steve, how's the [54:19] wife, Steve? Steve. Steve. Steve. Steve. [54:21] Steve. [54:23] But the reverse is I'm Chris. [54:26] I'm Chris [54:28] and I'm I'm working on behalf of a [54:30] couple of people uh you know Bill and [54:34] Kathy from Iowa. [54:36] Bill and Kathy been trying to come to LA [54:38] their entire life. They heard this is a [54:40] place to be. What I'm doing now is I'm [54:42] personalizing and becoming memorable. [54:45] Instead of me getting to know you, [54:47] you're getting to know us. little [54:50] increments here and there. Every every [54:51] every step of the way, you're getting to [54:54] know us as opposed to me trying to get [54:56] to know you or me hammering you with [54:58] yes. You want to make a deal, don't you? [55:00] You want to make a lot of money, don't [55:01] you? [55:03] And then also, whatever comes out of [55:04] your mouth, I'm making sure that you [55:08] know that I heard you [55:12] because [55:14] if you talk and I don't listen, then I [55:16] just wasted your time. [55:19] So why should you talk to me? [55:24] I notice that you are very calm. [55:29] Is that natural? Is that what you've [55:32] learned to be? You're very patient. [55:34] You're not trying to rush any anything. [55:38] Whereas most sales people are trying to [55:42] get it done now, get it done now, get it [55:43] done now. Any thoughts around that? [55:46] No, I've learned it. it, you know, it [55:48] it's not my natural demeanor. I'm I'm na [55:50] I'm You're one of three types. Every one [55:54] of you, you're one of three types. It's [55:55] arcade man wiring. You're fight, flight, [55:57] make friends, assertive, friend [56:00] oriented, analytical. The flight guy is [56:02] a very analytical guy. My naturalb born [56:05] type is the fight assertive negotiator. [56:08] Donald Trump and I are the same type. [56:11] Assertive. You know, everybody's one of [56:13] those to begin with. The rest of it is [56:14] learned. You become the best negotiator [56:16] you could possibly be when you [56:18] understand which each attri attributes [56:20] to the other types [56:23] make you better. There's no one best [56:25] type. You begin to learn the the the the [56:28] the friend oriented people. You're six [56:30] times more likely to make a deal with [56:32] somebody you like. Us assertives go [56:34] like, "Wow, the guy smiles all the time [56:36] makes more deals than I do. Everybody [56:38] else smiles." [56:40] So it's learned [56:43] and talk about what's the role of [56:46] patience in a negotiation. [56:48] Patience is a weapon [56:52] and just like silence. You know there's [56:55] there we call them effective pauses just [56:58] slightly being patient. First of all [57:00] patience is an advantage because it [57:02] makes the other side feel less pushed. [57:05] There's a core need for autonomy. [57:09] It's one of the fundamental core needs. [57:11] It's why this country is here because of [57:13] our need for autonomy. [57:16] So the more patient you are, the more [57:17] the other person feels their autonomy is [57:19] being respected, the easier it is for [57:21] them to respond to you. And then also I [57:23] had a judge in a trial in New York. He [57:25] had he had a great phrase. He used to [57:27] like to say, "We're going to delay [57:28] things in order to save time." [57:33] Now, the position I was in with the FBI [57:36] overseeing hostage negotiation teams [57:38] across the United States, [57:41] I would see a siege in Atlanta and a [57:43] siege in Portland. And I would see the [57:46] guys in Atlanta work that siege and be [57:49] done in three hours. And the guys in [57:51] Portland work it and it would take them [57:53] eight. [57:55] The guys in Atlanta were real deliberate [57:59] and they didn't rush into anything and [58:02] they took their time [58:05] and [58:07] talked things out and heard people out. [58:10] The guys in Portland was commander wants [58:12] to know when we're going to get this [58:13] done. We got to get this guy out. And [58:15] they were very direct. They were very [58:17] actionoriented and you know let's get [58:19] the process engaged. Let's get this [58:20] start. Let's start talking. And I could [58:22] see the people that were the most direct [58:24] and the most engaged take twice as long [58:27] as the people that were the most [58:28] relaxed. [58:32] You seem to say in the book that [58:35] negotiations are more about emotion than [58:40] logic and reason, [58:42] right? [58:43] How do how do you see that applying in a [58:46] real estate negotiation? [58:47] All right. So we make decisions based on [58:49] what we care about which makes decision [58:51] making by definition an emotional [58:53] process. Reason is what we think up [58:56] after we our gut has told us what we [58:58] want to do. So if you're willing to [59:00] accept that then you begin to understand [59:03] what are some of one of the principal [59:04] components of what makes up emotional [59:06] decision-m that the negatives are three [59:08] times as powerful as the positives. [59:11] And then the the last thing we add in is [59:15] a hostage negotiator. We always look for [59:16] what the recent loss was. [59:19] And as it turns out, the dominating [59:22] theory of how the the biggest, not the [59:25] only factor, but the biggest factor is [59:29] people's fear of loss. [59:31] And they want Danny Conorman who wrote [59:33] the book thinking fast and slow won a [59:36] Nobel Prize for that. [59:38] So if I understand loss is an issue and [59:41] I understand with these tools how to [59:42] navigate them and then I when I hear [59:46] people saying something that is [59:49] contradictory to what they really want [59:51] which happens all the time [59:53] then I'll say something like well you [59:55] know somebody says well I can't give you [59:56] the listing because my my brother-in-law [59:57] is a real a real estate agent. So it [60:00] sounds to me like your relationship with [60:02] your brother-in-law is more important to [60:03] you than selling the house. [60:10] That's a hostage negotiation. [60:15] But that that was a label. That was a [60:17] hostage negotiation skill. [60:18] So tell me if there's a difference here [60:20] in that situation, a script in real [60:22] estate. So a realtor would say in that, [60:26] so what's more important to you? your [60:28] relationship with your [60:31] u brother-in-law or getting your home [60:34] sold for the highest price. Is that [60:37] different than what you just said in any [60:39] way? [60:40] The differences are and they're they're [60:42] two dependent upon person's brain. I [60:45] either get through quicker with a [60:46] question or I get through quicker with [60:48] the tool that I just used which was a [60:50] label. [60:52] And so there are some people that when [60:54] asked questions because we're hostage [60:57] negotiators gather information, but I [60:59] don't always gather information by [61:00] asking questions. I want you to give me [61:02] an unguarded and honest response. You're [61:05] less likely to give me an unguarded and [61:08] honest response as a result of a [61:10] question, even a what question, which is [61:11] a very good question. [61:14] The bread and butter of your question [61:15] should be what and how. [61:18] But some people immediately [61:20] get their backup and they become guarded [61:22] with questions. So instead of saying, [61:24] you know, what's more important, you [61:25] selling a house or your relationship [61:26] with your brother-in-law? I've just [61:29] observed the dynamic that's taking [61:30] place. [61:30] So what you're telling me is [61:32] Well, I would say no. You said [61:35] sounds like [61:36] Yeah. [61:37] It sounds like your relationship with [61:40] your brother-in-law is more important [61:41] than selling a house or it sounds like [61:43] you're willing to leave money on the [61:45] table in order to preserve your [61:46] relationship. And so now we're getting [61:47] to know that's another way to get to to [61:50] know. Correct. [61:52] Right. Yeah. [61:52] Because then natural responsibility. No, [61:54] that's not [61:55] I'm not doing that. Yeah. Exactly. And [61:56] then they feel in control [61:58] and they feel protected and they don't [62:00] understand where the feeling of control [62:03] came from and the feeling of protection [62:04] came from, but subconsciously they know [62:07] it came from you. So now when you're in [62:09] the trust business, [62:12] they connect feelings of being protected [62:15] with the sound of your voice, [62:18] reading your name, and seeing your face. [62:22] You said each word has a different [62:26] emotional impact, [62:27] right? [62:28] Can you say more about that? [62:30] Um, well, I and you I is self-centered. [62:34] You is is a provocation. [62:39] good or bad depending upon the context. [62:42] I I I like the word I a lot when I'm [62:46] getting ready to be assertive and I'll [62:48] say I'm sorry [62:51] and then I'll be assertive. [62:53] We use empathy so we can be assertive [62:57] and it's it's an empathic way. I won't [62:59] be assertive and then apologize. That [63:01] was that's bad timing. I won't say we [63:03] can't do this. I'm sorry. I'll say I'm [63:05] sorry we can't do this. [63:08] I know the sequencing of the emotional [63:10] impacts. So I use I when I need to be I [63:13] is usually used best when you're saying [63:15] no or setting a boundary. [63:18] So all right this is important. [63:23] We can't do this. I'm sorry versus I'm [63:27] sorry we can't do this. [63:29] Right. Apologize first. And that can [63:31] change the whole what you're saying is [63:33] that can change the whole dynamic right [63:36] of of a negotiation just that right [63:39] switching of words. [63:40] Yeah. Absolutely. Two reasons. First of [63:42] all, if you apologize before they know [63:44] what you're apologizing for, they go [63:46] like [63:47] you're sorry. Which means boom, you got [63:50] instant attention. Anytime that you [63:52] provoke someone into attention, your [63:55] words automatically have more weight. [63:58] Also, when you say I'm sorry first, as [64:01] fast as the mind works, they run through [64:03] the entire gamut. They don't know what [64:04] it's going to be. You know, I'm sorry. [64:07] They think you're going to say your [64:08] home's being foreclosed on, the FBI has [64:09] a warrant for your arrest, [64:12] and your children are in jail. [64:15] So, in that moment also knowing how the [64:18] brain works negatively, [64:20] then whatever I say after that, it's [64:22] probably going to be relief. [64:25] I you know I different different uh [64:28] context but same analogy. I got a woman [64:31] who's working in a business [64:33] uh where she wants some time off and [64:35] they're short-handed and they've had [64:37] people quit. She goes into the boss and [64:38] she says, "I'm sorry. I got some really [64:40] bad news for you." He goes, "You're [64:42] going to quit?" She said, "No, I just [64:45] need some extra time off." She said, [64:46] "Oh, thank God. Yeah, you got it." [64:52] So I know how the sequencing works. So [64:54] if you know how it works, why don't you [64:56] why don't you use it? It's understanding [64:58] how it works and then change changes in [64:59] the sequencing around. [65:02] How do you balance tactical empathy with [65:07] them getting to know you? Is is there a [65:10] contradiction there or is that a [65:13] competing [65:15] No, I I want I want both things to [65:16] happen at the same time. What I want [65:19] them to get to know from me is that they [65:20] could trust me and that I'm a straight [65:22] shooter. And if I got bad news, I'm not [65:25] going to hide it from them. [65:27] Um because that just builds much more [65:29] trust. So, how how do you build trust? [65:32] What are some of the things that enables [65:35] you to build trust with someone you're [65:37] dealing with? [65:37] Okay. Right off the bat, we do what's [65:39] called a cold read. [65:41] And [65:43] we never say I understand ever. But [65:46] we'll say all right so if I met you for [65:48] the first time I'll say this this is the [65:49] situation you find yourself in. This is [65:51] what the real estate market looks like [65:52] today. This is the challenges that are [65:55] being faced by buyers and sellers. [65:56] Here's where some of the problems are. [65:58] Here's the problems that happen every [66:00] single time. Uh if you if you navigate [66:02] these with a certain amount of time, [66:04] this is how it's going to go. And what's [66:06] that done is is immediately it showed [66:09] that you know something about the [66:10] market. And you probably say if you're [66:12] first time, I'm going to tell you what [66:13] you're thinking. I will do a read of the [66:15] situation of you and I will tell you [66:17] what it is. Initially, I one or two [66:19] things happen. Either they say, "Wow, [66:20] this person really knows what they're [66:21] talking about." Or they go, "No, no, no. [66:24] This is what it is. Here's what you need [66:25] to understand." Which means you have an [66:27] an in when they correct you, you have an [66:29] instant collaboration going on. Then [66:30] when you listen [66:33] now, they feel this great sense of trust [66:35] and predictability as much as anything [66:37] else. I don't want surprises. [66:42] as a football player and you know a [66:44] little bit about that, right? [66:47] I was trained to read, react, [66:51] right? [66:51] And and then close, [66:53] right? [66:55] And reading a lot was about being [66:57] prepared, you know, you know, being able [67:00] to size up a situation quickly, [67:04] right? And that meant I had to study [67:05] formations down and distance tendencies [67:09] all those things. So the moment I light [67:11] up lined up in a quick second, I'm [67:14] flipping it through. I'm I'm reading [67:16] fast through. Okay, this is what I [67:18] think's going to happen, [67:19] right? [67:19] Then the play starts and then I've got [67:21] to react, you know, I have an [67:22] assignment. I've got to do my assignment [67:25] and if the as a linebacker, if the gap [67:27] opens up, I've got to shoot the gap and [67:29] and make the play. is is is there a [67:33] similar [67:35] pattern that happens in a negotiation? [67:38] Yeah, I would I would say [67:40] almost word for word. I mean, you you [67:43] take what you've known, you read it, you [67:45] you you make some predictions, and then [67:47] you're prepared to adapt. [67:50] Um there's a colon pow phrase, never let [67:52] your ego get so tied to a position that [67:54] if the position collapses, your ego goes [67:56] with it. So when you do a read, you [67:58] can't say it's going to happen like this [68:01] because when it veers, your ego is tied [68:04] to that wanted to go a certain way. When [68:06] I was doing kidnapping negotiation, I [68:08] got to the point where I used to think, [68:09] all right, there's only about five [68:10] different ways this could possibly go. [68:13] Whichever one it is, I'll go with it. [68:15] I've seen it. [68:16] Now, did before you went into a [68:17] negotiation, did you have that talk with [68:20] yourself? You know, this is what I I [68:22] think can happen here. Um I I I take a [68:25] rough read of the situation. Yeah. And [68:27] there there are few situations that you [68:29] go into that even if you've never seen [68:31] it before, you can start making some [68:33] pretty good guesses. [68:35] And so, all right, so uh somebody's [68:37] selling a home. Are they going to be [68:38] emotional? Yes. [68:40] Um if if it was my first day as a real [68:44] estate agent and it was the first person [68:47] that I ever spoke to, I'd look at him [68:50] and I'd say, "Selling your home's got to [68:52] be an emotional process. [68:55] day one. [68:57] That's all I know. So once you you can [69:00] start adding to your read, adding to [69:02] your depth of experience. And then [69:04] empathy is recognition and articulation. [69:08] So you you're going back and you're [69:10] seeing what you rec what you recognize [69:11] and then you're articulating it. Does [69:14] that answer your question? [69:15] Yes. [69:16] the [69:21] how do you how do you train yourself? [69:24] Because what I hear with realtor all the [69:25] time, they're they're always trying to [69:27] use logic. They're always trying to use [69:29] facts and convincing someone of their [69:34] argument, [69:35] right? [69:36] Rather than you talk about, you know, [69:38] trying to find out what the the emotion [69:40] is underlying the situation, [69:43] right? And all this triggers back to [69:45] your first example of how you do it. [69:51] It's really awkward at first because [69:53] everyone's got these habits that they're [69:55] so tied into. I Everyone in the room, [69:58] they basically negotiate on autopilot. [70:01] Would you agree? They they do the same [70:02] things. [70:03] You go back to your habits [70:04] over and over again. [70:05] Yeah. Yeah. [70:06] How do you start to unwind these habits? [70:09] just like up here uh you know saying you [70:12] know what I think I hear you saying [70:14] versus you seem to say right just that [70:16] little thing you I have to consciously [70:20] think about using the word you versus [70:22] I how do you how do how do you in all [70:26] your training how do you get people to [70:28] start doing things differently that feel [70:30] awkward uncomfortable and a lot of it [70:33] seems very counterintuitive [70:35] right right yeah it is counterintuitive [70:38] you know here you are you're going into [70:39] a negotiation, this is how you you get [70:42] paid and now you're going to do [70:43] something that feels awkward, [70:45] counterintuitive. [70:47] That that's a that's a big leap. Yeah. [70:50] Yes or no? [70:51] Uh it it's a big leap if you look at it [70:54] all at once. [70:55] Okay. [70:56] So, how do you break it down? What do [70:57] you do to break it down? You you you [71:00] pick a skill and on a day when you [71:02] haven't got a lot at stake, which all [71:04] right. So, if you if you're not [71:06] negotiating with sellers or buyers on a [71:08] Monday, whatever, on Monday, [71:12] all day long, no matter what happens, [71:15] I'm going to let the other person talk [71:16] first, and I'm just going to try to [71:18] paraphrase everything I hear. It's a low [71:20] stakes day. What this gets into is uh as [71:24] a rule, uh I call it the rule of 67. [71:29] Somewhere between one and 67 tries, [71:33] you're going to get it. [71:35] And if you try it and if you just spend [71:37] a day doing it, you probably get 20 [71:40] tries in that day. [71:43] And so we'll pick different negotiation [71:45] skills and I'll then and I and I'll and [71:47] I'll say I'll tell some today's [71:49] paraphrase day. [71:51] You're not allowed to do anything other [71:53] than paraphrase everybody you talk to [71:55] today all day long and do it in a low [71:59] stakes day when you're not negotiating a [72:01] deal of your life. By the end of the [72:03] day, you're going to be like, "Wow, that [72:04] was a cool day. I got stuff out of [72:07] people I never expected to get out of [72:08] them." And that that's how you get it. [72:10] It just it comes to you very quickly. [72:12] The other thing that you have to watch [72:13] out for, though, is it's a perishable [72:16] skill. It's like any it's a skill. It's [72:18] not riding a bike. So, it requires a [72:21] certain amount of maintenance [72:22] afterwards. You can't just acquire it [72:24] and say, "Well, I can label whenever I [72:26] feel like it." You have to still be able [72:28] to use use these skills in your everyday [72:30] conversation so that we're when you're [72:32] talking to a seller or a buyer then the [72:35] recognition comes. [72:36] So [72:38] how many hostage negotiators are there [72:41] in the country? Do you have any idea? [72:43] Yeah, I I got I got a rough idea. Um and [72:46] how many of them and how many of them [72:48] with experience and what kind of [72:49] experience they are? At any given point [72:51] in time, the FBI's got about 400. NYPD [72:54] has about 400. [72:57] LAPD probably has their their [73:00] negotiators and their SWATs are dual [73:02] hats. [73:04] So, there's a lot of them, but since [73:07] there's so many of them, not that many [73:08] of them actually get to do real life [73:10] negotiations. [73:11] And is there real like do they have to [73:13] go through training or can anyone just [73:16] be a hostage negotiator? [73:18] Yeah, you got you got to go. Every [73:19] agency has their own training uh uh [73:21] their own training requirements. The FBI [73:24] provides training to law enforcement for [73:26] free. So the vast majority of hostage [73:28] negotiators in the US have been trained [73:29] by the FBI. [73:31] And what have you you've taught a lot of [73:34] classes now. What have what have you [73:36] learned about people and their natural [73:40] tendencies towards negotiating versus [73:43] what you think would be more effective? [73:46] Um, you know, there's a couple natural [73:48] tendencies that get in the way. If [73:50] you're control oriented, that gets in [73:52] your way. [73:54] Uh if [73:55] they're all control freaks, by the way. [73:58] Um if you're uncomfortable, [74:01] will be uncomfortable. Two two out of [74:03] three people are very uncomfortable with [74:04] silence and they can't keep quiet. [74:07] Um that's that's a problem. Yet you have [74:11] to be comfortable with silence. [74:14] Um some people are scared to learn. [74:19] you know, they're afraid that it's an [74:20] admission of weakness or vulnerability [74:23] and they don't they don't want to admit [74:26] that that they they need to learn more [74:28] stuff. Um, so you know, those kind of [74:31] things get in our way. [74:34] You talked about this addiction to yes, [74:37] which right here in the room. [74:41] Are you saying that first you want to [74:44] get to no in order to then have the [74:47] possibility to get to yes or you are you [74:50] trying to get to a no in the beginning? [74:53] Depending upon how clouded the other [74:54] person's thought patterns are like if I [74:56] if I'm talking to somebody that I can [74:58] see like if somebody's not listening at [75:01] all [75:03] then I'll get you to say no a couple [75:04] times because it'll startle you and [75:06] it'll it'll it'll break you out of this [75:08] internal thought pattern. And then at [75:11] that point in time, what I'm going to go [75:12] for after that is I'm going to try to [75:14] say a couple things to you that you'd be [75:16] surprised in a really good way that I [75:19] noticed, you know, and I'll say it [75:22] sounds to me like this is really [75:24] weighing heavily on your mind. Sounds to [75:26] me like it looks to me like you got a [75:27] lot on your plate, [75:29] you know. I'll I'll I'll I'll do a read [75:31] of your body language when I come up and [75:33] look on your face to see if I can get a [75:35] feeling of what you what mood you're in. [75:37] And I might my first first thing to you [75:39] I might say like long day. [75:44] Is it beneficial when you're going into [75:47] a negotiation to think about why the [75:50] deal won't work? [75:53] Um and I'll look for why you think it [75:56] won't work. [75:56] Okay? [75:58] Because why you think it won't work is [76:00] going to be the most important thing. So [76:01] I'm I'm going to be looking for [76:03] reluctance and hesitation. Like if if if [76:06] for some reason if you accidentally ask [76:08] somebody a question where you're trying [76:09] to get them to say yes and they go okay [76:15] stop right there. [76:18] There's a there's a hole to dive down [76:20] into [76:21] because the other thing that happens [76:22] when someone gives you a hesitation in [76:24] their tone of voice at all is they're [76:27] hoping you pick up on it. They're hoping [76:29] hoping hoping that you hear it. And if [76:33] you gloss over what you just taught them [76:34] was you're not listening. [76:37] In the book you talk about you're right [76:40] versus that's right. [76:42] Yeah. [76:43] This is a you're right kind of crowd. [76:47] You're right. [76:48] That's the kiss of death. [76:49] The kiss of death. The absolute somebody [76:51] looks at you and says you're right. We [76:55] say that when we're talking to people [76:56] that we want to maintain a relationship [76:58] with and we want them to shut up and go [77:00] away. [77:02] And in and and within my company the we [77:06] have a working joke that when we say [77:08] you're right, you're really saying f you [77:09] to the other person. [77:11] And I'm I'm having a discussion given my [77:13] director of operations a few months ago [77:15] and and he's just hammering me on [77:17] something. And finally and he was so [77:19] passionate about it. Finally, I just [77:20] said to him, "You're right." And he [77:22] went, "Okay, [77:25] because we but you're right is really [77:27] bad. It's it's bad. It's what people say [77:29] to you when they want you to stop [77:30] talking. [77:32] Chris, thank you. [77:35] Great job. [77:41] [Music]

===FILE=== yTF3qQUXiDE - How To UNFCK Your Sales In 15 Minutes or Less.txt
https://youtu.be/yTF3qQUXiDE
How To UNFCK Your Sales In 15 Minutes or Less!

[0:00] How to unf your sales in 15 minutes or [0:04] less. [0:06] Here's the truth. Most sales fail [0:09] because you're talking at your customer, [0:12] not with them. If you're explaining, [0:16] you're losing. [0:17] Pitching features instead of finding the [0:20] hidden information, the black swans [0:23] that actually close the deal. Stick [0:26] around. I'll show you how to use [0:28] tactical empathy and calibrated [0:30] questions to flip dead end conversations [0:32] into closed deals. Hey, it's Chris Vos, [0:37] CEO of the Black Swan Group, and today [0:40] I'm going to show you how to h your [0:42] sales in just 15 minutes or less. You're [0:45] about to learn how to stop losing deals [0:47] you should win by negotiating like the [0:51] top 1% of the top performers who [0:55] understand human nature, not just [0:59] memorize scripts [1:02] that make you a robot. Step one, lead [1:06] with tactical empathy. First, stop [1:08] thinking of sales as convincing. [1:11] Think of it as understanding, [1:14] discovering, [1:16] and [1:18] learning. [1:20] Before you talk about your offer, talk [1:22] about them. Learn about them from them. [1:26] Label their likely reality. It seems [1:30] like there's a reason we're talking. It [1:32] seems like hitting your targets this [1:34] quarter has probably been tough. You're [1:37] probably under a lot of pressure to cut [1:40] cost. [1:41] When you label emotions, you calm them [1:44] down. You demonstrate understanding. [1:46] You're showing, I see you. I hear you. [1:49] This lures their defenses and unlocks [1:53] trust. [1:55] And on any of these good guesses, [1:58] if you miss, they correct you. Solid [2:02] gold. Step number two, ask calibrated [2:06] questions. Stop asking surface level [2:10] questions. They put people in [2:12] uncomfortable situations. [2:15] Instead, ask calibrated questions that [2:18] start with how or what. But first, [2:23] avoid the dreaded and most common robot [2:26] question you could ask, which makes you [2:28] sound like every other dumb salesperson. [2:32] How can I help you? [2:35] The insiders truth on human nature. If [2:38] you don't know how you might help me, [2:41] why should I waste my time with you? If [2:45] you're clueless, then I don't even know [2:48] where to begin. [2:50] Example of a good how question or what [2:52] question. How have things failed in the [2:55] past? [2:57] This is a good question and it draws [2:59] upon memory from them which is easy for [3:02] them to access that information. A what [3:04] question? What might make this a good [3:08] fit for you? [3:10] Draws them into collaborative problem [3:12] solving thinking. Another how question. [3:16] How does this align with what you're [3:18] trying to achieve? [3:20] Again, get some thinking collaboratively [3:22] with you. [3:25] These questions do two main things. They [3:28] shift the problem solving to the [3:30] customer in a collaborative way. So they [3:34] feel ownership in the outcome as they go [3:38] and they reveal the hidden information [3:40] of black swans you can use to tailor [3:44] your pitch. [3:46] Step three, mirror like a pro. Mirroring [3:51] is the simplest Jedi mind trick in a [3:53] black swan toolkit. [3:56] When they say we just don't have the [3:58] budget right now, you mirror the last [4:00] few words. The budget right now. [4:04] Tone is critical. It must convey either [4:08] comprehension [4:10] or curiosity [4:12] or you're a robot. And if you neither [4:15] comprehend nor are curious about what [4:18] was said, you are a robot. Mirror [4:22] properly and they'll keep talking and [4:25] elaborate. They'll spill what's actually [4:27] going on behind that objection. Maybe [4:30] they have the budget next quarter [4:32] or for the right return on investment. [4:36] Maring buys you time, makes them feel [4:39] heard, and unlocks [4:42] detail. [4:44] Step four, get to [4:48] that's right. [4:50] The real magic in negotiation and in [4:52] sales is getting your customer to say [4:54] that's right. When you hear that's [4:56] right, you know they feel understood, [4:59] not manipulated, not pressured, [5:02] understood. [5:03] And that's when they trust you enough to [5:06] buy. [5:07] So, how do you do it? [5:10] You summarize their situation better [5:12] than they could. Use tactical empathy [5:16] and labeling to summarize their [5:19] perceived reality. Take the conversation [5:22] that you just heard and try to sum it up [5:24] in two or three sentences. [5:27] If you get it right, they'll nod and [5:29] say, "That's right." Boom. Now they feel [5:33] heard. And people don't argue with their [5:36] own conclusions. [5:38] If you don't get it right, stay silent [5:42] and they will fill in what you missed. [5:45] Then repeat what they added until you do [5:48] get a that's right. [5:50] From there, [5:52] your ask becomes a natural next step, [5:55] not a pushy pitch. [5:58] Get permission to make the ask with a no [6:00] warranted question by saying, [6:03] "Would it offend you if I shared some [6:05] ideas with you? [6:07] Would it offend you if I shared some [6:10] solutions with you? Two critical no [6:12] warranted questions that trigger them [6:14] giving you permission to move forward. [6:18] Bonus points. [6:20] Watch out. [6:22] Find the silent deal killers. Every deal [6:26] has a hidden piece of information that [6:28] changes everything. And one of those [6:31] pieces of information could be the deal [6:33] killers on the other side. [6:36] Could be a budget that does exist. [6:40] Could be an internal priority you didn't [6:42] know about. [6:44] Could be a colleague of theirs who needs [6:47] convincing. You'll find these hidden [6:49] deal killers, these black swans [6:53] by mixing labels, mirrors, and [6:55] calibrated questions till you get a [6:58] that's right. So, here's how you unf [7:01] your sales. Let's summarize. [7:04] Number one, start with empathy first. [7:06] Number two, calibrated questions and dig [7:09] deep. Number three, mirror, mirror. And [7:13] number four, get to it. That's right. [7:16] And remember, watch out for the deal [7:19] killers. Now go close that deal. [7:23] Black swan one.
